God proven to exist using mathematics

[The Irish Ram]

The bible is not an accurate predictor either

A few prophecies happeend becsause they were self fulfilling and people MADE them happen

Overwhelmingly the bible fails to predict anything with accuracy

There are about 2,500 prophesies in the Bible. 2,000 of them have been fulfilled to the letter. That's more than a few.
500 remain.< Those are end time prophecies, some of which are being fulfilled in our lifetime.

 

[Soupnazi630]

There are about 2,500 prophesies in the Bible. 2,000 of them have been fulfilled to the letter. That's more than a few.
500 remain.< Those are end time prophecies, some of which are being fulfilled in our lifetime.

Wrong

None have been fulfilled

In most cases the new testament was rigged to force it to fit those prophecies which is not the same thing.

 

[alang1216]

Man can't see the end from the beginning. That's why humans can't predict the future with 100% accuracy the way God can. 1/4 of the Bible is prophecy. You can't even tell me who is going to win the Kentucky Derby next year.

What is a good example of a prophecy of God?

Where did they get more knowledge than the masses?

Got an example of this knowledge?

 

[The Irish Ram]

Wrong

None have been fulfilled

In most cases the new testament was rigged to force it to fit those prophecies which is not the same thing.

200 years before Babylon was conquered by a man named Cyrus, Isaiah told us that the man named Cyrus would invade Babylon, free the Jews, and tell them to go back home and build their Temple. Isaiah even told us HOW Cyrus would invade Babylon, by diverting the river and enter by the two doors that weren't shut.
And that is exactly how Cyrus did it. Imagine his surprise when he was told that he and his actions were prophesied, by name.

And to PROVE that he wasn't forced to invade Babylon to fulfill scripture years into the future, by some anonymous bible writers, the prophecy is also found in the Dead Sea Scrolls, buried in the 3rd century BC to the first century AD.

King David told us the Messiah would be hung on wood. His hands and feet pierced. A practice not known at that time.
I don't think the Romans were trying to fulfill prophecy when they determined Christ's fate.

 

[Soupnazi630]

200 years before Babylon was conquered by a man named Cyrus, Isaiah told us that the man named Cyrus would invade Babylon, free the Jews, and tell them to go back home and build their Temple. Isaiah even told us HOW Cyrus would invade Babylon, by diverting the river and enter by the two doors that weren't shut.
And that is exactly how Cyrus did it. Imagine his surprise when he was told that he and his actions were prophesied, by name.

And to PROVE that he wasn't forced to invade Babylon to fulfill scripture years into the future, by some anonymous bible writers, the prophecy is also found in the Dead Sea Scrolls, buried in the 3rd century BC to the first century AD.

King David told us the Messiah would be hung on wood. His hands and feet pierced. A practice not known at that time.
I don't think the Romans were trying to fulfill prophecy when they determined Christ's fate.

Nope all false

All massive failures

No such specific prophecies existed

Which is why you cannot name book chapter and verse

 

[The Irish Ram]

Nope all false

All massive failures

No such specific prophecies existed

Which is why you cannot name book chapter and verse

Read Isaiah. There it is, chapter and verse. The Dead Sea Scrolls prove the existence of the prophecy. In fact, Isaiah is the most complete scroll to be found. Read it, then tell me Cyrus didn't invade Babylon.


One such prophecy was about a man named Cyrus and two nations: Babylon and the Medo-Persian Empire. Isaiah vividly described how God would destroy the powerful kingdom of Babylon, “the glory of kingdoms” (13:19). Writing as if it had already occurred (commonly known as the “prophetic perfect,” frequently employed in the Old Testament to stress the absolute certainty of fulfillment, i.e. Isaiah 53), Isaiah declared Babylon would fall (21:9). He then prophesied that Babylon would fall to the Medes and Persians (Isa.13; 21:1-10). Later, he proclaimed that the “golden city” (Babylon) would be conquered by a man named Cyrus (44:28; 45:1-7). This is a remarkable prophecy, especially since Cyrus was not born until almost 150 years after Isaiah penned these words.


Not only did Isaiah predict that Cyrus would overthrow Babylon, but he also wrote that Cyrus, serving as Jehovah’s “anointed” and “shepherd,” would release the Jews from captivity and assist them in their return to Jerusalem for the purpose of rebuilding the temple. All of this was written almost 200 years before Cyrus conquered Babylon (539 B.C.).


In case you are wondering about the factuality of this story, secular history verifies that all of these events came true. There really was a man named Cyrus who ruled the Medo-Persian Empire. He did conquer Babylon. And just as Isaiah prophesied, he assisted the Jews in their return to Jerusalem and in the rebuilding of the temple.


Truly, “no prophecy of Scripture is of any private interpretation, for prophecy never came by the will of man, but holy men of God spoke as they were moved by the Holy Spirit” (2 Peter 1:20-21).


Now you predict something for me that is merely months away. What 2 teams will play in the next Superbowl?

 

[Eman623]

I want to build a time machine and go back to the 13th century and punch Thomas Aquinas in the nose for inventing Natural Theology.

I will never understand the need for some to use logic and arguments and spreadsheets with pros and cons carefully listed to prove - or disprove - the existence of God.

You want to believe in God? Believe in God. And if you don't , then don't! It's unverifiable and unfalsifiable.

 

[alang1216]

Read Isaiah. There it is, chapter and verse. The Dead Sea Scrolls prove the existence of the prophecy. In fact, Isaiah is the most complete scroll to be found. Read it, then tell me Cyrus didn't invade Babylon.

The earliest manuscript we have of the Book of Isaiah is The Great Isaiah Scroll:

The Great Isaiah Scroll (1QIsaa) is one of the original seven Dead Sea Scrolls discovered in Qumran in 1947. It is the largest (734 cm) and best preserved of all the biblical scrolls, and the only one that is almost complete. The 54 columns contain all 66 chapters of the Hebrew version of the biblical Book of Isaiah. Dating from ca. 125 BCE, it is also one of the oldest of the Dead Sea Scrolls, some one thousand years older than the oldest manuscripts of the Hebrew Bible known to us before the scrolls' discovery.

So our oldest extant copy of Isaiah dates to a much later period than that of Cyrus.

Modern scholarship considers the Book of Isaiah to be an anthology, the two principal compositions of which are the Book of Isaiah proper (chapters 1-39, with some exceptions), containing the words of the prophet Isaiah himself, dating from the time of the First Temple, around 700 BCE, and Second Isaiah (Deutero-Isaiah, chapters 40-66), comprising the words of an anonymous prophet, who lived some one hundred and fifty years later, around the time of the Babylonian exile and the restoration of the Temple in the Persian Period. By the time our Isaiah Scroll was copied (the last third of the second century BCE), the book was already regarded as a single composition.

If so, no miracles or prophecies are required to explain the mention of Cyrus in the Book of Isaiah: Chapter 45, where his name is mentioned, was originally written during the time of Cyrus's rule.

So there are other possible explanations for the prophesy and it is well know that fulfilling prophesies was a big deal in the OT and NT.

 

[The Irish Ram]

was originally written during the time of Cyrus's rule

By whom?

 

[The Irish Ram]

The people who wrote the Bible had only slightly more knowledge

How so?

 

[alang1216]

By whom?

The Babylonian exiles.

 

[alang1216]

How so?

Did they know why it rained? Did they know about galaxies?

 

[scruffy]

Where I disagree with the video is the step between "math exists outside the human mind, therefore there must be something else creating these mathematical principles" ... and used Pythagorean theorem as an example ...

Math does not exist outside the human mind.

Math is a tool that human beings use to analyze (and hopefully comprehend) the structure of the universe.

Math is a representation, a human tool. There's a whole branch of mathematics called "representation theory".

Numbers are a property of the universe, they're not math. Math seeks to define relationships between numbers, but the numbers themselves take on forms governed by the structure of the universe. In that way math is exactly like physics or chemistry, we're all looking at the same thing. It doesn't prove anything, it just means we're interested.

 

[ReinyDays]

Math does not exist outside the human mind.

Math is a tool that human beings use to analyze (and hopefully comprehend) the structure of the universe.

Math is a representation, a human tool. There's a whole branch of mathematics called "representation theory".

Numbers are a property of the universe, they're not math. Math seeks to define relationships between numbers, but the numbers themselves take on forms governed by the structure of the universe. In that way math is exactly like physics or chemistry, we're all looking at the same thing. It doesn't prove anything, it just means we're interested.

Math is kinda sorta like language ... it communicates ideas ... operators (like addition) are the verbs, numbers are the nouns ... and just like language, it doesn't exist outside the mind ...

The numbers themselves are just symbols ... "4" means nothing until we say "deer" ... now we should all have a clear picture of what I mean by "4" ... the symbol isn't the object ... the symbol is there to help the human understand his environment, in this case, we'll have dinner ... the deer are the same, just we use a different symbol "3" ... subtraction was the verb, "4" and "3" are the nouns ...

Nothing clarifies this more keenly than trigonometry, which includes Pythagoras ... these ratios just are, they have to exist, no intellect required ... the video was targeting folks who never took that class in high school ... that logical step completely fails, and their example perfectly shows this failure ...

These three guys are lying about their credentials ...