Investment Manager Explains Why 99.5% Of Americans Can Never Win

[expat_panama]

...how did the topic get changed to hunger?

Yeah I thought that was slick too. Seems to have happened sometime around post #50 because we'd begun with 99.9% of Americans can't win, then to "the vast majority", then to "not a small minority".

Ain't it great --an amazing recovery right before our very eyes!!

 

[SteadyMercury]

So you are telling us that you don't believe that hunger exists in this country? Really?

Incorrect, I've never claimed that but I'm getting used to you twisting arguments so you can beat on straw men.

Hunger exists in this country, but it cannot be measured by vaguely defined terms like "food insecure" to where you use stats on that to declare 17 million children go to bed hungry every night.

 

[expat_panama]

So you are telling us that you don't believe that hunger exists in this country? Really?

Incorrect, I've never claimed that but I'm getting used to you twisting arguments so you can beat on straw men....

Huh, so I'm not the only one he does that with. I guess I'm just not as special as I thought I was...

 

[Spiderman]

...how did the topic get changed to hunger?

Yeah I thought that was slick too. Seems to have happened sometime around post #50 because we'd begun with 99.9% of Americans can't win, then to "the vast majority", then to "not a small minority".

Ain't it great --an amazing recovery right before our very eyes!!

And don't forget the morph from Americans to all poor people in the world

 

[depotoo]

If that were the case, I would have already won the biggest victim claim in history. Which would mean that I am richer than anyone else. Since that is not the case, next.

I agree that everyone is different. Moreover, everyone has a different situation. Contrary to popular conservative opinion, in the vast majority of cases, the poor are NOT poor because they choose to be.

Of course it's a choice.

One can remain poor or one can improve his position.

It really is that simple. Not easy mind you but simple nonetheless.

Have you ever taken graduate-level economics classes? The truth about "success" has very little to do with purely hard work--many people work very, very hard. Wealth almost always is the result of (1) inheritance of land, property, position, or cash; (2) a very fortunate set of available "contacts"'; (3) purely unrepeatable and unpredictable luck; and/or (3) crime.

it's called working smart and living smart - not necessarily hard. And in your prior post you mentioned taking the money out of the economy. Nowhere did he state to take it out, he said to invest for a return on the money - thus keeping it in the economy.

 

[depotoo]

So much of our country has the mentality that goals aren't important. If you set a goal and work toward it, never taking your eyes off the ball, you are much more likely to succeed in any endeavor.
And working toward a goal of being able to retire early, thus sacrificing some today is a very worthy goal. Of which, unfortunately many are never told just how important that work will be to their later success in life.

I am not talking dreams here, I am talking goals - goals where you set down and make a plan, just as any succesful business does, and following the steps you need to achieve that goal. Can there be bumps in the road? Of course, but the 'winners' are those that don't let those bumps become mountains and run right over them.

One less latte a week. Buying a pair of shoes which are not the most coveted and buying on sale. Not eating out this week. Taking your lunch rather than eating out. Not buying those game tickets. Not having netflix. Using coupons or shopping only the sales when buying groceries. Not giving your kids the latest and greatest toys out there. People that do these things will be able to see they are able to save, even if it all does not apply to you. And not only can you look upon it as an accomplishment, your wallet will be fatter and you really won't feel that deprived.

 

[depotoo]

The Problem | No Kid Hungry | End Child Hunger in America...

From the link:

...16 million kids in America aren't getting the food they need.

--and from googling 'food insecurity'

food insecurity
​

Web definitions

Food security refers to the availability of food and one's access to it. A household is considered food-secure when its occupants do not live in hunger or fear of starvation. The USDA estimates that nearly 9 out of 10 U.S households were food secure throughout 2005. ...
Food security - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
​

Maybe the problem of getting a precise read on the number of FI people has to do with quantifying 'fear of starvation'. I mean I think starvation is something bad enough that we all should be afraid of it, although I personally would not demand tax supported government assistance just to make me feel better about something that's not happening.

So just to be clear, you don't believe that hunger is a serious problem in this country?

How do you define hunger?

 

[Kimura]

Of course it's a choice.

One can remain poor or one can improve his position.

It really is that simple. Not easy mind you but simple nonetheless.

Have you ever taken graduate-level economics classes? The truth about "success" has very little to do with purely hard work--many people work very, very hard. Wealth almost always is the result of (1) inheritance of land, property, position, or cash; (2) a very fortunate set of available "contacts"'; (3) purely unrepeatable and unpredictable luck; and/or (3) crime.

it's called working smart and living smart - not necessarily hard. And in your prior post you mentioned taking the money out of the economy. Nowhere did he state to take it out, he said to invest for a return on the money - thus keeping it in the economy.

Not necessarily. Wall Street and, by and large, the FIRE sector make their money through rent seeking. Economic rent doesn't make any contribution to productivity and is an overall drag on the macro level of the economy.

 

[orogenicman]

From the link:--and from googling 'food insecurity'

food insecurity
​

​

Web definitions

Food security refers to the availability of food and one's access to it. A household is considered food-secure when its occupants do not live in hunger or fear of starvation. The USDA estimates that nearly 9 out of 10 U.S households were food secure throughout 2005. ...
Food security - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
​

Maybe the problem of getting a precise read on the number of FI people has to do with quantifying 'fear of starvation'. I mean I think starvation is something bad enough that we all should be afraid of it, although I personally would not demand tax supported government assistance just to make me feel better about something that's not happening.

So just to be clear, you don't believe that hunger is a serious problem in this country?

How do you define hunger?

Are you trying to argue semantics?

 

[orogenicman]

So you are telling us that you don't believe that hunger exists in this country? Really?

Incorrect, I've never claimed that but I'm getting used to you twisting arguments so you can beat on straw men.

It sure seemed to be what you were suggesting.

Hunger exists in this country,

Finally, we are getting somewhere.

but it cannot be measured by vaguely defined terms like "food insecure" to where you use stats on that to declare 17 million children go to bed hungry every night.

How would you define it?

 

[Spiderman]

What's wrong with going to bed hungry once in a while?

No one is starving in the streets.

When was the last documented death of a child from starvation in the USA?

 

[orogenicman]

So much of our country has the mentality that goals aren't important. If you set a goal and work toward it, never taking your eyes off the ball, you are much more likely to succeed in any endeavor.
And working toward a goal of being able to retire early, thus sacrificing some today is a very worthy goal. Of which, unfortunately many are never told just how important that work will be to their later success in life.

I am not talking dreams here, I am talking goals - goals where you set down and make a plan, just as any succesful business does, and following the steps you need to achieve that goal. Can there be bumps in the road? Of course, but the 'winners' are those that don't let those bumps become mountains and run right over them.

One less latte a week. Buying a pair of shoes which are not the most coveted and buying on sale. Not eating out this week. Taking your lunch rather than eating out. Not buying those game tickets. Not having netflix. Using coupons or shopping only the sales when buying groceries. Not giving your kids the latest and greatest toys out there. People that do these things will be able to see they are able to save, even if it all does not apply to you. And not only can you look upon it as an accomplishment, your wallet will be fatter and you really won't feel that deprived.

In the real world where millions of people cannot actually afford that latte, those coveted shoes, eating out, or buying game tickets (etc., etc., etc.,), I don't think your plan will work very well until the root of the problem (chronically high unemployment, chronically low wages, an over-prevalence of menial jobs, along with an education system that is failing our youth) is solved.

 

[Ernie S.]

It's the classic false dichotomy.

You are either poor or vastly wealthy all the gradations in between don't matter to those who constantly whine about "the rich"

I do not aspire to the lifestyle mentioned in the article. I don't want a yacht or an opulent home or a new Lambo in the garage.

Here's a some simple math for you people who say you can't achieve financial freedom.

If you save 100 a week for 45 years with an average return of 7% you'll retire with 1.5 million dollars.

1.5 million dollars safely invested at a 5% return could pay you 5000 a month and in 30 years you'd have a million dollars more than you started with.

That's my definition of winning.

But people will come up with every excuse in the book why they can't save that money.

Oh, you mean like the fact that millions simply don't have the money to spare because despite working their arses off, they don't make enough money to think about saving it?

If you spend 30 years working your ass off flipping burgers, of course you won't make enough to save much.

BUT

The wealthy did not hold you back. The wealthy did not deny you an education or remove your free will.

The wealthy owe you NOTHING.
YOU owe it to yourself to excel.

 

[Ernie S.]

So just to be clear, you don't believe that hunger is a serious problem in this country?

How do you define hunger?

Are you trying to argue semantics?

Not yet. He asked you to define hunger. Are kids on food stamps hungry?

How do you know. They may live on a farm and have all the food they need. Their mother may be frugal and may scrimp elsewhere so she can provide good food to her kids.
SO, define hunger and how you come up with a census of hungry Americans.

 

[flacaltenn]

Oh, you mean like the fact that millions simply don't have the money to spare because despite working their arses off, they don't make enough money to think about saving it?

And it's impossible for them to make a little extra money right?

That's your problem. You'll look for any excuse why your failures are someone else's fault.

$100 extra dollars a week can be earned by anyone if they want to. They just don't want to.

Right, so your solution for people who work their arses off with little to show for it is for them to work their arses off even more. Wow, what a brilliant idea, particularly for poor single working mothers with all the time in the world <sarcasm>.

In ANY Century --- it's not how hard you work that's rewarded.. It's what you PRODUCE that matters. In the 21st Century -- the value is in what you KNOW and how FLEXIBLE your skills are..

Discussions like this do NOTHING to prepare society for modern reality. And attempting to REDISTRIBUTE income and wealth will NOT FIX the imminent disaster of wrong-skilled labor...

 

[Ernie S.]

So much of our country has the mentality that goals aren't important. If you set a goal and work toward it, never taking your eyes off the ball, you are much more likely to succeed in any endeavor.
And working toward a goal of being able to retire early, thus sacrificing some today is a very worthy goal. Of which, unfortunately many are never told just how important that work will be to their later success in life.

I am not talking dreams here, I am talking goals - goals where you set down and make a plan, just as any succesful business does, and following the steps you need to achieve that goal. Can there be bumps in the road? Of course, but the 'winners' are those that don't let those bumps become mountains and run right over them.

One less latte a week. Buying a pair of shoes which are not the most coveted and buying on sale. Not eating out this week. Taking your lunch rather than eating out. Not buying those game tickets. Not having netflix. Using coupons or shopping only the sales when buying groceries. Not giving your kids the latest and greatest toys out there. People that do these things will be able to see they are able to save, even if it all does not apply to you. And not only can you look upon it as an accomplishment, your wallet will be fatter and you really won't feel that deprived.

In the real world where millions of people cannot actually afford that latte, those coveted shoes, eating out, or buying game tickets (etc., etc., etc.,), I don't think your plan will work very well until the root of the problem (chronically high unemployment, chronically low wages, an over-prevalence of menial jobs, along with an education system that is failing our youth) is solved.

But they have flat screen TV's, cell phones, subsidized rent and food stamps... How can they be hungry?

 

[kwc57]

It's the classic false dichotomy.

You are either poor or vastly wealthy all the gradations in between don't matter to those who constantly whine about "the rich"

I do not aspire to the lifestyle mentioned in the article. I don't want a yacht or an opulent home or a new Lambo in the garage.

Here's a some simple math for you people who say you can't achieve financial freedom.

If you save 100 a week for 45 years with an average return of 7% you'll retire with 1.5 million dollars.

1.5 million dollars safely invested at a 5% return could pay you 5000 a month and in 30 years you'd have a million dollars more than you started with.

That's my definition of winning.

But people will come up with every excuse in the book why they can't save that money.

Oh, you mean like the fact that millions simply don't have the money to spare because despite working their arses off, they don't make enough money to think about saving it?

Why are they working their asses off for not enough money? What have THEY not done to better themselves since flipping burgers in high school? That's the question.

 

[orogenicman]

It's the classic false dichotomy.

You are either poor or vastly wealthy all the gradations in between don't matter to those who constantly whine about "the rich"

I do not aspire to the lifestyle mentioned in the article. I don't want a yacht or an opulent home or a new Lambo in the garage.

Here's a some simple math for you people who say you can't achieve financial freedom.

If you save 100 a week for 45 years with an average return of 7% you'll retire with 1.5 million dollars.

1.5 million dollars safely invested at a 5% return could pay you 5000 a month and in 30 years you'd have a million dollars more than you started with.

That's my definition of winning.

But people will come up with every excuse in the book why they can't save that money.

Oh, you mean like the fact that millions simply don't have the money to spare because despite working their arses off, they don't make enough money to think about saving it?

Why are they working their asses off for not enough money? What have THEY not done to better themselves since flipping burgers in high school? That's the question.

The real question is why you live in this dream world of yours where everyone actually has the same opportunities, and never, ever have bad things happen to them.

 

[orogenicman]

And it's impossible for them to make a little extra money right?

That's your problem. You'll look for any excuse why your failures are someone else's fault.

$100 extra dollars a week can be earned by anyone if they want to. They just don't want to.

Right, so your solution for people who work their arses off with little to show for it is for them to work their arses off even more. Wow, what a brilliant idea, particularly for poor single working mothers with all the time in the world <sarcasm>.

In ANY Century --- it's not how hard you work that's rewarded.. It's what you PRODUCE that matters. In the 21st Century -- the value is in what you KNOW and how FLEXIBLE your skills are..

Discussions like this do NOTHING to prepare society for modern reality. And attempting to REDISTRIBUTE income and wealth will NOT FIX the imminent disaster of wrong-skilled labor...

What has Paris Hilton ever produced that makes her more valuable than a person whose blood, sweat and tears makes it possible for you to affordably put food on your table?

 

[orogenicman]

What's wrong with going to bed hungry once in a while?

No one is starving in the streets.

When was the last documented death of a child from starvation in the USA?

Hunger Statistics, Hunger Facts & Poverty Facts | Feeding America


Poverty http://feedingamerica.org/hunger-in-america/hunger-facts/hunger-and-poverty-statistics.aspx#_edn1

• In 2012, 46.5 million people (15.0 percent) were in poverty.
• In 2012, 26.5 million (13.7 percent) of people ages 18-64 were in poverty.
• In 2012, 16.1 million (21.8 percent) children under the age of 18 were in poverty.
• In 2012, 3.9 million (9.1 percent) seniors 65 and older were in poverty.
• The overall poverty rate according to the Supplemental Poverty Measure is 16.1%, as compared with the official poverty rate of 15.1%. [ii]
• Under the Supplemental Poverty Measure, there are 49.7 million people living in poverty, 3.1 million more than are represented by the official poverty measure (46.5 million). [iii]

Food Insecurity and Very Low Food Security [iv]

• In 2012, 49.0 million Americans lived in food insecure households, 33.1 million adults and 15.9 million children.
• In 2012, 14.5 percent of households (17.6 million households) were food insecure.
• In 2012, 5.7 percent of households (7.0 million households) experienced very low food security.
• In 2012, households with children reported food insecurity at a significantly higher rate than those without children, 20.0 percent compared to 11.9 percent.
• In 2012, households that had higher rates of food insecurity than the national average included households with children (20.0 percent), especially households with children headed by single women (35.4 percent) or single men (23.6 percent), Black non-Hispanic households (24.6 percent) and Hispanic households (23.3 percent).
• In 2011, 4.8 million seniors (over age 60), or 8.4% of all seniors were food insecure. [v]
• Food insecurity exists in every county in America, ranging from a low of 2.4 percent in Slope County, ND to a high of 35.2 percent in Holmes County, MS. [vi]