Iraqi Poll and Iraqi Comments

[Annie]

http://chrenkoff.blogspot.com/2005/04/new-poll-from-iraq.html

Our special correspondent and translator Haider Ajina wants you to know about a new opinion poll from Iraq. It was published in the April 18 edition of Iraqi Arabic newspaper "Almidhar". 778 Baghdadis were asked:


"Do you support the pull out of foreign troops?

"At once - 12.56%

"According to a future timetable - 81.80%

"Do not know - 5.64%

"Has the security situation improved since the start of the new government?

"Yes - 55%

"No - 35%

"No change - 10%"
Haider also writes:


"Most of us read, heard and saw the medias report of the April 9th demonstrations in Baghdad. Most of the U.S. media portrayed it as a massive anti American demonstration in the streets of Iraq. I noticed, however, from Iraqi Arabic newspapers that most the demonstrations were against terrorism & calling for Saddam’s trial & hanging (all these signs were in Arabic). I called my father in Baghdad to confirm this and he confirmed it. My father then confirmed that Al Sadr had asked his followers to demonstrate for the withdrawal of foreign troops, he also said that this group was very small and almost insignificant compared to the rest who were calling for Saddam’s trial & hanging and those against terrorism. My father said the Iraqi media reported the number like this 'about 200,000 demonstrators of which 8,000-10,000 were Al-Sadr & Sunni supporters' (strange bed fellows). He also said that when he listened to the Iraqi elected officials (on live T.V.) in the assembly, that every one (every one including those Sunnis initially opposed to the elections), every man and woman assembly member, reiterated the importance of foreign and specifically U.S. troops staying in Iraq till Iraq is ready to take over its own security. Most of them expressed their thanks for the troops being there and freeing Iraqis from Saddam. This I did not read, hear or see in any U.S. mainstream media outlet.

"These are the people Iraq elected, asking us to stay and thanking us. The poll shows only 12% want us to leave at once. This makes a complete mockery of the mainstream media coverage of the demonstrations. As my wife told me when she heard the coverage on CNN: 'Haider you are going to get mad when you hear this', and I am still mad. Forgive me for rehashing this point. I feel it really needs pointing out. Iraqis are grateful for what we did and continue to be grateful for us being there."
The mainstream media fails yet again. Spread the word.

# posted by Arthur : 7:54 AM

 

[IceEyes]

Because of Hans Blix being from Sweden we probably followed the the events before the war more closley than we else would have done. The reason for this war was to neutralize Iraq military and following the ambition after the attack on World Trade Center, USA activley seeks out terrorist and their way of getting equiped, trained and supported.
But now, would it matter to USA if the Iraqies wanted USA to leave? How shall I put this...

Iraq is rid of Saddam and has a great oportunity to create a stable and democratic society. (I know it is a long road) But if this poll had come to the conclusion that 100% of the people wanted USA to leave, would that to be considered a failure? Is there a risk of an immidiant revolution when USA leaves?

 

[Annie]

Because of Hans Blix being from Sweden we probably followed the the events before the war more closley than we else would have done. The reason for this war was to neutralize Iraq military and following the ambition after the attack on World Trade Center, USA activley seeks out terrorist and their way of getting equiped, trained and supported.
But now, would it matter to USA if the Iraqies wanted USA to leave? How shall I put this...

Iraq is rid of Saddam and has a great oportunity to create a stable and democratic society. (I know it is a long road) But if this poll had come to the conclusion that 100% of the people wanted USA to leave, would that to be considered a failure? Is there a risk of an immidiant revolution when USA leaves?

I think there is little doubt that the outside forces, as well as the Saddam sympathesizers would kill the common Iraqis quest for self-government.

 

[IceEyes]

I think there is little doubt that the outside forces, as well as the Saddam sympathesizers would kill the common Iraqis quest for self-government.

Doesn't that mean that what the Iraqies feels about the American presence has no impact on when to withdraw the military? Maybe Iraq will follow the way things have turned in Afghanistan. Slowly some sort of order is forming.

If everything goes well I don't really think Iraq risk being jumped by their neighbours. On the other hand... well, we'll see, right? If a country in the middle-east is to survive without an army of "neighbour jumping" standards they will need powerfull allies.

Anyway, the mainstream media picture is a global issue.

 

[Annie]

Doesn't that mean that what the Iraqies feels about the American presence has no impact on when to withdraw the military? Maybe Iraq will follow the way things have turned in Afghanistan. Slowly some sort of order is forming.

If everything goes well I don't really think Iraq risk being jumped by their neighbours. On the other hand... well, we'll see, right? If a country in the middle-east is to survive without an army of "neighbour jumping" standards they will need powerfull allies.

Anyway, the mainstream media picture is a global issue.

Actually I'm not sure if we would stay there, if the new government wanted us out. Believe it or not, there have been substantial changes in US thinking and attitude.

Many believed, including in the US that the US would never leave Western Europe, NATO, UN, etc. I wouldn't be so sure. The American people have heard and read what passes for best sellers and popular humor in France, Germany, the Netherlands. We watched as Schroeder was elected, to some degree on his anti-American comments. Just in the past week, Chirac is attempting to get a yes vote on EU approval, based on being a block to US.

As so many have said to US, perhaps it is better that we care for ourselves and our friends. It is also wise to ascertain who are your friends and who are your enemies.

 

[IceEyes]

Actually I'm not sure if we would stay there, if the new government wanted us out. Believe it or not, there have been substantial changes in US thinking and attitude.

Many believed, including in the US that the US would never leave Western Europe, NATO, UN, etc. I wouldn't be so sure. The American people have heard and read what passes for best sellers and popular humor in France, Germany, the Netherlands. We watched as Schroeder was elected, to some degree on his anti-American comments. Just in the past week, Chirac is attempting to get a yes vote on EU approval, based on being a block to US.

As so many have said to US, perhaps it is better that we care for ourselves and our friends. It is also wise to ascertain who are your friends and who are your enemies.

That is truely chilling. Americans have got to accept some degree of critiscism, as do everyone who take serious actions. It is easier to blame someone who is doing something than vice versa.

I think America and Europe is sharing some fundamental values. Ofcource there are, and will be differencies, but I can't think of USA as anything else than a nation sharing my western way of life. European politicians trying to distance Europe from USA is making more harm than good. I hope Europe and EU will mature into a strong and reliable counterpart to USA. A shattered and divided Europe will do you no good and it won't raise no good either.

As for best sellers i don't know what you mean exactly. Humor is humor.

 

[Annie]

That is truely chilling. Americans have got to accept some degree of critiscism, as do everyone who take serious actions. It is easier to blame someone who is doing something than vice versa.

I think America and Europe is sharing some fundamental values. Ofcource there are, and will be differencies, but I can't think of USA as anything else than a nation sharing my western way of life. European politicians trying to distance Europe from USA is making more harm than good. I hope Europe and EU will mature into a strong and reliable counterpart to USA. A shattered and divided Europe will do you no good and it won't raise no good either.

As for best sellers i don't know what you mean exactly. Humor is humor.

Chilling? Why? I would have thought that was what you were looking for, that the US respects what the citizens of other countries desire us to do :scratch:

 

[IceEyes]

Chilling? Why? I would have thought that was what you were looking for, that the US respects what the citizens of other countries desire us to do :scratch:

I'm sorry. I don't quite follow you...

...and I tried again.
Maybe I missed the point totally. I don't get it! Language problem maybe?

Some back tracing...
Why has this thread ended up here?

You started talking about Chriac and Schroeder... Does Americans feel that Europe has some sort of unified opinions in matter of USA/Iraq? I don't think there is, think of Europe like USA, where countries are states but with no (or little) coordination.

 

[Annie]

I'm sorry. I don't quite follow you...

...and I tried again.
Maybe I missed the point totally. I don't get it! Language problem maybe?

Some back tracing...
Why has this thread ended up here?

You started talking about Chriac and Schroeder... Does Americans feel that Europe has some sort of unified opinions in matter of USA/Iraq? I don't think there is, think of Europe like USA, where countries are states but with no (or little) coordination.

Probably is the language. Your original post referred to 'criticism' acceptance by the US. Funny thing, US citizens probably criticize our government more than outsiders. What you seem to not understand, perhaps are not aware of, is just how much anti-Americanism seems to be being bought and sold in much of Europe. We have come to see the European nations, at least the Western ones, with the exception of UK administration, as working as one, via EU.

 

[IceEyes]

Probably is the language. Your original post referred to 'criticism' acceptance by the US. Funny thing, US citizens probably criticize our government more than outsiders. What you seem to not understand, perhaps are not aware of, is just how much anti-Americanism seems to be being bought and sold in much of Europe. We have come to see the European nations, at least the Western ones, with the exception of UK administration, as working as one, via EU.

About criticism acceptance by the US, I think it is natural. Anyone who does anything other than just passively watching draws criticism. That is not a bad thing and not only in politics.

When I think of it you are right... from the top of my head is the work of Michael Moore. I've read one of his books. But I think of it as curiosities wich would be equally sick, had he wrote about Sweden. A book wich manages to say not one positive word can hardly be a objective book. Apart from that I feel that, even if America is talked about alot - your'e bound to be talked about, there are many different views.

A few general random things everyone consider "good" with USA even if it sometimes doen't show over there:
- US research in general, like space and medicine.
- US way of making business.
- US way of standing up for their allies.
- US way of getting things done instead of talking
- The US army
- Technologies developed by US is considered top class


It makes me a bit sad that Europe is looked upon as almost hostile. EU forms by no way a unified instument. We probably won't be able to agree over the first federal laws. The foreign policies vary alot.

 

[Annie]

About criticism acceptance by the US, I think it is natural. Anyone who does anything other than just passively watching draws criticism. That is not a bad thing and not only in politics.

When I think of it you are right... from the top of my head is the work of Michael Moore. I've read one of his books. But I think of it as curiosities wich would be equally sick, had he wrote about Sweden. A book wich manages to say not one positive word can hardly be a objective book. Apart from that I feel that, even if America is talked about alot - your'e bound to be talked about, there are many different views.

A few general random things everyone consider "good" with USA even if it sometimes doen't show over there:
- US research in general, like space and medicine.
- US way of making business.
- US way of standing up for their allies.
- US way of getting things done instead of talking
- The US army
- Technologies developed by US is considered top class


It makes me a bit sad that Europe is looked upon as almost hostile. EU forms by no way a unified instument. We probably won't be able to agree over the first federal laws. The foreign policies vary alot.

I must say, I'm impressed with your response. Truly, it's refreshing. I do think many Europeans do not understand us any better than we do them.

I can understand their experiences in the two world wars making them very strongly want to avoid war, but not appeasement and not blocking a traditional ally the way that has been done. For a continent so obsessed with history, they appear unable to understand the lessons.

Sometimes I think they understand the US no better than a bin Laden or Saddam. While US went too long without reacting forcefully from Carter-Clinton, the hope that we would return there, well it is based on smoke, not going to happen.

 

[IceEyes]

I must say, I'm impressed with your response. Truly, it's refreshing. I do think many Europeans do not understand us any better than we do them.

I can understand their experiences in the two world wars making them very strongly want to avoid war, but not appeasement and not blocking a traditional ally the way that has been done. For a continent so obsessed with history, they appear unable to understand the lessons.

Sometimes I think they understand the US no better than a bin Laden or Saddam. While US went too long without reacting forcefully from Carter-Clinton, the hope that we would return there, well it is based on smoke, not going to happen.

Thank you! Very nice said.
I was thinking, maybe in a forum like this, wich is emphasizing on differences, a touch of understaning stands out more. At leas I am getting alot of interesting views and opinions here.