RetiredGySgt
Diamond Member
So why in the 90's when they had the SAME laws was it so high? Or even 5 years ago?
CDZ NYC on track for lowest number of murders in decades
- Thread starter rightwinger
- Start date
SobieskiSavedEurope
Gold Member
- Banned
- #42
A lot of African Americans left New York City too..
SobieskiSavedEurope
Gold Member
- Banned
- #43
Because of Blacks..
SobieskiSavedEurope
Gold Member
- Banned
- #44
New York's so expensive that a lot of the Black, and Puerto Rican ghetto trash who caused a lot of problems in the 90's fled to Georgia, Florida, the Carolina's, or out to Suburban cities like Newburgh, Newark, Bridgeport, Waterbury, Mount Vernon, Patterson, Middletown, Poughkeepsie, etc. etc.
SobieskiSavedEurope
Gold Member
- Banned
- #45
El Paso has a lot of guns, and a low murder rate.
Juarez has few guns, and a huge murder rate.
Both on the other side of the border, both filled with Mexicans.
Juarez has few guns, and a huge murder rate.
Both on the other side of the border, both filled with Mexicans.
usmbguest5318
Gold Member
Like you, anyone can abstractly share facts.
- Gun homicides and gun ownership listed by country
- The US has the highest gun ownership rate in the world - an average of 88 per 100 people. That puts it first in the world for gun ownership - and even the number two country, Yemen, has significantly fewer - 54.8 per 100 people.
- The US does not have the worst firearm murder rate - that prize belongs to Honduras, El Salvador and Jamaica. In fact, the US is number 28, with a rate of 2.97 per 100,000 people.
- Puerto Rico tops the world’s table for firearms murders as a percentage of all homicides - 94.8%. It’s followed by Sierra Leone in Africa and Saint Kitts and Nevis in the Caribbean.
- Chart showing gun ownership and murder rates by country (Raw data is here)
- Interactive map showing
toobfreak
Tungsten/Glass Member
More likely so that New Yorkers could better remember its name.
So thinks anyone from New York, except the people in upstate New York which HATE the city, and until that perfect cyclone eventually hits New York Harbor dead on and puts it half underwater. Maybe next year. Then NYC will be another Puerto Rico and the center of only the nearest dumpster.
SobieskiSavedEurope
Gold Member
- Banned
- #48
Besides America, Western Europe is a high gun owner part of the World, and has very low murder rates.
usmbguest5318
Gold Member
I guess you missed the whole point of the post to which you've replied. Let me make it clear for you: So what!
SobieskiSavedEurope
Gold Member
- Banned
- #50
Lithuania = Lowest gun ownership rate in Europe, and also #1 in Suicide, and #2 in murder.
Explanation?
usmbguest5318
Gold Member
Wow! You still don't get it....
Correlation absent proof of causation.
SobieskiSavedEurope
Gold Member
- Banned
- #52
Wow! You still don't get it....
Correlation absent proof of causation.
Right back at you.
You also haven't effectively explained why Western Europe has general high gun ownership rates compared to the World, but low murder rates in comparison to the world.
usmbguest5318
Gold Member
Wow! You still don't get it....
Correlation absent proof of causation.
Right back at you.
You also haven't effectively explained why Western Europe has general high gun ownership rates compared to the World, but low murder rates in comparison to the world.
I don't need to do that because I'm not asserting there is a causal relationship -- in either direction, gun ownership or gun non-ownership -- between those metrics. That there is not widely accepted (among sound and substantive researchers) that there is such a causal relationship is the the reason I have not posted an argument based on there being one. Because there is no preponderantly or unequivocally established causal relationship among the incidence of gun ownership and using a gun for unlawful purposes, neither gun rights nor gun control activists can craft sound arguments that rely on there being such a relationship.
That is the central theme of my remarks, yet even after my having stated it and alluded to it, it yet appears to have gone over your head. I suspect that theme eluded you because you are of a mind that my overall message is something that it is not and that I've not so much as alluded to it being. That happens to relatively intelligent folks when they, as readers and listeners, focus more on who says "such and such" rather than limiting their inferences to the what is explicitly written/said and/or alluded to. Is that why my theme went over your head? I don't know; all I can tell by your remarks is that it has.
Individuals on each side of the matter can cite instances where gun ownership and gun use/misuse metrics ostensibly support the case they aim to make. It's obvious why the NRA, which is the gun industry's organization that exists for the express purpose of promoting public policy that advances or at least does not portend to diminish gun industry profits, do so. I understand too that organizations like the National Coalition to Ban Handguns see themselves as champions of an element of social justice, thus why they espouse the stance they do. Too, it's clear why politicians do so; they are dependent on the resources they receive from organizations that are expressly on one or the other side of the matter.
What makes no sense to me is why individuals who are not politicians issue or repeat, as well as condone the sophistic lines of rhetoric that comes from politicians and organizations that have some "axe to grind" with regard to the matter. What I'd expect from non-politician citizens is a resounding cry for increased research to determine unequivocally or preponderantly (1) whether there are any set of factors that cause gun misuse and (2) what indeed be the nature and extent of any such factors comprising the causal relationship between guns and the misuse of guns. Research of that nature would serve to remove the realm of politics for upon knowing what be the causes of gun misuse, we can stop tossing about metrics that seem to advance a point of view and stop talking about what causes gun misuse, and instead, act to reduce the impact those causes have and thereby lower the quantity of people injured by gun misuse.
Mere ownership of guns is not the cause of gun misuse. The problem is that we don't know what be the cause of gun misuse; consequently, there is far too much haranguing about correlations that may or may not be indicative of and point to a sage approach for abating gun misuse and its outcomes. I think it's obvious that a material aspect of the cause has to do with a gun possesser's state of mind; however, the NIMH has been expressly prohibited from conducting research to find out.
Meathead
Diamond Member
MAGA BABY!!!
rightwinger
Award Winning USMB Paid Messageboard Poster
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iamwhatiseem
Diamond Member
meanwhile in Chicago....
C_Clayton_Jones
Diamond Member
Conservatives can't have it both ways.
If gun laws don't work because there's high crime, then they must be working when crime is low.
If gun laws don't work because there's high crime, then they must be working when crime is low.
harmonica
Diamond Member
- Sep 1, 2017
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St Louis has a higher murder rate than Chicago, LA, and NYC
STL is very pro-gun
STL ranks near the top--if not the top--most dangerous cities--Chi, LA, and NYC do not
STL population density is much lower
Missouri ranks high in murder rates
MO is very pro-gun
STL is very pro-gun
STL ranks near the top--if not the top--most dangerous cities--Chi, LA, and NYC do not
STL population density is much lower
Missouri ranks high in murder rates
MO is very pro-gun
2aguy
Diamond Member
- Jul 19, 2014
- 112,559
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actually, more guns made America safer over the last 24 years....
We went from 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s and 4.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 1997...to close to 400-600 million guns in private hands and over 16.3 million people carrying guns for self defense in 2017...guess what happened...
-- gun murder down 49%
--gun crime down 75%
--violent crime down 72%
Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware
Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.
2aguy
Diamond Member
- Jul 19, 2014
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St. Louis, Missouri has had democrats in Charge since 1949.....and they have a revolving door policy for black gun criminals...
Those are the reasons....not law abiding gun owners....but you know this...because you were shown this before.....that you keep posting about St. Louis, without stating the truth, shows you are a liar....
Mayor of St. Louis - Wikipedia
Rise in Murders Has St. Louis Debating Why
Jennifer M. Joyce, the city’s circuit attorney, or prosecutor, an elected position, complains that in St. Louis, the illegal possession of a gun is too often “a crime without a consequence,” making it difficult to stop confrontation from turning lethal.
At the same time, deeper social roots of violence such as addiction and unemployment continue unchecked. And city officials also cite what they call a “Ferguson effect,” an increase in crime last year as police officers were diverted to control protests after a white officer shot and killed Michael Brown, an unarmed black teenager in the nearby suburb on Aug. 9.
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Now, an overstretched department is forced to pick one neighborhood at a time to flood with officers. Last month, Chief Dotson even asked the state highway patrol if it could lend a dozen men to help watch downtown streets; the agency declined.
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When the police discover a gun in a car with several passengers, including some with felony records, but no one admits to owning the gun, criminal charges are often impossible, Mr. Rosenfeld said.
In addition, according to a 2014 study by Mr. Rosenfeld and his colleagues, a majority of those who are convicted of illegally possessing a gun but not caught using it in a crime receive probation rather than jail time. Gun laws and enforcement are stiffer in many other cities.
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