No Indictment in Eric Garner Case

[RKMBrown]

Holly shit, looked into this some more... so the EMTs got there and did nothing. The guy passes out stops breathing, after complaining that he can't breathe. The cops won't let anyone help him, won't do cpr, won't check to see if he's breathing. The EMTs get there and don't do CPR. WTF ?

Guess thats why they were provided immunity.

Pretty sick stuff. They act like killing a citizen is no different than taking out the trash. Nutz.

 

[Asclepias]

You miss the point. A billy club to the back of the knees would have quickly taken him down.

So you would rather he be beaten with a billy club than wrestled down by hand?

Billy clubs dont kill people.

of course they can.

No they cant. I've never seen a billyclub to the back of someones leg kill them.

Until the fat guy falls down hits his head and dies or he still has the heart attack anyway.

Getting lowered to the ground is better than getting beat with clubs any day

Why would he hit his head? Its instinct to put your hands out when you fall.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

Was anyone actually expecting the State to prosecute it's own?

I mean....




The farm hands do their best and the farmer backs them up. Occasionally one of the cattle does not comply in a manner that the farmer's helpers like. When that happens sometimes the cattle get killed. The farmer ain't pleased too much but he aint going to put good farm help in the pasture with the herd.

Come one, people.,

No but I thought they would be too embarrassed to keep it from going to trail.

The grand jury is not the state it is "the people"

The State needs Statists. "The People" is a myth perp'ed by Statists.

 

[RKMBrown]

So you would rather he be beaten with a billy club than wrestled down by hand?

Billy clubs dont kill people.

of course they can.

No they cant. I've never seen a billyclub to the back of someones leg kill them.

Until the fat guy falls down hits his head and dies or he still has the heart attack anyway.

Getting lowered to the ground is better than getting beat with clubs any day

Why would he hit his head? Its instinct to put your hands out when you fall.

They were holding his arms behind him.

 

[Skull Pilot]

So you would rather he be beaten with a billy club than wrestled down by hand?

Billy clubs dont kill people.

of course they can.

No they cant. I've never seen a billyclub to the back of someones leg kill them.

Until the fat guy falls down hits his head and dies or he still has the heart attack anyway.

Getting lowered to the ground is better than getting beat with clubs any day

Why would he hit his head? Its instinct to put your hands out when you fall.

Yeah and people never hit their head when they fall because of instinct

You know I just rewatched the video and the cop had his arm around Garner's neck for less than 10 seconds.

Sorry but that did not kill him

 

[ClosedCaption]

I'm still asking what reason....Are you saying the coroner is lying? Doesnt know what hes talking about? Or is it a secret?

I'm saying he listed way more than one contributing factor yet you say the choke hold killed him. If the choke hold was the singular cause of death you should be able to show me where it says that

So you want to indict a glass of kool-aid then? Yeah it was the choke hold, lack of oxygen, he was fat, there were guys on top of him...it was hot.

so there wasn't just one cause of death.

And tell me if who do you indict? The one guy who used the so called choke hold that still allowed Garner to talk, the guy kneeling on his head? One or more of the cops holding his body down?

And you wonder why the one cop was not indicted? I wouldn't have indicted him either. Reasonable doubt and all that

Obviously you would indict his refrigerator

I'm of the mind that Garner caused his own death. His behavior is the root cause of his death.

Thats not on the list of cause silly

 

[georgephillip]

Wikipedia? Really dude?

What's the problem...not enough advertising?

 

[ThatsRight-Uknow]

You know whats wrong here? People thinking they can resist arrest. You are risking your life when you resist arrest, and frankly that is the way it should be. If a cop arrests you, then go calmly and quietly.
If you resist, well, nothing good is going to happen from that point on. Not to mention, they can add more charges such as assaulting an officer, resisting arrest, disorderly conduct, etc. So if you are getting arrested, then calmly follow the officers instructions.
Would you rather police act like scared wusses when they come to your house trying to save your life? How would you want an officer to treat someone who just robbed you at gunpoint? Think about that before you protest.
Also, you cannot hold an entire department or government accountable for the actions of one or two men. Oh, and dont forget, if it just so happens that a black officer accidentally kills a white man, it wont even make the news!

 

[Mindful]

For the parser.

"Deceased" is not uncommon.

"The deceased is heard saying he can’t breathe numerous times on the video."

A Tangled Web Blog Archive The Sidewalks of New York 8211 The Garner Killing

 

[Clementine]

They aren't releasing all the evidence that the grand jury was given. They would have been shown the autopsy results, which likely showed that Garner's death was more due to existing conditions than the actions of the officer. The only way to prevent this in the future would be for officers to do nothing and let criminals go free or for suspects to call a time out to inform them that they have health issues. Can't really see that happening. Clearly, that is not the solution. The best way to prevent this sort of thing would be for criminals to change their ways and for anyone confronted by police to fully cooperate. Of course, that won't happen because they don't want to get caught. Seems to me that if you are in bad health, or not, and decide to fight police, the choice was completely yours and you should bear responsibility for the consequences. The choke hold is not banned, as some claim, and this case proves that physical exertion is a very bad idea for those with heart conditions. Garner made a very stupid choice to start fighting. Sad that it cost him his life, but it was his choice.

Bottom line is that the officer used an approved method for constraining a combative suspect and had no idea that it would end that way due to the guy's health.

From the link:

"Pataleo's lawyer and police union officials argued that the grand jury got it right, saying that the officer used an authorized takedown move — not a banned chokehold — against a man who was resisting arrest. And they said Garner's poor health was the main cause of his death.
To find Pantaleo criminally negligent, the grand jury would have had to determine he knew there was a "substantial risk" that Garner would die."

http://news.yahoo.com/chokehold-decision-highlights-complex-jury-process-062504221.html

Has anyone described the difference between this approved method and the banned choke hold? Looked just like a choke hold to me.

Don't know. What the cop did was deemed to be allowed, so that's that. Either change the rules or accept it. I want to know why the guy got combative and what police are supposed to do when that happens.

One thing we probably all agree on is that cops should all wear body cameras. I am tired of lying witnesses in so many cases and lack of evidence.

Thats the problem. I was under the impression anything even slightly resembling a choke hold was illegal. So if they just say "approved method" then its ok?

Apparently. They stated that whatever the guy did was an approved method. You'd have to ask whoever makes decisions regarding the NYC police dept.

 

[georgephillip]

"The deceased is heard saying he can’t breathe numerous times on the video."

"A Grand Jury refused to indict a white police officer who used a choke hold (against regulations but not illegal) on a black man named Eric Garner who was on a sidewalk in New York’s Staten Island Borough.

"The man was suspected of selling loose (untaxed) cigarets.

"The incident was captured on film, rendering the Grand Jury decision virtually incomprehensible.

"The deceased is heard saying he can’t breathe numerous times on the video.

"The suspect’s crime was so low level the attempted arrest defies logic.

"And while a large man, his resistance was pretty minimal.
"It is fair to say he apparently had over 30 prior arrests, but it seems they were of a petty crime nature.

"He also had health issues, but the medical examiner ruled the primary cause of death was due to the choking.

"He certainly presented zero danger to the half dozen cops involved (all were given immunity except for the one who used the choke hold)."

A Tangled Web Blog Archive The Sidewalks of New York 8211 The Garner Killing

 

[MACAULAY]

I have been reading along and, except for a couple of assholes, this thread seems about like the debate I would expect to hear from 25 Grand Jurors trying in good faith to effect justice.

If I was on the Grand Jury, and knowing just what I know from the video and the opinions I have read and heard, well....ELEVEN..... "I can't breathe" s" is way too many.

I would have voted for an indictment of Involuntary Manslaughter.

I was at work one day and a fellow worker started saying I can't breathe and no one was touching him he was just having a heart attack.

For all we know or for all the cops knew for that matter was he was just saying that. People say all kinds of things when they are getting arrested and it doesn't make them all true.

IMO if he really couldn't breathe he wouldn't have been able to say anything at all

_______________________________________________________

So, your position is that he was likely lying when he conveyed this to the Cops eleven times, and so the Cops were reasonable to ignore him. I wonder why he chose "I can't breahe" to lie to the Cops about.

If I gonna lie to the Cops, I am gonna say: "I Didn't do it." Or something like that.

"I can't breathe" ELEVEN times to four Cops on top of him ought to have conveyed some distress, even desperation, and the fact that it didn't is negligence so gross as to be culpable. It seems to me anyway.

 

[ThatsRight-Uknow]

It is disheartening that the officers nor others were able to give Eric Garner medical care in time to possibly save his life. Otherwise, there was no wrong doing IMO. Perhaps Police Departments should improve their policies on post-arrest medical care.

 

[Boss]

Okay, for all of you libtards who are defending Eric Garner here, let me ask you a hypothetical...

Let's say I am speeding down the highway in a stolen car after I've robbed a liquor store... and the cop sees me speeding so he pulls me over. He runs my tag to find that my car is stolen, so he pulls his gun and slowly approaches my car telling me to keep my hands in sight and exit the car... If the shock and trauma of his pulling me over causes me to suddenly have a heart attack and die... does the officer become a scapegoat and lose his career?

Oh.. I forgot... I'm black and the officer is white.

 

[Clementine]

Now we know who was in charge of the arrest and was calling the shots. Oddly, despite video being available, the person isn't seen in the video that the media has been replaying constantly. I wonder why that is.

From the link:


Pantaleo who applied the lethal chokehold on Eric Garner was supervised by an African-American female NYPD sergeant.
….
"Having that Black sergeant in charge of that crime scene takes race out of the equation. As awful as Pantaleo’s actions appear on that video, at no time does that Black sergeant order Pantaleo to stop choking Garner."

--------------------

The Black female police sergeant who was in charge of the arrest is not shown in the countless TV replays in the media of cellphone footage that showed White male police officers confronting and taking down Garner but she is said to be seen in the original video (the Grand Jury saw).

Why haven’t we seen that unedited video in the countless media showings? Can you guess?

From a police report reported by PIX11 in July, the sergeant’s name is revealed to be Kizzy Adoni.

"The female sergeant, Kizzy Adoni, made a similar statement in the report. She "believed she heard" Garner say he was having difficulty breathing. Adoni also said "The perpetrator’s condition did not seem serious and he did not appear to get worse."

--------------------

Call it excessive force. Call it involuntary manslaughter. Call it justified force against a resisting suspect, who died from his substantial health problems rather than a chokehold. These may well be legitimate arguments to bring to the table.

But not race. This case has nothing to do with it. And the continued media-Democrat focus on it is clear political manipulation to distract from Obama’s recent shellacking in the midterm elections and deeply unpopular executive action amnesty for illegal aliens.

The major outrage here is: why was Eric Garner even bothered to begin with? Why did Pantaleo’s Black female supervisor decide to arrest Garner for the nonsensical "crime" of selling cigarettes on the street?


Because the same Bill DeBlasio who hysterically blamed racism for Garner’s death himself stepped up enforcement of such petty crimes in order to increase taxes, while cancelling the successful "stop and frisk" program that reduced crime to record low levels in the decimated Black communities.

Those cops were there harassing Garner because of Democrat tax greed, not because he was Black. Where is the outrage over that?

http://toprightnews.com/?p=7474

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

BOSS SAID:

“Okay, for all of you libtards who are defending Eric Garner...”

The ignorance exhibited by you and most others on the right is remarkable, not surprising, but remarkable nonetheless.

No one is 'defending' Garner, there's nothing to 'defend.'

In their attempt to detain Garner, the police used unauthorized, unwarranted excessive force that resulted in his wrongful death.

It is that unauthorized, unwarranted excessive force which is at issue, not Garner's words or actions.

 

[Kondor3]

The split second that Garner refused to submit to arrest or handcuffing, his status 'graduated' from illegal sales of 'loosies', to Resisting Arrest.

Resisting Arrest opens-up a whole different Can of Whoop-Ass, and removes a whole bunch-a barriers to the use of force.

The dumb lard-ass should not have resisted arrest.

This is doubly-true for someone who knew his health was so poor that he could not withstand a few seconds of wrestling with a handful of cops.

I feel sorry for the guy, and his family, but, the truth of the matter is - both legally and ethically - he brought this down upon his own head.

Perhaps, in the next life, he'll know better, and submit to arrest.

 

[Politico]

People with heart conditions can have a heart attack just from getting really upset. The typical chokehold doesn't kill anyone. I've seen people crying and yelling for police to let go of their spouses and not because they are being hurt, but because they don't want them arrested.

It's sad that the guy died, but the cop was merely subduing a suspect that fought. How was he supposed to know the guy's heart was a ticking time bomb? When you resist, cops will do what they need to take you down.

Hindsight is always 20/20, but you have to put yourself in the cop's place at the time. Taking down a suspect who is fighting you isn't something that is done gently. Little hard when you are literally fighting with the person to get them to stop and sit still. Had the guy cooperated, it might have been different, but then maybe not. If he had not encountered police and gone home, there is a good chance he was on the verge of a heart attack already.

We weren't privy to all the evidence presented to the grand jury, but they would have had to see proof that the cop knowingly and willfully harmed the guy. I don't see how the cop could have known about the guy's condition. It's possible the guy didn't know how bad off his heart was.

If a person is choked to death, they die on the spot. An autopsy would have shown the cause of death. Without knowing all the details, it's too hard to judge. I would guess the grand jury had information not released to the public yet.

I know police use the chokehold all the time and this is rare, so there must have been other things at play here, like the guy's general health. I just can't buy that a cop murdered someone in front of witnesses. I really can't believe that.

The death was ruled a homicide. You can't be this stupid. Are you spoofing to make RWnuts look bad?

Dude, you're making liberals look bad every time you post.

If you agree with the imbecile Clementine then defend her retarded post. Otherwise shut up.

I agree with Clementine's post, so you stfu.

So the death was ruled a homicide, but that is not cause enough to let a jury decide the degree of criminality that may have been involved in the HOMICIDE?

lol

Jesus I wish you people would be willing to drop the left/right BS, stop starting a hundred threads and have an honest discussion. This situation was about overcharging as it often is. The question in front of the grand jury was whether this guy murdered him. He did not nor was it his intention. So they did their job and voted a “no-bill,” which means the specific criminal charges alleged had not been sufficiently supported by the evidence presented to warrant prosecution. There was some wrongdoing here on a variety of levels. But it was not that. So if you want to be honest and argue that fine. But quit it with the partisan race crap.

 

[Boss]

BOSS SAID:

“Okay, for all of you libtards who are defending Eric Garner...”

The ignorance exhibited by you and most others on the right is remarkable, not surprising, but remarkable nonetheless.

No one is 'defending' Garner, there's nothing to 'defend.'

In their attempt to detain Garner, the police used unauthorized, unwarranted excessive force that resulted in his wrongful death.

It is that unauthorized, unwarranted excessive force which is at issue, not Garner's words or actions.

Oh it's much worse than "defending Garner" ...I was just being nice about it. What the left is doing is using the unfortunate death of this man to incite racial riots, make false racial allegations, attack law enforcement and the grand jury process. Your left-wing kook attorney general is about to launch a federal civil rights investigation when there is absolutely NO indication this had anything to do with racism.

Garner was being arrested for breaking the law and he resisted arrest. At this point, a rational person has to ask, what were the police supposed to do? Beg Mr. Garner's pardon and wish him well in his entrepreneurial enterprise? Seriously... what are the cops supposed to do whenever someone resists arrest? No one on the left seems to want to answer this question.

And what other options did the cops have? Tazers? Pepper spray? Would that have been more "healthy" for Mr. Garner? I'm honestly out of ideas as to options for subduing someone who is resisting arrest. So all I can assume here is the left thinks the cops should have simply shrugged their shoulders and said... meh, the guy doesn't want to be arrested today! Oh well!

The bottom line here is not that the police used unwarranted or unauthorized excessive force, it is that Mr. Gardner resisted arrest and his choice of actions resulted in his untimely death. If feel sorry for his family and I wish that he had chosen differently, but I can't blame the cops for doing their job.

 

[reason10]

Jesus Christ...do you seriously believe the garbage you just said here?

Naw. I just make shit up to screw with liberals' heads. WHAT IS IT ABOUT REALITY YOU ARE HAVING SO MUCH TROUBLE DEALING WITH?

You want a society of Gestapo-style law enforcement where they can basically do anything they want to you and you have little to no recourse.

Of course not. If I did, I would vote for Democrats. In THIS particular case, the police were responding to a complaint from minority store owners. They had a warrant for his arrest. The laws against resisting arrest have been around for a long time.

I guess you want a country where a guy gets pulled over for speeding and get's shot to death because he called the officer an asshole.
What a dumb opinion. I am sorry - but your statement is beyond ridiculous.

This moron wasn't driving a car. He didn't get shot. His OBESITY got him killed. His RESISTING ARREST got him killed.

The situation was escalated beyond reason. At least ONE of those officers should have calmed things down and realized that it isn't worth all of this simply because the power whore officers felt disrespected.

The officers were the ones trying to calm things down. And this fat perp RESISTED ARREST. They weren't going to just walk away from this moron. They were under orders. If this water buffalo had just gone along quietly, he would have likely survived.

He did this to himself.