CDZ “National Popular Vote” ... in 2024 and beyond ?

[Wyatt earp]

Like I said it's unconstitutional for states to make compacts without Congress approval, this will head to the supreme court when they get a majority.

 

[TroglocratsRdumb]

NPV is inevitable. That will give the Democratic Party a permanent majority party dominance going forward, which will result in blue presidencies, congresses, and an increased number of SCOTUS seats to ensure a Democratic majority.

when the dems gain control of a school board they wreck the schools
when the dems gain control of a city council they turn it into a racist circus
when the dems gain control of a state they drive the middle class taxpayers out
if they get permanent control of the contrl of the country they will destroy it

 

[RetiredGySgt]

NPV does not require a Constitutional convention. It is a consortium of state agreements, that is all that is needed.

It violates the Constitution because it removes the right of the majority which is guaranteed by said constitution.

 

[Wyatt earp]

NPV is inevitable. That will give the Democratic Party a permanent majority party dominance going forward, which will result in blue presidencies, congresses, and an increased number of SCOTUS seats to ensure a Democratic majority.

when the dems gain control of a school board they wreck the schools
when the dems gain control of a city council they turn it into a racist circus
when the dems gain control of a state they drive the middle class taxpayers out
if they get permanent control of the contrl of the country they will destroy it

It's inevitable the left will gain full control and destroy America, deal with it.

 

[TroglocratsRdumb]

Nothing seems likely to prevent the upcoming Presidential Election from being another disaster for U.S. political institutions and popular confidence in elections. My (worthless) gut feeling is that Trump will win another term. Whether it will be overwhelming, a squeaker in which he again loses the popular vote but wins the electoral vote, or whether Biden gets elected, popular unhappiness with the Electoral College system (certainly not the only problem with elections or our political system!) will likely remain highly disruptive going forward.

There was a long and interesting article Sept. 8 in the “liberal” NY. Times which discussed the proposal for a “National Popular Vote” for President. Unfortunately, you may find it’s behind an Internet pay wall. It was rather provocatively titled “The Electoral College Will Destroy America...” A few excerpts below:

“If Mr. Biden wins by five percentage points or more — if he beats Donald Trump by more than seven million votes — he’s a virtual shoo-in. If he wins 4.5 million more votes than the president? He’s still got a three-in-four chance to be president.

Anything less, however, and Mr. Biden’s odds drop like a rock. A mere three million-vote Biden victory? A second Trump term suddenly becomes more likely than not. If Mr. Biden’s margin drops to 1.5 million — about the populations of Rhode Island and Wyoming combined — forget about it. The chance of a Biden presidency in that scenario is less than one in 10....

“Given that abolishing the Electoral College is not on the table at the moment, for a number of reasons, the best solution would be to do what Madison tried to do more than two centuries ago: get rid of statewide winner-take-all laws. That can be achieved through the National Popular Vote Interstate Compact ...

If you think this is a plot by bitter Democrats who just want to win, consider this: Texas is going to turn blue. Maybe not this year, maybe not even in 2024. But it’s headed in that direction, and when it gets there, Republicans will be in for an unpleasant surprise. In 2016, Donald Trump won about 4.5 million votes in Texas. The moment the Democratic nominee wins more, all those Republican voters suddenly disappear, along with any realistic shot at winning the White House....

“Every time a new national poll ... is released, it’s followed by a chorus of responses along the lines of, Who cares? The national popular vote is meaningless. Well, I care. So do tens of millions of other Americans.

“And so does Donald Trump. ‘The electoral college is a disaster for a democracy,’ he tweeted on election night 2012. Why? Because he believed Mitt Romney would win the popular vote and lose the Electoral College. Not only has he never taken that tweet down, but he continues to claim that he won the popular vote in 2016. Why does he care so much about making that case unless he believed in his heart, like the rest of us do, that the person who gets the most votes should win?“

Opinion | The Electoral College Will Destroy America

They are admitting that they cannot sell their regressive culture and failed far left economics to American Citizens, therefore they are depending upon illegal immigration to have their Orwellian Nightmare come true.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Article IV section 4

Section. 4.

The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government, and shall protect each of them against Invasion; and on Application of the Legislature, or of the Executive (when the Legislature cannot be convened) against domestic Violence.

The compact violates the rights in the State involved if the State overrules the popular vote.

The Constitution of the United States: A Transcription | National Archives

www.archives.gov

 

[westwall]

NPV does not require a Constitutional convention. It is a consortium of state agreements, that is all that is needed.

Yeah, it does. It's Part and Parcel of how the government was set up.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Each Individual State is free to determine the process for electing the President. How ever if that process is by POPULAR vote they can not violate that by changing who won by a compact with other States.

 

[westwall]

NPV is inevitable. That will give the Democratic Party a permanent majority party dominance going forward, which will result in blue presidencies, congresses, and an increased number of SCOTUS seats to ensure a Democratic majority.

when the dems gain control of a school board they wreck the schools
when the dems gain control of a city council they turn it into a racist circus
when the dems gain control of a state they drive the middle class taxpayers out
if they get permanent control of the contrl of the country they will destroy it

It's inevitable the left will gain full control and destroy America, deal with it.

No, they won't.

 

[Tom Paine 1949]

Like I said it's unconstitutional for states to make compacts without Congress approval, this will head to the supreme court when they get a majority.

Actually states make compacts all the time. There is a whole field of law specializing in this, and the creators of the National Popular Vote Compact were leading experts in the field. Every interstate lottery, interstate transport authority, etc. is usually based on such interstate compacts. The Constitution specifically grants states authority to determine their electoral votes in any way they wish. States do not need even have to assign elEctoral votes on the basis of elections. They can have their state legislature decide, or even their governor. Our two party elections and winner-take-all selection of electors is simply evolved, and the states can altere this system.

Of course political reality being what it is there will indeed be court challenges and it may well go to the Supreme Court. But if public opinion favors it, and no major party vigorously opposes it, there is no reason to suppose it would be rejected by the USSC.

The idea is that it might serve partly as a stopgap measure, testing the principle, since states could dissolve the compact if they wished. It would certainly be better to eventually have a constitutional amendment that would find a better solution, allowing for ranked choice voting on a national level perhaps. (“Citizens United” can also be superceeded by Constitutional amendment.) But the National Vote Compact might at least be a practical first step to end a system that seems to have outlived its usefulness and now serves mainly professional partisan politicians, frustrating and effectively disenfranchising most voters.

 

[JakeStarkey]

NPV is inevitable. That will give the Democratic Party a permanent majority party dominance going forward, which will result in blue presidencies, congresses, and an increased number of SCOTUS seats to ensure a Democratic majority.

when the dems gain control of a school board they wreck the schools
when the dems gain control of a city council they turn it into a racist circus
when the dems gain control of a state they drive the middle class taxpayers out
if they get permanent control of the contrl of the country they will destroy it

No, they don't, and, no, they won't.

 

[westwall]

Like I said it's unconstitutional for states to make compacts without Congress approval, this will head to the supreme court when they get a majority.

Actually states make compacts all the time. There is a whole field of law specializing in this, and the creators of the National Popular Vote Compact were leading experts in the field. Every interstate lottery, interstate transport authority, etc. is usually based on such interstate compacts. The Constitution specifically grants states authority to determine their electoral votes in any way they wish. States do not need to even to assign elEctoral votes on the basis of elections, can have their state legislature decide. Our two party elections and winner-take-all selection of electors is simply evolved and the states can altered this system.

Of course political reality being what it is there will indeed be court challenges and it may well go to the Supreme Court. But if public opinion favors it, and no major party vigorously opposes it, there is no reason to suppose it would be rejected by the USSC.

The idea is that it might serve partly as a stopgap measure, testing the principle, since states could dissolve the compact if they wished. It would certainly be better to eventually have a constitutional amendment that would find a better solution, allowing for ranked choice voting on a national level perhaps. (“Citizens United” can also be superceeded by Constitutional amendment.) But the National Vote Compact might at least be a practical first step to end a system that seems to have outlived its usefulness and now serves mainly professional partisan politicians, frustrating and effectively disenfranchising most voters.

Indeed they do, but not for things that the COTUS codifies

 

[Thunk]

NPV does not require a Constitutional convention. It is a consortium of state agreements, that is all that is needed.

The electoral college is in the constitution.

To move to NPV or any other method would requite a change to the constitution...which would require a constitutional convention and ratification.

 

[JakeStarkey]

NPV does not require a Constitutional convention. It is a consortium of state agreements, that is all that is needed.

It violates the Constitution because it removes the right of the majority which is guaranteed by said constitution.

False. The NPV guarantees in fact that the majority will rule.

 

[Wyatt earp]

Like I said it's unconstitutional for states to make compacts without Congress approval, this will head to the supreme court when they get a majority.

Actually states make compacts all the time. There is a whole field of law specializing in this, and the creators of the National Popular Vote Compact were leading experts in the field. Every interstate lottery, interstate transport authority, etc. is usually based on such interstate compacts. The Constitution specifically grants states authority to determine their electoral votes in any way they wish. States do not need to even to assign elEctoral votes on the basis of elections, can have their state legislature decide. Our two party elections and winner-take-all selection of electors is simply evolved and the states can altered this system.

Of course political reality being what it is there will indeed be court challenges and it may well go to the Supreme Court. But if public opinion favors it, and no major party vigorously opposes it, there is no reason to suppose it would be rejected by the USSC.

The idea is that it might serve partly as a stopgap measure, testing the principle, since states could dissolve the compact if they wished. It would certainly be better to eventually have a constitutional amendment that would find a better solution, allowing for ranked choice voting on a national level perhaps. (“Citizens United” can also be superceeded by Constitutional amendment.) But the National Vote Compact might at least be a practical first step to end a system that seems to have outlived its usefulness and now serves mainly professional partisan politicians, frustrating and effectively disenfranchising most voters.

Of course states make compacts ..




With Congress approval, Congress didn't approve this one

 

[JakeStarkey]

NPV does not require a Constitutional convention. It is a consortium of state agreements, that is all that is needed.

The electoral college is in the constitution.

To move to NPV or any other method would requite a change to the constitution...which would require a constitutional convention and ratification.

Already noted, rebutted, and overruled. You will find no law to that effect. The path of NPV is constitutional, and nothing can stop it except the votes of the states. And the states' will will be reflected in the final tabulation of the EC.

 

[eagle1462010]

Nothing seems likely to prevent the upcoming Presidential Election from being another disaster for U.S. political institutions and popular confidence in elections. My (worthless) gut feeling is that Trump will win another term. Whether it will be overwhelming, a squeaker in which he again loses the popular vote but wins the electoral vote, or whether Biden gets elected, popular unhappiness with the Electoral College system (certainly not the only problem with elections or our political system!) will likely remain highly disruptive going forward.

There was a long and interesting article Sept. 8 in the “liberal” NY. Times which discussed the proposal for a “National Popular Vote” for President. Unfortunately, you may find it’s behind an Internet pay wall. It was rather provocatively titled “The Electoral College Will Destroy America...” A few excerpts below:

“If Mr. Biden wins by five percentage points or more — if he beats Donald Trump by more than seven million votes — he’s a virtual shoo-in. If he wins 4.5 million more votes than the president? He’s still got a three-in-four chance to be president.

Anything less, however, and Mr. Biden’s odds drop like a rock. A mere three million-vote Biden victory? A second Trump term suddenly becomes more likely than not. If Mr. Biden’s margin drops to 1.5 million — about the populations of Rhode Island and Wyoming combined — forget about it. The chance of a Biden presidency in that scenario is less than one in 10....

“Given that abolishing the Electoral College is not on the table at the moment, for a number of reasons, the best solution would be to do what Madison tried to do more than two centuries ago: get rid of statewide winner-take-all laws. That can be achieved through the National Popular Vote Interstate Compact ...

If you think this is a plot by bitter Democrats who just want to win, consider this: Texas is going to turn blue. Maybe not this year, maybe not even in 2024. But it’s headed in that direction, and when it gets there, Republicans will be in for an unpleasant surprise. In 2016, Donald Trump won about 4.5 million votes in Texas. The moment the Democratic nominee wins more, all those Republican voters suddenly disappear, along with any realistic shot at winning the White House....

“Every time a new national poll ... is released, it’s followed by a chorus of responses along the lines of, Who cares? The national popular vote is meaningless. Well, I care. So do tens of millions of other Americans.

“And so does Donald Trump. ‘The electoral college is a disaster for a democracy,’ he tweeted on election night 2012. Why? Because he believed Mitt Romney would win the popular vote and lose the Electoral College. Not only has he never taken that tweet down, but he continues to claim that he won the popular vote in 2016. Why does he care so much about making that case unless he believed in his heart, like the rest of us do, that the person who gets the most votes should win?“

Opinion | The Electoral College Will Destroy America

Yawn........losers can't win by the set rules they want to change the rules............

We get rid of the illegals working in here..........and make the Senate the voice of the State again......you wouldn't have a pot to piss in.

 

[westwall]

NPV does not require a Constitutional convention. It is a consortium of state agreements, that is all that is needed.

It violates the Constitution because it removes the right of the majority which is guaranteed by said constitution.

False. The NPV guarantees in fact that the majority will rule.

Fortunately for the citizens of this country the Founders set it up so that the Mob, that would be you, couldn't just run roughshod over the minority.

That's why your little compact can't ever do what you claim no matter how much you whine about it.

 

[Tom Paine 1949]

NPV does not require a Constitutional convention. It is a consortium of state agreements, that is all that is needed.

The electoral college is in the constitution. To move to NPV or any other method would requite a change to the constitution...which would require a constitutional convention and ratification.

The National Vote Compact does NOT remove or replace or in any way alter the assembling of the Electoral College. It only changes the way individual states decide to select their electors.

 

[westwall]

NPV does not require a Constitutional convention. It is a consortium of state agreements, that is all that is needed.

The electoral college is in the constitution. To move to NPV or any other method would requite a change to the constitution...which would require a constitutional convention and ratification.

The National Vote Compact does NOT remove or replace or in any way alter the assembling of the Electoral College. It only changes the way individual states decide to select their electors.

Yes, but then it stipulates how they must vote in violation of the COTUS.