Finland: Government Collapses Over Universal Health Care Costs

[Confounding]

What I think is sad, is the fact that this country won't learn from their mistakes...

I guess they don't think it's a mistake.

The democrats didn't think it was a mistake when they owned slaves......socialists, democrats never understand their mistakes.

Maybe you're wrong about how things are working out for them over there. The places you get your information from in regards to this issue seem pretty biased.

 

[Andylusion]

And for some crazy reason after they sort it out they'll still be using universal healthcare.

Yeah, maybe. But the point remains that they are still going broke, still having huge budget problems, and still having to try and fix it.

I thought the left-wingers told us that if we had Nordic style health care, that it would be a utopia. Where is it?

and let us also look at the taxes over there.

A person earning just $48,000 a year, pays 21% in income tax, and 16% to 22% depending on what specific municipality you are in.

In short, the middle class pays a minimum tax of 37% in taxes, and as high as 43%.

Keep in mind that doesn't include the 24% sales tax. So what little money you have left over, you get to pay a massive sales tax on everything you buy.

Also keep in mind that high taxes on Finland's employers, results in lower pay to employees. The average Finnish worker earns about 10% less money for the same job, as their US counterparts.

TO THE POINT.....

With all this money collected by the government, shouldn't that have unlimited money to spend on health care?

And yet they don't. Are you getting the picture sparky? Your system doesn't work.

If it did, Finland should not be even having this discussion.

And yet the issue is reform, not dump completely. Reform is a constant process. When we learned lead in gas or in tin cans was deadly, did we stop driving or storing in cans, or did we find another way...over time. When kids PJs were highly flammable, did kids stop wearing bed clothes? Andy, there MUST be a better way than a system where healthcare either denies or impoverishes a significant portion of a nation's citizens.

America was promised reform too, remember? I think it's what you voted for. Or did you realize that campaign promise was code for as fake as wall funding?

America was promised reform? Anyone who puts their hopes for a better future, in the hands of the politician, is an idiot. That's both left, and right. Liberal or Conservative... if you put your hope for a better future in voting for some moron who says he'll reform everything.... you are stupid.

I have never voted for reform. My last vote, was a vote against people attacking Brett Kanvanough, and the vote before that, was a vote against that evil lying corrupt Hillary.

Most of my votes are votes against pure evil.

I think the last time I voted "for" someone, was likely Bush Jr second term.

As for reform....

Yeah, I know what reform means. Reform means taxing the middle and lower class, and cutting benefits. Look at Social Security. Social Security used to be a 1% tax. Now you pay 15% of your income into Social Security, and it harms the lowest income people in this country... AND IT IS STILL GOING BROKE.

We will have to 'reform' Social Security again, so that you have to be over 75 years old to collect it.

Right now in Finland, people who are lower-middle class income earners, are losing HALF OF THE INCOME.... People who have what would be middle class jobs in the US, in Finland are living like they are poor.

And it is not enough. Just like it wasn't enough in France. Not enough in Denmark. Not enough in Sweden.

Everywhere in Europe, they are paying double OR MORE in taxes than we do... and it is NEVER ENOUGH.

Socialism does not work. Period. It never has. It never will. Stop trying to say there has got to be a better way, when every single way you point to is terrible.

You are not giving the next generation great health care. You are giving them poverty.

And by the way, what drive me crazy is.... we have tried all of your ways already. We have those ways here.

This idea that we just have not tried all of your brilliant socialized care crap, is simply not true. We have subsidized health care, called Medicare. It's going broke. We have government hospitals, called the VA. They suck. They are absolutely terrible. We have government funded clinics, they suck. We have everything you people have dreamed up as a solution, we have it all, and it all sucks... all of it.

Your system, does not work. It never has... it never will... and you can either learn something from the last 100 years, or be doomed like the Soviets, the NKoreans, the Chinese, the Cubans, the Venezuelans, and on and on and on.

YOUR SYSTEM SUCKS.

 

[Andylusion]

You have no idea how their form of government works.
They have a different structure than we have

It's Called "Parliamentary"
We Know How Parliamentary Gov't Works
And The United States
Is The Only Bi-Cameral Republic On Earth

Try Again
Better Yet, Get Back On Topic
You've Been Wrong From Post #6

Instead of addressing how I am wrong you just play this game and state "You are Wrong'. Tells me you are still playing partisan politics which has no meaning and no truths in it.

Because it does not matter how the government runs. You pointed out they are proposing changes to the system. Yeah... that's our point.

If the system worked, they wouldn't need to cut benefits or increase taxes.

The whole problem is, their system isn't working. Like all socialized system, you eventually run out of other people's money.

So trying to give us some sort of 5th grade primer on how the Finnish government works, isn't relevant. If their system was working, they wouldn't be trying to 'fix it'.

 

[Daryl Hunt]

You have no idea how their form of government works.
They have a different structure than we have

It's Called "Parliamentary"
We Know How Parliamentary Gov't Works
And The United States
Is The Only Bi-Cameral Republic On Earth

Try Again
Better Yet, Get Back On Topic
You've Been Wrong From Post #6

Instead of addressing how I am wrong you just play this game and state "You are Wrong'. Tells me you are still playing partisan politics which has no meaning and no truths in it.

Because it does not matter how the government runs. You pointed out they are proposing changes to the system. Yeah... that's our point.

If the system worked, they wouldn't need to cut benefits or increase taxes.

The whole problem is, their system isn't working. Like all socialized system, you eventually run out of other people's money.

So trying to give us some sort of 5th grade primer on how the Finnish government works, isn't relevant. If their system was working, they wouldn't be trying to 'fix it'.

All successful governments are in a constant state of change. Every year things change and the Government must change with it. The Economy is not static. If a Government refuses to change it becomes irrelevant pretty damned quick.

 

[Andylusion]

You have no idea how their form of government works.
They have a different structure than we have

It's Called "Parliamentary"
We Know How Parliamentary Gov't Works
And The United States
Is The Only Bi-Cameral Republic On Earth

Try Again
Better Yet, Get Back On Topic
You've Been Wrong From Post #6

Instead of addressing how I am wrong you just play this game and state "You are Wrong'. Tells me you are still playing partisan politics which has no meaning and no truths in it.

Because it does not matter how the government runs. You pointed out they are proposing changes to the system. Yeah... that's our point.

If the system worked, they wouldn't need to cut benefits or increase taxes.

The whole problem is, their system isn't working. Like all socialized system, you eventually run out of other people's money.

So trying to give us some sort of 5th grade primer on how the Finnish government works, isn't relevant. If their system was working, they wouldn't be trying to 'fix it'.

All successful governments are in a constant state of change. Every year things change and the Government must change with it. The Economy is not static. If a Government refuses to change it becomes irrelevant pretty damned quick.

Especially socialists policies, because they are constant state of changing in to deficits and bankruptcy.

You don't see them changing for the better.

 

[Daryl Hunt]

You have no idea how their form of government works.
They have a different structure than we have

It's Called "Parliamentary"
We Know How Parliamentary Gov't Works
And The United States
Is The Only Bi-Cameral Republic On Earth

Try Again
Better Yet, Get Back On Topic
You've Been Wrong From Post #6

Instead of addressing how I am wrong you just play this game and state "You are Wrong'. Tells me you are still playing partisan politics which has no meaning and no truths in it.

Because it does not matter how the government runs. You pointed out they are proposing changes to the system. Yeah... that's our point.

If the system worked, they wouldn't need to cut benefits or increase taxes.

The whole problem is, their system isn't working. Like all socialized system, you eventually run out of other people's money.

So trying to give us some sort of 5th grade primer on how the Finnish government works, isn't relevant. If their system was working, they wouldn't be trying to 'fix it'.

All successful governments are in a constant state of change. Every year things change and the Government must change with it. The Economy is not static. If a Government refuses to change it becomes irrelevant pretty damned quick.

Especially socialists policies, because they are constant state of changing in to deficits and bankruptcy.

You don't see them changing for the better.

View attachment 250108

ALL Governments including our own since the day after it was created. You keep trying to make everything about "Party Politics". Well somethings just are going to be because they have to be.

 

[deanrd]

“Similar problems are bedeviling Sweden and Denmark, two other countries frequently held up as models to follow on health care”

Let’s be more like Europe the Left say!

Finnish Government Collapses Due to Rising Cost of Universal Health Care

It's not the cost of healthcare.

It's the fact that nearly a quarter of the population is over 65.

That's why happens with people stop having babies and won't let in immigrants.

Finland is what Republicans want here.

Republicans say healthcare is too expensive. So who lives and who dies and who gets to decide?

Remember when Republicans were freaked out about "death panels"??????

Now?

Not so much.

 

[deanrd]

Republicans think if there are death panels, it will be white people on the panel and they will "save" other white people.

Rich Republicans don't care about poor Republicans. And most of the GOP is poor Republicans.

Good luck on that. The only way they will survive is if they vote Democrat.

Sorry.

 

[Daryl Hunt]

“Similar problems are bedeviling Sweden and Denmark, two other countries frequently held up as models to follow on health care”

Let’s be more like Europe the Left say!

Finnish Government Collapses Due to Rising Cost of Universal Health Care

It's not the cost of healthcare.

It's the fact that nearly a quarter of the population is over 65.

That's why happens with people stop having babies and won't let in immigrants.

Finland is what Republicans want here.

Republicans say healthcare is too expensive. So who lives and who dies and who gets to decide?

Remember when Republicans were freaked out about "death panels"??????

Now?

Not so much.

Just break the Health Care System. Who needs a death panel at that point. The Attrition takes care of it.

 

[karpenter]

Looks Like Denmark May Be Next Too

Denmark in a State of Unreported Collapse

 

[Dr Grump]

Scandinavian countries..sadly ... have absorbed globalism so deeply ....

I wonder if its in their genes to like to be fucked by other cultures

Are they really such imbeciles???

and ...

if they are

they deserve everything they get.

Everything to the last drop of suffering.

Talking of imbeciles. Everything you type is such right-wing drivel it would make me laugh if it wasn't so pathetic.

Most Scandinavian cultures are very monoculture. Not many other cultures there.
99 % of Finland's population are Finnish or Swedish
91 % of Sweden's population is Swedish or European
94 % of Iceland's population is Icelandic or European
92 % of Denmark's population is of Danish or European descent.
76% of the US is of European descent.

 

[Daryl Hunt]

Looks Like Denmark May Be Next Too

Denmark in a State of Unreported Collapse

People with brown skin copulate like rabbits it seems. Even the Chinese Yellow people are trying to figure out a way to get their Chinese Births up these days. The White Population are having deaths than babies.

 

[Andylusion]

It's Called "Parliamentary"
We Know How Parliamentary Gov't Works
And The United States
Is The Only Bi-Cameral Republic On Earth

Try Again
Better Yet, Get Back On Topic
You've Been Wrong From Post #6

Instead of addressing how I am wrong you just play this game and state "You are Wrong'. Tells me you are still playing partisan politics which has no meaning and no truths in it.

Because it does not matter how the government runs. You pointed out they are proposing changes to the system. Yeah... that's our point.

If the system worked, they wouldn't need to cut benefits or increase taxes.

The whole problem is, their system isn't working. Like all socialized system, you eventually run out of other people's money.

So trying to give us some sort of 5th grade primer on how the Finnish government works, isn't relevant. If their system was working, they wouldn't be trying to 'fix it'.

All successful governments are in a constant state of change. Every year things change and the Government must change with it. The Economy is not static. If a Government refuses to change it becomes irrelevant pretty damned quick.

Especially socialists policies, because they are constant state of changing in to deficits and bankruptcy.

You don't see them changing for the better.

View attachment 250108

ALL Governments including our own since the day after it was created. You keep trying to make everything about "Party Politics". Well somethings just are going to be because they have to be.

Which changes nothing I said before. Nothing you said, contradicted what I said.

Yes, government change.... when they move left, the country crashes. When they move right, the country flourishes. They all change, yes. Especially socialist policies because they constantly fail. There isn't single example of your system that works. Not one. Not even ONE.

 

[Daryl Hunt]

Instead of addressing how I am wrong you just play this game and state "You are Wrong'. Tells me you are still playing partisan politics which has no meaning and no truths in it.

Because it does not matter how the government runs. You pointed out they are proposing changes to the system. Yeah... that's our point.

If the system worked, they wouldn't need to cut benefits or increase taxes.

The whole problem is, their system isn't working. Like all socialized system, you eventually run out of other people's money.

So trying to give us some sort of 5th grade primer on how the Finnish government works, isn't relevant. If their system was working, they wouldn't be trying to 'fix it'.

All successful governments are in a constant state of change. Every year things change and the Government must change with it. The Economy is not static. If a Government refuses to change it becomes irrelevant pretty damned quick.

Especially socialists policies, because they are constant state of changing in to deficits and bankruptcy.

You don't see them changing for the better.

View attachment 250108

ALL Governments including our own since the day after it was created. You keep trying to make everything about "Party Politics". Well somethings just are going to be because they have to be.

Which changes nothing I said before. Nothing you said, contradicted what I said.

Yes, government change.... when they move left, the country crashes. When they move right, the country flourishes. They all change, yes. Especially socialist policies because they constantly fail. There isn't single example of your system that works. Not one. Not even ONE.

When it moves too far to the right the corporations get too much power and the poor suffer. Plus, the ones in the middle are moved to the poor side quickly. There is no middle class anymore. Yes, there is a lot of wealth but it's all in a select fews hands and everyone else suffers greatly.

Move it too far to the left and there isn't enough wealth to support the government and the corporations fail.

The end result is exactly the same.

From the Right side, Fascism takes over until only one super leader emerges and it falls into a Dictator.

From the left side, there really isn't even a name for this, it degrades until one super leader emerges and it falls into a Dictator.

Both ends up the same exact place. This is why both are needed and it's a push pull symbiotic relationship. I don't expect the fanatics on either side to understand this but the Moderates and Centrist certainly do. But we are the bad people in the world and cause all the problems. Actually, without us, you dipsticks would go to war against each other and wipe the whole world out. If you only wiped each other out, I would recommend it. Unfortunately, you also catch the rest of us in the cross fire.

 

[SweetSue92]

“Similar problems are bedeviling Sweden and Denmark, two other countries frequently held up as models to follow on health care”

Let’s be more like Europe the Left say!

Finnish Government Collapses Due to Rising Cost of Universal Health Care

Well my, my, my who could have ever predicted this, huh? But here is what will happen: more European harpies dogging on Americans for not having Universal Health Care and being sooooo mean. As they fail, they blame America more, and harder.

So what, we say. Go your way, just don't expect us to bail you out. Oh, and good luck with your, um, "militaries"

 

[xband]

“Similar problems are bedeviling Sweden and Denmark, two other countries frequently held up as models to follow on health care”

Let’s be more like Europe the Left say!

Finnish Government Collapses Due to Rising Cost of Universal Health Care

Well my, my, my who could have ever predicted this, huh? But here is what will happen: more European harpies dogging on Americans for not having Universal Health Care and being sooooo mean. As they fail, they blame America more, and harder.

So what, we say. Go your way, just don't expect us to bail you out. Oh, and good luck with your, um, "militaries"

The EU has recently decided to build their own Aircraft Carrier. What a miserable mess that aircraft carrier will be.

 

[Baron]

“Similar problems are bedeviling Sweden and Denmark, two other countries frequently held up as models to follow on health care”

Let’s be more like Europe the Left say!

Finnish Government Collapses Due to Rising Cost of Universal Health Care

All ideas of lefts are ( were ) collapsed.

 

[Andylusion]

Because it does not matter how the government runs. You pointed out they are proposing changes to the system. Yeah... that's our point.

If the system worked, they wouldn't need to cut benefits or increase taxes.

The whole problem is, their system isn't working. Like all socialized system, you eventually run out of other people's money.

So trying to give us some sort of 5th grade primer on how the Finnish government works, isn't relevant. If their system was working, they wouldn't be trying to 'fix it'.

All successful governments are in a constant state of change. Every year things change and the Government must change with it. The Economy is not static. If a Government refuses to change it becomes irrelevant pretty damned quick.

Especially socialists policies, because they are constant state of changing in to deficits and bankruptcy.

You don't see them changing for the better.

View attachment 250108

ALL Governments including our own since the day after it was created. You keep trying to make everything about "Party Politics". Well somethings just are going to be because they have to be.

Which changes nothing I said before. Nothing you said, contradicted what I said.

Yes, government change.... when they move left, the country crashes. When they move right, the country flourishes. They all change, yes. Especially socialist policies because they constantly fail. There isn't single example of your system that works. Not one. Not even ONE.

When it moves too far to the right the corporations get too much power and the poor suffer. Plus, the ones in the middle are moved to the poor side quickly. There is no middle class anymore. Yes, there is a lot of wealth but it's all in a select fews hands and everyone else suffers greatly.

Move it too far to the left and there isn't enough wealth to support the government and the corporations fail.

The end result is exactly the same.

From the Right side, Fascism takes over until only one super leader emerges and it falls into a Dictator.

From the left side, there really isn't even a name for this, it degrades until one super leader emerges and it falls into a Dictator.

Both ends up the same exact place. This is why both are needed and it's a push pull symbiotic relationship. I don't expect the fanatics on either side to understand this but the Moderates and Centrist certainly do. But we are the bad people in the world and cause all the problems. Actually, without us, you dipsticks would go to war against each other and wipe the whole world out. If you only wiped each other out, I would recommend it. Unfortunately, you also catch the rest of us in the cross fire.

Not true. Corporations get too powerful? How? Give an example? Using government? That's government getting too powerful. If the corporations use the power of government, that's a move to the left.

From the Right side, Fascism? Fascism isn't right-side. Fascism is left-side. Every aspect of Fascism is a left-wing ideology. Control over media, is left-wing. What do you think RT is? What do you think Media Matters is? Same thing. The Hush Rush law, wasn't created by Republicans. Fascism control over the economy, is a left-wing. Everything about Fascism is left-wing. It may not be *AS* left-wing as communism, but just because it is "right of communism" doesn't make it right-wing.

Actually, without us, you dipsticks would go to war against each other and wipe the whole world out.

Yeah, I can make up BS crap too. Funny how left-wingers are constantly engaging in warfare, and yet they blame everything on the right-wing. I'm always amused when the left-wing squeals like a pig about Pinochet who killed a couple thousand, and that's terrible... but you have no problem with the Soviets and Communist China which killed over 100 million people... but their ok... they were left-wing. That few thousand though, that was bad. He was right-wing.

You people don't really care about wiping each other out. You say you do, and pay lip service, and pretend you want peace for people... but the moment we let you idiots in control, you have Obama saying there's a red line on WMDs in Syria, and then when crossed, you allow, almost invite Putin to roll into Syria and start killing civilians, and defend the guy that used WMDs on his own people.

So with all due respect, shut your filthy lying crap filled mouth.

You either start practicing what you preach, or be a good little toddler and shut up.

 

[Daryl Hunt]

All successful governments are in a constant state of change. Every year things change and the Government must change with it. The Economy is not static. If a Government refuses to change it becomes irrelevant pretty damned quick.

Especially socialists policies, because they are constant state of changing in to deficits and bankruptcy.

You don't see them changing for the better.

View attachment 250108

ALL Governments including our own since the day after it was created. You keep trying to make everything about "Party Politics". Well somethings just are going to be because they have to be.

Which changes nothing I said before. Nothing you said, contradicted what I said.

Yes, government change.... when they move left, the country crashes. When they move right, the country flourishes. They all change, yes. Especially socialist policies because they constantly fail. There isn't single example of your system that works. Not one. Not even ONE.

When it moves too far to the right the corporations get too much power and the poor suffer. Plus, the ones in the middle are moved to the poor side quickly. There is no middle class anymore. Yes, there is a lot of wealth but it's all in a select fews hands and everyone else suffers greatly.

Move it too far to the left and there isn't enough wealth to support the government and the corporations fail.

The end result is exactly the same.

From the Right side, Fascism takes over until only one super leader emerges and it falls into a Dictator.

From the left side, there really isn't even a name for this, it degrades until one super leader emerges and it falls into a Dictator.

Both ends up the same exact place. This is why both are needed and it's a push pull symbiotic relationship. I don't expect the fanatics on either side to understand this but the Moderates and Centrist certainly do. But we are the bad people in the world and cause all the problems. Actually, without us, you dipsticks would go to war against each other and wipe the whole world out. If you only wiped each other out, I would recommend it. Unfortunately, you also catch the rest of us in the cross fire.

Not true. Corporations get too powerful? How? Give an example? Using government? That's government getting too powerful. If the corporations use the power of government, that's a move to the left.

From the Right side, Fascism? Fascism isn't right-side. Fascism is left-side. Every aspect of Fascism is a left-wing ideology. Control over media, is left-wing. What do you think RT is? What do you think Media Matters is? Same thing. The Hush Rush law, wasn't created by Republicans. Fascism control over the economy, is a left-wing. Everything about Fascism is left-wing. It may not be *AS* left-wing as communism, but just because it is "right of communism" doesn't make it right-wing.

Actually, without us, you dipsticks would go to war against each other and wipe the whole world out.

Yeah, I can make up BS crap too. Funny how left-wingers are constantly engaging in warfare, and yet they blame everything on the right-wing. I'm always amused when the left-wing squeals like a pig about Pinochet who killed a couple thousand, and that's terrible... but you have no problem with the Soviets and Communist China which killed over 100 million people... but their ok... they were left-wing. That few thousand though, that was bad. He was right-wing.

You people don't really care about wiping each other out. You say you do, and pay lip service, and pretend you want peace for people... but the moment we let you idiots in control, you have Obama saying there's a red line on WMDs in Syria, and then when crossed, you allow, almost invite Putin to roll into Syria and start killing civilians, and defend the guy that used WMDs on his own people.

So with all due respect, shut your filthy lying crap filled mouth.

You either start practicing what you preach, or be a good little toddler and shut up.

I have only one thing to say to you. Actually, it's a visual.