Next time you hear someone criticizing socialism...

[The Irish Ram]

At it's worst, this country was strong enough to turn around and liberate the world, so...
Ask yourself what the world has gained from this capitalist country since it's inception. Life changing gains like light, skyscrapers, assembly lines, automobiles and all the rest.
Capitalism allows ideas to thrive. Socialism stifles achievement.

You mean regulated capitalism.

Whatever you call it, you'd all be speaking German if it wasn't for us, and our assembly lines, technology, and guts...

 

[EvilCat Breath]

The early 1900s shows us that unregulated capitalism will destroy itself .

It actually showed us that capitalism will right itself. Socialism never recovers. It requires a massive upheaval.

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

Ask them how well capitalism was doing in 1929.
View attachment 245504 View attachment 245506 View attachment 245505

To the extent that capitalism’s problems – inequality, instability (cycles/crises), etc. – stem in part from its production relationships, reforms focused exclusively on regulating or supplanting markets will not succeed in solving them. For example, Keynesian monetary policies (focused on raising or lowering the quantity of money in circulation and, correspondingly, interest rates) do not touch the employer-employee relationship, however much their variations redistribute wealth, regulate markets, or displace markets in favor of state-administered investment decisions. Likewise, Keynesian fiscal policies (raising or lowering taxes and government spending) do not address the employer-employee relationship.

Keynesian policies also never ended the cyclical instability of capitalism. The New Deal and European social democracy left capitalism in place in both state and private units (enterprises) of production notwithstanding their massive reform agendas and programs. They thereby left capitalist employers facing the incentives and receiving the resources (profits) to evade, weaken and eventually dissolve most of those programs.

It is far better not to distribute wealth unequally in the first place than to re-distribute it after to undo the inequality. For example, FDR proposed in 1944 that the government establish a maximum income alongside a minimum wage; that is one among the various ways inequality could be limited and thereby redistribution avoided. Efforts to redistribute encounter evasions, oppositions, and failures that compound the effects of unequal distribution itself. Social peace and cohesion are the victims of redistribution sooner or later. Reforming markets while leaving the relations/organization of capitalist production unchanged is like redistribution. Just as redistribution schemes fail to solve the problems rooted in distribution, market-focused reforms fail to solve the problems rooted in production.

Since 2008, capitalism has showed us all yet again its deep and unsolved problems of cyclical instability, deepening inequality and the injustices they both entail. Their persistence mirrors that of the capitalist organization of production. To successfully confront and solve the problems of economic cycles, income and wealth inequality, and so on, we need to go beyond the capitalist employer-employee system of production. The democratization of enterprises – transitioning from employer-employee hierarchies to worker cooperatives – is a key way available here and now to realize the change we need.

Worker coops democratically decide the distribution of income (wages, bonuses, benefits, profit shares, etc.) among their members. No small group of owners and the boards of directors they choose would, as in capitalist corporations, make such decisions. Thus, for example, it would be far less likely that a few individuals in a worker coop would earn millions while most others could not afford to send children to college. A democratic worker coop decision on the distribution of enterprise income would be far less unequal than what typifies capitalist enterprises. A socialism for the 21st century could and should include the transition from a capitalist to a worker-coop-based economic system as central to its commitments to less inequality and less social conflict over redistribution.

Capitalism Is Not the “Market System”

Ask them about 1922.

 

[the other mike]

Washington is the modern day Rome.
Fall of the Western Roman Empire - Wikipedia

 

[dblack]

Here’s the reply you’ll get : “that’s not socialism “. As much as Cons talk about the democrats socialism, none of them can you an example of it .

By definition it wasn't

do you know the definition of socialism?

He does seem a tad confused.

 

[dblack]

By definition it wasn't

do you know the definition of socialism?

I do . The real definition , not the bastardize version Cons use aka “anything the gov does that helps people”.

but nothing the government does ever helps people

That’s not true .

yes it is,,, because they have to use a gun to do it

Really ?

We are talking over the internet . Which was created and promoted by the government. Was that done wh a gun ?

Yep. It wasn't necessary, but that's what they did.

 

[dblack]

There is no good in unfettered freedom or control in the long run.

"Unfettered" - that's a favorite word of the left these days. What does it mean to you? How is it different than "unlimited". Because I'd agree that unlimited freedom is an oxymoron. "Your freedom to swing your fist ends at the tip of my nose" is a pithy phrase that expresses how and why freedom must be limited. But somehow, I'm guessing "fettering" is different.

 

[Indeependent]

There is no good in unfettered freedom or control in the long run.

"Unfettered" - that's a favorite word of the left these days. What does it mean to you? How is it different than "unlimited". Because I'd agree that unlimited freedom is an oxymoron. "Your freedom to swing your fist ends at the tip of my nose" is a pithy phrase that expresses how and why freedom must be limited. But somehow, I'm guessing "fettering" is different.

You are free to move to any Libertarian country that doesn’t exist.

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

"Unfettered" - that's a favorite word of the left these days. What does it mean to you? How is it different than "unlimited". Because I'd agree that unlimited freedom is an oxymoron. "Your freedom to swing your fist ends at the tip of my nose" is a pithy phrase that expresses how and why freedom must be limited. But somehow, I'm guessing "fettering" is different.

My guess is it means that he wants to control you on issues he values, but when it comes to what you want, fuck your rights, as far as he is concerned. That's the general attitude of most people. They don't see the value in other people's freedom. They want their freedom and nobody else's.



.

 

[dblack]

There is no good in unfettered freedom or control in the long run.

"Unfettered" - that's a favorite word of the left these days. What does it mean to you? How is it different than "unlimited". Because I'd agree that unlimited freedom is an oxymoron. "Your freedom to swing your fist ends at the tip of my nose" is a pithy phrase that expresses how and why freedom must be limited. But somehow, I'm guessing "fettering" is different.

You are free to move to any Libertarian country that doesn’t exist.

So far. Depends on how that wall business pans out.

Regardless, ... I'll stay here and fight for the freedom. Fetter the fetterers you might say.

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

You are free to move to any Libertarian country that doesn’t exist.

Likewise, you're free to move to any buttfucking communist country you want. There are at least 100 of them. There is only one America. We have nowhere else to go. So, fuck you. Stop trying to rid the world of the only free place left.

.

 

[Cellblock2429]

Here’s the reply you’ll get : “that’s not socialism “. As much as Cons talk about the democrats socialism, none of them can you an example of it .

/——/ Lets see how the experts you admire define it: "The goal of socialism is communism." - Vladimir Lenin

 

[The Original Tree]

The only function of Socialism is to enrich the oligarchy and enslave the peasants to a mundane subsistence existence.

 

[Cellblock2429]

The only function of Socialism is to enrich the oligarchy and enslave the peasants to a mundane subsistence existence.

/——/ "The goal of socialism is communism." - Vladimir Lenin

 

[the other mike]

They don't see the value in other people's freedom.

How do you think the 30 million people of Venezuela value the freedom of the United States to impose harsh economic sanctions on them or tell them who's president of their own country ?

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

How do you think the 30 million people of Venezuela value the freedom of the United States to tell them who's president of their own country ?

You will get no argument from me on that point.

If the people of Venezuela are being screwed by their government, they should rise up and overthrow it.



Not really our concern.

.

 

[Mac1958]

Worker co-ops?

What a sad, dark life to wish for.

 

[Stormy Daniels]

This is like saying radiation treatment is an imperfect solution to cancer, so leech therapy shouldn't be criticized.

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

/——/ "The goal of socialism is communism." - Vladimir Lenin

But, the result of communism is socialism.

That's why no person with a brain believes communism can ever work (or socialism, for that matter).

.

 

[dblack]

Socialists deny that their ambitions are totalitarian. But their stated goals say otherwise. Here's the first paragraph from 'What is Democratic Socialism' on the Democratic Socialists of America's website:

What is Democratic Socialism? - Democratic Socialists of America (DSA)

Democratic socialists believe that both the economy and society should be run democratically—to meet public needs, not to make profits for a few. To achieve a more just society, many structures of our government and economy must be radically transformed through greater economic and social democracy so that ordinary Americans can participate in the many decisions that affect our lives.

They want the economy, and society, to be "run" democratically. Think about that. What else is left? What else is beyond their control if they run the economy and society?