Game Over, Hillary

[AllieBaba]

You're a piece of shit.

The truth hurts.

 

[AllieBaba]

No, it's more than that.

Anyway, if a woman is risking her life to give birth she certainly deserves to be the one with the final say.

Not that it is possible for it to be any other way.

Her opportunity to have the "final say" ends with her decision whether or not to have sex. After that, decision making is over, other than the decisions one must make that come with preparing for the baby.

 

[Ravi]

The truth hurts.

Do you also think that a woman should die giving birth to a dead baby when she could have been saved?

 

[Ravi]

Her opportunity to have the "final say" ends with her decision whether or not to have sex. After that, decision making is over, other than the decisions one must make that come with preparing for the baby.

She can always commit suicide, Allie.

 

[jillian]

Her opportunity to have the "final say" ends with her decision whether or not to have sex. After that, decision making is over, other than the decisions one must make that come with preparing for the baby.

Why? Because *YOU* said so?

 

[Shogun]

Yes. Women who want babies also sometimes need to have the babies aborted. In the given case it would kill both the baby and the mother as opposed to just killing the baby.
So how is that respect for life again?
Kicking your ass is always relevant.



well shit.. my bad.. you haven't been relevant this whole damn thread then apparently.


After all, caveats to facilitate specific circumstances can be written in while still filtering your open season on baby killing. clearly, this has nothing to do with controlling women, as you'd put it, rather restricting the wanton death of babies regardless of your fetal opinion. It passed. It's fact. and your boofuckinghoo routine won't change that.


this strawman is about as impressive as any other "life of the mother" arguement that you think validates free and casual abortions. Were it ONLY the case that the ONLY abortions happening were those that that threatened the life of a woman; if so, you MIGHT have recieved the consideration that you think this strawman deserves. As it is, enjoy the mudhole I just stomped in your ass.

 

[AllieBaba]

Do you also think that a woman should die giving birth to a dead baby when she could have been saved?

That is an idiotic question. IT DOESN'T HAPPEN, and there are no ghoulish doctors (outside the abortion clinics), nor are there any judges anywhere in the US, nor are there any Christians, who would ever "force" a mother to carry a dead baby to term (for one thing, there is no "term" if the baby is dead, moron.) It didn't happen before abortion was legal, it won't happen if abortion is illegal. BECAUSE IT ISN'T ABORTION IF THE BABY IS DEAD.

It's just scare tactics assholes use to try to terrify young women into thinking that if abortion isn't legal, they're going to die.

 

[Shogun]

Why? Because *YOU* said so?

no.. ultimately, because the majority of AMERICA says so.

dont like it? Feel free to emmigrate to a country where human life is less valuable than your irresponsibility.

looks like it won't be ISRAEL!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abortion_in_Israel

 

[Ravi]

That is an idiotic question. IT DOESN'T HAPPEN, and there are no ghoulish doctors (outside the abortion clinics), nor are there any judges anywhere in the US, nor are there any Christians, who would ever "force" a mother to carry a dead baby to term (for one thing, there is no "term" if the baby is dead, moron.) It didn't happen before abortion was legal, it won't happen if abortion is illegal. BECAUSE IT ISN'T ABORTION IF THE BABY IS DEAD.

It's just scare tactics assholes use to try to terrify young women into thinking that if abortion isn't legal, they're going to die.

Do you agree with Shogun that if the baby is going to die being born then it is the mother's cross to bear that she dies with it even if aborting the baby would save the mother's life?

I know it isn't an event that normally happens, but if Shogun thinks the woman made that decision to die when she got pregnant I'm curious to see if you agree with him.

 

[Larkinn]

After all, caveats to facilitate specific circumstances can be written in while still filtering your open season on baby killing.

Point being they haven't been written in, and in fact that situation has been allowed, which you specifically stated was ok. Dogger explained it nice and clear for you, what part is confusing you?

clearly, this has nothing to do with controlling women, as you'd put it, rather restricting the wanton death of babies regardless of your fetal opinion.

The babies die anyway. Care to explain how that restricts the death of babies?

this strawman is about as impressive as any other "life of the mother" arguement that you think validates free and casual abortions.

Strawman? Its a bill that the Republicans passed. Somehow thats a strawman?

Were it ONLY the case that the ONLY abortions happening were those that that threatened the life of a woman; if so, you MIGHT have recieved the consideration that you think this strawman deserves.

So the only abortions we can consider are the ones that are exactly representative of all of them?

no.. ultimately, because the majority of AMERICA says so.

America says that the womans voice ends as soon as the baby is conceived?

Really?

Care to cite that?

 

[jillian]

America says that the womans voice ends as soon as the baby is conceived?

Really?

Care to cite that?

He's just distorting the numbers again, despite his having been schooled that his assertions were wrong.

But he doesn't care about misusing sources he calls "evidence".

 

[AllieBaba]

Do you agree with Shogun that if the baby is going to die being born then it is the mother's cross to bear that she dies with it even if aborting the baby would save the mother's life?

I know it isn't an event that normally happens, but if Shogun thinks the woman made that decision to die when she got pregnant I'm curious to see if you agree with him.

Mothers die every day giving birth. It's a dangerous proposition. However, it is extremely rare that a woman becomes pregnant and the doctors know ahead of time that the woman, if she carries the baby, will die. IT DOESN'T HAPPEN, NITWIT. Certain mothers are at higher risk. Diabetics, women with heart issues, women who have been diagnosed with cancer who need to undergo chemo which could be harmful to the baby. Those women always have and always will be given the option to terminate dangerous pregnancies. Nobody thinks that women who suffer rare physical ailments which mean they have to make a choice between their life or the life of the child should be killed in the off chance the baby will live.

Those few women are not at risk if abortion is declared illegal. THEY NEVER HAVE BEEN. THe myth that making abortion illegal will result in a slew of poor women dying because they're "forced" to go through with deadly pregnancies is a myth.

If you can't come up with situations that prove that it happens regularly, and that women who are medically fragile will be "forced" to have babies that will kill them, spit them out, or shut the fuck up about this imaginary scenario.

 

[Shogun]

Do you agree with Shogun that if the baby is going to die being born then it is the mother's cross to bear that she dies with it even if aborting the baby would save the mother's life?

I know it isn't an event that normally happens, but if Shogun thinks the woman made that decision to die when she got pregnant I'm curious to see if you agree with him.

Do I need a neon fucking flashing light to tack onto my fucking avatar or something? If a mother is going to die because the baby is DEAD then there is not issue, is there? If the kid is already dead then what MORE could your coathanger do?


BUT, that's not the criteria for which abortions are currently performed, is it? Of course not but don't bother admitting as much in your little vagina rant.

 

[Ravi]

Mothers die every day giving birth. It's a dangerous proposition. However, it is extremely rare that a woman becomes pregnant and the doctors know ahead of time that the woman, if she carries the baby, will die. IT DOESN'T HAPPEN, NITWIT. Certain mothers are at higher risk. Diabetics, women with heart issues, women who have been diagnosed with cancer who need to undergo chemo which could be harmful to the baby. Those women always have and always will be given the option to terminate dangerous pregnancies. Nobody thinks that women who suffer rare physical ailments which mean they have to make a choice between their life or the life of the child should be killed in the off chance the baby will live.

Those few women are not at risk if abortion is declared illegal. THEY NEVER HAVE BEEN. THe myth that making abortion illegal will result in a slew of poor women dying because they're "forced" to go through with deadly pregnancies is a myth.

If you can't come up with situations that prove that it happens regularly, and that women who are medically fragile will be "forced" to have babies that will kill them, spit them out, or shut the fuck up about this imaginary scenario.

Okay, Allie, if I'm reading you correctly you don't agree with Shogun. Is that correct? You simply believe that it never, ever happens...right?

 

[Ravi]

Do I need a neon fucking flashing light to tack onto my fucking avatar or something? If a mother is going to die because the baby is DEAD then there is not issue, is there? If the kid is already dead then what MORE could your coathanger do?


BUT, that's not the criteria for which abortions are currently performed, is it? Of course not but don't bother admitting as much in your little vagina rant.

Are you now distancing yourself from your previous statement?

 

[Dogger]

Do you agree with Shogun that if the baby is going to die being born then it is the mother's cross to bear that she dies with it even if aborting the baby would save the mother's life?

If the mother's life might be in danger, and the doctor performs a partial birth abortion, how do we know for sure that the procedure was necessary to save the life of the mother as provided by the statute?

We only have certainity if no abortion is done. If the abortion is done and the mother lives, it becomes a factual issue as to necessity. That means an aggressive prosecutor could indict and try every doctor who performs the surgery, and make him prove necessity to a jury. The risk of prosecution will deter doctors; how many will resolve any doubt in favor of greater risk to the mother? And how many of those women will die because the doctor was afraid to perform the procedure that could have saved her life?

 

[Shogun]

Are you now distancing yourself from your previous statement?

not at all. Im clarifying my position before your ad hominem machine can take another lesson from jillian.


Again, what more harm can your coathanger do to a dead fetus? And, how REFLECTIVE of the general abortion procedures happening is the scenario you presented?


Or, if that gets to deep for ya just call me a woman hating man beast and be done with it. I told you yesterday, you've got the substance of a fucking rice cake.

 

[Dogger]

Okay, Allie, if I'm reading you correctly you don't agree with Shogun. Is that correct? You simply believe that it never, ever happens...right?

No, Allie said this: "If you can't come up with situations that prove that it happens regularly, and that women who are medically fragile will be "forced" to have babies that will kill them, spit them out, or shut the fuck up about this imaginary scenario."

So allie is willing to kill the occasional woman who needs the procedure because her situation is not a regular occurence.

 

[Shogun]

If the mother's life might be in danger, and the doctor performs a partial birth abortion, how do we know for sure that the procedure was necessary to save the life of the mother as provided by the statute?

We only have certainity if no abortion is done. If the abortion is done and the mother lives, it becomes a factual issue as to necessity. That means an aggressive prosecutor could indict and try every doctor who performs the surgery, and make him prove necessity to a jury. The risk of prosecution will deter doctors; how many will resolve any doubt in favor of greater risk to the mother? And how many of those women will die because the doctor was afraid to perform the procedure that could have saved her life?

um, LESS that the amount of DEAD BABIES since the inception of RvW?

 

[jillian]

No, Allie said this: "If you can't come up with situations that prove that it happens regularly, and that women who are medically fragile will be "forced" to have babies that will kill them, spit them out, or shut the fuck up about this imaginary scenario."

So allie is willing to kill the occasional woman who needs the procedure because her situation is not a regular occurence.

Which is why only DOCTORS should make medical decisions with their patients.