Michelle and Jackie Similar?

[BlackSand]

It is only the anti-Obama right wingers in the US who find fault with Mrs. Obama's looks and style.

It was the Emperor that liked his new clothes ... And the people that feared what other people would think if they told the truth that let him walk around naked.

"Can it be that I'm a fool? I'd have never guessed it, and not a soul must know. Am I unfit to be the minister? It would never do to let on that I can't see the cloth." ~ Hans Christian Anderson - The Emperor's New Clothes

.

 

[Sarah G]

This pisses me off. Not sure exactly why, but it does. Michelle is NOTHING like Jackie. Who is this dumbfuck that wrote this crap?

White House Style: Michelle O vs. Jackie O | HelloBeautiful

Jackie was basically vain and interested in the gold ring.

Not so much with Michelle.

She likes people and knows how to keep the hubby at home.

Jackie was also as was the mindset back then, subservient to her husband. She didn't get in his business nor did she have much to say about his dalliances. She decorated the WH, did all of the girly stuff which she thought was the right thing to do but it wasn't the kind of thing she had chosen as a career. She placed her needs on the back burner.

Michelle puts her family in a high place but she includes herself in that scenario. She's happy and they're also happy, intelligent and loving. Her husband adores her. It shows.

 

[Sarah G]

This is getting funnier and funnier. Are you on the same pain-killers as Vox?

The queen like our president always has a contingent of security around her. And like the president, there is a perimeter that one cannot cross without getting taken in hand by security personnel. If you tried to walk up and touch the queen you would have to breach that perimeter and you would get arrested. And you would be hauled in by the SS if the president of the US was not in hand shaking mode when you decided to touch him. When he is in handshaking mode you have to have both hands visible and empty.

I have been a few places you have not been.

Oh, I'm sure that is quite true.

 

[wavingrl]

This pisses me off. Not sure exactly why, but it does. Michelle is NOTHING like Jackie. Who is this dumbfuck that wrote this crap?

White House Style: Michelle O vs. Jackie O | HelloBeautiful

Jackie was basically vain and interested in the gold ring.

Not so much with Michelle.

She likes people and knows how to keep the hubby at home.

Jackie was also as was the mindset back then, subservient to her husband. She didn't get in his business nor did she have much to say about his dalliances. She decorated the WH, did all of the girly stuff which she thought was the right thing to do but it wasn't the kind of thing she had chosen as a career. She placed her needs on the back burner.

Michelle puts her family in a high place but she includes herself in that scenario. She's happy and they're also happy, intelligent and loving. Her husband adores her. It shows.

I agree --somewhat. Jackie was more complex. She had a career --photojournalist, prior to marrying JFK. An aristocrat, intelligent, well educated. JFK had already established a reputation as a womanizer, like his father. He is said to have laid the cards on the table prior to becoming engaged.

Then went on to have her own career in publishing. Not exactly 'subservient'--jmo.

They were never 'average Americans'.

a quote--about Camelot.
'Do you know what I think of history? ... For a while I thought history was something that bitter old men wrote. But Jack loved history so... No one'll ever know everything about Jack. But ... history made Jack what he was ... this lonely, little sick boy ... scarlet fever ... this little boy sick so much of the time, reading in bed, reading history ... reading the Knights of the Round Table ... and he just liked that last song.
Then I thought, for Jack history was full of heroes. And if it made him this way, if it made him see the heroes, maybe other little boys will see. Men are such a combination of good and bad ... He was such a simple man. But he was so complex, too. Jack had this hero idea of history, the idealistic view, but then he had that other side, the pragmatic side... his friends were all his old friends; he loved his Irish Mafia.'

~~~
sigh--Prince William and Kate--they are said to be striving to represent/identify with the People. I suppose that is what the current first couple are doing. Tired of it--all I have to say.

After all the documentaries on JFK I can see how things have changed. I was 15 when he was assassinated. So much that I never knew--Cold War and Vietnam and more.

I just wonder what will come next.

 

[bodecea]

Jackie was basically vain and interested in the gold ring.

Not so much with Michelle.

She likes people and knows how to keep the hubby at home.

Jackie was also as was the mindset back then, subservient to her husband. She didn't get in his business nor did she have much to say about his dalliances. She decorated the WH, did all of the girly stuff which she thought was the right thing to do but it wasn't the kind of thing she had chosen as a career. She placed her needs on the back burner.

Michelle puts her family in a high place but she includes herself in that scenario. She's happy and they're also happy, intelligent and loving. Her husband adores her. It shows.

I agree --somewhat. Jackie was more complex. She had a career --photojournalist, prior to marrying JFK. An aristocrat, intelligent, well educated. JFK had already established a reputation as a womanizer, like his father. He is said to have laid the cards on the table prior to becoming engaged.

Then went on to have her own career in publishing. Not exactly 'subservient'--jmo.

They were never 'average Americans'.

a quote--about Camelot.
'Do you know what I think of history? ... For a while I thought history was something that bitter old men wrote. But Jack loved history so... No one'll ever know everything about Jack. But ... history made Jack what he was ... this lonely, little sick boy ... scarlet fever ... this little boy sick so much of the time, reading in bed, reading history ... reading the Knights of the Round Table ... and he just liked that last song.
Then I thought, for Jack history was full of heroes. And if it made him this way, if it made him see the heroes, maybe other little boys will see. Men are such a combination of good and bad ... He was such a simple man. But he was so complex, too. Jack had this hero idea of history, the idealistic view, but then he had that other side, the pragmatic side... his friends were all his old friends; he loved his Irish Mafia.'

~~~
sigh--Prince William and Kate--they are said to be striving to represent/identify with the People. I suppose that is what the current first couple are doing. Tired of it--all I have to say.

After all the documentaries on JFK I can see how things have changed. I was 15 when he was assassinated. So much that I never knew--Cold War and Vietnam and more.

I just wonder what will come next.

They both had beautiful children.

 

[wavingrl]

Jackie was also as was the mindset back then, subservient to her husband. She didn't get in his business nor did she have much to say about his dalliances. She decorated the WH, did all of the girly stuff which she thought was the right thing to do but it wasn't the kind of thing she had chosen as a career. She placed her needs on the back burner.

Michelle puts her family in a high place but she includes herself in that scenario. She's happy and they're also happy, intelligent and loving. Her husband adores her. It shows.

I agree --somewhat. Jackie was more complex. She had a career --photojournalist, prior to marrying JFK. An aristocrat, intelligent, well educated. JFK had already established a reputation as a womanizer, like his father. He is said to have laid the cards on the table prior to becoming engaged.

Then went on to have her own career in publishing. Not exactly 'subservient'--jmo.

They were never 'average Americans'.

a quote--about Camelot.
'Do you know what I think of history? ... For a while I thought history was something that bitter old men wrote. But Jack loved history so... No one'll ever know everything about Jack. But ... history made Jack what he was ... this lonely, little sick boy ... scarlet fever ... this little boy sick so much of the time, reading in bed, reading history ... reading the Knights of the Round Table ... and he just liked that last song.
Then I thought, for Jack history was full of heroes. And if it made him this way, if it made him see the heroes, maybe other little boys will see. Men are such a combination of good and bad ... He was such a simple man. But he was so complex, too. Jack had this hero idea of history, the idealistic view, but then he had that other side, the pragmatic side... his friends were all his old friends; he loved his Irish Mafia.'

~~~
sigh--Prince William and Kate--they are said to be striving to represent/identify with the People. I suppose that is what the current first couple are doing. Tired of it--all I have to say.

After all the documentaries on JFK I can see how things have changed. I was 15 when he was assassinated. So much that I never knew--Cold War and Vietnam and more.

I just wonder what will come next.

They both had beautiful children.

The Kennedy's and the Obamas? Yes, the kids are a good legacy in both cases, I would say.

I don't have enough of a mind to 'assess' history well. But--I am certain that there are many others who do. The Kennedy's --some form of US royalty. Generations of striving--Scotland, England, Ireland.

~~~
who knows how 'true' this is--just found it on Google. With a very basic idea of what went on in the UK--I'd say the Kennedy's must have been fierce warriors and intelligent/shrewd people --all the way back through the ages.

http://www.theforbiddenknowledge.com/hardtruth/the_kennedy_bloodline.htm

<The Kennedy's that we will look closest at are related to the Fitzpatrick's, a powerful Irish family whose coat of arms has 3 fleur-de-lis with a dragon and a lion. (The Fitzpatrick's may tie back to France, and they may possibly part of the Sang Royal (Sangraal--Sang Raal is the term used in the older manuscripts which can mean both Royal bloodline or Holy Grail.) Jackie Bouvier Kennedy Onassis who married John F. Kennedy was tied to the Auchinclosses via her sister&#8217;s marriage into the Auchincloss family. The Auchinclosses are Scottish bloodline of the Illuminati.>

<There are several versions of how the Kennedy's got started, but when one goes in and examines things, what turns out is that the origins of the Kennedy's is Ireland are very clear. They are descendants of Brian Born (also known as Brian Caeneddi) and his nephew who spelled it Cinneide. The name thereafter was O&#8217;Kennedy. They originally were a Dalcassion sept, and were in the area near Killahoe, and Killokennedy parish is a reminder of that ancient fact. The O&#8217;Briens and MacNamaras forced them into new territories where they became the Lords of Ormond--what is now north Tipperary. Most Kennedy's in Ireland today are still found in that area. The Kennedy's remained powerful into the 16th century.>

 

[BDBoop]

I missed the point of the thread? So far, the only point I can expound upon is that Michele Obama slouches and the she has a big butt. Both are correct, but why are you any better?

she is MUCH better. She is just a private citizen.

When she will be a FLOTUS or POTUS you will be able to discuss her.

Now just discuss the subject of this thread or STFU

Thought I was - you guys really don't have a point, here - Michelle Obama is a class act. Sorry, just a fact. You saying that she can dress better? Oh, brother!

Thanks for chiming in.

She is dressing better. She has lost probably 30-40 pounds, and toned up what's left.

And you KNOW, as sure as shit stinks, that this same lot has bitched about her wearing designer clothing.

Eleanor Roosevelt knew her stuff.

"Do what you feel in your heart to be right- for you'll be criticized anyway. You'll be damned if you do, and damned if you don't."

 

[wavingrl]

she is MUCH better. She is just a private citizen.

When she will be a FLOTUS or POTUS you will be able to discuss her.

Now just discuss the subject of this thread or STFU

Thought I was - you guys really don't have a point, here - Michelle Obama is a class act. Sorry, just a fact. You saying that she can dress better? Oh, brother!

Thanks for chiming in.

She is dressing better. She has lost probably 30-40 pounds, and toned up what's left.

And you KNOW, as sure as shit stinks, that this same lot has bitched about her wearing designer clothing.

Eleanor Roosevelt knew her stuff.

"Do what you feel in your heart to be right- for you'll be criticized anyway. You'll be damned if you do, and damned if you don't."

I certainly agree with that.

lol--I cannot imagine the women of today wearing pill box hats.

Times change. I try to hang on to that. Fashion and politics. Too deep for me.

~~~
At any rate--the Kennedy family tree goes 'way back'.

http://www.baronage.co.uk/bphtm-01/kennedy1.html

Jackie--
http://www.nytimes.com/books/first/b/bradford-queen.html

<Our Forebears was treated by the Major's descendants with the reverence accorded the family Bible, and in 1961 Mary Van Rensselaer Thayer's authorized biography of Jackie as First Lady was still peddling the aristocratic family line. However, it was then that the fake was gently unmasked by an American historian. The truth is that the Bouviers were third-generation French immigrants who had made good but felt it necessary to fantasize about their ancestry, converting shopkeepers into nobles. In the class-conscious America of the Bouvier sisters' youth everyone "in Society" knew exactly where everyone else came from and White Anglo-Saxon Protestant families ruled the roost. Even after the Bouviers' unmasking in the sixties, Jackie's eccentric cousin Edie Beale boasted to writer Gail Sheehy in 1972, "We're all descended from fourteenth-century French kings." When Jackie married John F. Kennedy in 1953, newspaper reports trumpeted the alliance of the wealthy Boston Irish senator with the descendant of a family of French aristocrats. "I don't know how Janet [Jackie's mother] got away with this," Gore Vidal said. "Well, it only worked with the press, I mean they were somehow Plantagenets and Tudors&#8212;it was just nonsense. They were pretty lowly born ..." They were Catholics, but not grand Catholics, of Mediterranean descent in a Protestant WASP world. None of this was to matter outwardly to Jackie, as the classy beauty she grew up to be, but it contributed to an inner sense of apartness; as she told society bandleader Peter Duchin in reference to Newport, many years later, "You and I, Peter, both outsiders." >

 

[BDBoop]

British Magazine Crowns Michelle Obama Queen | TheBlaze.com

The Sunday Times Style Magazine has ranked the first lady at the top of its best-dressed people in the world list, and created a mock first-class postage stamp — a space traditionally reserved for the Queen of England — to promote the issue.

It is only the anti-Obama right wingers in the US who find fault with Mrs. Obama's looks and style.

Thank you!!

Check this out. Michelle, 2009.



And 2011.



And late fall, 2013.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

"The river of sludge will go on and on. It isn’t about me." ~ Jacqueline Kennedy Onassis

.

And, the rw's really are nothing more than a river of sludge.

I hate the right for the same reason the right hates the left.

The left (and our first lady) wants children to have full tummies and vets and their families to have homes and jobs.

That's the exact opposite of what the right wants.

I wish the right would secede. They will never do any more than whine though because, they'd all starve the left feeding them.

Imagine how much better off the US would be if we could just get rid of the lazy rw's who want their free health care.

 

[BDBoop]

And by the way - I've been captivated by Jackie Kennedy since day one. Practically hero-worshiped the woman. Thought she looked like a right royal princess.

Just thought I'd put the shoe on the other foot and see how you lot handled it.

Well done! Well done, indeed.

 

[Zona]

The first sow's bad posture is really something of a paradox. She, herself, is an attorney. I noticed in law school that anyone who made it to the last year developed an erect posture and a swagger. Her JD, like hubby's, is probably also mail order. She doesn't even carry herself like a lawyer.

This is pretty pathetic on your part.

I thought of it as pretty standard stuff for Sunshine.

[MENTION=21954]Sunshine[/MENTION] is pretty vile.

 

[Sallow]

British Magazine Crowns Michelle Obama Queen | TheBlaze.com

The Sunday Times Style Magazine has ranked the first lady at the top of its best-dressed people in the world list, and created a mock first-class postage stamp — a space traditionally reserved for the Queen of England — to promote the issue.

It is only the anti-Obama right wingers in the US who find fault with Mrs. Obama's looks and style.

Thank you!!

Check this out. Michelle, 2009.



And 2011.



And late fall, 2013.

Obama kinda reminds me of Robert Kennedy.

I'm sure Edward felt the same way.

 

[Sallow]

This is pretty pathetic on your part.

I thought of it as pretty standard stuff for Sunshine.

[MENTION=21954]Sunshine[/MENTION] is pretty vile.

Careful.

She'll make you feel guilty cause she dyyyying dahling!

 

[Luddly Neddite]

Thought I was - you guys really don't have a point, here - Michelle Obama is a class act. Sorry, just a fact. You saying that she can dress better? Oh, brother!

Thanks for chiming in.

She is dressing better. She has lost probably 30-40 pounds, and toned up what's left.

And you KNOW, as sure as shit stinks, that this same lot has bitched about her wearing designer clothing.

Eleanor Roosevelt knew her stuff.

"Do what you feel in your heart to be right- for you'll be criticized anyway. You'll be damned if you do, and damned if you don't."

I certainly agree with that.

lol--I cannot imagine the women of today wearing pill box hats.

Times change. I try to hang on to that. Fashion and politics. Too deep for me.

~~~
At any rate--the Kennedy family tree goes 'way back'.

John F. Kennedy, jr

Jackie--
America's Queen

<Our Forebears was treated by the Major's descendants with the reverence accorded the family Bible, and in 1961 Mary Van Rensselaer Thayer's authorized biography of Jackie as First Lady was still peddling the aristocratic family line. However, it was then that the fake was gently unmasked by an American historian. The truth is that the Bouviers were third-generation French immigrants who had made good but felt it necessary to fantasize about their ancestry, converting shopkeepers into nobles. In the class-conscious America of the Bouvier sisters' youth everyone "in Society" knew exactly where everyone else came from and White Anglo-Saxon Protestant families ruled the roost. Even after the Bouviers' unmasking in the sixties, Jackie's eccentric cousin Edie Beale boasted to writer Gail Sheehy in 1972, "We're all descended from fourteenth-century French kings." When Jackie married John F. Kennedy in 1953, newspaper reports trumpeted the alliance of the wealthy Boston Irish senator with the descendant of a family of French aristocrats. "I don't know how Janet [Jackie's mother] got away with this," Gore Vidal said. "Well, it only worked with the press, I mean they were somehow Plantagenets and Tudors—it was just nonsense. They were pretty lowly born ..." They were Catholics, but not grand Catholics, of Mediterranean descent in a Protestant WASP world. None of this was to matter outwardly to Jackie, as the classy beauty she grew up to be, but it contributed to an inner sense of apartness; as she told society bandleader Peter Duchin in reference to Newport, many years later, "You and I, Peter, both outsiders." >

So do the Obama's family.

Go way back, that is.

For example, a woman Mrs Obama is descended from was raped by her black owner and had his child. So, our beautiful and elegant and hard working and inspirational first lady is part white.

 

[wavingrl]

Thanks for chiming in.

She is dressing better. She has lost probably 30-40 pounds, and toned up what's left.

And you KNOW, as sure as shit stinks, that this same lot has bitched about her wearing designer clothing.

Eleanor Roosevelt knew her stuff.

"Do what you feel in your heart to be right- for you'll be criticized anyway. You'll be damned if you do, and damned if you don't."

I certainly agree with that.

lol--I cannot imagine the women of today wearing pill box hats.

Times change. I try to hang on to that. Fashion and politics. Too deep for me.

~~~
At any rate--the Kennedy family tree goes 'way back'.

John F. Kennedy, jr

Jackie--
America's Queen

<Our Forebears was treated by the Major's descendants with the reverence accorded the family Bible, and in 1961 Mary Van Rensselaer Thayer's authorized biography of Jackie as First Lady was still peddling the aristocratic family line. However, it was then that the fake was gently unmasked by an American historian. The truth is that the Bouviers were third-generation French immigrants who had made good but felt it necessary to fantasize about their ancestry, converting shopkeepers into nobles. In the class-conscious America of the Bouvier sisters' youth everyone "in Society" knew exactly where everyone else came from and White Anglo-Saxon Protestant families ruled the roost. Even after the Bouviers' unmasking in the sixties, Jackie's eccentric cousin Edie Beale boasted to writer Gail Sheehy in 1972, "We're all descended from fourteenth-century French kings." When Jackie married John F. Kennedy in 1953, newspaper reports trumpeted the alliance of the wealthy Boston Irish senator with the descendant of a family of French aristocrats. "I don't know how Janet [Jackie's mother] got away with this," Gore Vidal said. "Well, it only worked with the press, I mean they were somehow Plantagenets and Tudors&#8212;it was just nonsense. They were pretty lowly born ..." They were Catholics, but not grand Catholics, of Mediterranean descent in a Protestant WASP world. None of this was to matter outwardly to Jackie, as the classy beauty she grew up to be, but it contributed to an inner sense of apartness; as she told society bandleader Peter Duchin in reference to Newport, many years later, "You and I, Peter, both outsiders." >

So do the Obama's family.

Go way back, that is.

For example, a woman Mrs Obama is descended from was raped by her black owner and had his child. So, our beautiful and elegant and hard working and inspirational first lady is part white.

I'm not in the mood to debate first ladies. Politics, money and power---will be with us until the close of the ages. Corruption of some kind seems to be the by product.

I was 15 when Kennedy was elected and much more idealistic then than I am now. It all sounded good.

Implementing the ideals has taken its toll. To make a long story short.

I will be happy to see a new fashion trend. A minor annoyance but I'm tired of looking at bare arms.

Generally think Michelle O's style is OK but am seriously concerned about the political philosophies. I don't think she is that concerned about me and my family. Cognitive dissonance--'Ask not what your country can do for you...' I think we have moved away from that. for what it is worth.

 

[Sarah G]

Jackie was basically vain and interested in the gold ring.

Not so much with Michelle.

She likes people and knows how to keep the hubby at home.

Jackie was also as was the mindset back then, subservient to her husband. She didn't get in his business nor did she have much to say about his dalliances. She decorated the WH, did all of the girly stuff which she thought was the right thing to do but it wasn't the kind of thing she had chosen as a career. She placed her needs on the back burner.

Michelle puts her family in a high place but she includes herself in that scenario. She's happy and they're also happy, intelligent and loving. Her husband adores her. It shows.

I agree --somewhat. Jackie was more complex. She had a career --photojournalist, prior to marrying JFK. An aristocrat, intelligent, well educated. JFK had already established a reputation as a womanizer, like his father. He is said to have laid the cards on the table prior to becoming engaged.

Then went on to have her own career in publishing. Not exactly 'subservient'--jmo.

They were never 'average Americans'.

a quote--about Camelot.
'Do you know what I think of history? ... For a while I thought history was something that bitter old men wrote. But Jack loved history so... No one'll ever know everything about Jack. But ... history made Jack what he was ... this lonely, little sick boy ... scarlet fever ... this little boy sick so much of the time, reading in bed, reading history ... reading the Knights of the Round Table ... and he just liked that last song.
Then I thought, for Jack history was full of heroes. And if it made him this way, if it made him see the heroes, maybe other little boys will see. Men are such a combination of good and bad ... He was such a simple man. But he was so complex, too. Jack had this hero idea of history, the idealistic view, but then he had that other side, the pragmatic side... his friends were all his old friends; he loved his Irish Mafia.'

~~~
sigh--Prince William and Kate--they are said to be striving to represent/identify with the People. I suppose that is what the current first couple are doing. Tired of it--all I have to say.

After all the documentaries on JFK I can see how things have changed. I was 15 when he was assassinated. So much that I never knew--Cold War and Vietnam and more.

I just wonder what will come next.

Here you say you were 15 when he was assassinated ...

I was 15 when Kennedy was elected and much more idealistic then than I am now. It all sounded good.

Then you were 15 when he was elected ... Were you 15 all those years?

 

[wavingrl]

Jackie was also as was the mindset back then, subservient to her husband. She didn't get in his business nor did she have much to say about his dalliances. She decorated the WH, did all of the girly stuff which she thought was the right thing to do but it wasn't the kind of thing she had chosen as a career. She placed her needs on the back burner.

Michelle puts her family in a high place but she includes herself in that scenario. She's happy and they're also happy, intelligent and loving. Her husband adores her. It shows.

I agree --somewhat. Jackie was more complex. She had a career --photojournalist, prior to marrying JFK. An aristocrat, intelligent, well educated. JFK had already established a reputation as a womanizer, like his father. He is said to have laid the cards on the table prior to becoming engaged.

Then went on to have her own career in publishing. Not exactly 'subservient'--jmo.

They were never 'average Americans'.

a quote--about Camelot.
'Do you know what I think of history? ... For a while I thought history was something that bitter old men wrote. But Jack loved history so... No one'll ever know everything about Jack. But ... history made Jack what he was ... this lonely, little sick boy ... scarlet fever ... this little boy sick so much of the time, reading in bed, reading history ... reading the Knights of the Round Table ... and he just liked that last song.
Then I thought, for Jack history was full of heroes. And if it made him this way, if it made him see the heroes, maybe other little boys will see. Men are such a combination of good and bad ... He was such a simple man. But he was so complex, too. Jack had this hero idea of history, the idealistic view, but then he had that other side, the pragmatic side... his friends were all his old friends; he loved his Irish Mafia.'

~~~
sigh--Prince William and Kate--they are said to be striving to represent/identify with the People. I suppose that is what the current first couple are doing. Tired of it--all I have to say.

After all the documentaries on JFK I can see how things have changed. I was 15 when he was assassinated. So much that I never knew--Cold War and Vietnam and more.

I just wonder what will come next.

Here you say you were 15 when he was assassinated ...

I was 15 when Kennedy was elected and much more idealistic then than I am now. It all sounded good.

Then you were 15 when he was elected ... Were you 15 all those years?

oh --please excuse me. how odd that you would comment on that.

it was 'a long time ago'---I must have been 12-13 when he was elected. Had no clue about politics at 12 or at 15. He was 'young', had a pretty wife and later 2 children--all of that.

'Swept away'---thanks again media.

I haven't thought about the Kennedy's in quite some time. Driven people--as I am certain are others who aspire to great achievement.

that's all I've got.

 

[Sarah G]

Well at least you know I do read all of this.

 

[wavingrl]

Well at least you know I do read all of this.

does it make any sense to you?

it doesn't make much sense to me.

I have a very basic knowledge about the Kennedy family and about the same for the Bush family--less about others.

The struggle for power. Very disturbing--always has been and will be.