Has the Bible ever been proven wrong?

[glockmail]

I didn't say you said that, did I?

You debate like a person who doesn't believe anything they write. And, you still didn't answer the question. Do you believe the Bible is 100% accurate and true?

Yes I do, but that's not the issue, is it?

 

[MissileMan]

No, nor do I anything else. But what I think you're going to try & do here is ask, how can I believe in the Bible when so much depends on faith, right?
How can one believe the "stories" that are told?

Too many people believe that Christianity makes a person weak. That because we take the higher road, turn the other cheek....; a bunch of self-righteous do-gooders. But I will tell you, it takes ALOT of strength to stand for what you believe in; and when push comes to shove, we can be a bunch of tough S.O.B's, as the recent election bears out.

What I was trying to get across to you is that my disbelief in any deity is identical to your disbelief in Islam. That's it in a nutshell. I'm not making the argument to smear Christians. You think it's foolish to require proof, I think it's foolish to not.

 

[MissileMan]

Yes I do, but that's not the issue, is it?

No, the issue is that "never been proven wrong" doesn't equal "100% accurate and true".

 

[Joz]

What I was trying to get across to you is that my disbelief in any deity is identical to your disbelief in Islam. That's it in a nutshell. I'm not making the argument to smear Christians. You think it's foolish to require proof, I think it's foolish to not.

Where did you get that I think it's foolish to require proof?
Just because there is ALOT that requires faith, doesn't mean I don't need evidence that God is who He says He is and will do what He says He will do.

And that is exactly why I believe.

 

[MissileMan]

Where did you get that I think it's foolish to require proof?

That was my interpretation of your tone in Post#24. I guess I misread it.

 

[Joz]

That was my interpretation of your tone in Post#24. I guess I misread it.

Fair assumption. Like I said, there is alot that needs to be accepted on strictly by faith.

But in order for that faith to grow, you occasionally need concrete proof. Some refuse to accept even when proof is given.
Sort of like, if your wife always told you she loved you but never in ANY way showed you, would you believe her?

 

[glockmail]

No, the issue is that "never been proven wrong" doesn't equal "100% accurate and true".

Gee, that doesn't read anything like Post 1. Perhaps you should start a new thread, Call it: "prove the Bible 100% accurate by first hand accounts only".

So really, just why are you afraid of the Truth?

 

[MissileMan]

Fair assumption. Like I said, there is alot that needs to be accepted on strictly by faith.

But in order for that faith to grow, you occasionally need concrete proof. Some refuse to accept even when proof is given.
Sort of like, if your wife always told you she loved you but never in ANY way showed you, would you believe her?

In your example, if I believed her only based on her testimony, I would be displaying faith in the absence of any concrete proof, in other words, taking her word for it.

When it comes to religion, I've yet to be presented any concrete evidence.

 

[mattskramer]

Firstly, check out "A Case for Christ," by Lee Strobel. It's much longer than I can post here, but it makes a legal case for the complete story of Jesus Christ. There was also a similar book written by a British lawyer intent on proving that the Jesus story was bogus, but came to the conclusion that with 4 corroborating witness stories that match historically verifiable evidence, the story was true beyond a reasonable doubt. He published his book and converted to Christianity.

Next, check out "Exodus Decoded," on the History Channel and produced by James Cameron. It gives a full array of archeological evidence that supports, beyond a reasonable doubt, the Biblical account of the entire book of Exodus, from evidence of all ten plagues to the location of Mt. Sinai, to what is believed to be an actual image of the Ark of the Covenant.

The entire chronological account from the annihilation of Canaan to the conquests by other nations has been archeologically proven, and accounts of the battles are so accurate that generals throughout history have taken Bibles with them to that area of the world not (solely) for their spiritual content, but because it has a detailed account of over half of the major military actions occurring in that area and is an excellent source of battle strategy for that area.

Archeologists also tend to carry Bibles for their historical accuracy.

About the only thing people think they can prove wrong about the Bible is the age of the Earth. The problem is that the estimated Biblical age starts with the base assumption that the Jewish geneologies contain all relatives. However, ancient Jewish geneologies only record ancestors of note, and the Bible also claims that people lived hundreds of years, potentially throwing off all calculations, as people might have been able to bear (or at least father) children well past the modern 50 year average.

http://www.infidels.org/library/mode...r/strobel.html

http://mwillett.org/atheism/strobel.htm

http://www.jesuspuzzle.com/

 

[glockmail]

Cat got your toungue, Matts?

 

[MissileMan]

Gee, that doesn't read anything like Post 1. Perhaps you should start a new thread, Call it: "prove the Bible 100% accurate by first hand accounts only".

So really, just why are you afraid of the Truth?

It was your suggestion to use legal standards in determining whether something from the Bible was wrong, not mine. I even offered to let you use a lesser burden of proof, but as usual, after painting yourself in a corner, you fail miserably to present an argument of any substance. It's too bad that you didn't stop to consider that a legal standard would include the inadmission of hearsay evidence before you shot your mouth off.

 

[mattskramer]

Cat got your toungue, Matts?

Not really. I’m just tired of the whole debate. For every book or web site that people can produce supporting a belief in Jesus and the Bible, people have other books and web sites to counter those. Christian apologists have web sites to counter those that counter the pro-Christian books. Atheists have information to counter those that counter those that counter those. The arguments and debates go on and on and on. People spend a lifetime trying to find the truth. I’m tired of it. :blah2:

 

[glockmail]

Not really. I’m just tired of the whole debate. For every book or web site that people can produce supporting a belief in Jesus and the Bible, people have other books and web sites to counter those. Christian apologists have web sites to counter those that counter the pro-Christian books. Atheists have information to counter those that counter those that counter those. The arguments and debates go on and on and on. People spend a lifetime trying to find the truth. I’m tired of it. :blah2:

Well perhaps that should tell you something. The web site that you cited in the other thread that attempted to prove inconsistencies was shown to be wrong, at least for the examples that you gave. That actually surprised me, as I have used that source myself to dispute the Koran.

 

[Joz]

......When it comes to religion, I've yet to be presented any concrete evidence.

Maybe you have been, but just hate to admit it or refuse to see it?
It's sometimes very hard to admit that with all the knowledge & wonder this world holds, we really know nothing.

And yes, if you went solely on the words of your wife, you would be accepting by faith, that she loves you. But isn't it nice for her to prove it to you occasionally?

 

[Annie]

Not really. I’m just tired of the whole debate. For every book or web site that people can produce supporting a belief in Jesus and the Bible, people have other books and web sites to counter those. Christian apologists have web sites to counter those that counter the pro-Christian books. Atheists have information to counter those that counter those that counter those. The arguments and debates go on and on and on. People spend a lifetime trying to find the truth. I’m tired of it. :blah2:

Are they all equal in what they are saying? Proving?

 

[MissileMan]

Maybe you have been, but just hate to admit it or refuse to see it?

Why do you find it so hard to believe that I haven't? Two-thirds of the planet don't share your spiritual beliefs...do you honestly believe we're all in denial?

 

[LuvRPgrl]

There you go with that 100% requirement. It doesn't surprise me that you dismiss beyond reasonable doubt, as I surmised in post 10.

besides, homers oddysey never tried to present itself as factual. Many Bibilical proofs of history have come AFTER some have claimed those events, people or places didnt occur because they were just not believable.

 

[LuvRPgrl]

Of course it is. You volunteer to use the legal standard of "beyond a reasonable doubt" and when presented with the opportunity to use the even lower legal standard of "preponderance of the evidence", you suddenly think the whole idea is lame. Perhaps you find it so because you don't really believe it yourself.

How about the "great flood"

Also, the Hebrew? diet God gave them. Until recently, people were not aware of many nutrional aspects of most foods. It turns out the diet presented to the Hebrews? by God is an excellent and very healthy one.

 

[LuvRPgrl]

An interesting argument. Do you accept the claims of Muslims without benefit of critical thought?

It doesnt take any critical thought to disclaim Islam. Their leader and phrophet was a war monger and pedophile. Its just plan and simple factual history.

 

[LuvRPgrl]

No, nor do I anything else. But what I think you're going to try & do here is ask, how can I believe in the Bible when so much depends on faith, right?
How can one believe the "stories" that are told?

Too many people believe that Christianity makes a person weak. That because we take the higher road, turn the other cheek....; a bunch of self-righteous do-gooders. But I will tell you, it takes ALOT of strength to stand for what you believe in; and when push comes to shove, we can be a bunch of tough S.O.B's, as the recent election bears out.

The idea of faith in God and the Bible is much misunderstood. Faith is really believing in someone or something based on past experience. You get loans based on faith, but the faith is built over a time period of having paid back other loans.

We who have faith in God, believe He will not lie to us, abandon us, and He does give us 100% accurate information on how we should behave.

We believe this because of prior experiences with God. My personal experience included events that confirmed 100% of His existence. Perhaps you will become open minded enough to have your own. Another good example is the former slave trader who wrote "amazing grace".

Abraham didnt prove his faith until AFTER he had already talked to God. Now, I tell you, if God talked to me, I would raise the sword to my son also. But if I didnt have any shred of proof to myself, that God was real, or a good God, then to hell with killing my son.