For You Gun Hating Nutters

[2aguy]

So are we talking murder rates or mass shooting rates?

Seems to me you are cherry picking

FYI less than 1% of all murders in the US occur in mass shooting events

And you always seem to forget that most Americans don't give a shit what happens in other countries

Not mass shootings. Just shootings. We are talking about gun control in this thread. So I don't want to include suicides and I also don't think it makes sense to include non-gun murders.

And then you have the fact that 70-80% of victims of our shootings, and the shootings in Britain and Australia, are criminals engaged in the criminal lifestyle. And of the other murders, many of those are the friends and family of the criminals.

So if you are not involved in criminal activity you are unlikely to be shot.

Yep, unlikely, but you still have 20% of murders where the victim isn't a criminal.

Most of that 20% the victim is killed by family/lover so they probably know they are in dangerous situation.

Not necessarily. 90% of all murder is committed by criminals with long histories of crime and violence......including domestic murder.....we aren't talking about normal people ...

 

[Brain357]

So are we talking murder rates or mass shooting rates?

Seems to me you are cherry picking

FYI less than 1% of all murders in the US occur in mass shooting events

And you always seem to forget that most Americans don't give a shit what happens in other countries

Not mass shootings. Just shootings. We are talking about gun control in this thread. So I don't want to include suicides and I also don't think it makes sense to include non-gun murders.

Cdc keeps the numbers. This link breaks them down. One would guess numbers have been going up in more recent years.

US Gun Deaths, 1999-2014 - Gun Control - ProCon.org

Here we go....a country of over 320 million people...

Expanded Homicide Data Table 8



gun murder rate 1997 -2000


1997..... 10,729
1998..... 9,257
1999..... 8,480
2000..... 8,493
2001..... 8,719
2002... 9,369
2003.... 9,638
2004..... 9,385
2005.... 10,158
2006.... 10,225
2007 10,129
2008-- 9,528
2009-- 9,199
2010- 8,874
2011-- 8,653
2012-- 8,897
2013-- 8,454
2014-- 8,312
2015--9,616

Wrong link? Link goes to 2014 and numbers don't match what you posted.

The early numbers have another link....the FBI changed their data presentation...try this...

Expanded Homicide Data Table 8

From 2014…..and I added 2011……

2006

Expanded Homicide Data Table 8 and

2006 fbi table 8

Murder by firearm….

Federal Bureau of Investigation - Uniform Crime Reports - 2000

Expanded Homicide Data Table 8

Expanded Homicide Data Table 8

gun murder rate 1997 -2000


1997..... 10,729
1998..... 9,257
1999..... 8,480
2000..... 8,493
2001..... 8,719
2002... 9,369
2003.... 9,638
2004..... 9,385
2005.... 10,158
2006.... 10,225
2007 10,129
2008-- 9,528
2009-- 9,199
2010- 8,874
2011-- 8,653
2012-- 8,897
2013-- 8,454
2014-- 8,312
2015--9,616

--------

Any reason to believe it hasn't continued going up in 2016 and 2017?

 

[Timmy]

So are we talking murder rates or mass shooting rates?

Seems to me you are cherry picking

FYI less than 1% of all murders in the US occur in mass shooting events

And you always seem to forget that most Americans don't give a shit what happens in other countries

Not mass shootings. Just shootings. We are talking about gun control in this thread. So I don't want to include suicides and I also don't think it makes sense to include non-gun murders.

Cdc keeps the numbers. This link breaks them down. One would guess numbers have been going up in more recent years.

US Gun Deaths, 1999-2014 - Gun Control - ProCon.org

And that would not be true. The FBI, who keeps a total of the bodies on the ground from actual gun crime shows it has been going down, except for the year following Ferguson when it went up...after the police pulled back from active policing in the major cities.

If you have numbers for 2015 and 2016 please share. 2017 doesn't seem to be doing well, but news can be deceiving.

2017 is post Ferguson.....the democrats have attacked the police and in the major cities they have pulled back....it is called the Ferguson Effect. They no longer pro actively respond to suspicious people, they only respond to 911 calls....and add on top of that reduced manpower as democrat mayors spend money on everything but police.....and then you have cities like Baltimore, where cops are quiting and retiring and they can't or won't replace them.

BAD police . What's wrong with that by the way ? Must we suffer corrupt police departments?

 

[bitter clinging swiftie]

if every gun owner today just decided to say **** the gun grabbers and deliberately violate every singel firearms law on the books, and day the other sidde to do something about it....nothing would happen. the anti gunners are impotent, period.

 

[Skull Pilot]

If different countries have different definitions of crime than any comparison in invalid. You know like the UK not counting a homicide as murder unless there is an actual conviction.

Since many of our states are larger than many of the countries you refer to then any one US state to foreign country is a better comparison.

Most US states have murder rates comparable to any other nation

You can't cherrypick aspects of your country. The stats are the stats. And it is done per capita so population is irrelevant

Obama was right when he said 'this type of mass violence does not happen in other developed countries'

So are we talking murder rates or mass shooting rates?

Seems to me you are cherry picking

FYI less than 1% of all murders in the US occur in mass shooting events

And you always seem to forget that most Americans don't give a shit what happens in other countries

Not mass shootings. Just shootings. We are talking about gun control in this thread. So I don't want to include suicides and I also don't think it makes sense to include non-gun murders.

Grump brought up mass violence not me
And I never count suicides since suicide is a choice not a crime

 

[Skull Pilot]

If different countries have different definitions of crime than any comparison in invalid. You know like the UK not counting a homicide as murder unless there is an actual conviction.

Since many of our states are larger than many of the countries you refer to then any one US state to foreign country is a better comparison.

Most US states have murder rates comparable to any other nation

You can't cherrypick aspects of your country. The stats are the stats. And it is done per capita so population is irrelevant

Obama was right when he said 'this type of mass violence does not happen in other developed countries'

So are we talking murder rates or mass shooting rates?

Seems to me you are cherry picking

FYI less than 1% of all murders in the US occur in mass shooting events

And you always seem to forget that most Americans don't give a shit what happens in other countries

Not mass shootings. Just shootings. We are talking about gun control in this thread. So I don't want to include suicides and I also don't think it makes sense to include non-gun murders.

Cdc keeps the numbers. This link breaks them down. One would guess numbers have been going up in more recent years.

US Gun Deaths, 1999-2014 - Gun Control - ProCon.org

Gun deaths include suicides
Suicide is not a crime

 

[Brain357]

If different countries have different definitions of crime than any comparison in invalid. You know like the UK not counting a homicide as murder unless there is an actual conviction.

Since many of our states are larger than many of the countries you refer to then any one US state to foreign country is a better comparison.

Most US states have murder rates comparable to any other nation

You can't cherrypick aspects of your country. The stats are the stats. And it is done per capita so population is irrelevant

Obama was right when he said 'this type of mass violence does not happen in other developed countries'

So are we talking murder rates or mass shooting rates?

Seems to me you are cherry picking

FYI less than 1% of all murders in the US occur in mass shooting events

And you always seem to forget that most Americans don't give a shit what happens in other countries

Not mass shootings. Just shootings. We are talking about gun control in this thread. So I don't want to include suicides and I also don't think it makes sense to include non-gun murders.

Cdc keeps the numbers. This link breaks them down. One would guess numbers have been going up in more recent years.

US Gun Deaths, 1999-2014 - Gun Control - ProCon.org

Gun deaths include suicides
Suicide is not a crime

Like I mentioned, the link separates them.

 

[charwin95]

Rebuttal from post #7 2aguy.

You do know that your link is only an opinion. Did you really read it or just look at it just to spread your propaganda?
You may want to read the real AB109. I did not copy and paste the rest but this is some of what are mentioned in AB109.

As always------- Your only solution is you want to flood this country with more guns like Chicago.



4. What crimes are NOT covered by realignment?
Certain categories of crimes, and certain types of offenders, are not covered by realignment. Realignment is designed to deal with low-level and low-risk offenders, not people who are considered too dangerous to be rehabilitated within the community.

The following offenses and offenders are excluded from realignment:

• Violent felonies under Penal Code 667.5and offenses where the defendant has a prior conviction for one of the violent felonies under Penal Code 667.5 16
• Serious felonies under Penal Code 1192.7and offenses where the defendant has a prior conviction for one of the serious felonies under Penal Code 1192.717
• Certain sex crimes in California where the offender is Required to Register as a Sex Offender in California 18
• Certain aggravated white-collar crimes19pursuant to California Penal Code Section 186.1120
• Approximately 60 other crimes that the legislature has decided to exclude, such as California Penal Code 273.5 pc corporal injury on a spouse, California Penal Code 92 pc bribery of judges or jurors, and California Penal Code 266(h) pc pimping.21(For a list of other excluded crimes see the California Department of Corrections and Rehabilitation Final Crime Exclusion List.).

Chicago has the strictest gun control in the state.....and they have 0 gun stores and shooting ranges....and they have the same gun laws as L.A. and New York, but have more murder than those Cities combined...it isn't guns, it is the nature of the criminals that causes gun violence....

And as more Americans own and carry guns...our crime rate has gone down, showing that the anti gunner belief that more guns create more crime is wrong.....

We went from 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s and 4.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 1997...to close to 400-600 million guns in private hands and over 15.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 2017...guess what happened...

-- gun murder down 49%
--gun crime down 75%
--violent crime down 72%

Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.

I was commenting about your link in post #7 but you went all over the place that has nothing to do with my post except Chicago. Your link was ONLY an opinion but he twisted a lot of crap and lies to support his gun nut propaganda.

Yes I'm very aware of the very strict gun control in Chicago but they buy them from somewhere else guy.
You assumed ( as always ) that all gun owners are responsible citizens. Thus by arming all citizens doesn't make this country safer.

 

[2aguy]

Rebuttal from post #7 2aguy.

You do know that your link is only an opinion. Did you really read it or just look at it just to spread your propaganda?
You may want to read the real AB109. I did not copy and paste the rest but this is some of what are mentioned in AB109.

As always------- Your only solution is you want to flood this country with more guns like Chicago.



4. What crimes are NOT covered by realignment?
Certain categories of crimes, and certain types of offenders, are not covered by realignment. Realignment is designed to deal with low-level and low-risk offenders, not people who are considered too dangerous to be rehabilitated within the community.

The following offenses and offenders are excluded from realignment:

• Violent felonies under Penal Code 667.5and offenses where the defendant has a prior conviction for one of the violent felonies under Penal Code 667.5 16
• Serious felonies under Penal Code 1192.7and offenses where the defendant has a prior conviction for one of the serious felonies under Penal Code 1192.717
• Certain sex crimes in California where the offender is Required to Register as a Sex Offender in California 18
• Certain aggravated white-collar crimes19pursuant to California Penal Code Section 186.1120
• Approximately 60 other crimes that the legislature has decided to exclude, such as California Penal Code 273.5 pc corporal injury on a spouse, California Penal Code 92 pc bribery of judges or jurors, and California Penal Code 266(h) pc pimping.21(For a list of other excluded crimes see the California Department of Corrections and Rehabilitation Final Crime Exclusion List.).

Chicago has the strictest gun control in the state.....and they have 0 gun stores and shooting ranges....and they have the same gun laws as L.A. and New York, but have more murder than those Cities combined...it isn't guns, it is the nature of the criminals that causes gun violence....

And as more Americans own and carry guns...our crime rate has gone down, showing that the anti gunner belief that more guns create more crime is wrong.....

We went from 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s and 4.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 1997...to close to 400-600 million guns in private hands and over 15.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 2017...guess what happened...

-- gun murder down 49%
--gun crime down 75%
--violent crime down 72%

Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.

I was commenting about your link in post #7 but you went all over the place that has nothing to do with my post except Chicago. Your link was ONLY an opinion but he twisted a lot of crap and lies to support his gun nut propaganda.

Yes I'm very aware of the very strict gun control in Chicago but they buy them from somewhere else guy.
You assumed ( as always ) that all gun owners are responsible citizens. Thus by arming all citizens doesn't make this country safer.

The criminals in New York and L.A. also buy their guns from out of state sellers.....they have the same gun laws as Chicago, but Chicago has the murder rate of both the other cities combined.........it isn't gun laws moron, it is the nature of the criminals committing the crimes...Chicago gangs shoot more often

As to making the country safer......you are wrong...facts, truth and reality shows you are wrong...

The truth...

We went from 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s and 4.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 1997...to close to 400-600 million guns in private hands and over 15.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 2017...guess what happened...


-- gun murder down 49%
--gun crime down 75%
--violent crime down 72%

Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.

 

[bitter clinging swiftie]

Rebuttal from post #7 2aguy.

You do know that your link is only an opinion. Did you really read it or just look at it just to spread your propaganda?
You may want to read the real AB109. I did not copy and paste the rest but this is some of what are mentioned in AB109.

As always------- Your only solution is you want to flood this country with more guns like Chicago.



4. What crimes are NOT covered by realignment?
Certain categories of crimes, and certain types of offenders, are not covered by realignment. Realignment is designed to deal with low-level and low-risk offenders, not people who are considered too dangerous to be rehabilitated within the community.

The following offenses and offenders are excluded from realignment:

• Violent felonies under Penal Code 667.5and offenses where the defendant has a prior conviction for one of the violent felonies under Penal Code 667.5 16
• Serious felonies under Penal Code 1192.7and offenses where the defendant has a prior conviction for one of the serious felonies under Penal Code 1192.717
• Certain sex crimes in California where the offender is Required to Register as a Sex Offender in California 18
• Certain aggravated white-collar crimes19pursuant to California Penal Code Section 186.1120
• Approximately 60 other crimes that the legislature has decided to exclude, such as California Penal Code 273.5 pc corporal injury on a spouse, California Penal Code 92 pc bribery of judges or jurors, and California Penal Code 266(h) pc pimping.21(For a list of other excluded crimes see the California Department of Corrections and Rehabilitation Final Crime Exclusion List.).

Chicago has the strictest gun control in the state.....and they have 0 gun stores and shooting ranges....and they have the same gun laws as L.A. and New York, but have more murder than those Cities combined...it isn't guns, it is the nature of the criminals that causes gun violence....

And as more Americans own and carry guns...our crime rate has gone down, showing that the anti gunner belief that more guns create more crime is wrong.....

We went from 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s and 4.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 1997...to close to 400-600 million guns in private hands and over 15.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 2017...guess what happened...

-- gun murder down 49%
--gun crime down 75%
--violent crime down 72%

Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.

I was commenting about your link in post #7 but you went all over the place that has nothing to do with my post except Chicago. Your link was ONLY an opinion but he twisted a lot of crap and lies to support his gun nut propaganda.

Yes I'm very aware of the very strict gun control in Chicago but they buy them from somewhere else guy.
You assumed ( as always ) that all gun owners are responsible citizens. Thus by arming all citizens doesn't make this country safer.

firstly, none of us want toarm everyone, just respect the right of everyone who is free to arm themselves if they so choose. While you say that all citizens being armed doesn't make the country any safer, it also doesn't make the country any more dangerous, as evidenced by the numerous times over the past decades when states and municipalities loosened gun laws and violent crime either went down or stayed the same.

 

[Dr Grump]

If different countries have different definitions of crime than any comparison in invalid. You know like the UK not counting a homicide as murder unless there is an actual conviction.

Since many of our states are larger than many of the countries you refer to then any one US state to foreign country is a better comparison.

Most US states have murder rates comparable to any other nation

You can't cherrypick aspects of your country. The stats are the stats. And it is done per capita so population is irrelevant

Obama was right when he said 'this type of mass violence does not happen in other developed countries'

Of course I can.

more than 50% of all murders are committed in just 2% of all the counties in the entire united states

That is a significant statistical anomaly

And 50 percent aren't. Again, you are cherrypicking. You can't only mention 50 percent. The other 50 percent is a significant number. 95% committed in 2 % is an anomaly worth talking about. All western countries - even the ones with strict gun control - can cherrypick and skew their POV via stats.

 

[Dr Grump]

And you always seem to forget that most Americans don't give a shit what happens in other countries

We know. The (at least) 100,000 civilians dead in Iraq can attest to that...

 

[Dr Grump]

Yes they can be and if the people wanted to amend or eliminate the second it would have been done by now

No it wouldn't. It can be done at any time but it is a political hot potato that neither party is willing to take on.

 

[Clementine]

I don't have a problem with it in the least. I'm against background checks, against paperwork for purchases, all of that

Which is why you're a gun nut...

The first thing every fascist government does is ban guns.
Fascist lover.

who wants to ban guns?

the left. they might not want to ban EVERY ONE from possession of ALL types of firearms, but they definitely dont consider firearms ownership to be a right of the people.

Hillary, Feinstein and other do want a total ban. Hillary vowed to fight against the 2nd amendment every chance she got.

What they were doing was trying to get them banned by trampling our right one little step at a time. First, make it harder for everyone to buy one. They wanted to declare people mentally ill for stupid reasons, like just being a military veteran. They want to ban more and more ammo so even if you have guns, you can't load them. They expanded gun-free zones to ensure only bad guys had guns. This brings about shootings from the crazies that the left can use to fight against guns.

All their laws accomplish is rendering the innocent, law-abiding people helpless. That is all. Criminals continue not to give a **** about what laws are on the books but they do love the idea of disarming their potential victims.

 

[bitter clinging swiftie]

Yes they can be and if the people wanted to amend or eliminate the second it would have been done by now

No it wouldn't. It can be done at any time but it is a political hot potato that neither party is willing to take on.

and rightfully so, the repeal of ANY of the first tn amendments to the US constitution is tantamount to the overthrow of the government in its entirety. Do you think these politicians want to be known by history as the ones who brought a bloody end to the American experiment.

 

[charwin95]

Rebuttal from post #7 2aguy.

You do know that your link is only an opinion. Did you really read it or just look at it just to spread your propaganda?
You may want to read the real AB109. I did not copy and paste the rest but this is some of what are mentioned in AB109.

As always------- Your only solution is you want to flood this country with more guns like Chicago.



4. What crimes are NOT covered by realignment?
Certain categories of crimes, and certain types of offenders, are not covered by realignment. Realignment is designed to deal with low-level and low-risk offenders, not people who are considered too dangerous to be rehabilitated within the community.

The following offenses and offenders are excluded from realignment:

• Violent felonies under Penal Code 667.5and offenses where the defendant has a prior conviction for one of the violent felonies under Penal Code 667.5 16
• Serious felonies under Penal Code 1192.7and offenses where the defendant has a prior conviction for one of the serious felonies under Penal Code 1192.717
• Certain sex crimes in California where the offender is Required to Register as a Sex Offender in California 18
• Certain aggravated white-collar crimes19pursuant to California Penal Code Section 186.1120
• Approximately 60 other crimes that the legislature has decided to exclude, such as California Penal Code 273.5 pc corporal injury on a spouse, California Penal Code 92 pc bribery of judges or jurors, and California Penal Code 266(h) pc pimping.21(For a list of other excluded crimes see the California Department of Corrections and Rehabilitation Final Crime Exclusion List.).

Chicago has the strictest gun control in the state.....and they have 0 gun stores and shooting ranges....and they have the same gun laws as L.A. and New York, but have more murder than those Cities combined...it isn't guns, it is the nature of the criminals that causes gun violence....

And as more Americans own and carry guns...our crime rate has gone down, showing that the anti gunner belief that more guns create more crime is wrong.....

We went from 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s and 4.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 1997...to close to 400-600 million guns in private hands and over 15.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 2017...guess what happened...

-- gun murder down 49%
--gun crime down 75%
--violent crime down 72%

Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.

I was commenting about your link in post #7 but you went all over the place that has nothing to do with my post except Chicago. Your link was ONLY an opinion but he twisted a lot of crap and lies to support his gun nut propaganda.

Yes I'm very aware of the very strict gun control in Chicago but they buy them from somewhere else guy.
You assumed ( as always ) that all gun owners are responsible citizens. Thus by arming all citizens doesn't make this country safer.

The criminals in New York and L.A. also buy their guns from out of state sellers.....they have the same gun laws as Chicago, but Chicago has the murder rate of both the other cities combined.........it isn't gun laws moron, it is the nature of the criminals committing the crimes...Chicago gangs shoot more often

As to making the country safer......you are wrong...facts, truth and reality shows you are wrong...

The truth...

We went from 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s and 4.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 1997...to close to 400-600 million guns in private hands and over 15.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 2017...guess what happened...


-- gun murder down 49%
--gun crime down 75%
--violent crime down 72%

Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.

In short you want to flood this country with more guns that all people in America should have guns. Again you assumed that all gun owners are law abiding citizens. That is your propaganda.

 

[bitter clinging swiftie]

I don't have a problem with it in the least. I'm against background checks, against paperwork for purchases, all of that

Which is why you're a gun nut...

The first thing every fascist government does is ban guns.
Fascist lover.

who wants to ban guns?

the left. they might not want to ban EVERY ONE from possession of ALL types of firearms, but they definitely dont consider firearms ownership to be a right of the people.

Hillary, Feinstein and other do want a total ban. Hillary vowed to fight against the 2nd amendment every chance she got.

What they were doing was trying to get them banned by trampling our right one little step at a time. First, make it harder for everyone to buy one. They wanted to declare people mentally ill for stupid reasons, like just being a military veteran. They want to ban more and more ammo so even if you have guns, you can't load them. They expanded gun-free zones to ensure only bad guys had guns. This brings about shootings from the crazies that the left can use to fight against guns.

All their laws accomplish is rendering the innocent, law-abiding people helpless. That is all. Criminals continue not to give a **** about what laws are on the books but they do love the idea of disarming their potential victims.

don't have one of those and I'm not scared of evil men having one, cuz I got a couple of these

 

[bitter clinging swiftie]

Rebuttal from post #7 2aguy.

You do know that your link is only an opinion. Did you really read it or just look at it just to spread your propaganda?
You may want to read the real AB109. I did not copy and paste the rest but this is some of what are mentioned in AB109.

As always------- Your only solution is you want to flood this country with more guns like Chicago.



4. What crimes are NOT covered by realignment?
Certain categories of crimes, and certain types of offenders, are not covered by realignment. Realignment is designed to deal with low-level and low-risk offenders, not people who are considered too dangerous to be rehabilitated within the community.

The following offenses and offenders are excluded from realignment:

• Violent felonies under Penal Code 667.5and offenses where the defendant has a prior conviction for one of the violent felonies under Penal Code 667.5 16
• Serious felonies under Penal Code 1192.7and offenses where the defendant has a prior conviction for one of the serious felonies under Penal Code 1192.717
• Certain sex crimes in California where the offender is Required to Register as a Sex Offender in California 18
• Certain aggravated white-collar crimes19pursuant to California Penal Code Section 186.1120
• Approximately 60 other crimes that the legislature has decided to exclude, such as California Penal Code 273.5 pc corporal injury on a spouse, California Penal Code 92 pc bribery of judges or jurors, and California Penal Code 266(h) pc pimping.21(For a list of other excluded crimes see the California Department of Corrections and Rehabilitation Final Crime Exclusion List.).

Chicago has the strictest gun control in the state.....and they have 0 gun stores and shooting ranges....and they have the same gun laws as L.A. and New York, but have more murder than those Cities combined...it isn't guns, it is the nature of the criminals that causes gun violence....

And as more Americans own and carry guns...our crime rate has gone down, showing that the anti gunner belief that more guns create more crime is wrong.....

We went from 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s and 4.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 1997...to close to 400-600 million guns in private hands and over 15.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 2017...guess what happened...

-- gun murder down 49%
--gun crime down 75%
--violent crime down 72%

Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.

I was commenting about your link in post #7 but you went all over the place that has nothing to do with my post except Chicago. Your link was ONLY an opinion but he twisted a lot of crap and lies to support his gun nut propaganda.

Yes I'm very aware of the very strict gun control in Chicago but they buy them from somewhere else guy.
You assumed ( as always ) that all gun owners are responsible citizens. Thus by arming all citizens doesn't make this country safer.

The criminals in New York and L.A. also buy their guns from out of state sellers.....they have the same gun laws as Chicago, but Chicago has the murder rate of both the other cities combined.........it isn't gun laws moron, it is the nature of the criminals committing the crimes...Chicago gangs shoot more often

As to making the country safer......you are wrong...facts, truth and reality shows you are wrong...

The truth...

We went from 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s and 4.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 1997...to close to 400-600 million guns in private hands and over 15.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 2017...guess what happened...


-- gun murder down 49%
--gun crime down 75%
--violent crime down 72%

Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.

In short you want to flood this country with more guns that all people in America should have guns. Again you assumed that all gun owners are law abiding citizens. That is your propaganda.

until such time as someone is convicted of a crime and taken to jail, or committed to an instiution,they have all the same rights as anyone else does

 

[charwin95]

Rebuttal from post #7 2aguy.

You do know that your link is only an opinion. Did you really read it or just look at it just to spread your propaganda?
You may want to read the real AB109. I did not copy and paste the rest but this is some of what are mentioned in AB109.

As always------- Your only solution is you want to flood this country with more guns like Chicago.



4. What crimes are NOT covered by realignment?
Certain categories of crimes, and certain types of offenders, are not covered by realignment. Realignment is designed to deal with low-level and low-risk offenders, not people who are considered too dangerous to be rehabilitated within the community.

The following offenses and offenders are excluded from realignment:

• Violent felonies under Penal Code 667.5and offenses where the defendant has a prior conviction for one of the violent felonies under Penal Code 667.5 16
• Serious felonies under Penal Code 1192.7and offenses where the defendant has a prior conviction for one of the serious felonies under Penal Code 1192.717
• Certain sex crimes in California where the offender is Required to Register as a Sex Offender in California 18
• Certain aggravated white-collar crimes19pursuant to California Penal Code Section 186.1120
• Approximately 60 other crimes that the legislature has decided to exclude, such as California Penal Code 273.5 pc corporal injury on a spouse, California Penal Code 92 pc bribery of judges or jurors, and California Penal Code 266(h) pc pimping.21(For a list of other excluded crimes see the California Department of Corrections and Rehabilitation Final Crime Exclusion List.).

Chicago has the strictest gun control in the state.....and they have 0 gun stores and shooting ranges....and they have the same gun laws as L.A. and New York, but have more murder than those Cities combined...it isn't guns, it is the nature of the criminals that causes gun violence....

And as more Americans own and carry guns...our crime rate has gone down, showing that the anti gunner belief that more guns create more crime is wrong.....

We went from 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s and 4.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 1997...to close to 400-600 million guns in private hands and over 15.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 2017...guess what happened...

-- gun murder down 49%
--gun crime down 75%
--violent crime down 72%

Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.

I was commenting about your link in post #7 but you went all over the place that has nothing to do with my post except Chicago. Your link was ONLY an opinion but he twisted a lot of crap and lies to support his gun nut propaganda.

Yes I'm very aware of the very strict gun control in Chicago but they buy them from somewhere else guy.
You assumed ( as always ) that all gun owners are responsible citizens. Thus by arming all citizens doesn't make this country safer.

firstly, none of us want toarm everyone, just respect the right of everyone who is free to arm themselves if they so choose. While you say that all citizens being armed doesn't make the country any safer, it also doesn't make the country any more dangerous, as evidenced by the numerous times over the past decades when states and municipalities loosened gun laws and violent crime either went down or stayed the same.

Wrong. I'm a law abiding citizen and I can buy the guns that I like and no one can stop me.

Then explain all the illegal killings and murders in this country because of guns may it be lower or higher.
Then explain all the illegal guns floating around this country.
Then explain why you don't want to control the flow of guns illegally to the public.

Bottom line gun nuts wants to flood this country with more guns. Like Chicago.

 

[2aguy]

Rebuttal from post #7 2aguy.

You do know that your link is only an opinion. Did you really read it or just look at it just to spread your propaganda?
You may want to read the real AB109. I did not copy and paste the rest but this is some of what are mentioned in AB109.

As always------- Your only solution is you want to flood this country with more guns like Chicago.



4. What crimes are NOT covered by realignment?
Certain categories of crimes, and certain types of offenders, are not covered by realignment. Realignment is designed to deal with low-level and low-risk offenders, not people who are considered too dangerous to be rehabilitated within the community.

The following offenses and offenders are excluded from realignment:

• Violent felonies under Penal Code 667.5and offenses where the defendant has a prior conviction for one of the violent felonies under Penal Code 667.5 16
• Serious felonies under Penal Code 1192.7and offenses where the defendant has a prior conviction for one of the serious felonies under Penal Code 1192.717
• Certain sex crimes in California where the offender is Required to Register as a Sex Offender in California 18
• Certain aggravated white-collar crimes19pursuant to California Penal Code Section 186.1120
• Approximately 60 other crimes that the legislature has decided to exclude, such as California Penal Code 273.5 pc corporal injury on a spouse, California Penal Code 92 pc bribery of judges or jurors, and California Penal Code 266(h) pc pimping.21(For a list of other excluded crimes see the California Department of Corrections and Rehabilitation Final Crime Exclusion List.).

Chicago has the strictest gun control in the state.....and they have 0 gun stores and shooting ranges....and they have the same gun laws as L.A. and New York, but have more murder than those Cities combined...it isn't guns, it is the nature of the criminals that causes gun violence....

And as more Americans own and carry guns...our crime rate has gone down, showing that the anti gunner belief that more guns create more crime is wrong.....

We went from 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s and 4.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 1997...to close to 400-600 million guns in private hands and over 15.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 2017...guess what happened...

-- gun murder down 49%
--gun crime down 75%
--violent crime down 72%

Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.

I was commenting about your link in post #7 but you went all over the place that has nothing to do with my post except Chicago. Your link was ONLY an opinion but he twisted a lot of crap and lies to support his gun nut propaganda.

Yes I'm very aware of the very strict gun control in Chicago but they buy them from somewhere else guy.
You assumed ( as always ) that all gun owners are responsible citizens. Thus by arming all citizens doesn't make this country safer.

The criminals in New York and L.A. also buy their guns from out of state sellers.....they have the same gun laws as Chicago, but Chicago has the murder rate of both the other cities combined.........it isn't gun laws moron, it is the nature of the criminals committing the crimes...Chicago gangs shoot more often

As to making the country safer......you are wrong...facts, truth and reality shows you are wrong...

The truth...

We went from 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s and 4.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 1997...to close to 400-600 million guns in private hands and over 15.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 2017...guess what happened...


-- gun murder down 49%
--gun crime down 75%
--violent crime down 72%

Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.

In short you want to flood this country with more guns that all people in America should have guns. Again you assumed that all gun owners are law abiding citizens. That is your propaganda.

No....we already have laws that state that violent felons can't buy, own or carry guns. We have laws that already state that the dangerously mentally ill can't buy, own or carry guns....

The problem is you don't care about those categories, you only care about the normal, law abiding gun owners who own and carry guns and don't use them to commit crimes.

You are no different than a Book Burner. Book Burners irrationally want to burn books they don't like. You are the equivalent of a Book Burner for guns and the 2nd Amendment...you are irrational, and refuse to apply truth, facts or reality to gun ownership.