If Universal Healthcare is a Bad Idea...

[Ray From Cleveland]

conservatives want taxes to go what's outlined in the Constitution and nothing more.

Would you eliminate Social Security, Medicare & Medicaid, then?
.

Yes I would, and if states want those or similar programs, then they can start and fund them. But the federal government should not be in charge of the nations healthcare or retirement. If our founders expected that from a federal government, those items would be listed in the Constitution.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Oh, sure it was, it was the way everywhere. Just some countries grew up, and you're basically telling me the US is still in 1900.

No. We're not in 1900. With 26 specific exceptions we should still be in the last 25 years of the 18th Century. You know, when this nation was founded and the rules which were intended to govern this nation (Thge US Constitution) were put in place.

We should no more expect to be governed by 18th century rules than the founders thought they should be governed by British rules.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Then you reject public education?

Which, if you think about it, is universal education, using the healthcare terminology.

I don't reject public education, I do reject how it's paid for......at least in our state.

Our schools are funded by property taxes--not if or how many children you have in the school system. In fact I filed a complaint about my property taxes and I have a hearing date setup in a few weeks. So what happened after I got the date? The Board of Education sent me a notice they are sending their sleezy lawyers to the hearing to fight me on it.

I have never had children in my life. None of my tenants ever had children in the public school system. Yet we collectively are paying three times the amount of money to the schools than the lady down the street with four kids in the system. That's unfair.

Schools should be funded mostly by the parents. There is your universal school system. Taxing me for something I'll never use is plain robbery. I decided early in life never to have children mostly because of the expense. If you have children, then you should pay for their education--not me.

So you believe the poor should go without an education - if the parents can't afford it - AND without healthcare, if the parents can't afford it.

See, AGAIN, what I mean? It's all about widening the gap between rich and poor with these RWnuts.

NOWHERE in their agenda do you see anything that contradicts that statement.

Nobody should be forced to pay for other peoples shit… this is not a village, fuck the village

Fine. Then exempt me from all of my taxes that go to the military. That is ALL other people's shit.

Nope. It is a Constitutionally mandated responsibility of the federal government, which can levy taxes against you in support of it.

So now you agree that it's okay to force people to pay for other people's shit.

Make up your mind.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Provide a public option and we can all see what is the most efficient public or private.

You fuckers keep your public option, leave the rest of us out of it. Millions of Americans want nothing to do with the collective

The military is the most 'collective' institution in America.

No one is forced into the military, the same cannot be said for fucked up socialist entitlement programs...
The sooner the collective burns to the ground the better for the country

lol. I was drafted. Go soak your empty head.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

Who should go without?

The people that do not want it, and should not be paying for other people....
Fucking Control freaks...

If you don't want it, then never seek care. Simple.

 

[Rustic]

Provide a public option and we can all see what is the most efficient public or private.

You fuckers keep your public option, leave the rest of us out of it. Millions of Americans want nothing to do with the collective

The military is the most 'collective' institution in America.

No one is forced into the military, the same cannot be said for fucked up socialist entitlement programs...
The sooner the collective burns to the ground the better for the country

lol. I was drafted. Go soak your empty head.

So you do know how it feels to be forced into something that you do not want? Lol
No one should be forced into a socialist entitlement programs… End of story

 

[Rustic]

Who should go without?

The people that do not want it, and should not be paying for other people....
Fucking Control freaks...

If you don't want it, then never seek care. Simple.

Health insurance/single payer are not healthcare… Dipshit
Lol

 

[WheelieAddict]

Obamacare would have been fine if it was an "opt in"... the only people in it would've been the people that wanted to be in it.

The obamacare rule that everyone needs to have healthcare needs to stand. I don't want higher taxes or policy costs because dumb rednecks pay nothing then go to the ER.

Fortunately it's no longer enforced under the Trump administration, but the mandate needs to be abolished. Frivolous lawsuits and the extravagant lifestyle's they promote by lawyers and doctors are the reason why healthcare costs are so high....

Taxpayers pay IRS $3 billion in 2015 for Obamacare penalty

Good, no more deadbeats that go to the ER and don't pay the bill.

How would you know? Commie Care plans have a $7,000 deductible and $7,000 out of pocket. So they still won't pay the bill.

Better for everyone to pay the bill instead of you being a deadbeat then.

 

[Lewdog]

You're like a fucking broken record. And how many vacations have they been able to take their family on? Can they buy the brand new gaming systems other families do? How many new cars do they have? How often do they get to go out to dinner at a nice restaurant? Do you think they are proud parents to their children because they can't afford to do simple things like take their kids to a movie like their kid's friend's parents can?

Okay, how many vacations do they take their family on? They are on vacation every day. I only get two weeks. As far as going somewhere, I don't know, but as for myself, I haven't been on a vacation where I go somewhere in over 30 years.

Can they buy the latest gaming system? I don't know, but whatever they do have has got to be newer than my Playstation 2.

How many new cars do they have? None, and neither do I. I have a 2009 Toyota Camry,

How often do they go to dinner at a nice restaurant. I don't know, and I don't run into them since I haven't been at a nice restaurant in decades.

Movies? Well that might be too pricy for them since they have four kids--two more than the average working family. And if they can't give their children the extras that they are deprived of, maybe they shouldn't have had kids in the first place??? Or if they want to take their family out to the movies twice a month, work at McDonald's two days a month and that's enough to afford the movies.

The sad thing in all this is, you actually think that people enjoy being poor so that they can get HUD and Food Stamps... despite the fact they can't actually get the things that others enjoy in life.

They may not enjoy being poor, but they don't mind it either.

You must be one miserable son of a bitch to be around in real life sitting at your front window watching people in your neighborhood complaining about everything they do.

And I shouldn't be? I should just hand over my money to the government and not care how they spend it? When I see my neighbor getting disability checks going to the gas station every morning when I leave for work to buy beer, that's something I shouldn't be concerned about?

Oh, that's right, you think it's governments money and not mine. When they need more, they just go to the money tree in the back of the White House and pick more.

You don't do things by choice. They don't do them because they can't.

I'll be honest your neighbors should be afraid of you and file some kind of paperwork about it. You sound creepy as fuck keeping tabs on every single thing they do, going as far as to pay attention to how much food they have on the grill during a BBQ with friends. You have no clue as to whether they provided the food or their friends brought it with them.

Just because someone gets a disability check doesn't mean they have to live their life like you want them to. If you want it to be that way, then maybe you should move to North Korea or some Communist country.

 

[WheelieAddict]

Who decides?
I was not well off as a young man as most are not. Luckily, I never needed to use healthcare in any real way. The ability to pay at any given time should not be the deciding factor when prioritizing care. The goal rather, should be balancing those in need with those who are not.

Very simply, the people giving the care decide. If they're willing to work for free, good for you. If not, too bad.

I reset a mildly dislocated shoulder of mine twice in one year about 15 years ago, because I didn't have a medical plan or money to cover the doctor's visit. That's life.

You have no more Right to get the Government to steal money from me to pay for your medical needs thsn I would have to get the Government to steal from you to cover mine. The fact thst you support exactly that tells me some unpleasant things about your character.

What you dopes fail to realize is that you already pay for those who can't with higher costs and premiums. The most inefficient way possible to do it.

They don't want to see that because ideology.

 

[Rustic]

The obamacare rule that everyone needs to have healthcare needs to stand. I don't want higher taxes or policy costs because dumb rednecks pay nothing then go to the ER.

Fortunately it's no longer enforced under the Trump administration, but the mandate needs to be abolished. Frivolous lawsuits and the extravagant lifestyle's they promote by lawyers and doctors are the reason why healthcare costs are so high....

Taxpayers pay IRS $3 billion in 2015 for Obamacare penalty

Good, no more deadbeats that go to the ER and don't pay the bill.

How would you know? Commie Care plans have a $7,000 deductible and $7,000 out of pocket. So they still won't pay the bill.

Better for everyone to pay the bill instead of you being a deadbeat then.

Health insurance/single payer is not healthcare, and the federal government never pays its debt… So they have no credibility

 

[Anathema]

We should no more expect to be governed by 18th century rules than the founders thought they should be governed by British rules.

Then change the rules, don't ignore them. Unless you don't believe you have the support to get the changes passed.

 

[Lewdog]

You can't use the experience of just a couple people "You know" as how things really are. I knew someone that had agoraphobia so bad they couldn't leave their house without a panic attack and Crohn's Disease so bad they bled out of their ass every day. It took them the max amount of tries, then a refile, and the max amount of tries again to get approved. It took them 8 years, had lost everything they had, and was living in a homeless shelter by the time they got approved.

I've never heard of 8 years.

HOW LONG DOES IT TAKE TO BE APPROVED FOR SSI OR SOCIAL SECURITY DISABILITY?

You didn't read my post or you don't understand it. You can only appeal so far, then you have to refile and start all over.

I read it and responded by providing a link which covers the appeals process.

You don't get it. You only get to appeal so far, then you have to start ALL OVER again. Not sure how many times I gotta repeat myself here.

 

[Rustic]

You're like a fucking broken record. And how many vacations have they been able to take their family on? Can they buy the brand new gaming systems other families do? How many new cars do they have? How often do they get to go out to dinner at a nice restaurant? Do you think they are proud parents to their children because they can't afford to do simple things like take their kids to a movie like their kid's friend's parents can?

Okay, how many vacations do they take their family on? They are on vacation every day. I only get two weeks. As far as going somewhere, I don't know, but as for myself, I haven't been on a vacation where I go somewhere in over 30 years.

Can they buy the latest gaming system? I don't know, but whatever they do have has got to be newer than my Playstation 2.

How many new cars do they have? None, and neither do I. I have a 2009 Toyota Camry,

How often do they go to dinner at a nice restaurant. I don't know, and I don't run into them since I haven't been at a nice restaurant in decades.

Movies? Well that might be too pricy for them since they have four kids--two more than the average working family. And if they can't give their children the extras that they are deprived of, maybe they shouldn't have had kids in the first place??? Or if they want to take their family out to the movies twice a month, work at McDonald's two days a month and that's enough to afford the movies.

The sad thing in all this is, you actually think that people enjoy being poor so that they can get HUD and Food Stamps... despite the fact they can't actually get the things that others enjoy in life.

They may not enjoy being poor, but they don't mind it either.

You must be one miserable son of a bitch to be around in real life sitting at your front window watching people in your neighborhood complaining about everything they do.

And I shouldn't be? I should just hand over my money to the government and not care how they spend it? When I see my neighbor getting disability checks going to the gas station every morning when I leave for work to buy beer, that's something I shouldn't be concerned about?

Oh, that's right, you think it's governments money and not mine. When they need more, they just go to the money tree in the back of the White House and pick more.

You don't do things by choice. They don't do them because they can't.

I'll be honest your neighbors should be afraid of you and file some kind of paperwork about it. You sound creepy as fuck keeping tabs on every single thing they do, going as far as to pay attention to how much food they have on the grill during a BBQ with friends. You have no clue as to whether they provided the food or their friends brought it with them.

Just because someone gets a disability check doesn't mean they have to live their life like you want them to. If you want it to be that way, then maybe you should move to North Korea or some Communist country.

All the more reason for strengthening the 10th amendment… Keep the fucking federal government out of our personal business

 

[WheelieAddict]

You're like a fucking broken record. And how many vacations have they been able to take their family on? Can they buy the brand new gaming systems other families do? How many new cars do they have? How often do they get to go out to dinner at a nice restaurant? Do you think they are proud parents to their children because they can't afford to do simple things like take their kids to a movie like their kid's friend's parents can?

Okay, how many vacations do they take their family on? They are on vacation every day. I only get two weeks. As far as going somewhere, I don't know, but as for myself, I haven't been on a vacation where I go somewhere in over 30 years.

Can they buy the latest gaming system? I don't know, but whatever they do have has got to be newer than my Playstation 2.

How many new cars do they have? None, and neither do I. I have a 2009 Toyota Camry,

How often do they go to dinner at a nice restaurant. I don't know, and I don't run into them since I haven't been at a nice restaurant in decades.

Movies? Well that might be too pricy for them since they have four kids--two more than the average working family. And if they can't give their children the extras that they are deprived of, maybe they shouldn't have had kids in the first place??? Or if they want to take their family out to the movies twice a month, work at McDonald's two days a month and that's enough to afford the movies.

The sad thing in all this is, you actually think that people enjoy being poor so that they can get HUD and Food Stamps... despite the fact they can't actually get the things that others enjoy in life.

They may not enjoy being poor, but they don't mind it either.

You must be one miserable son of a bitch to be around in real life sitting at your front window watching people in your neighborhood complaining about everything they do.

And I shouldn't be? I should just hand over my money to the government and not care how they spend it? When I see my neighbor getting disability checks going to the gas station every morning when I leave for work to buy beer, that's something I shouldn't be concerned about?

Oh, that's right, you think it's governments money and not mine. When they need more, they just go to the money tree in the back of the White House and pick more.

You don't do things by choice. They don't do them because they can't.

I'll be honest your neighbors should be afraid of you and file some kind of paperwork about it. You sound creepy as fuck keeping tabs on every single thing they do, going as far as to pay attention to how much food they have on the grill during a BBQ with friends. You have no clue as to whether they provided the food or their friends brought it with them.

Just because someone gets a disability check doesn't mean they have to live their life like you want them to. If you want it to be that way, then maybe you should move to North Korea or some Communist country.

Makes you wonder why he/her is so paranoid about it...

 

[WheelieAddict]

You're like a fucking broken record. And how many vacations have they been able to take their family on? Can they buy the brand new gaming systems other families do? How many new cars do they have? How often do they get to go out to dinner at a nice restaurant? Do you think they are proud parents to their children because they can't afford to do simple things like take their kids to a movie like their kid's friend's parents can?

Okay, how many vacations do they take their family on? They are on vacation every day. I only get two weeks. As far as going somewhere, I don't know, but as for myself, I haven't been on a vacation where I go somewhere in over 30 years.

Can they buy the latest gaming system? I don't know, but whatever they do have has got to be newer than my Playstation 2.

How many new cars do they have? None, and neither do I. I have a 2009 Toyota Camry,

How often do they go to dinner at a nice restaurant. I don't know, and I don't run into them since I haven't been at a nice restaurant in decades.

Movies? Well that might be too pricy for them since they have four kids--two more than the average working family. And if they can't give their children the extras that they are deprived of, maybe they shouldn't have had kids in the first place??? Or if they want to take their family out to the movies twice a month, work at McDonald's two days a month and that's enough to afford the movies.

The sad thing in all this is, you actually think that people enjoy being poor so that they can get HUD and Food Stamps... despite the fact they can't actually get the things that others enjoy in life.

They may not enjoy being poor, but they don't mind it either.

You must be one miserable son of a bitch to be around in real life sitting at your front window watching people in your neighborhood complaining about everything they do.

And I shouldn't be? I should just hand over my money to the government and not care how they spend it? When I see my neighbor getting disability checks going to the gas station every morning when I leave for work to buy beer, that's something I shouldn't be concerned about?

Oh, that's right, you think it's governments money and not mine. When they need more, they just go to the money tree in the back of the White House and pick more.

You don't do things by choice. They don't do them because they can't.

I'll be honest your neighbors should be afraid of you and file some kind of paperwork about it. You sound creepy as fuck keeping tabs on every single thing they do, going as far as to pay attention to how much food they have on the grill during a BBQ with friends. You have no clue as to whether they provided the food or their friends brought it with them.

Just because someone gets a disability check doesn't mean they have to live their life like you want them to. If you want it to be that way, then maybe you should move to North Korea or some Communist country.

All the more reason for strengthening the 10th amendment… Keep the fucking federal government out of our personal business

Yeah those federal highways and health standards are bullshit!

 

[Anathema]

What you dopes fail to realize is that you already pay for those who can't with higher costs and premiums. The most inefficient way possible to do it.

That's only because the liberal shit Reagan forced providers to service useless sacks of crap. Fix that and stop covering the scum and premiums will go down.

 

[Missouri_Mike]

Who decides?
I was not well off as a young man as most are not. Luckily, I never needed to use healthcare in any real way. The ability to pay at any given time should not be the deciding factor when prioritizing care. The goal rather, should be balancing those in need with those who are not.

Very simply, the people giving the care decide. If they're willing to work for free, good for you. If not, too bad.

I reset a mildly dislocated shoulder of mine twice in one year about 15 years ago, because I didn't have a medical plan or money to cover the doctor's visit. That's life.

You have no more Right to get the Government to steal money from me to pay for your medical needs thsn I would have to get the Government to steal from you to cover mine. The fact thst you support exactly that tells me some unpleasant things about your character.

What you dopes fail to realize is that you already pay for those who can't with higher costs and premiums. The most inefficient way possible to do it.

What you dupes don't realize is people steal from stores. The most efficient way to stop that is to just let people take what they want and the government will pay for it.

 

[Rustic]

You're like a fucking broken record. And how many vacations have they been able to take their family on? Can they buy the brand new gaming systems other families do? How many new cars do they have? How often do they get to go out to dinner at a nice restaurant? Do you think they are proud parents to their children because they can't afford to do simple things like take their kids to a movie like their kid's friend's parents can?

Okay, how many vacations do they take their family on? They are on vacation every day. I only get two weeks. As far as going somewhere, I don't know, but as for myself, I haven't been on a vacation where I go somewhere in over 30 years.

Can they buy the latest gaming system? I don't know, but whatever they do have has got to be newer than my Playstation 2.

How many new cars do they have? None, and neither do I. I have a 2009 Toyota Camry,

How often do they go to dinner at a nice restaurant. I don't know, and I don't run into them since I haven't been at a nice restaurant in decades.

Movies? Well that might be too pricy for them since they have four kids--two more than the average working family. And if they can't give their children the extras that they are deprived of, maybe they shouldn't have had kids in the first place??? Or if they want to take their family out to the movies twice a month, work at McDonald's two days a month and that's enough to afford the movies.

The sad thing in all this is, you actually think that people enjoy being poor so that they can get HUD and Food Stamps... despite the fact they can't actually get the things that others enjoy in life.

They may not enjoy being poor, but they don't mind it either.

You must be one miserable son of a bitch to be around in real life sitting at your front window watching people in your neighborhood complaining about everything they do.

And I shouldn't be? I should just hand over my money to the government and not care how they spend it? When I see my neighbor getting disability checks going to the gas station every morning when I leave for work to buy beer, that's something I shouldn't be concerned about?

Oh, that's right, you think it's governments money and not mine. When they need more, they just go to the money tree in the back of the White House and pick more.

You don't do things by choice. They don't do them because they can't.

I'll be honest your neighbors should be afraid of you and file some kind of paperwork about it. You sound creepy as fuck keeping tabs on every single thing they do, going as far as to pay attention to how much food they have on the grill during a BBQ with friends. You have no clue as to whether they provided the food or their friends brought it with them.

Just because someone gets a disability check doesn't mean they have to live their life like you want them to. If you want it to be that way, then maybe you should move to North Korea or some Communist country.

All the more reason for strengthening the 10th amendment… Keep the fucking federal government out of our personal business

Yeah those federal highways and health standards are bullshit!

We don't need anymore Federal highways, let the states take care of themselves. The nanny state is no good for any sort of freedom and individuality…

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

You can't use the experience of just a couple people "You know" as how things really are. I knew someone that had agoraphobia so bad they couldn't leave their house without a panic attack and Crohn's Disease so bad they bled out of their ass every day. It took them the max amount of tries, then a refile, and the max amount of tries again to get approved. It took them 8 years, had lost everything they had, and was living in a homeless shelter by the time they got approved.

I've never heard of 8 years.

HOW LONG DOES IT TAKE TO BE APPROVED FOR SSI OR SOCIAL SECURITY DISABILITY?

You didn't read my post or you don't understand it. You can only appeal so far, then you have to refile and start all over.

I read it and responded by providing a link which covers the appeals process.

You don't get it. You only get to appeal so far, then you have to start ALL OVER again. Not sure how many times I gotta repeat myself here.

I see. Since you obviously never even looked at the link, would you like me to copy and paste the appeals process? I have some yard work to do, but I can get to it today if you'd like.