New York city submits to Islam

[irosie91]

As a Christian why would I defend anyone who killed people in a church? In fact I don’t recall defending this asshole at any time. I simply said his atheism was not the motivating factor in killing people in that church.

He went there because his in-laws attended that church. He killed his wife’s grandmother there. It’s not like the family would have let them in if he’d gone to their home. They would have called the cops when he pulled in the driveway.

He couldn’t have “just killed his wife” because they’re not together.

true------so you agree that the family murder of passion was
nothing like TERRORISM

Every public mass shooting is terrorism, regardless of motive. There are hundreds of definitions of what constitutes terrorism around the world but the only consensus is that it involves violence or the threat of violence.

American law defines it as violence in pursuit of idealogical goals but the Americans don’t want to face the fact that there are many acts of terrorism perpetrated with no goal other than to kill or injure as many people as possible. The Boston bombing springs to mind, the Las Vegas shooting, the Aurora movie theatre killing, Sandy Hook, Columbine.

Anericans don’t define these attacks as terrorism because they would have to do something other than wring their hands over them, and send prayers and condolences. Prayers aren’t working.

I consider your theory on "terrorism" as any BIG VIOLENT ACT------to be silly and trite. Terrorism as a political or ideological TOOL is the issue of lots of national programs.
Terrorism as a psychosis-----is a subject for psychiatry and
criminology

 

[irosie91]

a very FRINGE group. -------people who worship cheese are also nuts------but harmless.

I do not agree with you.

Leftwing Christian haters are not a very fringe group, but a majority.

a majority of WHAT? all americans? all registered
democrats? all democratic Hispanics? All democratic
Irish? All democratic Italians? All democratic Jews?
All democratic greeks?

A majority of Leftwing ideologues who hate Christians.

It's not so difficult to understand. Period.

try to clarify------you said a MAJORITY----now it is
'those left wing ideologues who hate Christians"---
how about those republican ideologues who hate Christians
or those UTOPIAN FASCIST ideologues who hate Christians?

Communists?

You can't be that thick irosie91.....

then again you can.

sweet talk will get you nowhere, skye

 

[skye]

I do not agree with you.

Leftwing Christian haters are not a very fringe group, but a majority.

a majority of WHAT? all americans? all registered
democrats? all democratic Hispanics? All democratic
Irish? All democratic Italians? All democratic Jews?
All democratic greeks?

A majority of Leftwing ideologues who hate Christians.

It's not so difficult to understand. Period.

try to clarify------you said a MAJORITY----now it is
'those left wing ideologues who hate Christians"---
how about those republican ideologues who hate Christians
or those UTOPIAN FASCIST ideologues who hate Christians?

Communists?

You can't be that thick irosie91.....

then again you can.

sweet talk will get you nowhere, skye

But you being a smartass with me will?

Go play with somebody else.

 

[Dragonlady]

As a Christian why would I defend anyone who killed people in a church? In fact I don’t recall defending this asshole at any time. I simply said his atheism was not the motivating factor in killing people in that church.

He went there because his in-laws attended that church. He killed his wife’s grandmother there. It’s not like the family would have let them in if he’d gone to their home. They would have called the cops when he pulled in the driveway.

He couldn’t have “just killed his wife” because they’re not together.

true------so you agree that the family murder of passion was
nothing like TERRORISM

Every public mass shooting is terrorism, regardless of motive. There are hundreds of definitions of what constitutes terrorism around the world but the only consensus is that it involves violence or the threat of violence.

American law defines it as violence in pursuit of idealogical goals but the Americans don’t want to face the fact that there are many acts of terrorism perpetrated with no goal other than to kill or injure as many people as possible. The Boston bombing springs to mind, the Las Vegas shooting, the Aurora movie theatre killing, Sandy Hook, Columbine.

Anericans don’t define these attacks as terrorism because they would have to do something other than wring their hands over them, and send prayers and condolences. Prayers aren’t working.

I consider your theory on "terrorism" as any BIG VIOLENT ACT------to be silly and trite. Terrorism as a political or ideological TOOL is the issue of lots of national programs.
Terrorism as a psychosis-----is a subject for psychiatry and
criminology

“Terrorism as a psychosis”??? Do you mean “Terrorism as a result of psychosis” because your term doesn’t make sense. Terrorism as a result of psychosis is still terrorism. People are dead, the survivors are frightened and terrified.

This article defines terrorism as “violence to a achieve a political, psychological or idealogical goal”. Which is what I’ve been saying.

It has come out that the Vegas shooter considered himself one of the Vegas “elites” and the casinos treated him as such. But in the past year, he had suffered a series of financial losses which may have triggered his desire to assert his power and status. His attack meets every criteria of your definition of terrorism except the political or idealogical goal, but it does achieve a psychological goal for the shooter.

Medscape: Medscape Access

 

[irosie91]

As a Christian why would I defend anyone who killed people in a church? In fact I don’t recall defending this asshole at any time. I simply said his atheism was not the motivating factor in killing people in that church.

He went there because his in-laws attended that church. He killed his wife’s grandmother there. It’s not like the family would have let them in if he’d gone to their home. They would have called the cops when he pulled in the driveway.

He couldn’t have “just killed his wife” because they’re not together.

true------so you agree that the family murder of passion was
nothing like TERRORISM

Every public mass shooting is terrorism, regardless of motive. There are hundreds of definitions of what constitutes terrorism around the world but the only consensus is that it involves violence or the threat of violence.

American law defines it as violence in pursuit of idealogical goals but the Americans don’t want to face the fact that there are many acts of terrorism perpetrated with no goal other than to kill or injure as many people as possible. The Boston bombing springs to mind, the Las Vegas shooting, the Aurora movie theatre killing, Sandy Hook, Columbine.

Anericans don’t define these attacks as terrorism because they would have to do something other than wring their hands over them, and send prayers and condolences. Prayers aren’t working.

I consider your theory on "terrorism" as any BIG VIOLENT ACT------to be silly and trite. Terrorism as a political or ideological TOOL is the issue of lots of national programs.
Terrorism as a psychosis-----is a subject for psychiatry and
criminology

“Terrorism as a psychosis”??? Do you mean “Terrorism as a result of psychosis” because your term doesn’t make sense. Terrorism as a result of psychosis is still terrorism. People are dead, the survivors are frightened and terrified.

This article defines terrorism as “violence to a achieve a political, psychological or idealogical goal”. Which is what I’ve been saying.

It has come out that the Vegas shooter considered himself one of the Vegas “elites” and the casinos treated him as such. But in the past year, he had suffered a series of financial losses which may have triggered his desire to assert his power and status. His attack meets every criteria of your definition of terrorism except the political or idealogical goal, but it does achieve a psychological goal for the shooter.

Medscape: Medscape Access

you are playing with semantics. Medscape has nothing
on me in the field of psychiatry which is one of my subspecialties. The actions of a psychotic do not meet
the criteria of "terrorism". However psychotics CAN be
terrorists. What is a "psychological goal" ? Try not to use
terms that you do not understand. I do not understand why
you are suddenly addressing the VEGAS SHOOTER----
that he had financial setbacks and ego issues does not
make him a terrorist. He was probably psychotic, however. Did you know that the consensus amongst the world's foremost psychiatrists is ADOLF HITLER was not psychotic? He, certainly, engaged in terrorism

 

[jasonnfree]

Dragon----your problem is that you imagine that you are smart---but you are not. There are very big differences between insanity and Islamic ideology-----you want to deny that fact?

Yes there are differences between insanity and jihadist ideology but if both result in innocents being slaughtered there is absolutely no difference to the victims, their families or their communities.

Both attacks terrorize the victims and the survivors. Do you think it somehow helps the survivors or the communities heal to know that a deranged man with a long history of violence and mental illness, who should never have had access to guns, shot up their church and killed them rather than a member of ISIS? You think that will make it easier to heal.

Dead is dead. It doesn’t matter if your shot by a neighbour or a jihadist, you’re dead. Witnesses are terrorized and communities torn apart.

You ban people from flying because they’re potentially terrorists but you still sell them guns. Does that even make sense to you? No you can’t fly to grandma’s for Thanksgiving because we think you’re a risk to everyone on this plane but here take the money and go buy an AR 15. Enjoy!

Use common sense and logic.

I use lots of common sense-----terrorism leaves TERROR for the rest of the community and the COUNTRY----a murder leaves relatives and friends. Terrorism is on ongoing problem for the whole country----a straitjacket solves the social problem of murder by nut------in reference to a given nut. The destruction of WTC on 9-11-01 would be an entirely OTHER kind of event if it was a single pilot nut job

Such a great explanation of terrorism as opposed to murder or other violent acts you give, Irosie. Looks like those who've had political correctness hammered into them are not capable of seeing the difference, maybe?

 

[irosie91]

You're still trying to compare completely different things.
Muslim terrorism is a movement and an ideology. Mass murders commited by disturbed individuals are individual.

I get that you don’t want to equate them because because then you have no excuse to hate on Muslims but there is no difference. Both are planned, organized attacks with the goal of inflicting as much harm as possible.

The New York attacker was also individual. He was an ISIS sympathizer but he wasn’t under anyone’s direction or control. He planned his attack by himself and no one but the driver knew he was planning it.

I can see an argument for the 9/11 attacks being different. This was a planned organized attack carried out by Al Qaeda and funded and directed by Bin Laden.

nope----terrorism based on IDEOLOGY is not an isolated event even if it is not "controlled' by fellow ideologues and is
effectuated by a single person. I take it that you do not know muslims and have never been exposed to the "prayer" service in a mosque and the accompanying "sermon".

I know a LOT of Muslims. I lived in the most multi-cultural city in the world for 30 years. I worked with Muslims. We had Muslim neighbours, my daughter had Muslim teachers. Our firm used a Muslim-owned car service which I used every day. Some of the nicest people I ever met. Family oriented, decent, kind and respectful to others.

Saying that jihadists are representative of Muslims is like saying that the KKK is representative of Christians. It’s a lie.

You are comparing your experience with Muslims in Western Democracies with open societies to how life is for Muslims in Muslim countries? Ha ha ha.

No, I’m responding to a poster who says I don’t know any Muslims.

I have previously posted that the vast majority of Muslims hate ISIS just as much as we do. That’s because ISIS are Sunni Muslims who kill Shi’ite Muslims and makes sex slaves of their daughters too. These men are outliers even among other Muslims. Most of their victims are Muslims.

I’m well aware that Muslims who have emigrated here by choice are doing so because they want a better life and more opportunities for the families, which makes them no different than you and I.

you have AGAIN proven that you know nothing about actual MUSLIMS. If you imagine that sunni muslims in the US are
HORRIFIED when Shiite muslims are killed-----you are a joke.------of course you could be familiar with a few muslim professionals &/or businessmen. I doubt that you have ever been in a real mosque

 

[irosie91]

Dragon----your problem is that you imagine that you are smart---but you are not. There are very big differences between insanity and Islamic ideology-----you want to deny that fact?

Yes there are differences between insanity and jihadist ideology but if both result in innocents being slaughtered there is absolutely no difference to the victims, their families or their communities.

Both attacks terrorize the victims and the survivors. Do you think it somehow helps the survivors or the communities heal to know that a deranged man with a long history of violence and mental illness, who should never have had access to guns, shot up their church and killed them rather than a member of ISIS? You think that will make it easier to heal.

Dead is dead. It doesn’t matter if your shot by a neighbour or a jihadist, you’re dead. Witnesses are terrorized and communities torn apart.

You ban people from flying because they’re potentially terrorists but you still sell them guns. Does that even make sense to you? No you can’t fly to grandma’s for Thanksgiving because we think you’re a risk to everyone on this plane but here take the money and go buy an AR 15. Enjoy!

Use common sense and logic.

I use lots of common sense-----terrorism leaves TERROR for the rest of the community and the COUNTRY----a murder leaves relatives and friends. Terrorism is on ongoing problem for the whole country----a straitjacket solves the social problem of murder by nut------in reference to a given nut. The destruction of WTC on 9-11-01 would be an entirely OTHER kind of event if it was a single pilot nut job

Such a great explanation of terrorism as opposed to murder or other violent acts you give, Irosie. Looks like those who've had political correctness hammered into them are not capable of seeing the difference, maybe?

I have not provided an "EXPLANATION OF TERRORISM AS OPPOSED TO MURDER"-------I have simple made a single tiny point regarding a tiny difference between those two concepts

 

[Lastamender]

• The media began to paint Muslims as the victims of Saipov's attack -- not the dead and the wounded victims of the terrorist.
  
  
• "As a Muslim committed to fighting Islamism, I appeal to you: The need for strong
  New York City Submits to Islam

==========================================================================
Never let a good crisis go to waste you mean you didn't see this coming it's been in plain view. Trendy's won't notice a thing until it hits them personally and even then some are to fkn stupid to fend for their own rights as they suffer from a severe case of stock holm syndrome.

Other people won't care because their attitude is " oh who cares, that's in NY" well news flash if it's happened there it is very highly likely it can happen in your state / city fools.

Short attention span after the church shooting , you go right back after the Muslim.

They are not the same. Islam is an organized enemy of freedom. Crazies are crazies.

 

[theHawk]

As a Christian why would I defend anyone who killed people in a church? In fact I don’t recall defending this asshole at any time. I simply said his atheism was not the motivating factor in killing people in that church.

He went there because his in-laws attended that church. He killed his wife’s grandmother there. It’s not like the family would have let them in if he’d gone to their home. They would have called the cops when he pulled in the driveway.

He couldn’t have “just killed his wife” because they’re not together.

Wow, you really are this dumb. You’re claiming his ideology was not a motivating factor, yet his wife wasn’t even there. Why would he kill everyone else? You’re reasoning is completely illogical, her family wouldn’t open the door for him so he would never be able to kill just her? Your defense of this monster is disgusting. He targeted the church because his wife was Christian and he hated her for being Christian, because he hated all Christians. Just like many of your leftwing friends on this board.

 

[theHawk]

As a Christian why would I defend anyone who killed people in a church? In fact I don’t recall defending this asshole at any time. I simply said his atheism was not the motivating factor in killing people in that church.

He went there because his in-laws attended that church. He killed his wife’s grandmother there. It’s not like the family would have let them in if he’d gone to their home. They would have called the cops when he pulled in the driveway.

He couldn’t have “just killed his wife” because they’re not together.

true------so you agree that the family murder of passion was
nothing like TERRORISM

Every public mass shooting is terrorism, regardless of motive. There are hundreds of definitions of what constitutes terrorism around the world but the only consensus is that it involves violence or the threat of violence.

American law defines it as violence in pursuit of idealogical goals but the Americans don’t want to face the fact that there are many acts of terrorism perpetrated with no goal other than to kill or injure as many people as possible. The Boston bombing springs to mind, the Las Vegas shooting, the Aurora movie theatre killing, Sandy Hook, Columbine.

Americans don’t define these attacks as terrorism because they would have to do something other than wring their hands over them, and send prayers and condolences. Prayers aren’t working.

The Boston bombing was Islamic terrorism. Columbine was atheist terrorism, much like this church massacre.

 

[Penelope]

As a Christian why would I defend anyone who killed people in a church? In fact I don’t recall defending this asshole at any time. I simply said his atheism was not the motivating factor in killing people in that church.

He went there because his in-laws attended that church. He killed his wife’s grandmother there. It’s not like the family would have let them in if he’d gone to their home. They would have called the cops when he pulled in the driveway.

He couldn’t have “just killed his wife” because they’re not together.

true------so you agree that the family murder of passion was
nothing like TERRORISM

Every public mass shooting is terrorism, regardless of motive. There are hundreds of definitions of what constitutes terrorism around the world but the only consensus is that it involves violence or the threat of violence.

American law defines it as violence in pursuit of idealogical goals but the Americans don’t want to face the fact that there are many acts of terrorism perpetrated with no goal other than to kill or injure as many people as possible. The Boston bombing springs to mind, the Las Vegas shooting, the Aurora movie theatre killing, Sandy Hook, Columbine.

Americans don’t define these attacks as terrorism because they would have to do something other than wring their hands over them, and send prayers and condolences. Prayers aren’t working.

The Boston bombing was Islamic terrorism. Columbine was atheist terrorism, much like this church massacre.

You do not know he was an atheist. What was Tim McVeigh.

 

[theHawk]

As a Christian why would I defend anyone who killed people in a church? In fact I don’t recall defending this asshole at any time. I simply said his atheism was not the motivating factor in killing people in that church.

He went there because his in-laws attended that church. He killed his wife’s grandmother there. It’s not like the family would have let them in if he’d gone to their home. They would have called the cops when he pulled in the driveway.

He couldn’t have “just killed his wife” because they’re not together.

true------so you agree that the family murder of passion was
nothing like TERRORISM

Every public mass shooting is terrorism, regardless of motive. There are hundreds of definitions of what constitutes terrorism around the world but the only consensus is that it involves violence or the threat of violence.

American law defines it as violence in pursuit of idealogical goals but the Americans don’t want to face the fact that there are many acts of terrorism perpetrated with no goal other than to kill or injure as many people as possible. The Boston bombing springs to mind, the Las Vegas shooting, the Aurora movie theatre killing, Sandy Hook, Columbine.

Americans don’t define these attacks as terrorism because they would have to do something other than wring their hands over them, and send prayers and condolences. Prayers aren’t working.

The Boston bombing was Islamic terrorism. Columbine was atheist terrorism, much like this church massacre.

You do not know he was an atheist. What was Tim McVeigh.

He identified as agnostic.

 

[Roudy]

Does anybody realize that the NY terrorist who ran over people with a truck had two very young kids himself? Just imagine, he did what he did knowing that he will die and his kids will grow up fatherless. Trump was wrong calling him an animal, at least an animal would care for its own offspring.

 

[Penelope]

As a Christian why would I defend anyone who killed people in a church? In fact I don’t recall defending this asshole at any time. I simply said his atheism was not the motivating factor in killing people in that church.

He went there because his in-laws attended that church. He killed his wife’s grandmother there. It’s not like the family would have let them in if he’d gone to their home. They would have called the cops when he pulled in the driveway.

He couldn’t have “just killed his wife” because they’re not together.

true------so you agree that the family murder of passion was
nothing like TERRORISM

Every public mass shooting is terrorism, regardless of motive. There are hundreds of definitions of what constitutes terrorism around the world but the only consensus is that it involves violence or the threat of violence.

American law defines it as violence in pursuit of idealogical goals but the Americans don’t want to face the fact that there are many acts of terrorism perpetrated with no goal other than to kill or injure as many people as possible. The Boston bombing springs to mind, the Las Vegas shooting, the Aurora movie theatre killing, Sandy Hook, Columbine.

Americans don’t define these attacks as terrorism because they would have to do something other than wring their hands over them, and send prayers and condolences. Prayers aren’t working.

The Boston bombing was Islamic terrorism. Columbine was atheist terrorism, much like this church massacre.

You do not know he was an atheist. What was Tim McVeigh.

He identified as agnostic.

It doesn't matter what he identified as, both did what they did because of pent up anger and rage. I know on Fox they say people lack faith, turned away from God, that is a lame excuse.

 

[Penelope]

• The media began to paint Muslims as the victims of Saipov's attack -- not the dead and the wounded victims of the terrorist.
  
  
• "As a Muslim committed to fighting Islamism, I appeal to you: The need for strong
  New York City Submits to Islam

==========================================================================
Never let a good crisis go to waste you mean you didn't see this coming it's been in plain view. Trendy's won't notice a thing until it hits them personally and even then some are to fkn stupid to fend for their own rights as they suffer from a severe case of stock holm syndrome.

Other people won't care because their attitude is " oh who cares, that's in NY" well news flash if it's happened there it is very highly likely it can happen in your state / city fools.

Short attention span after the church shooting , you go right back after the Muslim.

They are not the same. Islam is an organized enemy of freedom. Crazies are crazies.

They are not crazy. They new what they were doing.

 

[Lysistrata]

I was taught that Catholics were evil, pure evil, Italians were ignorant, blacks were inferior and the French were terrible people, in my home. I was grounded for walking to school with a black neighbour. My church’s founding documents call the Pope the Antichrist.

My experience in the world showed me that none of what I was being told was true. But clearly a lot of people in the US are still teaching their children that black people are inferior, because I read that every day on this board.

80 million Muslims around the world and only a handful are spreading hate and violence. I find your take away on Muslims to ring very false.

Yep- the bigots want us to fear and hate all Muslims- and that is why they- and I include the OP- equate Islam to Islamist terrorism- Muslims to Islamist terrorists.

Why they want to fight with all Muslims- rather than fight the terrorists- is the question.

Why? There is a particularly virulent strain of Christianity afoot in the U.S. The "end times," "if we have a war with Muslims, Jesus will come back" types, who are just carrying on the old rivalries among the Abrahamic from medieval times and want to use the U.S. military as a proxy "Christian" army to make their wishes come true. They are so foolish that they cannot accept the fact that most of the people being killed by the radical Islamist groups are Muslim. My theory is that the corporate types, eyeing oil and profits, see these rubes as easy to manipulate for their own purposes.

 

[jasonnfree]

• The media began to paint Muslims as the victims of Saipov's attack -- not the dead and the wounded victims of the terrorist.
  
  
• "As a Muslim committed to fighting Islamism, I appeal to you: The need for strong
  New York City Submits to Islam

==========================================================================
Never let a good crisis go to waste you mean you didn't see this coming it's been in plain view. Trendy's won't notice a thing until it hits them personally and even then some are to fkn stupid to fend for their own rights as they suffer from a severe case of stock holm syndrome.

Other people won't care because their attitude is " oh who cares, that's in NY" well news flash if it's happened there it is very highly likely it can happen in your state / city fools.

Short attention span after the church shooting , you go right back after the Muslim.

They are not the same. Islam is an organized enemy of freedom. Crazies are crazies.

They are not crazy. They new what they were doing.

I think they're crazy. Crazies can still plan evil and act on it. Ted Bundy was crazy and went on murdering and raping for years.

 

[irosie91]

true------so you agree that the family murder of passion was
nothing like TERRORISM

Every public mass shooting is terrorism, regardless of motive. There are hundreds of definitions of what constitutes terrorism around the world but the only consensus is that it involves violence or the threat of violence.

American law defines it as violence in pursuit of idealogical goals but the Americans don’t want to face the fact that there are many acts of terrorism perpetrated with no goal other than to kill or injure as many people as possible. The Boston bombing springs to mind, the Las Vegas shooting, the Aurora movie theatre killing, Sandy Hook, Columbine.

Americans don’t define these attacks as terrorism because they would have to do something other than wring their hands over them, and send prayers and condolences. Prayers aren’t working.

The Boston bombing was Islamic terrorism. Columbine was atheist terrorism, much like this church massacre.

You do not know he was an atheist. What was Tim McVeigh.

He identified as agnostic.

It doesn't matter what he identified as, both did what they did because of pent up anger and rage. I know on Fox they say people lack faith, turned away from God, that is a lame excuse.

"it doesn't matter what he identified as....." ------yeah it does------it MATTERS. A very personal anger----like anger at being rebuffed as a lover-------is a LOT DIFFERENT from anger based on a massive IDEOLOGY. KKK people are angry-----so the actions of a SOCIAL FORCE are "NO DIFFERENT" according to penny-------from the anger of a man who murders his wife for burning the toast.

 

[irosie91]

• The media began to paint Muslims as the victims of Saipov's attack -- not the dead and the wounded victims of the terrorist.
  
  
• "As a Muslim committed to fighting Islamism, I appeal to you: The need for strong
  New York City Submits to Islam

==========================================================================
Never let a good crisis go to waste you mean you didn't see this coming it's been in plain view. Trendy's won't notice a thing until it hits them personally and even then some are to fkn stupid to fend for their own rights as they suffer from a severe case of stock holm syndrome.

Other people won't care because their attitude is " oh who cares, that's in NY" well news flash if it's happened there it is very highly likely it can happen in your state / city fools.

Short attention span after the church shooting , you go right back after the Muslim.

They are not the same. Islam is an organized enemy of freedom. Crazies are crazies.

They are not crazy. They new what they were doing.

Penny claims to be a "health care provider"--------got "NEWS" for you----penny dear-----that they "NEW" what they were doing does not disprove psychosis