Obama just announced a $200 million program for non whites only

[TemplarKormac]

Ahh, debating minutia... a sign of a clear lack of a cogent argument.

It's not "minutia", it's your entire argument. You're claiming this violates the 14th. It doesn't.

It does. Since this Presidential Memorandum carries with it the force of law, it thereby is subject to a Constitutional analysis. It violates the equal protection clause, simply by using government agencies under the direction of the president to serve one group of people, while specifically excluding another. You can't use our government in such a way.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

As to the first part - no, the program does not use government agencies to implement it.

The "task force" will respond to the program, not "implement" it.

 

[TemplarKormac]

I have tried to explain, but I've been posting on my phone, and it's harder to get my point across.

Here are a few of the issues I was talking about:

1. The program is entirely funded by private donations, not federal funds. The "task force" is, as the article explains, nothing but a way to centralize the local efforts. The members of the "task force" are already employed by the government, and won't be getting a raise.

2. Who the initiative is intended to help is irrelevant. Intentions don't hold legal status, and nothing about this program will create any laws that discriminate, or deny any rights to anyone. Therefore, it doesn't violate the 14th. Domestic violence programs are generally "intended" to help battered women. Do you think those violate the 14th?

1) The program uses government agencies to implement. Are you seriously not getting the message yet? These agencies ARE run by Federal funds. And yep, this task force is already employed by the government, which means they are being paid taxpayer money. There is no such thing as a free lunch. Whether they receive a raise or not is irrelevant.

2) Aha! You were making such a big deal about who it was supposed to be serving earlier. You said the it was meant to help "everyone." That, sir, is a concession. The very language of this initiative is discriminatory. "Color" this, and "color" that; to say that it doesn't discriminate against a certain demographic group is egregiously false. Presidential Memorandums are similar to, if not identical to Executive Orders, which means they BOTH carry with them the force of law.

I never said anything close to that.

I said that legally, the program does not discriminate against anyone.

Sigh, a legal professional would have a field day with the language in this initiative. It is specifically directed at "boys and young men of color." Put on your reading glasses dude.

 

[Pheonixops]

I guess whites can't be poor

Do you have any particulars on the program? Links?

Oh stop it. For once, please do your own research.

FACT SHEET: Opportunity for all: President Obama Launches My Brother?s Keeper Initiative to Build Ladders of Opportunity For Boys and Young Men of Color | The White House

I always do my own research, I like to reach my own conclusions, instead of just parroting what some political talk show hosts and their lemming like listeners spew each day. I wanted to see what the OP was specifically referring to. When I heard Savage stating that it was 200 million in taxpayer money this afternoon, I figured it was bullshit and I was correct. Thanks for the link.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

Ahh, debating minutia... a sign of a clear lack of a cogent argument.

It's not "minutia", it's your entire argument. You're claiming this violates the 14th. It doesn't.

It does. Since this Presidential Memorandum carries with it the force of law, it thereby is subject to a Constitutional analysis. It violates the equal protection clause, simply by using government agencies under the direction of the president to serve one group of people, while specifically excluding another. You can't use our government in such a way.

1. Nothing about this carries with it any "force of law". The "Presidential Memorandum" speaks only of creating a task force to track this program, not the program itself.

2. It does not exclude anyone from anything.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

1) The program uses government agencies to implement. Are you seriously not getting the message yet? These agencies ARE run by Federal funds. And yep, this task force is already employed by the government, which means they are being paid taxpayer money. There is no such thing as a free lunch. Whether they receive a raise or not is irrelevant.

2) Aha! You were making such a big deal about who it was supposed to be serving earlier. You said the it was meant to help "everyone." That, sir, is a concession. The very language of this initiative is discriminatory. "Color" this, and "color" that; to say that it doesn't discriminate against a certain demographic group is egregiously false. Presidential Memorandums are similar to, if not identical to Executive Orders, which means they BOTH carry with them the force of law.

I never said anything close to that.

I said that legally, the program does not discriminate against anyone.

Sigh, a legal professional would have a field day with the language in this initiative. It is specifically directed at "boys and young men of color." Put on your reading glasses dude.

USDOJ: Office on Violence Against Women

That above link is "specifically directed" only at women. Is it "excluding" men? Is it a violation of the 14th?

 

[TemplarKormac]

As to the first part - no, the program does not use government agencies to implement it.

The "task force" will respond to the program, not "implement" it.

What exactly does a Presidential Memorandum do? I'll tell you.

A presidential memorandum is a type of executive instrument typically issued by the President of the United States to manage and govern the actions, practices and policies of the various departments and agencies found under the executive branch of the United States government. Presidential memoranda and executive orders appear to be very closely related, if not identical. However, the lack of a definition for either of these mechanisms has made it difficult to make a clear distinction between them.

Presidential memorandum - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Againsheila]

Handouts to rich, white Wall Streeters? OK.

Handouts to poor, black Americans? Not ok.

Mmmkay.

I was against the bailouts. I'm against this. The bailouts helped only the rich. This helps poor blacks and hispanics but not poor whites. That makes it racist. Both are wrong.

 

[TemplarKormac]

I never said anything close to that.

I said that legally, the program does not discriminate against anyone.

Sigh, a legal professional would have a field day with the language in this initiative. It is specifically directed at "boys and young men of color." Put on your reading glasses dude.

USDOJ: Office on Violence Against Women

That above link is "specifically directed" only at women. Is it "excluding" men? Is it a violation of the 14th?

Red herrings? Not like you. Do you often hear of battered men? I don't think so. Weak argument, Doc.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

As to the first part - no, the program does not use government agencies to implement it.

The "task force" will respond to the program, not "implement" it.

What exactly does a Presidential Memorandum do? I'll tell you.

A presidential memorandum is a type of executive instrument typically issued by the President of the United States to manage and govern the actions, practices and policies of the various departments and agencies found under the executive branch of the United States government. Presidential memoranda and executive orders appear to be very closely related, if not identical. However, the lack of a definition for either of these mechanisms has made it difficult to make a clear distinction between them.

Presidential memorandum - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I don't know what you think that proves.

The "Presidential Memorandum" Obama issued is directing a task force to be created to report on the successes of various implementations of this program, and share them. They will not be "implementing" the program, running it, or anything close to that.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

Sigh, a legal professional would have a field day with the language in this initiative. It is specifically directed at "boys and young men of color." Put on your reading glasses dude.

USDOJ: Office on Violence Against Women

That above link is "specifically directed" only at women. Is it "excluding" men? Is it a violation of the 14th?

Red herrings? Not like you. Do you often hear of battered men? I don't think so. Weak argument, Doc.

There are many hundreds of thousands of male victims of domestic violence each year. The fact that you don't hear about them doesn't mean they don't exist.

 

[jon_berzerk]

I guess whites can't be poor

it is a nice gesture

but nothing

nothing replaces good parenting

 

[1776]

Imagine if Buuuuuuuuush gave $200M just to "white males" living in backwoods of America to give them a hand up in life......

 

[TemplarKormac]

Do you have any particulars on the program? Links?

Oh stop it. For once, please do your own research.

FACT SHEET: Opportunity for all: President Obama Launches My Brother?s Keeper Initiative to Build Ladders of Opportunity For Boys and Young Men of Color | The White House

I always do my own research, I like to reach my own conclusions, instead of just parroting what some political talk show hosts and their lemming like listeners spew each day. I wanted to see what the OP was specifically referring to. When I heard Savage stating that it was 200 million in taxpayer money this afternoon, I figured it was bullshit and I was correct. Thanks for the link.

"I like to reach my own conclusions" you say. Well then, let research be damned. And do you always believe I am acting under the specific direction of some political talk show host? Is this another one of your "conclusions"? I didn't say it was used with taxpayer money, since several foundations have pledged $200 million of their own money to fund the program. However, when you use government agencies and employees to help implement this initiative, that on the other hand, requires taxpayer money.

 

[TemplarKormac]

As to the first part - no, the program does not use government agencies to implement it.

The "task force" will respond to the program, not "implement" it.

What exactly does a Presidential Memorandum do? I'll tell you.

A presidential memorandum is a type of executive instrument typically issued by the President of the United States to manage and govern the actions, practices and policies of the various departments and agencies found under the executive branch of the United States government. Presidential memoranda and executive orders appear to be very closely related, if not identical. However, the lack of a definition for either of these mechanisms has made it difficult to make a clear distinction between them.

Presidential memorandum - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I don't know what you think that proves.

The "Presidential Memorandum" Obama issued is directing a task force to be created to report on the successes of various implementations of this program, and share them. They will not be "implementing" the program, running it, or anything close to that.

I think it proves that he is indeed using governmental agencies and employees to oversee the program. Oversight costs taxpayer money.

Besides, who in hell runs the damned thing, Doc? Why is the GOVERNMENT launching this initiative?! When you use the government for anything, you're using taxpayer money to do it.

 

[TemplarKormac]

USDOJ: Office on Violence Against Women

That above link is "specifically directed" only at women. Is it "excluding" men? Is it a violation of the 14th?

Red herrings? Not like you. Do you often hear of battered men? I don't think so. Weak argument, Doc.

There are many hundreds of thousands of male victims of domestic violence each year. The fact that you don't hear about them doesn't mean they don't exist.

But oh hey, that presumption of yours suddenly turns this initiative into something that helps non colored individuals. That's smart. And garbage. If the initiative says "boys and men of color" such is an all inclusive statement. That's who its meant to help. Nowhere does it mention helping white boys and young men with their nutrition and education.

Sorry, not falling for that flawed line of reasoning.

 

[Pheonixops]

Wouldn't you think the freaking president of all the people would have thrown poor rural white kids and (legal) Hispanic kids a bone with our freaking taxpayer dollars? Let's cut to the chase, mid terms are coming up and Hussein needs to solidify his base. Meanwhile Hilly is telling white college kids in Fla. that unemployment is liberating. Tell me the democrat party isn't imploding.

I don't think that Hispanic kids are excluded. I would like if the initiative was based more on socioeconomic factors than racial factors. This initiative isn't solely for Black people, other minorities are included as well. Here's something that looks similar:
Ohio Appalachian Task Force
Now I don't know the racial demographics for that area, but I would think that the program has white people as the primary beneficiaries. I'm sure that it's at least 91% white.

 

[eagle1462010]

Then Obama has nothing to do with it in an official capacity and who cares?

Why would anyone think ill of a racist president so long as he doesn't spend their tax money in displaying his personal racism?

If he isn't using our money and isn't committing a crime, what does it matter what causes he supports?

Looks like he's getting private funding for this. So I simply don't care........It's their money and if they want to donate it to this cause it's their right to do so.

 

[TemplarKormac]

Just admit it. This initiative is racist. Should it have been geared towards disadvantaged white boys and young men, there would be cries of "RACIST!" echoing from the left and from African Americans as well.

 

[1776]

This is what you get once liberals get even more bold.

First affirmative action was all about giving them a "chance" but now it's about funneling money to minorities.

Soon it will be your job and property on their list of goodies.....