Evolution vs. Evidence 2 Ph.D.'s discuss science approach --huge shock for believers

[Robert W]

Treat this as a primary lesson for everybody who really wants truth and no BS.
I mean ignore what you came here thinking you know. Truth will set us all free.
This is not very short. It requires you learn from scientists.

 

[zaangalewa]

Robert W

I will now not try to start to listen to stupid nonsense - scientifc nonsense or not - which I know since years or even decades. What is your problem?

 

[scruffy]

Treat this as a primary lesson for everybody who really wants truth and no BS.
I mean ignore what you came here thinking you know. Truth will set us all free.
This is not very short. It requires you learn from scientists.

Old news. Science is way ahead of this. Just this week we have the first actual pictures of chromatin loops unfolding during the cell division process. And we already know how the microtubules work. It won't be but 6 months till we figure out the physics behind all this.

For the past 10 years science has been working backwards through the Hox genes and the stem cells to study the physics of embryology. Until we figure that out, we won't be able to create designer species.

But you don't have to worry, it'll be next to impossible to create a fruit fly with the brain of a dog. Or vice versa.

Nevertheless, we continue making huge strides on a daily basis. The immunological expression of cell surface proteins is very close to being completely figured out. We already have the complete protein maps for humans, and we know which genes code for which proteins. The missing link is only the transcription factors.

Brains are a little harder. Neurons work together with glial cells and mitochondria to make it all happen. And there are still many mysteries on the electrical side. We do know that neurons, just like T cells, cleave their DNA in certain places during the learning process. And we already know all about the self organization of neural pathways during development.

At this point we understand the visual system quite well, across the entire range of species. The auditory system is harder, we know how it works in bats but not in humans. In another thread I just showed you the complete map of the visual system of a fruit fly, which includes the genes that code for every differentiable protein in every single neuron. It'll only be another year till they trace that backward through the stem cells.

Mice are also very well studied. There's already a huge commercial industry in designer mice. There's about 150,000 types of mice available with single-gene mutations, ranging across the entire spectrum of organs and cell types. New ones get created every day, as the need arises.

No one debates evolution anymore. Engineering is the thing now. It doesn't much matter how God did it, what matters is how WE can do it.

 

[scruffy]

https://www.cell.com/cell/fulltext/S0092-8674(25)00255-7?_returnURL=https%3A%2F%2Flinkinghub.elsevier.com%2Fretrieve%2Fpii%2FS0092867425002557%3Fshowall%3Dtrue

 

[scruffy]

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Old news. Science is way ahead of this. Just this week we have the first actual pictures of chromatin loops unfolding during the cell division process. And we already know how the microtubules work. It won't be but 6 months till we figure out the physics behind all this.

For the past 10 years science has been working backwards through the Hox genes and the stem cells to study the physics of embryology. Until we figure that out, we won't be able to create designer species.

But you don't have to worry, it'll be next to impossible to create a fruit fly with the brain of a dog. Or vice versa.

Nevertheless, we continue making huge strides on a daily basis. The immunological expression of cell surface proteins is very close to being completely figured out. We already have the complete protein maps for humans, and we know which genes code for which proteins. The missing link is only the transcription factors.

Brains are a little harder. Neurons work together with glial cells and mitochondria to make it all happen. And there are still many mysteries on the electrical side. We do know that neurons, just like T cells, cleave their DNA in certain places during the learning process. And we already know all about the self organization of neural pathways during development.

At this point we understand the visual system quite well, across the entire range of species. The auditory system is harder, we know how it works in bats but not in humans. In another thread I just showed you the complete map of the visual system of a fruit fly, which includes the genes that code for every differentiable protein in every single neuron. It'll only be another year till they trace that backward through the stem cells.

Mice are also very well studied. There's already a huge commercial industry in designer mice. There's about 150,000 types of mice available with single-gene mutations, ranging across the entire spectrum of organs and cell types. New ones get created every day, as the need arises.

No one debates evolution anymore. Engineering is the thing now. It doesn't much matter how God did it, what matters is how WE can do it.

Sounds like Jurassic Park

 

[Robert W]

Robert W

I will now not try to start to listen to stupid nonsense - scientifc nonsense or not - which I know since years or even decades. What is your problem?

None for me. But yours clearly is your bias.

 

[Robert W]

No one debates evolution anymore. Engineering is the thing now. It doesn't much matter how God did it, what matters is how WE can do it.

You will notice a lot of debate on evolution on this very forum. I wanted to expose fans of this forum to new ideas. The kind that have no bias at all.

Here is more.

Discovery Science

The Center for Science and Culture is a Discovery Institute program which supports research by scientists and other scholars challenging various aspects of neo-Darwinian theory, as well as developing the scientific theory known as intelligent design. Discovery's Center for Science and Culture...

www.youtube.com

 

[scruffy]

You will notice a lot of debate on evolution on this very forum. I wanted to expose fans of this forum to new ideas. The kind that have no bias at all.

Here is more.

Discovery Science

The Center for Science and Culture is a Discovery Institute program which supports research by scientists and other scholars challenging various aspects of neo-Darwinian theory, as well as developing the scientific theory known as intelligent design. Discovery's Center for Science and Culture...

www.youtube.com

The only way you're going to get intelligent design is if humans do it.

And then it's still debatable if it's truly intelligent.

 

[zaangalewa]

None for me. But yours clearly is your bias.

You know absolutelly nothing about me whiIe I know now that you are an extremely arrogant and stupid guy. If you have any question about the Christian religion and/or the real scientific theory of evolution and/or evolutionary epistemology or another theme in the grayscale between natural science and cultural science then ask. And if you have no problem except the need to attack Christians on not any reason to have do so then go to a psychologist and/or doctor and try to find out what's your real problem.

 

[ReinyDays]

My issue with the OP is God commands us to be peacemakers ... only SATAN approves of conflict ... why come here with your warmongering spitting out your hatefulness? ... you know perfectly well your only hate is for yourself ...

I have a little formal education in chemistry and biochemistry ... enough to be able to read Robert Watson's textbook with comprehension ... a full year's coursework at the Junior level of college ... of evolution the book is silent, the material is strictly about the regulatory functions of DNA ...

An hour 18 minute video is a poor substitute for actual knowledge ... and to be actual science ... the author must offer a valid replacement theory ... another framework to organize the life we see around us ... creation is, by definition, a unique event ... therefore it cannot be studied by scientific methods ... there's no experiment we can conduct to demonstration miracles ... we can't use that for our framework ... indeed the Bible was written before the microscope was invented ... fully 99.99% of all living things were unknown to the Ancients ...

You fill your gullet with frankenfoods and condemn the inventors ... that's hypocritical ... and brings shame on Christiandom ... maybe spend less time hating on other folks and more time studying your own faith ...

 

[Robert W]

You know absolutelly nothing about me whiIe I know now that you are an extremely arrogant and stupid guy. If you have any question about the Christian religion and/or the real scientific theory of evolution and/or evolutionary epistemology or another theme in the grayscale between natural science and cultural science then ask. And if you have no problem except the need to attack Christians on not any reason to have do so then go to a psychologist and/or doctor and try to find out what's your real problem.

That proves you know nothing about me. I won't take your bait. My video speaks for itself. Two scientists that know all about this topic tell us what and why. I never attack Christians. They at least have a better chance.

 

[Robert W]

The only way you're going to get intelligent design is if humans do it.

And then it's still debatable if it's truly intelligent.

I offered the video. Why didn't you watch it? Clearly you think you understand.

 

[ReinyDays]

... I never attack Christians ...

Christians never attack anyone ... "forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us" ... see that there ... forgiveness ... why can't you forgive yourself? ...

You should learn something about Christianity before you think to speak for Christians ...

We've sequenced both human DNA and that from a banana tree ... and of all the ACTIVE genes in both species, about half is completely duplicated ... this is chemical fact ... there's no argument here, research labs all over the world have duplicated this finding ...

It's just a biological fact that some cell functions are common throughout most all life ... the DNA for alanine metabolism is exactly the same for all creatures that use alanine, and that's prokarotic bacteria all the way to birds and including everything in between, like banana trees and humans ...

Most all life manufactures ATP the exact same way ... why we think everything is related ... and that means the exact same DNA genes ... the A's, T's, C's and G's ... always the same almost no matter which species ...

So I wasted a full minute of my life listening to video lies ... if it never explains ion-channels in the cell membrane, I won't watch another minute ... that's how stupid the video is, they don't even ask that question ...

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Christians never attack anyone ... "forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us" ... see that there ... forgiveness ... why can't you forgive yourself? ...

You should learn something about Christianity before you think to speak for Christians ...

then you also are no Christian because all you do is attack posters that disagree with you.

 

[ReinyDays]

then you also are no Christian because all you do is attack posters that disagree with you.

I attack the ideas ... not the person ... and I don't attack ideas in the name of Our Lord ... I do so in the name of science ... and such discourse is allowed in scientific dialogue ... the video is full of falsehoods ... what kind of Christian would stand by and let his brothers be deceived? ...

"Judge not, lest ye be judged. For that which you mete out will be measure unto you again" ...

What is your qualifications to judge my opinions on biochemistry? ... and in case you missed that in the Bible ... yeah, we are our brothers' keeper ...

 

[zaangalewa]

I attack the ideas ... not the person ... and I don't attack ideas in the name of Our Lord ... I do so in the name of science ... and such discourse is allowed in scientific dialogue ... the video is full of falsehoods ... what kind of Christian would stand by and let his brothers be deceived? ...

"Judge not, lest ye be judged. For that which you mete out will be measure unto you again" ...

What is your qualifications to judge my opinions on biochemistry? ... and in case you missed that in the Bible ... yeah, we are our brothers' keeper ...

I personally think by the way it is better to deny Darwinism (what's not the same as to deny evolution) instead to "believe" (what also has nothing to do with the belief and trust in god) in wrong forms of racist Darwinism as for example the Nazis once did do. After this intellectual disaster about ~120-80 years ago ("Life not worth to live") I see it as a duty to be careful with the theme "evolution". 'The survival of the fittest' is for example wrong. It survives whats fits. Why "fittest"? Example: If someone has a genetic change in the production of red blood cells so they are not able to transport oxygen then this animal or human being will not be able to live. This change not fits. Again: Why "fittest"? What is the sense to use this word in such a context? Is this scientific or racist?

(By the way: But even this word had once been a success. It came from the philosopher Spencer and replaced Darwin's original nonsense since the 5th edition of his book "The origin of the species". It was in the original something like "The survival of the strongest" - what was totally stupid and is still used in the German language. Is a tree stronger or weaker than a tiger? Interesting in this context: Without predators no woods.)

 

[zaangalewa]

That proves you know nothing about me.

You are a stupid and arrogant US-American - or with other words: Today's standard idiot. Make me happy by showing me that I'm wrong.

I won't take your bait.

Which bait?

My video speaks for itself.

A 12 hours concert of Richard Wganer also speaks for itselve. The difference: Wagner was the composer. Which video did you compose?

Two scientists that know all about this topic

If a scientist knows all about a or "this topic" - whatever this could mean - then he is no scientist any longer. Every answered scientific question produces new scientific questions.

tell us what and why. I never attack Christians. They at least have a better chance.

A what? If you should not know: Nearly all Christians on this planet have not any problem with the really scientific theory of evolution. Only US-Americans - or other members of the English speaking world - seem never to understand that creation and evolution are two totally different things. Most simple statement in this context: Evoluion is created (like all natural laws). "Created" means in this case that our natural laws existed since the very first moment of the universe. This laws exist since a first cause (a first cause is without cause) started this game all around and in us.

 

[Robert W]

Only US-Americans - or other members of the English speaking world - seem never to understand that creation and evolution are two totally different things.

I am not one of those. I often explain that Abiogenesis does not remotely prove evolution. I posted the video so people can understand but your way of attacking means you did not watch it for a moment.

 

[zaangalewa]

I am not one of those.

Slowly I start to feel lonesome here. Am I the only idiot in this world?

I often explain that Abiogenesis does not remotely prove evolution.

Eh? We are the same matter as the floor under our feet. The difference: We live - the floor under our feet not lives - probably ... or hopefully.

I posted the video so people can understand but your way of attacking means you did not watch it for a moment.

Exactly. I did not watch it for a moment. I fear no one did do so. Tell me why I should watch it - or why anyone else should watch it.

By the way: Do you know what Christians often speak about when they mean "spirit" or "intellect"? About breath and/or wind.