Millions of Americans probably praying that the ACA penalty will end immediately.

[beagle9]

I know people who need this money badly, and they can't afford to have their taxes levied to pay this penalty. They couldn't afford the insurance, and they sure don't need to be paying for anyone else's insurance. Period.

I'm one of those people.

I know plenty of people that are having to pay this penalty, and not because they choose to, but because they have to. They land right in between the not being able to qualify for a decent plan or to afford one, so they go without insurance, and pay the dam fine through a levy of their taxes.

 

[WillReadmore]

I know people who need this money badly, and they can't afford to have their taxes levied to pay this penalty. They couldn't afford the insurance, and they sure don't need to be paying for anyone else's insurance. Period.

yup just in time for tax season

What option will that give insurance companies other than to raise rates?

. Why would they have to raise rates ? Do they have customers who aren't paying the rates they ask for now ? So what you are you saying, that the government is paying for people to be covered by them, and that they are ripping the government a new butt hole ? How bout the government now doing what it said it was going to do, and that is to bring on the open borders across state lines ? You know where companies can compete for your business now ? It's time to repeal and replace, and to go after any company caught gouging their customers.

Several states already let insurance companies sell across state lines.

Insurance companies haven't seen the benefit in that.

This idea is just more Republican bull that they hyped even though it had already been proven false.

It's not about benefitting the insurance companies, moron.
It's about affordable health care.

Hey, good to hear from overseas somewhere!

This is capitalism over here.

 

[Doc1]

I envy anyone who still thinks that our Gov has no "secret" agendas. I also pity them because they will be the ones most affected when the shit hits the fan

 

[WillReadmore]

yup just in time for tax season

What option will that give insurance companies other than to raise rates?

what

the insurance companies dont get the money the fines generate

That's the way they were going to funnel money back to the companies through the Risk Corridors.

The concern was that insurance companies would see a lot of risk in the transition to the ACA, and would raise rates due to that risk of not knowing for sure what customers would do, etc.


"Risk Corridors" was a 3 year program designed to keep insurance companies from raising rates to cover that risk.

That was not permanent. The penalty for not having insurance was designed to be permenant.

Again, the rates can only be raised by application and approval by either the State or the Feds depending upon the size of the increase. Even BEFORE the ACA the companies had to apply to the State Commissioner s office before approval of the increases. They NEVER had the authority to just raise them to whatever they wished.

??? That post was about risk corridors - a policy related to the transition plan.

 

[Doc1]

obama union speech sibgle payer - Bing video

Please watch the video, Obama tells you exactly what the plan was.

 

[Doc1]

What option will that give insurance companies other than to raise rates?

what

the insurance companies dont get the money the fines generate

That's the way they were going to funnel money back to the companies through the Risk Corridors.

The concern was that insurance companies would see a lot of risk in the transition to the ACA, and would raise rates due to that risk of not knowing for sure what customers would do, etc.


"Risk Corridors" was a 3 year program designed to keep insurance companies from raising rates to cover that risk.

That was not permanent. The penalty for not having insurance was designed to be permenant.

Again, the rates can only be raised by application and approval by either the State or the Feds depending upon the size of the increase. Even BEFORE the ACA the companies had to apply to the State Commissioner s office before approval of the increases. They NEVER had the authority to just raise them to whatever they wished.

??? That post was about risk corridors - a policy related to the transition plan.

Maybe I'm conflating posts.

 

[WillReadmore]

I know people who need this money badly, and they can't afford to have their taxes levied to pay this penalty. They couldn't afford the insurance, and they sure don't need to be paying for anyone else's insurance. Period.

yup just in time for tax season

What option will that give insurance companies other than to raise rates?

. Why would they have to raise rates ? Do they have customers who aren't paying the rates they ask for now ? So what you are you saying, that the government is paying for people to be covered by them, and that they are ripping the government a new butt hole ? How bout the government now doing what it said it was going to do, and that is to bring on the open borders across state lines ? You know where companies can compete for your business now ? It's time to repeal and replace, and to go after any company caught gouging their customers.

Several states already let insurance companies sell across state lines.

Insurance companies haven't seen the benefit in that.

This idea is just more Republican bull that they hyped even though it had already been proven false.

. The problem is the word SOME. Either this nation is united or it isn't. The only way you make something work for all Americans, is to have every state participate in a unified way. Protectionism or the idea of some states opting out, and others trying to help is unexceptable.

??
I pointed out that it didn't work.

One reason is that insurance companies think they need offices in the state in order to give enough service to customers.

 

[WillReadmore]

If they went to he doc, they had insurance or money.....what the **** business is it if mine?

False. Before the ACA, we pushed those who can't pay into our ERs.

Then, we paid for that through taxes and through increased costs of insurance and direct charges.

If we dump millions off insurance, we'll need to start shipping tax dollars to hospitals again.

'All the money spent to create the PPACA, and all the time wasted of paying the GOP wages as they sat and tried to get it repealed over 50 times knowing Obama would not, it will cost billion to repeal it. Like someone said if a boat has a tiny leak, one does not buy a new boat , one fixes the leak.

You progressives can keep it to yourself that being Obamacare, keep the rest of us out of it.

Yes. You want us to cover you.

And, I want you to cover yourself - regardless of your whining.

I've never bought insurance not about to either… I've always paid for my shit out of pocket

That's fine until there is something you can't.

Before the ACA, health care cost was the number 1 reason for bankruptcy. My taxes went to cover what those people couldn't - their health care.

 

[Doc1]

False. Before the ACA, we pushed those who can't pay into our ERs.

Then, we paid for that through taxes and through increased costs of insurance and direct charges.

If we dump millions off insurance, we'll need to start shipping tax dollars to hospitals again.

'All the money spent to create the PPACA, and all the time wasted of paying the GOP wages as they sat and tried to get it repealed over 50 times knowing Obama would not, it will cost billion to repeal it. Like someone said if a boat has a tiny leak, one does not buy a new boat , one fixes the leak.

You progressives can keep it to yourself that being Obamacare, keep the rest of us out of it.

Yes. You want us to cover you.

And, I want you to cover yourself - regardless of your whining.

I've never bought insurance not about to either… I've always paid for my shit out of pocket

That's fine until there is something you can't.

Before the ACA, health care cost was the number 1 reason for bankruptcy. My taxes went to cover what those people couldn't - their health care.

You're right, they did.
But now your taxes are paying for their insurance. Since they couldn't afford their own insurance what makes you think that they can afford $7150 out of pocket for a health issue?
So now your taxes are STILL doing what they were doing BEFORE the ACA.
The question you must ask is WHY the ACA then? That's where the video I posted comes in. It was the first step to Single Payer.

 

[WillReadmore]

What option will that give insurance companies other than to raise rates?

. Why would they have to raise rates ? Do they have customers who aren't paying the rates they ask for now ? So what you are you saying, that the government is paying for people to be covered by them, and that they are ripping the government a new butt hole ? How bout the government now doing what it said it was going to do, and that is to bring on the open borders across state lines ? You know where companies can compete for your business now ? It's time to repeal and replace, and to go after any company caught gouging their customers.

Several states already let insurance companies sell across state lines.

Insurance companies haven't seen the benefit in that.

This idea is just more Republican bull that they hyped even though it had already been proven false.

All plans in all States have at least the 10 minimum benefits. Companies are free to ADD benefits , but not subtract them. The portability issue is moot and a red herring still being used by those against the ACA.

That doesn't address anything I posted.

You responded to a post that points out that the several states have allowed selling insurance across state lines.

And, insurance companies are not showing interest in that.

That's because they don't have to. The plans are minimally standardized, a minimum of the same 10 standards no matter what. States can allow insurance to put plans out with MORE benefits, but never less than the 10 required benefits. Companies can sell plans from Bronze to Gold.

You aren't being consistent. Companies did not want to sell across state lines.

The coverage requirements are a different issue.

 

[Doc1]

. Why would they have to raise rates ? Do they have customers who aren't paying the rates they ask for now ? So what you are you saying, that the government is paying for people to be covered by them, and that they are ripping the government a new butt hole ? How bout the government now doing what it said it was going to do, and that is to bring on the open borders across state lines ? You know where companies can compete for your business now ? It's time to repeal and replace, and to go after any company caught gouging their customers.

Several states already let insurance companies sell across state lines.

Insurance companies haven't seen the benefit in that.

This idea is just more Republican bull that they hyped even though it had already been proven false.

All plans in all States have at least the 10 minimum benefits. Companies are free to ADD benefits , but not subtract them. The portability issue is moot and a red herring still being used by those against the ACA.

That doesn't address anything I posted.

You responded to a post that points out that the several states have allowed selling insurance across state lines.

And, insurance companies are not showing interest in that.

That's because they don't have to. The plans are minimally standardized, a minimum of the same 10 standards no matter what. States can allow insurance to put plans out with MORE benefits, but never less than the 10 required benefits. Companies can sell plans from Bronze to Gold.

You aren't being consistent. Companies did not want to sell across state lines.

The coverage requirements are a different issue.

The problem with portability prior to the ACA was coverages. Coverages were not the same across State lines. Now they pretty much are. Portability is no the issue. I'm being entirely consistent.Think about it, why do you think that they promoted FEDERAL Exchanges?
People from ANY state can call the Fed exchange and buy insurance now.

 

[WillReadmore]

What option will that give insurance companies other than to raise rates?

. Why would they have to raise rates ? Do they have customers who aren't paying the rates they ask for now ? So what you are you saying, that the government is paying for people to be covered by them, and that they are ripping the government a new butt hole ? How bout the government now doing what it said it was going to do, and that is to bring on the open borders across state lines ? You know where companies can compete for your business now ? It's time to repeal and replace, and to go after any company caught gouging their customers.

Insurance companies can not afford letting people buy insurance whe they get sick and then drop out when they are not.

That is why there is a mandate.

If that is removed, insurance companies will have to find ways to get more money from customers.

. If the rates were right, then people would pay their insurance bill just like any other bill they pay. The reason they do what you speak, is because they feel that they are getting screwed over bad on the rate verses what they are getting as a product for the rate being paid.

Analysts show that the total cost of health care did not jump with the switch to the ACA, and in fact a chart of total cost per year shows less increase year over year now.

The ACA tends to push toward paying for outcomes rather than procedures, which is a cost saving direction. That is given sone of the credit. Maybe the fact the low income folks have choices other than the ER is a help.

I think the big change is in the way costs are distributed. Also in the past, insurance companies could save money by dumping sick people, refusing to sell to those with a health history, having a lower age limit on kids covered on the parent's policy, etc.

. Well Trump is going to be looking at it all, so let's just pray that we get better plans and better results real soon.

Trump is tweeting once in a while. And, his own people roll his tweets back. So, no, he is not doing it - which is fine.

Right now, we do not know who is designing HC.

The ACA was designed in bi-partisan committees in the House and Senate.

The one thing we know today is that Dems are totally cut out.

 

[WillReadmore]

. Then what drives these rates, and who is setting them ?? All I know is that the American working class is getting killed out here, and no one seems to give a rats ass about it anymore. Everyone needs coverage, and whatever it takes to do that, but keep it within reason, and for all to have a good policy then let's get-r-donnnnne.

In a for profit system usage determines the rate increases applied for. Prior to the ACA the Companies had to apply to the State Insurance commissioners for approval. Now if the applied for increases are under 10% the States can say yay or nay, if it's for 10% or more HHS must approve it.

. OK, now how did such high rates meet with approval ?? I mean shouldn't these proceedings be transparent and public knowledge when they take place ? Hmm, they might be, so forgive me for just being on the bad rates end of this mess.

You'd have to take that up with HHS and Obama's appointee. I'd also point out that since competition is actually dying in the marketplace the rate increases have not been large enough to sustain the business.
Before you go off on that know this, the ACA is performing exactly as it was designed to do. It was designed to implode the system, the companies are bailing because they cannot make enough to sustain their business models.
Even the non-profits are pulling out. Obama had one goal in mind and that is single payer. He knew he couldn't get it all at once, but he will get it.

Nonsense.

Let's remember that there was a full compliment of Republicans on the bi-partisan committees in the House and Senate that designed the ACA.

There was no way for there to be some secret agenda. And, Obama had almost nothing to do with the design.

Did Obama have anything to do with anything?

No, Obama stated preferences, but he did not design anything about the ACA.

In fact, he wanted some form of single payer.

 

[WillReadmore]

. Then what drives these rates, and who is setting them ?? All I know is that the American working class is getting killed out here, and no one seems to give a rats ass about it anymore. Everyone needs coverage, and whatever it takes to do that, but keep it within reason, and for all to have a good policy then let's get-r-donnnnne.

In a for profit system usage determines the rate increases applied for. Prior to the ACA the Companies had to apply to the State Insurance commissioners for approval. Now if the applied for increases are under 10% the States can say yay or nay, if it's for 10% or more HHS must approve it.

. OK, now how did such high rates meet with approval ?? I mean shouldn't these proceedings be transparent and public knowledge when they take place ? Hmm, they might be, so forgive me for just being on the bad rates end of this mess.

You'd have to take that up with HHS and Obama's appointee. I'd also point out that since competition is actually dying in the marketplace the rate increases have not been large enough to sustain the business.
Before you go off on that know this, the ACA is performing exactly as it was designed to do. It was designed to implode the system, the companies are bailing because they cannot make enough to sustain their business models.
Even the non-profits are pulling out. Obama had one goal in mind and that is single payer. He knew he couldn't get it all at once, but he will get it.

Nonsense.

Let's remember that there was a full compliment of Republicans on the bi-partisan committees in the House and Senate that designed the ACA.

There was no way for there to be some secret agenda. And, Obama had almost nothing to do with the design.

That's all true, I don't care whether you believe it or not.

"Let's remember that there was a full compliment of Republicans on the bi-partisan committees in the House and Senate that designed the ACA."

Then why didn't any Repubs vote for it?

Boehner and McConnell stated that opposition to the ACA would be used as a demonstration of continuing partisan power following their catastrophic election.

They failed, of course, kicking off their years long partisan hate fest.

 

[WillReadmore]

I know people who need this money badly, and they can't afford to have their taxes levied to pay this penalty. They couldn't afford the insurance, and they sure don't need to be paying for anyone else's insurance. Period.

I'm one of those people.

I know plenty of people that are having to pay this penalty, and not because they choose to, but because they have to. They land right in between the not being able to qualify for a decent plan or to afford one, so they go without insurance, and pay the dam fine through a levy of their taxes.

60% of America believes that it is a responsibility of the government to ensure that all Americans have health care coverage.

We fail at that.

More should be done.

 

[miketx]

I know people who need this money badly, and they can't afford to have their taxes levied to pay this penalty. They couldn't afford the insurance, and they sure don't need to be paying for anyone else's insurance. Period.

I'm one of those people.

I know plenty of people that are having to pay this penalty, and not because they choose to, but because they have to. They land right in between the not being able to qualify for a decent plan or to afford one, so they go without insurance, and pay the dam fine through a levy of their taxes.

60% of America believes that it is a responsibility of the government to ensure that all Americans have health care coverage.

We fail at that.

More should be done.

If that's true then 60 percent of Americans are stupid. It's not the governments place, in this country, to provide for the people.

 

[Doc1]

In a for profit system usage determines the rate increases applied for. Prior to the ACA the Companies had to apply to the State Insurance commissioners for approval. Now if the applied for increases are under 10% the States can say yay or nay, if it's for 10% or more HHS must approve it.

. OK, now how did such high rates meet with approval ?? I mean shouldn't these proceedings be transparent and public knowledge when they take place ? Hmm, they might be, so forgive me for just being on the bad rates end of this mess.

You'd have to take that up with HHS and Obama's appointee. I'd also point out that since competition is actually dying in the marketplace the rate increases have not been large enough to sustain the business.
Before you go off on that know this, the ACA is performing exactly as it was designed to do. It was designed to implode the system, the companies are bailing because they cannot make enough to sustain their business models.
Even the non-profits are pulling out. Obama had one goal in mind and that is single payer. He knew he couldn't get it all at once, but he will get it.

Nonsense.

Let's remember that there was a full compliment of Republicans on the bi-partisan committees in the House and Senate that designed the ACA.

There was no way for there to be some secret agenda. And, Obama had almost nothing to do with the design.

That's all true, I don't care whether you believe it or not.

"Let's remember that there was a full compliment of Republicans on the bi-partisan committees in the House and Senate that designed the ACA."

Then why didn't any Repubs vote for it?

Boehner and McConnell stated that opposition to the ACA would be used as a demonstration of continuing partisan power following their catastrophic election.

They failed, of course, kicking off their years long partisan hate fest.

Two things.
1) Show us where the Pubs IN Committee helped design the ACA
2) Source their quotes.

 

[miketx]

. OK, now how did such high rates meet with approval ?? I mean shouldn't these proceedings be transparent and public knowledge when they take place ? Hmm, they might be, so forgive me for just being on the bad rates end of this mess.

You'd have to take that up with HHS and Obama's appointee. I'd also point out that since competition is actually dying in the marketplace the rate increases have not been large enough to sustain the business.
Before you go off on that know this, the ACA is performing exactly as it was designed to do. It was designed to implode the system, the companies are bailing because they cannot make enough to sustain their business models.
Even the non-profits are pulling out. Obama had one goal in mind and that is single payer. He knew he couldn't get it all at once, but he will get it.

Nonsense.

Let's remember that there was a full compliment of Republicans on the bi-partisan committees in the House and Senate that designed the ACA.

There was no way for there to be some secret agenda. And, Obama had almost nothing to do with the design.

That's all true, I don't care whether you believe it or not.

"Let's remember that there was a full compliment of Republicans on the bi-partisan committees in the House and Senate that designed the ACA."

Then why didn't any Repubs vote for it?

Boehner and McConnell stated that opposition to the ACA would be used as a demonstration of continuing partisan power following their catastrophic election.

They failed, of course, kicking off their years long partisan hate fest.

Two things.
1) Show us where the Pubs IN Committee helped design the ACA
2) Source their quotes.

If he does, will you accept it?

 

[Maryland Patriot]

I know people who need this money badly, and they can't afford to have their taxes levied to pay this penalty. They couldn't afford the insurance, and they sure don't need to be paying for anyone else's insurance. Period.

So you can be a loafer and go without insurance.

If someone chooses not to have health insurance that is none of your business.

As a tax payer it is, because at any moment I can pay for their er visit or cancer treatment. So yes , I am tired of freeloaders. Time to pay, I am sick of my taxes going for those who work and have income but chose to go without insurance. Do you think the young do not get ill or go out drinking and end up in ER, your wrong. Cancer can be growing in your right now.

if you are tired of the free loaders like you say you are, then you should be ecstatic that the ACA is no longer going to force people to pay into it. There is no greater free loader than the person that pays 100 bucks a month with no out of pocket for his insurance while someone else pays 1100 a month with a 12,000 a year out of pocket to pay for him.
Its clear that you also agree that people should pay for their own insurance only. No subsidies, no excessive payments from one person to cover free insurance for another.
It is certainly a buy it for full price or go without commodity and I am glad to see people finally waking up to this.

 

[Doc1]

You'd have to take that up with HHS and Obama's appointee. I'd also point out that since competition is actually dying in the marketplace the rate increases have not been large enough to sustain the business.
Before you go off on that know this, the ACA is performing exactly as it was designed to do. It was designed to implode the system, the companies are bailing because they cannot make enough to sustain their business models.
Even the non-profits are pulling out. Obama had one goal in mind and that is single payer. He knew he couldn't get it all at once, but he will get it.

Nonsense.

Let's remember that there was a full compliment of Republicans on the bi-partisan committees in the House and Senate that designed the ACA.

There was no way for there to be some secret agenda. And, Obama had almost nothing to do with the design.

That's all true, I don't care whether you believe it or not.

"Let's remember that there was a full compliment of Republicans on the bi-partisan committees in the House and Senate that designed the ACA."

Then why didn't any Repubs vote for it?

Boehner and McConnell stated that opposition to the ACA would be used as a demonstration of continuing partisan power following their catastrophic election.

They failed, of course, kicking off their years long partisan hate fest.

Two things.
1) Show us where the Pubs IN Committee helped design the ACA
2) Source their quotes.

If he does, will you accept it?

Sure if it's definitive.
Insurance is what I do, I know some things about it. It's going to be pretty tough to show that the Repubs helped design it in Committee and then forced the Dems to use reconciliation to pass it.
The other problem he has is that he boldly stated that there could not be a "secret agenda" in Gov and yet here he is saying just the opposite.