Nothing irks me off more than libertarian college kids...

[Avatar4321]

You can be sure it's the GOP behind the high cost of college (public ones' cost doubled just under W) and loans, and now possibly doubling the cost of loans. Some dems want to lower loans to 0.5%. Pubs and their dupes are terminally myopic (greedy)...

Yes. of course. It's a Republican conspiracy to funnel tax money to marxist professors.

 

[francoHFW]

OP- Libertarian? Actually low info Pub dupes...

 

[OohPooPahDoo]

Libertarians want to get the government out of our back yards and pocketbooks and back to doing what the constitution says they can.

Well that's certainly what they've been told they want. In truth, the power elite that run the libertarian/teabag movement want three things a) lower wages/salaries for the poor and middle class b) lower taxes for the wealthy c) elimination of any regulation that makes it harder for the wealthy to herd the poor like cattle and possible for the middle class to exist at all.

If the government wasn't overspending the money they get from us there might be more fore grants and loans for those who qualify.

That doesn't even make any sense at all. There isn't going to be more loans by spending less, you clearly flunked math.

The non-profits might get more money that is now wasted by our government to help those in need. Heck, we might be able to help ourselves if we didn't have to pay so much in taxes.

The libertarian power elite aren't interested in reducing their tax burden so they can pay for the college educations of poor kids - they are interesting in reducing their tax burden so they can have more money for themselves and they are interested in making it harder for the poor to attend college.

The reason, my friend, that the United States has one of the highest rates of post-secondary degrees in the world is because of - initially - the GI Bill - and then the slew of government sponsored aid such as Pell Grants and federally backed loans that followed. You are essentially asking us to abandon a system that has made the United States one of the most scientifically advanced nations in the world in favor of one that might work we'll just cross our fingers and hope the Koch Bros. want to give poor kids educations instead of reaping profits off their backs.

 

[francoHFW]

You can be sure it's the GOP behind the high cost of college (public ones' cost doubled just under W) and loans, and now possibly doubling the cost of loans. Some dems want to lower loans to 0.5%. Pubs and their dupes are terminally myopic (greedy)...

Yes. of course. It's a Republican conspiracy to funnel tax money to marxist professors.

No, Sean Rushbeck. It's for the greedy Pubs that run them, especially all the scam online universities that Bush policies made possible, that have made the amount of bad loans huge and produced graduates who learned nothing of value. A disgrace.

 

[Avatar4321]

You can be sure it's the GOP behind the high cost of college (public ones' cost doubled just under W) and loans, and now possibly doubling the cost of loans. Some dems want to lower loans to 0.5%. Pubs and their dupes are terminally myopic (greedy)...

Yes. of course. It's a Republican conspiracy to funnel tax money to marxist professors.

No, Sean Rushbeck. It's for the greedy Pubs that run them, especially all the scam online universities that Bush policies made possible, that have made the amount of bad loans huge and produced graduates who learned nothing of value. A disgrace.

So you're going to argue that the Universities are Republican controlled and yet black ball conservative Professors?

Bush is responsible for online universities? Silly me. I thought that was the INTERNET.

 

[francoHFW]

Nope. Read something.

The Pubs make the big money. Dem professors keep RWers out of professorships because they're MORONS or bought off LOL. Fact.

 

[Avatar4321]

Nope. Read something.

The Pubs make the big money. Dem professors keep RWers out of professorships because they're MORONS LOL. Fact.

I did just read something. What you wrote. It's complete nonsense.

Just because you read something doesn't make it true. You should know that considering how much nonsense you write.

 

[asterism]

That's simply not true.
Myth: Increases in Federal Student Aid Drive Increases in Tuition
Public university tuition has inflated due to reductions in public funding of universities. Inflation in private school tuitions has not been nearly as high because they rely on far less public funding. Your analysis is based on either the faulty presumption that universities are for-profit - most are not - or the faulty presumption that not-for-profits behave as if they were profit seeking - most do not. Charitable thrift shops raise their prices when their costs go up, not when their customers get better loans. Universities raise tuition to cover their costs - not to deliver profit into shareholders hands.

They didn't mention the increased availability of student loans, and that's the main culprit.

They did mention it, first in the title. IN fact its kinda the subject of the whole article.


What you have stated is a myth based on the faulty presumption that colleges and universities behave as entities with profit motive. With rare exception, both public and private universities are not-for profit (on a side note, there is growing evidence that the for-profit universities suck)

In fact, it is the other way around. Rising college tuitions make student loans more necessary for students to attend school.

Colleges and universities can increase their prices because people can pay it.

That's not even strictly true. The public universities in my home state cannot increase their tuition without approval from the legislature. The legislature won't approve an increase in tuition simply so the university can pad its coffers, there needs to be a demonstrated need for the increase based on the increase of cost.

I think I'll go with John V. Lombardi, the President of the University of Florida in the 1990s. He called low tuition at state universities "welfare for the middle class." His premise was that since college provides such a high value, it should charge market rates for it. When asked about ever increasing debt, he flippantly noted that college is not for everyone.

If student aid were means tested, college tuition would drop like a stone. I don't advocate such a thing, but colleges are absolutely participating in this economy. They charge more because they can get it.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Nothing irks me off more than libertarian college kids who pay no taxes telling me - who is backing their student loans with my taxes - that I want to tax them too much. Boys and girls, just shut up. Enjoy going to college on loans with low rates of interest - and don't ask why the interest is so low. Just know that government is bad - its evil! Ask them if they want to eliminate the department of education? YES! Do you want us to eliminate your student loans so you can pay double the interest you pay now? NO!

Its quite easy for people who are 19 years old with no responsibilities and living partially off of loan money to say they should pay a flat tax, isn't it?

You don't like kids that disagree with the party line?

No one gives a **** what you like.

FYI, the reason interest rates on loans is so low is to hide the cost of college behind a fake interest rate that distorts the market.

 

[OohPooPahDoo]

Yes. of course. It's a Republican conspiracy to funnel tax money to marxist professors.

No, Sean Rushbeck. It's for the greedy Pubs that run them, especially all the scam online universities that Bush policies made possible, that have made the amount of bad loans huge and produced graduates who learned nothing of value. A disgrace.

So you're going to argue that the Universities are Republican controlled and yet black ball conservative Professors?

Bush is responsible for online universities? Silly me. I thought that was the INTERNET.

I have no idea what Bush has to do with it, but online colleges & universities tend to be the for-profit colleges & universities - which tend to be shams. Most online for-profit institutions are designed simply to transfer taxpayer wealth and the future earnings of their customers into profits for private business. The default rate at for-profit schools is twice as high as at public institutions - meaning they are charging too much for the quality of education they are providing - at expense to the public. http://www.harkin.senate.gov/help/forprofitcolleges.cfm

More students can obtain college educations with less public money and with less money from the students themselves if we eliminate loans for for-profit institutions and re-direct them for use at public and non-for-profit private institutions.

 

[OohPooPahDoo]

They didn't mention the increased availability of student loans, and that's the main culprit.

They did mention it, first in the title. IN fact its kinda the subject of the whole article.


What you have stated is a myth based on the faulty presumption that colleges and universities behave as entities with profit motive. With rare exception, both public and private universities are not-for profit (on a side note, there is growing evidence that the for-profit universities suck)

In fact, it is the other way around. Rising college tuitions make student loans more necessary for students to attend school.

Colleges and universities can increase their prices because people can pay it.

That's not even strictly true. The public universities in my home state cannot increase their tuition without approval from the legislature. The legislature won't approve an increase in tuition simply so the university can pad its coffers, there needs to be a demonstrated need for the increase based on the increase of cost.

I think I'll go with John V. Lombardi, the President of the University of Florida in the 1990s. He called low tuition at state universities "welfare for the middle class." His premise was that since college provides such a high value, it should charge market rates for it. When asked about ever increasing debt, he flippantly noted that college is not for everyone.

If student aid were means tested, college tuition would drop like a stone. I don't advocate such a thing, but colleges are absolutely participating in this economy. They charge more because they can get it.

College tuition is not going to drop simply because less students have less money to pay for it. People having less money doesn't alter the costs that universities have to cover. Instead colleges will simply reduce their rolls, admitting only the few students with the money to pay the costs. not-for-profit (meaning most all) colleges don't raise tuition to make profit because they aren't trying to make a profit. They raise tuition to cover the cost of the education. These costs have been increasing as state aid to universities has dropped. Computers cost more than slide rules.

 

[asterism]

No, Sean Rushbeck. It's for the greedy Pubs that run them, especially all the scam online universities that Bush policies made possible, that have made the amount of bad loans huge and produced graduates who learned nothing of value. A disgrace.

So you're going to argue that the Universities are Republican controlled and yet black ball conservative Professors?

Bush is responsible for online universities? Silly me. I thought that was the INTERNET.

I have no idea what Bush has to do with it, but online colleges & universities tend to be the for-profit colleges & universities - which tend to be shams. Most online for-profit institutions are designed simply to transfer taxpayer wealth and the future earnings of their customers into profits for private business. The default rate at for-profit schools is twice as high as at public institutions - meaning they are charging too much for the quality of education they are providing - at expense to the public. For-Profit Colleges

More students can obtain college educations with less public money and with less money from the students themselves if we eliminate loans for for-profit institutions and re-direct them for use at public and non-for-profit private institutions.

I was wondering where you were going with this.

So, government loans can only be used to get educations at government institutions? What next, government loans can only be used to start government contractors? Government education can only be used to further careers in Government Sponsored Enterprises?

While I agree with your assessment of for-profit colleges (most are shams for academic purposes), there is still a great benefit to society for them and they serve as an excellent source of competition for traditional universities.

Federal student aid is there to promulgate the goals of people, not to have them be indoctrinated. And while most online programs are crap, plenty are quite good to serve the needs of those seeking a better career. Argosy sucks, but it's better than a literature degree from Columbia if you work for Allstate.

 

[francoHFW]

Bushies made BS online colleges possible AND run them...you do know your computer is the best research device ever, right? Google "Bush policy, online for profit SHYTTE college":

John Boehner Backed Deregulation Of Online Learning, Leading To ...
John Boehner Backed Deregulation Of Online Learning, Leading To Explosive Growth At For-Profit Colleges - Cached
Jul 29, 2011 ... AN ONLINE COLOSSUS. Any large industry takes heed of federal policy, but the
for-profit college industry has a special interest: It has ...
Online Colleges as a Policy Bloc? | Inside Higher Ed
Online Colleges as a Policy Bloc? | Inside Higher Ed - Cached - Similar
Oct 13, 2010 ... WASHINGTON -- For-profit colleges in one camp and everyone else in ... theme
of higher education policy this fall, but online institutions, regardless of their ... as
secretary of education during George W. Bush's second term.

 

[asterism]

They did mention it, first in the title. IN fact its kinda the subject of the whole article.


What you have stated is a myth based on the faulty presumption that colleges and universities behave as entities with profit motive. With rare exception, both public and private universities are not-for profit (on a side note, there is growing evidence that the for-profit universities suck)

In fact, it is the other way around. Rising college tuitions make student loans more necessary for students to attend school.


That's not even strictly true. The public universities in my home state cannot increase their tuition without approval from the legislature. The legislature won't approve an increase in tuition simply so the university can pad its coffers, there needs to be a demonstrated need for the increase based on the increase of cost.

I think I'll go with John V. Lombardi, the President of the University of Florida in the 1990s. He called low tuition at state universities "welfare for the middle class." His premise was that since college provides such a high value, it should charge market rates for it. When asked about ever increasing debt, he flippantly noted that college is not for everyone.

If student aid were means tested, college tuition would drop like a stone. I don't advocate such a thing, but colleges are absolutely participating in this economy. They charge more because they can get it.

College tuition is not going to drop simply because less students have less money to pay for it. People having less money doesn't alter the costs that universities have to cover. Instead colleges will simply reduce their rolls, admitting only the few students with the money to pay the costs. not-for-profit (meaning most all) colleges don't raise tuition to make profit because they aren't trying to make a profit. They raise tuition to cover the cost of the education. These costs have been increasing as state aid to universities has dropped. Computers cost more than slide rules.

How does the cost of a Bachelor of Arts in Mathematics rise exponentially? The concept that are taught have not changed in hundreds of years.

While computers cost more than slide rules, computers today are extremely cheaper than those needed 20 years ago to teach entry-level programming. We're not talking advanced curricula, I agree that those programs are and have always had escalating costs. I'm talking about the the resources needed to produce properly educated statisticians, mathematicians, poets, programmers, and managers. Those costs have gone down.

The cost is going up because the value is still there and increasing numbers of people are able to pay. They might not be able to afford it, but they are able to pay.

 

[francoHFW]

As I keep trying to inform you, dupes- Pubs are behind all the shytte going...FACT. Change the GD channel...

 

[Avatar4321]

As I keep trying to inform you, dupes- Pubs are behind all the shytte going...FACT. Change the GD channel...

Fact: your online rants aren't facts.

 

[TemplarKormac]

As I keep trying to inform you, dupes- Pubs are behind all the shytte going...FACT. Change the GD channel...

Fact: your online rants aren't facts.

If Franco says "dupe" one more time, I'll freaking torment him with pictures of Ronald Reagan and George W. Bush! I'll also make him watch movies with guns in them!

 

[francoHFW]

Avatar Templar, super dupers lol, read about Bushies deregulating online schooling so their cronies could rip off returning vets, more than half the growth in bad loans are those BS u's. You'd think ignorance were a virtue you're so gd ignorant and proud of it...

 

[OohPooPahDoo]

So you're going to argue that the Universities are Republican controlled and yet black ball conservative Professors?

Bush is responsible for online universities? Silly me. I thought that was the INTERNET.

I have no idea what Bush has to do with it, but online colleges & universities tend to be the for-profit colleges & universities - which tend to be shams. Most online for-profit institutions are designed simply to transfer taxpayer wealth and the future earnings of their customers into profits for private business. The default rate at for-profit schools is twice as high as at public institutions - meaning they are charging too much for the quality of education they are providing - at expense to the public. For-Profit Colleges

More students can obtain college educations with less public money and with less money from the students themselves if we eliminate loans for for-profit institutions and re-direct them for use at public and non-for-profit private institutions.

I was wondering where you were going with this.

So, government loans can only be used to get educations at government institutions?

Perhaps I wasn't clear enough in my original post. Or maybe you just didn't ******* read it all the way through because you're lazy. I have highlighted in large letters the blatant answer to your question.

What next, government loans can only be used to start government contractors? Government education can only be used to further careers in Government Sponsored Enterprises?

While I agree with your assessment of for-profit colleges (most are shams for academic purposes), there is still a great benefit to society for them and they serve as an excellent source of competition for traditional universities.

No they don't. For profit and not-for-profit institutions aren't competing for the same thing. For-profits are competing for profit - that's it. Not-for-profits compete for the highest quality professors and students and for a lot of other things - but not for the most profit.

Federal student aid is there to promulgate the goals of people, not to have them be indoctrinated. And while most online programs are crap, plenty are quite good to serve the needs of those seeking a better career. Argosy sucks, but it's better than a literature degree from Columbia if you work for Allstate.

I do not doubt that there are worthwhile online degrees. I doubt that they would come from profit seeking institutions, however.

 

[Avatar4321]

Avatar Templar, super dupers lol, read about Bushies deregulating online schooling so their cronies could rip off returning vets, more than half the growth in bad loans are those BS u's. You'd think ignorance were a virtue you're so gd ignorant and proud of it...

When on earth have we ever showed pride in any post you've written?