My Apologies to the Liberals Here; You Were Right.....

[Carl in Michigan]

Republicans are going to have to stand for re-election having failed to deliver on their promise to repeal and replace Obamacare when they had control of both houses of Congress and the White House.

Well, if you get discouraged and don't show up at the polls, how do you think the country will go with Pelosi and Shummer in power?

 

[Carl in Michigan]

I will never vote for a Republican for any Congressional office again the rest of my life, I swear to God

Pelosi and Shummer thank you for your support.

 

[Uncensored2008]

A viable third party would enable a guy like Trump to win with 34% of the vote. No thanks.

A viable third party might let you elect an open Marxist like Bernie.

 

[Dragonlady]

The best case scenario, that has zero chance of happening of course, is a bipartisan plan to improve the ACA. Or hell, a bipartisan plan to improve the AHCA, which will also never happen.

The BEST scenario is complete repeal and the elimination of Medicare for anyone not RETIRED on Social Security. Free markets are the only rational means of allocating resources.

Free markets were raising premiums at a rate that wasn't sustainable, and denying as many claims as possible to keep profits high.

One third of all bankruptcies related to health care expenses. Even people with "good" health insurance could be bankrupted by a catastrophic illness because of caps and lifetime limits.

Free markets have given the US the most expensive health care in the world, and the only first world country where a large percentage of your population has little, if any, access to quality health care.

 

[Uncensored2008]

[

Not due to Obamacare. That is big lie number two. You fuckers love that one as well.

The high premiums were there before Ocare for any plan that actually covered you. The rate of increase has been lower under The ACA.

The higher premiums in the last year are due to GOP ( especially Marco Rubio's ) attempts to sabotage the bill.

Try harder.

Ah, you are a lying fuck, but that comes with being a Nazi.

{The Manhattan Institute compared the average of the five least expensive pre-ACA plans in 2013 with the least expensive plans available on exchanges in 2014. Manhattan’s researchers adjusted the pre-ACA plan premiums upward to account for the population facing surcharges or denied coverage because of a pre-existing condition. Manhattan estimated that the average state individual market premium increased 41% between 2013 and 2014. A county-level analysis suggested that premiums increased by 49%.}

Overwhelming Evidence That Obamacare Caused Premiums To Increase Substantially

The next time you tell the truth will be the first time.

 

[Uncensored2008]

Free markets were raising premiums at a rate that wasn't sustainable, and denying as many claims as possible to keep profits high.

There hasn't been a free market in medical care since Johnson brought out medicare.

But even the bastardized system we had was tame compared to the astronomical increases Obama's Fascist care are causing.

One third of all bankruptcies related to health care expenses. Even people with "good" health insurance could be bankrupted by a catastrophic illness because of caps and lifetime limits.

And you Nazis doubling costs to consumers helped exactly how?

Free markets have given the US the most expensive health care in the world, and the only first world country where a large percentage of your population has little, if any, access to quality health care.

What free markets are those, brown shirt?

Tell me this, if you get your wish and fully socialize medicine, where will new drugs and medical procedures come from? Canada? Cuba? North Korea? While you fascist democrats demand we follow those countries into the dark ages, remember that when advanced care is needed, they flee to America.

 

[Uncensored2008]

The Republicans were trying the same ball busting shit that they always do- reduce tax breaks on the rich by screwing over the poor- working or not.

Oh? How EXACTLY did the Republican proposal "screw over the poor" Herr Himmler?

Yeah, you're just lying, as you Nazis always do.

 

[Uncensored2008]

The problem with obama care is that in order to give some freebies and subsidies the givers are now faced with high premiums, high co pays and very high deductibles. Now the givers cannot afford health care and the takers are riding free! Check yourself!

The politicians have no idea how the people suffer under Obamacare. A woman today said her premiums went from $300 a month to $1600! People can't afford to get sick.

Trump is right. If congress can't do its job, they need to just let it fail.

Before the ACA that woman may not have been able to get insurance if she had a pre-existing condition. Or she might not have been able to afford insurance before.

Obamacare repeal is flailing because Obamacare is working

But focusing on the problems obscures the overwhelming reality: The Affordable Care is popular, it is working, and on every dimension that voters care about, it outperforms the Republican alternatives. And that makes it damn hard to replace.

Poll after poll shows more people now favor the Affordable Care Act than oppose it. It has higher approval ratings than Donald Trump, Mitch McConnell, Paul Ryan, or the Republican Party. It far outperforms the Republican replacement plans: A new Washington Post/ABC News poll found voters prefer Obamacare to the Republican health bill by a 2-to-1 margin — 50 to 24 percent. You rarely see numbers like that in American politics.

These numbers are strange if you listen to Republicans describe the Affordable Care Act. In their telling, it is always “imploding,” “failing,” “dying,” “disastrous.” How can a law in such crisis command such healthy public support? The answer is that the law is, for the most part, not in crisis. There are areas of the country where the exchanges have struggled to attract insurers, and there are markets in which premiums have increased rapidly. These problems are real and, if the party in power were interested in improving the law, solvable.

But even without improvements, the reality is that for most people, in most places, the Affordable Care Act is working. The bulk of its coverage expansion has been through Medicaid, which is immune to the problems of the insurance marketplaces. Surveys find that Medicaid enrollees really like their coverage; they’re just as satisfied as people who get health insurance at work. Indeed, the Medicaid expansion has proven so popular, and so effective, that Senate Republicans from Medicaid-expanding states like Ohio and Nevada have been fighting to preserve it.

Nor are the exchanges in anything close to a state of collapse. More than 10 million people are buying insurance off Obamacare’s exchanges, and surveys show most of them are happy with their plans. While there are some counties at risk of beginning 2018 without participating insurers, the total number is quite small — 38 out of 3,143 counties, according to the Kaiser Family Foundation.

Nor has the Affordable Care Act seen exploding costs either in the program or in the health care system more broadly; the ACA has cost less than the Congressional Budget Office expected, and spending growth in the health system overall has been at historic lows (an achievement for which Obamacare deserves some, though not all, of the credit). Cost control in the health system has been so unexpectedly effective that the government is now projected to spend less on health care with Obamacare than we were projected to spend without Obamacare.

This is the reality that Republicans are flinging their repeal effort against — and it is a reality that their plans mostly worsen. According to the Congressional Budget Office, over the next 10 years, 23 million fewer people would have insurance if the House health bill passed, 22 million fewer people would have insurance if the Senate health bill passed, and 32 million fewer people would have insurance if the 2015 repeal bill — which McConnell now wants to bring to a vote — passed.

Obamacare’s biggest problem is the high cost sharing that frustrates those who buy coverage on the marketplaces. But all of the Republican bills would lead to higher deductibles, higher copays, sparer insurance, and, on an apples-to-apples basis, higher premiums. The reasons for this are simple: The GOP bills cancel the individual mandate, which pushes young and healthy people to buy health insurance, and then take hundreds of billions of dollars Obamacare is currently spending to make insurance more affordable and spend it instead on tax cuts and deficit reduction.

If the Affordable Care Act were truly as bad as Republicans say it is, it would be easier to replace. Hell, if it were as bad as they say it is, straight repeal would be an improvement — but even conservative Republicans don’t dare discuss repeal without some kind of vague, wonderful replacement.

Anyone claiming Obama'a fascist care is "working" is a fucking retard.

I get that you are a hack without a hint of integrity, but your foul lies are so absurd that you deserve to be shunned by decent people.

 

[Uncensored2008]

Well, now that the GOP has proven it can't govern, things are going to get much worse for you. You're never going to have libertarian purity in the GOP, never, ever. That's nothing more than a pipe dream that someone has sold you.

Those on the Right who have been convinced that compromise and moderation are bad things have taken a historic opportunity and peed on it.
.

IF the GOP had proven that they couldn't govern, you might have a point. But I see America out of the trans-pacific partnership, out of the Paris bullshit welfare for Marxists scam, and with Neil Gorsuch, a pro-Constitution advocate on the court.

The idiocy of Obamacare lite angers me, throw the pile of shit out and give freedom a try. BUT contrasted to the last 8 years of Obamunism and the utter fuckup that was the fascist democrat, the GOP come out smelling like roses.

Oh, and compromise with the fucking Nazis who run the democratic party is a suicide pact. My irritation with McConnell is that he included too much of the anti-American bullshit from Obama's fascist care in his bill, not that he failed to compromise with the evil turds who got us into this mess.

The fascist democrats are not a legitimate political party and have nothing to offer America save the yoke of slavery.

 

[Uncensored2008]

You cannot improve obamacare, it's a piece of shit. The Republicans were stupid for talking up a repeal replace bs mantra! They should have just left it die on it's own. All they really have to do now is vote out the mandate and the taxes!

The thousands upon thousands of REAL PEOPLE who would then suffer due to a collapsing governmental program is inhumane and incompetent governance.

Shame on you.

Do you support single payer, fully socialized medicine?

 

[Dragonlady]

Free markets were raising premiums at a rate that wasn't sustainable, and denying as many claims as possible to keep profits high.

There hasn't been a free market in medical care since Johnson brought out medicare.

But even the bastardized system we had was tame compared to the astronomical increases Obama's Fascist care are causing.

One third of all bankruptcies related to health care expenses. Even people with "good" health insurance could be bankrupted by a catastrophic illness because of caps and lifetime limits.

And you Nazis doubling costs to consumers helped exactly how?

Free markets have given the US the most expensive health care in the world, and the only first world country where a large percentage of your population has little, if any, access to quality health care.

What free markets are those, brown shirt?

Tell me this, if you get your wish and fully socialize medicine, where will new drugs and medical procedures come from? Canada? Cuba? North Korea? While you fascist democrats demand we follow those countries into the dark ages, remember that when advanced care is needed, they flee to America.

I'm living in Canada under a single payer system. Last week I went to the hospital with chest pains. I had my first heart attack in 2014 so I don't mess around.

Within 5 minutes of walking through the door at 11:00 am, I was hooked up to a heart monitor for the day, and checked frequently throughout the day. I went home at 7:30, after numerous tests throughout the day confirmed I wasn't having a heart attack.

My co-pay - zip
My paperwork - having my OHIP card swiped when I walked in
Pre-approvals - we don't need no stinking pre-approvals. Care is between me and my doctors for nearly all treatments

Private insurance skims 20% off the top for administration and profit. American Doctors and hospitals have to hire additional staff to obtain pre-approvals, and third party billing companies to collect co-pays and bill insurance companies. Administration eats up nearly 1/3 of every dollar spent on health care.

Single payer countries have administration costs of less than 10%, no preapprovals for standard treatments and care, and no third party billing. Doctors have more time to see more patients, and lower office expenses.

But tell me again how "efficient" the free market is.

 

[Uncensored2008]

Free markets were raising premiums at a rate that wasn't sustainable, and denying as many claims as possible to keep profits high.

There hasn't been a free market in medical care since Johnson brought out medicare.

But even the bastardized system we had was tame compared to the astronomical increases Obama's Fascist care are causing.

One third of all bankruptcies related to health care expenses. Even people with "good" health insurance could be bankrupted by a catastrophic illness because of caps and lifetime limits.

And you Nazis doubling costs to consumers helped exactly how?

Free markets have given the US the most expensive health care in the world, and the only first world country where a large percentage of your population has little, if any, access to quality health care.

What free markets are those, brown shirt?

Tell me this, if you get your wish and fully socialize medicine, where will new drugs and medical procedures come from? Canada? Cuba? North Korea? While you fascist democrats demand we follow those countries into the dark ages, remember that when advanced care is needed, they flee to America.

I'm living in Canada under a single payer system. Last week I went to the hospital with chest pains. I had my first heart attack in 2014 so I don't mess around.

Within 5 minutes of walking through the door at 11:00 am, I was hooked up to a heart monitor for the day, and checked frequently throughout the day. I went home at 7:30, after numerous tests throughout the day confirmed I wasn't having a heart attack.

My co-pay - zip
My paperwork - having my OHIP card swiped when I walked in
Pre-approvals - we don't need no stinking pre-approvals. Care is between me and my doctors for nearly all treatments

Private insurance skims 20% off the top for administration and profit. American Doctors and hospitals have to hire additional staff to obtain pre-approvals, and third party billing companies to collect co-pays and bill insurance companies. Administration eats up nearly 1/3 of every dollar spent on health care.

Single payer countries have administration costs of less than 10%, no preapprovals for standard treatments and care, and no third party billing. Doctors have more time to see more patients, and lower office expenses.

But tell me again how "efficient" the free market is.

If you end up needing a valve replacement or other advanced care, will you have enough money to fly to the USA and get it? Canada provides basic care, but anything beyond basic is a death sentence.

I am in Southern California, within driving distance of the City of Hope and Loma Linda - two of the most advanced care providers on the globe. The other providers who play at that level are also in the USA.

Let me ask you, as an American, I can walk into any hospital in Canada and demand free care, like the Mexicans do here? The answer is "hell no."

 

[JimBowie1958]

I will never vote for a Republican for any Congressional office again the rest of my life, I swear to God

Pelosi and Shummer thank you for your support.

See this is part of the reason the Establishment is able to keep power; they have us so polarized that we see not voting for YOUR party as the equivalent of a vote for your mirror opposite party.

I will vote third party, I suppose or Democrats locally and who knows on Presidential elections.

But clearly there is not a dimes worth of difference between a party so committed to every wack-job idiot social change it is psychotic vrs the other party that is so inept it cant do more than piss all over itself when it does have power.

 

[JimBowie1958]

You cannot improve obamacare, it's a piece of shit. The Republicans were stupid for talking up a repeal replace bs mantra! They should have just left it die on it's own. All they really have to do now is vote out the mandate and the taxes!

The thousands upon thousands of REAL PEOPLE who would then suffer due to a collapsing governmental program is inhumane and incompetent governance.

Shame on you.

Do you support single payer, fully socialized medicine?

No, I do not.

I do support state wide insurance pools and policies that get effective coverage for those that need it.

IF the free market cannot do that even with government health, then single payer is better than millions without health insurance that want and need it.

 

[Dragonlady]

Free markets were raising premiums at a rate that wasn't sustainable, and denying as many claims as possible to keep profits high.

There hasn't been a free market in medical care since Johnson brought out medicare.

But even the bastardized system we had was tame compared to the astronomical increases Obama's Fascist care are causing.

One third of all bankruptcies related to health care expenses. Even people with "good" health insurance could be bankrupted by a catastrophic illness because of caps and lifetime limits.

And you Nazis doubling costs to consumers helped exactly how?

Free markets have given the US the most expensive health care in the world, and the only first world country where a large percentage of your population has little, if any, access to quality health care.

What free markets are those, brown shirt?

Tell me this, if you get your wish and fully socialize medicine, where will new drugs and medical procedures come from? Canada? Cuba? North Korea? While you fascist democrats demand we follow those countries into the dark ages, remember that when advanced care is needed, they flee to America.

I'm living in Canada under a single payer system. Last week I went to the hospital with chest pains. I had my first heart attack in 2014 so I don't mess around.

Within 5 minutes of walking through the door at 11:00 am, I was hooked up to a heart monitor for the day, and checked frequently throughout the day. I went home at 7:30, after numerous tests throughout the day confirmed I wasn't having a heart attack.

My co-pay - zip
My paperwork - having my OHIP card swiped when I walked in
Pre-approvals - we don't need no stinking pre-approvals. Care is between me and my doctors for nearly all treatments

Private insurance skims 20% off the top for administration and profit. American Doctors and hospitals have to hire additional staff to obtain pre-approvals, and third party billing companies to collect co-pays and bill insurance companies. Administration eats up nearly 1/3 of every dollar spent on health care.

Single payer countries have administration costs of less than 10%, no preapprovals for standard treatments and care, and no third party billing. Doctors have more time to see more patients, and lower office expenses.

But tell me again how "efficient" the free market is.

If you end up needing a valve replacement or other advanced care, will you have enough money to fly to the USA and get it? Canada provides basic care, but anything beyond basic is a death sentence.

I am in Southern California, within driving distance of the City of Hope and Loma Linda - two of the most advanced care providers on the globe. The other providers who play at that level are also in the USA.

Let me ask you, as an American, I can walk into any hospital in Canada and demand free care, like the Mexicans do here? The answer is "hell no."

You're misinformed. Our health care goes far beyond "basic" and I'd much rather go to Sunnybrook Hospital in Toronto or McMaster Health Sciences Centre to have it done, if I needed it. Why would I fly to a foreign country and pay out of my own pocket when excellent care is available within an hour's drive from my home at no cost to me?

What Heart Valve Operations Are Covered

A family friend had a heart attack while in the US, and asked that he be stabilized, so he could go home to be treated by his Regular cardiologist at Sunnybrook.

My tubal reconstructive surgery was performed by the OB/GYN who pioneered the surgery, and taught Americans how to do it.

You have wonderful care for those who can afford it, but crap care for those who can't. Canadians live longer and healthier lives than Americans.

I seriously doubt anyone who was ill would be turned away from a Canadian hospital. It's not in our nature. It's also in our Constitution that we are required to help others. Students from outside Canada are issued OHIP cards with their visas.

 

[LuckyDuck]

The Republicans had no plan to replace Obamacare, it was all just a rhetorical game to undermine Obama and they are not capable of governing in the Democratic Parties place.

IF the Dems would back off on their Social agenda they can return to power for all I care.

Republicans are obviously not fit to govern.

Actually, you can thank the republican's "Freedom Caucus" for that. They're the ones who want no health care plan at all. For them, they're rich and believe that it should be "every man or woman for him or herself." The republican party consists of differing ideologies, some progressive and some.....well.....a**holes (like the Freedom Caucus).
A good example of a progressive republican from our past who was my idea of an excellent president, was Theodore Roosevelt. Conservative republicans didn't like him.
He created our National Parks, our National Forests, wildlife refuges and tried, but failed to create our Social Security system, but was blocked by the conservatives.

 

[Pumpkin Row]

The Republicans had no plan to replace Obamacare, it was all just a rhetorical game to undermine Obama and they are not capable of governing in the Democratic Parties place.

IF the Dems would back off on their Social agenda they can return to power for all I care.

Republicans are obviously not fit to govern.

They didn't think they'd even win, why would they have a plan?

Not that they need to replace that garbage with anything, they should just repeal it, then get rid of all regulations.

 

[Care4all]

The best case scenario, that has zero chance of happening of course, is a bipartisan plan to improve the ACA. Or hell, a bipartisan plan to improve the AHCA, which will also never happen.

You cannot improve obamacare, it's a piece of shit. The Republicans were stupid for talking up a repeal replace bs mantra! They should have just left it die on it's own. All they really have to do now is vote out the mandate and the taxes!

Of course the ACA can be improved. They can start by removing the previous GOP sabotage.

But go ahead and keep hoping for that 62nd repeal vote. I hear it's happening on the same day Loretta Lynch is going to be arrested... any day now

What GOP sabatoge! Can you bee specific?

Defunding the high risk pools and GOP states refusing to expand Medicare in order to increase their constituent's pain. That and spending years refusing to do anything but repeal which, we all know now, was just a transparent political stunt.

The best case scenario, that has zero chance of happening of course, is a bipartisan plan to improve the ACA. Or hell, a bipartisan plan to improve the AHCA, which will also never happen.

Then it should be easy to repeal. 61 votes already, right? All it'll take is a 62nd!

Nope... isn't that as obvious as Democrats not fixing the problems with it when they had/have the chance?

When did they have the chance? Republicans took the House and Senate and blocked any notion of changes and sabotaged the fuck out of it. Now Republicans control everything, including the future of healthcare, but you want to pretend they don't? LOL

The best case scenario, that has zero chance of happening of course, is a bipartisan plan to improve the ACA. Or hell, a bipartisan plan to improve the AHCA, which will also never happen.

You cannot improve obamacare, it's a piece of shit. The Republicans were stupid for talking up a repeal replace bs mantra! They should have just left it die on it's own. All they really have to do now is vote out the mandate and the taxes!

Of course the ACA can be improved. They can start by removing the previous GOP sabotage.

But go ahead and keep hoping for that 62nd repeal vote. I hear it's happening on the same day Loretta Lynch is going to be arrested... any day now

All republicans had to do was fix ACA. But instead they want a healthcare bill with their name on it.

They ( along with democrats) don't give a shit about America. They only care about their party.

This is exactly why our two party system needs to change. We need more parties making decisions in D.C

The best case scenario, that has zero chance of happening of course, is a bipartisan plan to improve the ACA. Or hell, a bipartisan plan to improve the AHCA, which will also never happen.

You cannot improve obamacare, it's a piece of shit. The Republicans were stupid for talking up a repeal replace bs mantra! They should have just left it die on it's own. All they really have to do now is vote out the mandate and the taxes!

Of course the ACA can be improved. They can start by removing the previous GOP sabotage.

But go ahead and keep hoping for that 62nd repeal vote. I hear it's happening on the same day Loretta Lynch is going to be arrested... any day now

What GOP sabatoge! Can you bee specific?

Defunding the high risk pools and GOP states refusing to expand Medicare in order to increase their constituent's pain. That and spending years refusing to do anything but repeal which, we all know now, was just a transparent political stunt.

Wait! The demotards gave each state the right to decide on whether they wanted to expand Medicaid, so I don't know how you can call that sabatoge except that you are a dishonest piece of shit. Just like all the other demotards!

no they DID NOT willow....

Republican states SUED Ocare provisions making Medicare expantion mandatory.... it went all the way to the Supreme Court and the Republicans WON and Roberts and court said the State gvts could decide for themselves....

 

[Pumpkin Row]

I will never vote for a Republican for any Congressional office again the rest of my life, I swear to God

You'd think it would depend on the individual, but that would be silly, wouldn't it?

 

[Carl in Michigan]

You'd think it would depend on the individual, but that would be silly, wouldn't it?

Exactly! Some aren't keeping their promise. Target THEM, but don't give power to the liberals whom he feels he should now grovel before. If he hates Republicans running things, does he think he'll be happy giving political power back to Pelosi and her ilk?