Mac's fix for the Real Estate crisis

[petro]

Hard to believe we can put men on the moon, put in artificial hearts, but can't economically dig a basement. Even a daylight basement work (only 4 ft underground).

I ask that question in phoenix and get told....too expensive. I say bullshyte.

My suspicion is desert soil is hard pan and a ***** to deal with.
Just a quick Google confirms that...

Why Basements Are Rare in Arizona

• Soil Conditions: Much of Arizona, particularly areas like Scottsdale, has hard, dense soil known as "caliche" or solid rock, making excavation difficult and costly.
• Frost Line: The frost line in Arizona is effectively at zero. In other regions, basements are often built to place foundations below the frost line to prevent freezing; this is unnecessary in Arizona's warm climate.
• Historical Development: Historically, developers had ample space to build outward rather than downward, eliminating the need for underground expansion.
• Cost and Regulation: Building a basement in the desert involves complex waterproofing and high costs for excavation.

As I get older, a one level rambler sounds like Heaven anyway. I hate stairs and carrying my laundry 3 flights.

I work residential construction and am very familiar with varying soil and water conditions.

 

[HikerGuy83]

My suspicion is desert soil is hard pan and a ***** to deal with.
Just a quick Google confirms that...

Why Basements Are Rare in Arizona

• Soil Conditions: Much of Arizona, particularly areas like Scottsdale, has hard, dense soil known as "caliche" or solid rock, making excavation difficult and costly.
• Frost Line: The frost line in Arizona is effectively at zero. In other regions, basements are often built to place foundations below the frost line to prevent freezing; this is unnecessary in Arizona's warm climate.
• Historical Development: Historically, developers had ample space to build outward rather than downward, eliminating the need for underground expansion.
• Cost and Regulation: Building a basement in the desert involves complex waterproofing and high costs for excavation.

As I get older, a one level rambler sounds like Heaven anyway. I hate stairs and carrying my laundry 3 flights.

I am aware of this. I know a guy who runs a concrete company. They don't do many basements.

More to the point. If someone came to him with one, he'd have to either hire it out or get some special help. They don't do them. If they were common....no issues.

Builders don't like them because they are cheap floor space and tend to cut down on footprint thus reducing cost of construction. This makes the $/square foot go down and the building industry does not like that.

You also have to allow for drainage. That makes for some additional plumbing. Again, builders don't like what they are not used to doing or have not done. They don't want to fix something like that if it is done wrong. A lot of housing is going up in more elevated areas so the water table is not a factor.

The few people I know that have them, love them in the valley. Guess where they spend most of their time in the summer? Really saves on cooling as they can let the upper floor warm a little more.

We already do stem walls, even for concrete pads. So we tear into the caliche as as it is.

I could dig one myself by hand if it were 30x30.

 

[Correll]

Well, America doesn't do that anymore.

Great. 2 ideas that both involve government regulation.

What a great idea.

IF corporatations insist on being BAD corporate citizens and doing shit like entering the home real estate marke to compete with young families trying to build homes,

then government regulation might be called for.

Indeed, in this specific case, I think the Big Money guys, are being complete asshats, and should be FUCKED, with some heavy handed regulation, to the point of we should have NO concern if they lose a lot of money in the process.

 

[Woodznutz]

Another thing is basements. Cheap living space. Why are they not done anymore or in some locations.

They're called "garden apartments". Great if you can have sunlight and keep them dry.

 

[Woodznutz]

Plop a medium-skill business in some of the thousands of small towns that are dying. That'll take the pressure off of the big city housing problems. When the "shoe factory" leaves the town dries up. Return a 'shoe factory' and watch the town flourish.

 

[Correll]

Plop a medium-skill business in some of the thousands of small towns that are dying. That'll take the pressure off of the big city housing problems. When the "shoe factory" leaves the town dries up. Return a 'shoe factory' and watch the town flourish.

ivy league educated business majors, can't think that.

They want to either put those factories in turd world countries, or in ******* california and then staff them with third world labor.

Then you have leftards point to poor red states and laugh at their low rate of economic development.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

Plop a medium-skill business in some of the thousands of small towns that are dying. That'll take the pressure off of the big city housing problems. When the "shoe factory" leaves the town dries up. Return a 'shoe factory' and watch the town flourish.

And compete with slave labor in Asia?
yeah.... no

 

[Woodznutz]

ivy league educated business majors, can't think that.

They want to either put those factories in turd world countries, or in ******* california and then staff them with third world labor.

Then you have leftards point to poor red states and laugh at their low rate of economic development.

Those aren't the people that have problems finding jobs or buying houses. My plan would cater to lower skilled workers that isn't attractive to high paid professionals.

Back in the day a couple of guys I knew carpooled to another city where they worked as machinists. They couldn't find work in our "white collar" city. They commuted because they didn't want to live in that city.

 

[Correll]

Those aren't the people that have problems finding jobs or buying houses. My plan would cater to lower skilled workers that isn't attractive to high paid professionals.

They are the people that decide where to put investment money.

And they are not going to put it where it benefits a bunch of rednecks whom they hate or at least have contempt for.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

Those aren't the people that have problems finding jobs or buying houses. My plan would cater to lower skilled workers that isn't attractive to high paid professionals.

Again, how do you propose to compete with slave labor from Asia?

 

[Correll]

Again, how do you propose to compete with slave labor from Asia?

Massive tariffs to **** those slave owners.

 

[Woodznutz]

They are the people that decide where to put investment money.

And they are not going to put it where it benefits a bunch of rednecks whom they hate or at least have contempt for.

That's where the government can help.

 

[Woodznutz]

Again, how do you propose to compete with slave labor from Asia?

With government subsidies.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

With government subsidies.

LOL
Raise taxes on the rich.

 

[Woodznutz]

LOL
Raise taxes on the rich.

No need, just redirect resources.

 

[Correll]

That's where the government can help.

If by that you mean bully big business into not being an elitist old boys club and invest in AMERICA, then I agree completely.

THey should also, not be nice about it. When I say "bully" I mean ******* bully these smug, stupid assholes.


Like holding their hands and doing that old, "why are you hitting yourself in the face" bit.

 

[Woodznutz]

If by that you mean bully big business into not being an elitist old boys club and invest in AMERICA, then I agree completely.

THey should also, not be nice about it. When I say "bully" I mean ******* bully these smug, stupid assholes.


Like holding their hands and doing that old, "why are you hitting yourself in the face" bit.

They can start by letting more contracts to domestic companies, and 'casting their bread on the (domestic) waters'.

 

[leftwinger]

"All would be controlled by HOAs that insure proper exterior maintenance and quality."

^^^^
That part is a big **** no for me.
I would never live in a HOA community.
Just another expensive cost with little return except for the Karen's running it.

Out west, they are hard to avoid. If you want a home that's not an 100yr old fixer-upper. Including corrided clogged pipes to the street in many cases.

Newer homes, gated communities are $150-$350 HOA probably.

 

[Mac-7]

Out west, they are hard to avoid. If you want a home that's not an 100yr old fixer-upper. Including corrided clogged pipes to the street in many cases.

Newer homes, gated communities are $150-$350 HOA probably.

HOA’s are a ripoff

 

[leftwinger]

Who the hell needs 2000 sq ft?

In the 60's and 70's people raised large families with 1,200 sq ft.

We've gotten way to entitled.

Another thing is basements. Cheap living space. Why are they not done anymore or in some locations.

I hear things like....to costly. Bullshit.

No basements out west. Maybe a crawlspace on older homes. They shake off the risers at E-Quake. Everything is slab. Pre-tension slab (don't drill, cables) is best.