If minimum wage were raised ...

[Spoonman]

You don't have to bump Sally because if she's making only 2-3 dollars over minimum wage, she isn't going to leave just to be knocked down to entry level.
And if she CAN leave for more she would have left already.

But now the boss is stuck with Sally's resentment for being more productive yet not making more money. Employees can make you or break you.

I'd be happy to give Sally a raise but I don't know if it would be correlated to the rise in the minimum wage. However, in truth, I would never have employees making the minimum wage to start with. If my competitors didn't follow suit, I'd probably end up with their Sally's resumes on my desk.

and your competitors would be undercutting your prices and your sales would decline. now you'll be laying off over paid sally's just to keep your doors open.

 

[candycorn]

But now the boss is stuck with Sally's resentment for being more productive yet not making more money. Employees can make you or break you.

I'd be happy to give Sally a raise but I don't know if it would be correlated to the rise in the minimum wage. However, in truth, I would never have employees making the minimum wage to start with. If my competitors didn't follow suit, I'd probably end up with their Sally's resumes on my desk.

and your competitors would be undercutting your prices and your sales would decline. now you'll be laying off over paid sally's just to keep your doors open.

Maybe...maybe not. Sally is a good employee. She gives the customers speedy refills of their iced green tea promptly; removes their plates; brings their food quickly... Customers appreciate her and some to my bistro more often than the passive-resistance they experience from my competitor's staff.

 

[Mathbud1]

I'd be happy to give Sally a raise but I don't know if it would be correlated to the rise in the minimum wage. However, in truth, I would never have employees making the minimum wage to start with. If my competitors didn't follow suit, I'd probably end up with their Sally's resumes on my desk.

and your competitors would be undercutting your prices and your sales would decline. now you'll be laying off over paid sally's just to keep your doors open.

Maybe...maybe not. Sally is a good employee. She gives the customers speedy refills of their iced green tea promptly; removes their plates; brings their food quickly... Customers appreciate her and some to my bistro more often than the passive-resistance they experience from my competitor's staff.

But if Sally realizes that since the minimum wage had been raised she can go out and get a less demanding job for the same wage you are offering her, what is to keep her around unless you do bump her wage?

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[Spoonman]

I'd be happy to give Sally a raise but I don't know if it would be correlated to the rise in the minimum wage. However, in truth, I would never have employees making the minimum wage to start with. If my competitors didn't follow suit, I'd probably end up with their Sally's resumes on my desk.

and your competitors would be undercutting your prices and your sales would decline. now you'll be laying off over paid sally's just to keep your doors open.

Maybe...maybe not. Sally is a good employee. She gives the customers speedy refills of their iced green tea promptly; removes their plates; brings their food quickly... Customers appreciate her and some to my bistro more often than the passive-resistance they experience from my competitor's staff.

perhaps, if you cater to the rich. other than that your doors will soon be shutting.

 

[candycorn]

and your competitors would be undercutting your prices and your sales would decline. now you'll be laying off over paid sally's just to keep your doors open.

Maybe...maybe not. Sally is a good employee. She gives the customers speedy refills of their iced green tea promptly; removes their plates; brings their food quickly... Customers appreciate her and some to my bistro more often than the passive-resistance they experience from my competitor's staff.

But if Sally realizes that since the minimum wage had been raised she can go out and get a less demanding job for the same wage you are offering her, what is to keep her around unless you do bump her wage?

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Uh...okay???

 

[Mathbud1]

Maybe...maybe not. Sally is a good employee. She gives the customers speedy refills of their iced green tea promptly; removes their plates; brings their food quickly... Customers appreciate her and some to my bistro more often than the passive-resistance they experience from my competitor's staff.

But if Sally realizes that since the minimum wage had been raised she can go out and get a less demanding job for the same wage you are offering her, what is to keep her around unless you do bump her wage?

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Uh...okay???

If Sally is making more than the minimum wage it is likely because her job is more challenging than the jobs that make minimum wage. The demands of the job justify a higher wage. If less demanding jobs (ie minimum wage jobs) are bumped to match her pay, why will she stay in the more demanding job unless she gets a proportional increase?

Also, the closer you are to entry level the more vertical advancement is open above you in your company. Staff to shift lead, shift lead to supervisor, supervisor to manager, etc. If you can take a job closer to entry level for the same wage, you increase the possibility for advancement.

Obviously there may be other mitigating factors, but a smart employee is not going to sit around and let you pay them the same in that kind of situation.

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[candycorn]

and your competitors would be undercutting your prices and your sales would decline. now you'll be laying off over paid sally's just to keep your doors open.

Maybe...maybe not. Sally is a good employee. She gives the customers speedy refills of their iced green tea promptly; removes their plates; brings their food quickly... Customers appreciate her and some to my bistro more often than the passive-resistance they experience from my competitor's staff.

perhaps, if you cater to the rich. other than that your doors will soon be shutting.

I'd probably have my bistro in an upper-middle income neighborhood to start with; true.

However, one of the reasons Chik-fil-a does well in some bad neighborhoods is because they emphasize service...there are usually flowers or greenery on the table,
a big flagpole in the parking lot, a very clean playground, evenings where the mascot is there to entertain kids, staffs that ask your name and call it out when your order is ready, neatly arranged and clean condiment stations.... Nobody would argue that Chik-fil-a competes price-wise with Burger King or McDonalds. There is no "dollar menu" at CFA. Yet they are often times across the street from these low-price leaders and are doing very well.

http://media.chick-fil-a.com/Media/...nts/Chick-fil-A-interior-lg.jpg?download=true

 

[Spoonman]

Maybe...maybe not. Sally is a good employee. She gives the customers speedy refills of their iced green tea promptly; removes their plates; brings their food quickly... Customers appreciate her and some to my bistro more often than the passive-resistance they experience from my competitor's staff.

perhaps, if you cater to the rich. other than that your doors will soon be shutting.

I'd probably have my bistro in an upper-middle income neighborhood to start with; true.

However, one of the reasons Chik-fil-a does well in some bad neighborhoods is because they emphasize service...there are usually flowers or greenery on the table,
a big flagpole in the parking lot, a very clean playground, evenings where the mascot is there to entertain kids, staffs that ask your name and call it out when your order is ready, neatly arranged and clean condiment stations.... Nobody would argue that Chik-fil-a competes price-wise with Burger King or McDonalds. There is no "dollar menu" at CFA. Yet they are often times across the street from these low-price leaders and are doing very well.

http://media.chick-fil-a.com/Media/...nts/Chick-fil-A-interior-lg.jpg?download=true

all true, but they still pay minimum wage

 

[candycorn]

But if Sally realizes that since the minimum wage had been raised she can go out and get a less demanding job for the same wage you are offering her, what is to keep her around unless you do bump her wage?

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Uh...okay???

If Sally is making more than the minimum wage it is likely because her job is more challenging than the jobs that make minimum wage. The demands of the job justify a higher wage. If less demanding jobs (ie minimum wage jobs) are bumped to match her pay, why will she stay in the more demanding job unless she gets a proportional increase?

Also, the closer you are to entry level the more vertical advancement is open above you in your company. Staff to shift lead, shift lead to supervisor, supervisor to manager, etc. If you can take a job closer to entry level for the same wage, you increase the possibility for advancement.

Obviously there may be other mitigating factors, but a smart employee is not going to sit around and let you pay them the same in that kind of situation.

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Yeah, I gave Sally a raise. If the raise isn't enticing enough...there is nothing I can do about that.

 

[candycorn]

perhaps, if you cater to the rich. other than that your doors will soon be shutting.

I'd probably have my bistro in an upper-middle income neighborhood to start with; true.

However, one of the reasons Chik-fil-a does well in some bad neighborhoods is because they emphasize service...there are usually flowers or greenery on the table,
a big flagpole in the parking lot, a very clean playground, evenings where the mascot is there to entertain kids, staffs that ask your name and call it out when your order is ready, neatly arranged and clean condiment stations.... Nobody would argue that Chik-fil-a competes price-wise with Burger King or McDonalds. There is no "dollar menu" at CFA. Yet they are often times across the street from these low-price leaders and are doing very well.

http://media.chick-fil-a.com/Media/...nts/Chick-fil-A-interior-lg.jpg?download=true

all true, but they still pay minimum wage

Your point was that service made no difference unless you were catering to the rich.
I think CFA employees make a tad more...not sure.
CFA employees certainly work harder but they get Sundays off

 

[Mathbud1]

Maybe...maybe not. Sally is a good employee. She gives the customers speedy refills of their iced green tea promptly; removes their plates; brings their food quickly... Customers appreciate her and some to my bistro more often than the passive-resistance they experience from my competitor's staff.

perhaps, if you cater to the rich. other than that your doors will soon be shutting.

I'd probably have my bistro in an upper-middle income neighborhood to start with; true.

However, one of the reasons Chik-fil-a does well in some bad neighborhoods is because they emphasize service...there are usually flowers or greenery on the table,
a big flagpole in the parking lot, a very clean playground, evenings where the mascot is there to entertain kids, staffs that ask your name and call it out when your order is ready, neatly arranged and clean condiment stations.... Nobody would argue that Chik-fil-a competes price-wise with Burger King or McDonalds. There is no "dollar menu" at CFA. Yet they are often times across the street from these low-price leaders and are doing very well.

http://media.chick-fil-a.com/Media/...nts/Chick-fil-A-interior-lg.jpg?download=true

Agreed. I worked at chick-fil-a when I was younger. They strongly emphasize customer service to all of their employees. They also offer higher quality foods. But they aren't paying their cashiers more (or not much more) than minimum wage, and they are going to be affected by a minimum wage hike. At some point even high quality fast food is just too expensive for people to justify buying though.

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[candycorn]

perhaps, if you cater to the rich. other than that your doors will soon be shutting.

I'd probably have my bistro in an upper-middle income neighborhood to start with; true.

However, one of the reasons Chik-fil-a does well in some bad neighborhoods is because they emphasize service...there are usually flowers or greenery on the table,
a big flagpole in the parking lot, a very clean playground, evenings where the mascot is there to entertain kids, staffs that ask your name and call it out when your order is ready, neatly arranged and clean condiment stations.... Nobody would argue that Chik-fil-a competes price-wise with Burger King or McDonalds. There is no "dollar menu" at CFA. Yet they are often times across the street from these low-price leaders and are doing very well.

http://media.chick-fil-a.com/Media/...nts/Chick-fil-A-interior-lg.jpg?download=true

Agreed. I worked at chick-fil-a when I was younger. They strongly emphasize customer service to all of their employees. They also offer higher quality foods. But they aren't paying their cashiers more (or not much more) than minimum wage, and they are going to be affected by a minimum wage hike. At some point even high quality fast food is just too expensive for people to justify buying though.

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Theorhetically a FMW increase of $0.25 per hour will hit all companies that pay minimum wages equally. So CFA has no injury that MCD didn't experience.

 

[Mathbud1]

I'd probably have my bistro in an upper-middle income neighborhood to start with; true.

However, one of the reasons Chik-fil-a does well in some bad neighborhoods is because they emphasize service...there are usually flowers or greenery on the table,
a big flagpole in the parking lot, a very clean playground, evenings where the mascot is there to entertain kids, staffs that ask your name and call it out when your order is ready, neatly arranged and clean condiment stations.... Nobody would argue that Chik-fil-a competes price-wise with Burger King or McDonalds. There is no "dollar menu" at CFA. Yet they are often times across the street from these low-price leaders and are doing very well.

http://media.chick-fil-a.com/Media/...nts/Chick-fil-A-interior-lg.jpg?download=true

Agreed. I worked at chick-fil-a when I was younger. They strongly emphasize customer service to all of their employees. They also offer higher quality foods. But they aren't paying their cashiers more (or not much more) than minimum wage, and they are going to be affected by a minimum wage hike. At some point even high quality fast food is just too expensive for people to justify buying though.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

Theorhetically a FMW increase of $0.25 per hour will hit all companies that pay minimum wages equally. So CFA has no injury that MCD didn't experience.

That's true, but McDonald's was cheaper to begin with. If both have to raise their prices, chick-fil-a as the more expensive option runs a bigger risk of passing the threshold that makes them too expensive for fast food to justify.

Also, I haven't heard anyone advocating that small of an increase. The increases I've heard more often suggested are more in the range of $1.75.

 

[Spoonman]

I'd probably have my bistro in an upper-middle income neighborhood to start with; true.

However, one of the reasons Chik-fil-a does well in some bad neighborhoods is because they emphasize service...there are usually flowers or greenery on the table,
a big flagpole in the parking lot, a very clean playground, evenings where the mascot is there to entertain kids, staffs that ask your name and call it out when your order is ready, neatly arranged and clean condiment stations.... Nobody would argue that Chik-fil-a competes price-wise with Burger King or McDonalds. There is no "dollar menu" at CFA. Yet they are often times across the street from these low-price leaders and are doing very well.

http://media.chick-fil-a.com/Media/...nts/Chick-fil-A-interior-lg.jpg?download=true

all true, but they still pay minimum wage

Your point was that service made no difference unless you were catering to the rich.
I think CFA employees make a tad more...not sure.
CFA employees certainly work harder but they get Sundays off

that's service that doesn't come at high priced sally wages. they get the same level of service from their minimum wage employees. they position themselves as being something more than a low pried fast food joint. BK tried it years ago. they became the healthy alternative, expanded their menu, offered salads and low fat alternatives. they still paid their employees the same amount.

 

[asterism]

Another question is whether it makes any sense to subsidise companies indirectly by providing SNAP and other general assistance to workers making less than a living wage.

It should be pretty obvious that if general assistance is available to workers making less than a certain wage level and minimum wage is below that level, then businesses will naturally pay less than that and workers will supliment their income with general assistance. (like SNAP.)

Roughly speaking, it seems that general assistance would kick in above a minimum wage of about $718.

Federal poverty level is $11490 a year for 2013. SNAP 130% of poverty level is $1,245 a month. 100% is $958. So, using the 130% for the sake of arguement, then that is $14940 per year.

Working 40 hours a week is 2080 hours a year, making that an hourly rate of $7.18.

Roughly, it means that above that $7.18, then SNAP assistance is unavailable. And, roughly speaking then, above $7.18 is a minimum livable wage.

That seems to be a baseline approach to measuring minimum wage. Minimum wage sits at what? $7.25 federal minimum?

Whether is should or should not be higher remains a question. It seems, though, that $7.25 just squeeks in at the 130% poverty mark. It may be that, in fact, the 130% poverty level is a function of the minimum wage standard.

Seems important to put things into some context.

My must all jobs pay a living wage when not all jobseekers need nor qualify for a living wage?

 

[Spiderman]

If minimum wage were raised about 3% of earners would have a couple more dollars a week to waste on shit they don't need.

Yeah big boost to the economy there.

 

[Dragonlady]

If minimum wage were raised about 3% of earners would have a couple more dollars a week to waste on shit they don't need.

Yeah big boost to the economy there.

Since more than half of minimum wage earners are over 25, and a large percentage are single mothers supporting one or more children, that money will be spent on food, rent, clothing. Non-essentials like that.

 

[Papawx3]

About 3% of all workers make minimum wage. Raising it a few bucks over four years will do nothing to injure anyone. Come off of it.

What you fail to understand is that for every minimum wage worker in any "private sector" organization, there are several more further up that corporate ladder who worked their way up from that same minimum wage job and pay scale.
If you raise the minimum wage worker from his present $8.25 level up to $15.00 per hour, then you also have to similarly raise the wages of every one of those who are above him/her. In order to make up for all those wage increases, you then have to raise the price of your company's product or service. The higher you raise the prices of your products or services then the greater the chances are that you will price yourself out of the range of your customer's affordability and thus your company's competitiveness in the marketplace. Soon, you will price yourself right out of business.
In short, you can't afford to run a business if you have to pay your employees more than for what you can market your product or service.

 

[Bluedog]

Tough call here. I guess the amount of people who may get their hours cut needs to be weighed against the benefit of raising everyone's wages.

Catch 22 in my opinion.

 

[Spiderman]

If minimum wage were raised about 3% of earners would have a couple more dollars a week to waste on shit they don't need.

Yeah big boost to the economy there.

Since more than half of minimum wage earners are over 25, and a large percentage are single mothers supporting one or more children, that money will be spent on food, rent, clothing. Non-essentials like that.

Yeah keep telling yourself that.