Jefferson on gun control.

[JBeukema]

"No freeman shall be debarred the use of arms [within his own lands].

Thomas Jefferson, Draft Constitution for the State of Virginia, June, 1776"

Thomas Jefferson Quotes

What was his postion on flame throwers, atomic weapons, LAWS rockets, chemical weapons and biological weapons?

Just wondering.

Those would be considered "arms" I do believe.

I can haz a hydrogen bomb?

 

[JBeukema]

"No freeman shall be debarred the use of arms [within his own lands].

Thomas Jefferson, Draft Constitution for the State of Virginia, June, 1776"

Thomas Jefferson Quotes

What was his postion on flame throwers, atomic weapons, LAWS rockets, chemical weapons and biological weapons?

Just wondering.

STrawman, he of course had no position on something he didn't even know would ever exist. AND I don't see very many people wanting to own those items.

BUT a clear argument could be made, and in fact I do, that although the 2nd guarantees the right to bear arms, it doesn't guarantee the right to own anything that is available. Based on my other readings of Jefferson, I would say that if he were alive today he would agree with my assessment. I would also hope that Allie doesn't think anyone should be able to own said weapons.

If everyone had their own Castel Bravo, nobody would ever commit any crime- because we'd all be dead...

 

[JBeukema]

Funny how you people forget they also left us a constitution which allowed us to amend it to fit our modern world.

I can't believe it. Truthmatters has actually made an intelligent post. Someone pinch me.

Here, put these on

 

[ConHog]

What was his postion on flame throwers, atomic weapons, LAWS rockets, chemical weapons and biological weapons?

Just wondering.

STrawman, he of course had no position on something he didn't even know would ever exist. AND I don't see very many people wanting to own those items.

BUT a clear argument could be made, and in fact I do, that although the 2nd guarantees the right to bear arms, it doesn't guarantee the right to own anything that is available. Based on my other readings of Jefferson, I would say that if he were alive today he would agree with my assessment. I would also hope that Allie doesn't think anyone should be able to own said weapons.

If everyone had their own Castel Bravo, nobody would ever commit any crime- because we'd all be dead...

Well, there would be a FEW crimes committed, but they would be the last ones, that's for sure.

Seriously though, if one reads the 2nd strictly it only guarantees that you can bear arms. It does not guarantee what those arms can or can't be, and with obvious reason, I contend that Jefferson would have in noway wanted individual citizens to have the right to automatic weapons, WMD, or any other such weapon, but just as the rest of the document is left vague so that it can grow with technology and such, so to does 2nd.

For instance, the 1st says freedom of the press. Rather than stating books and newspapers specifically even though those were the only two mediums available at the time, if they had wrote freedom for newspapers and books, what about telegraph, radio, tv, internet? The were smart enough to see that potential issue, so they wrote the Bill of Rights somewhat vaguely.

 

[Fenris Wolf]

STrawman, he of course had no position on something he didn't even know would ever exist. AND I don't see very many people wanting to own those items.

BUT a clear argument could be made, and in fact I do, that although the 2nd guarantees the right to bear arms, it doesn't guarantee the right to own anything that is available. Based on my other readings of Jefferson, I would say that if he were alive today he would agree with my assessment. I would also hope that Allie doesn't think anyone should be able to own said weapons.

If everyone had their own Castel Bravo, nobody would ever commit any crime- because we'd all be dead...

Well, there would be a FEW crimes committed, but they would be the last ones, that's for sure.

Seriously though, if one reads the 2nd strictly it only guarantees that you can bear arms. It does not guarantee what those arms can or can't be, and with obvious reason, I contend that Jefferson would have in noway wanted individual citizens to have the right to automatic weapons, WMD, or any other such weapon, but just as the rest of the document is left vague so that it can grow with technology and such, so to does 2nd.

For instance, the 1st says freedom of the press. Rather than stating books and newspapers specifically even though those were the only two mediums available at the time, if they had wrote freedom for newspapers and books, what about telegraph, radio, tv, internet? The were smart enough to see that potential issue, so they wrote the Bill of Rights somewhat vaguely.

I disagree with part of your stance. I believe the vagueness of the amendment was intentional to include the advancement of technology, but from the other way, remember this was a government that was ruled by the people who were fearful of government. During the revolutionary war they had seen the advancement of weapons technology, from rifles, breech loading cannons, and munitions with devastating payloads. It was the citizen militia man armed with a rifle that fought for the newly formed government and their value was given tribute in the amendment. It can also be argued that this vague amendment was a way to control weapons development for government use by limiting what a government could use, because it's citizens could as well. Citizens were allowed to own whatever kind of weapon their hearts desired, including cannons, grenades, and machine guns, until 1934 under federal law. Individual citizens are still allowed to own these weapons, except the nbc weapons, under federal law, but with extreme restrictions, which I disagree with. The only part that I agree with you on are the nbc weapons, but strictly from a storage perspective, as it would be impossible for a normal person to safely store and maintain. I think we could undo the gun control acts of the last century and still maintain a safe society. We could restructure laws regarding nbc weapons to fall under the jurisdiction of the centers of disease control and the department of energy for instance. These types of weapons have already been introduced into the world, and there's no stopping a whacko that is hell-bent on improvising and/or using them for mass murder. Another argument that I have is that without another amendment or a repeal of the second amendment, any other gun law federal or otherwise should be null and void. This is just my view on this subject , maybe there is a compromise we could agree to that gives more freedom.

 

[AllieBaba]

Again, you attack a right "loon" while never saying anything about the idiots on the left, yet you claim that you are not a partisan hack? Take the big boy shoes off Bert, they don't fit yet and you just look silly trying to walk around in them.

And once you again you try to derail yet another thread by making another personal attack against me. Do you have a crush on me Conhog? Only thing that can really explain it.

You must of missed the fact I asked TM if she/he was whacked in the head yesterday after he/she made a comment to me. A perfect example of your ignorance that continues to infect this board like a virus. Only sad part is you spread your bullshit around this board in post form faster than a virus can infect a computer.

Oh Modbert, don't be so humble. EVERYBODY has a crush on you. Because heaven knows you're the only sincere, perfectly sane person in the world, let alone on this board...

 

[rikules]

Why make a king of a corpse?

Argue your own case if you can.

Of course I can. But now I'm on a Jefferson kick.

So shut up and try to learn something, you weird racist fuck.

"So shut up and try to learn something, you weird racist fuck."


the rest of the conservatives on this board must be SOOOOO proud of you....

 

[rikules]

Too late ...



You misunderestimate Allie. The right wing loon is strong in her.

Batshit crazy, she is.

View attachment 10821

Again, you attack a right "loon" while never saying anything about the idiots on the left, yet you claim that you are not a partisan hack? Take the big boy shoes off Bert, they don't fit yet and you just look silly trying to walk around in them.

and did YOU chastise allibabble for THIS comment;

"So shut up and try to learn something, you weird racist fuck."


I'll bet you didn't

so
instead of jumping on sane and rational people for what they say.....

why don't you tell allbabble to STOP being such a vulgar uncivilized lout....


or else
"just shut up and try to learn something, you weird racist fuck."

 

[ConHog]

Batshit crazy, she is.

View attachment 10821

Again, you attack a right "loon" while never saying anything about the idiots on the left, yet you claim that you are not a partisan hack? Take the big boy shoes off Bert, they don't fit yet and you just look silly trying to walk around in them.

and did YOU chastise allibabble for THIS comment;

"So shut up and try to learn something, you weird racist fuck."


I'll bet you didn't

so
instead of jumping on sane and rational people for what they say.....

why don't you tell allbabble to STOP being such a vulgar uncivilized lout....


or else
"just shut up and try to learn something, you weird racist fuck."

In this thread? No. but I HAVE when I felt she said something crazy....

 

[Modbert]

Oh Modbert, don't be so humble. EVERYBODY has a crush on you. Because heaven knows you're the only sincere, perfectly sane person in the world, let alone on this board...

Poor Allie, bad reaction to some food or something today? Between this and crying for Obama to be jailed, I think you just might be having a meltdown. You're on your way to Ihopehefails status.

 

[ConHog]

Oh Modbert, don't be so humble. EVERYBODY has a crush on you. Because heaven knows you're the only sincere, perfectly sane person in the world, let alone on this board...

Poor Allie, bad reaction to some food or something today? Between this and crying for Obama to be jailed, I think you just might be having a meltdown. You're on your way to Ihopehefails status.

and you're not even close to fitting in big boy shoes status.