EPA turns down states' request for ethanol waiver

[Jarlaxle]

*WHACK, WHACK, WHACK!* Hello, McFly? You listening?!?! WHACK, WHACK, WHACK! How about now?!

News flash: alcohol is used to REMOVE water from fuel! What do you think Dry-gas is?!?!

 

[Oddball]

Yeah...You're right and thousands of mechanics are wrong.

BYW, the alcohol in drygas attracts moisture out of the fuel to later evaporate it in use...But it's not a good thing when the fuel is in storage in a closed container, like a motorcycle or farm equipment in winter storage.

 

[Jarlaxle]

News flash: alcohol is used to REMOVE water from fuel! What do you think Dry-gas is?!?!

Keep rereading that until it sinks in.

 

[Oddball]

News flash...Dry gas doesn't remove jack shit from the fuel...It only traps the water in suspension.

The "removal" part comes as the fuel is exposed to air, and the water evaporates with the ETOH.

But I'm sure such basic chemistry is way over your head.

 

[USNavyVet]

News flash: alcohol is used to REMOVE water from fuel! What do you think Dry-gas is?!?!

Keep rereading that until it sinks in.

Wow I guess the FAA is wrong and alcohol doesn't deteriorate gaskets. You should tell them that since you're so much smarter than anyone else.

 

[Jarlaxle]

News flash...Dry gas doesn't remove jack shit from the fuel...It only traps the water in suspension.

The "removal" part comes as the fuel is exposed to air, and the water evaporates with the ETOH.

But I'm sure such basic chemistry is way over your head.

Please explain, in detail, exactly how anything is supposed to "evaporate" in the completely sealed fuel system of a modern vehicle! Be specific.

 

[percysunshine]

So this is what it was like in 1932 Italy.

 

[daveman]

News flash...Dry gas doesn't remove jack shit from the fuel...It only traps the water in suspension.

The "removal" part comes as the fuel is exposed to air, and the water evaporates with the ETOH.

But I'm sure such basic chemistry is way over your head.

Please explain, in detail, exactly how anything is supposed to "evaporate" in the completely sealed fuel system of a modern vehicle! Be specific.

Please explain how dry gas "removes" water from the fuel in a completely sealed fuel system of a modern vehicle.

Where does it go?

 

[Jarlaxle]

It is held in suspension in the alcohol and burned in the engine.

 

[daveman]

It is held in suspension in the alcohol and burned in the engine.

Ummm...water doesn't burn at those temperatures.

 

[Jarlaxle]

I give up. This is like trying to explain something to my cats.

 

[daveman]

I give up. This is like trying to explain something to my cats.

Your insistence that ethanol causes no problems doesn't change the fact that ethanol causes problems.

Mechanics see ethanol damaging small engines - Business - Consumer news | NBC News

 

[Oddball]

Thousands of mechanics = Wrong.

One keyboard kommando = Right.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

of course they did, destroying cars is more important than feeding people.

Pablum. This is the myth that just refuses to die! I have been running E10 for more than ten years...ZERO, ZILCH, NO PROBLEMS to report.

Tell me something, if ethanol is not a problem why do manufacturer's refuse to honor their warranties if you use higher blends?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Pablum. This is the myth that just refuses to die! I have been running E10 for more than ten years...ZERO, ZILCH, NO PROBLEMS to report.

No, not pablum.

ETOH fuel dried out all the gaskets on my motorcycle and one of our small 2-cycle outboard motors.

The stuff is total shit for small engines.

Horse shit. I have run it in no less than a dozen small engines (many of them 20+ years old). The sum total of the problems resulting was having to clean out the carb on a 20-year-old leaf blower when the alcohol loosened years of crud in the fuel system. Cleaned it out, I'm still using that leaf blower. I have run my old (late 70's!) generator for easily 1000 hours on E10...it ran 19 days straight at one point without a hiccup. My wife's old motorcycle (1979 Suzuki) had no problems with E10. None of the half dozen vehicles I help prep for winter storage have had a problem.

In your case, I suspect operator error.

Let me see.

I have a choice between believing engine manufacturers, industry magazines, and independent researchers, all of whom report higher maintenance expenses when using ethanol, and an anonymous idiot who claims to be the only person on the planet never to have had a problem as a result of ethanol.

Guess which side I come down on.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

the supplies of ethanol producers has not taken away any corn fom the mouths of those Frito banditos.
First you people ***** to get ethanol blends made from corn, then you ***** to not make it. Make up your minds.

You haven't been paying attention to the news, have you? There was a massive drought this year, it was described as the worst since the Dust Bowl by some environmentalists. This all but eliminated corn production in some states, and all but eliminated all the acreage earmarked for ethanol use. Despite this drought the EPA is still mandating that a percentage of the crop be earmarked for ethanol, which is going to impact corn prices, the availability of food grade corn, and the portion of the harvest normally earmarked for storage in case there is an even worse year next year.

In response to this obvious natural disaster many corn states, who actually make money off the ethanol subsidies, requested a waiver from the requirement that 40% of the harvest be devoted to ethanol production. This was actually written into the law, and should not have presented a problem. The ethanol industry responded by asking the federal government to supply a waiver to the maximum blend of ethanol that is legal to sell, arguing that the only way to alleviate the government created fuel shortages in areas affected by Sandy is to allow stations to sell gas up to 15% ethanol.

Do you care to explain how this will not take food off of people's tables?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Listen the authoritarian central planner douchebags and their useful idiot apologists, who would rather wield absolute authority than feed people.

central planners like the farmers that pushed ethanol production years ago to raise the price of grain futures?

Farmers? Or politicians?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

No, not pablum.

ETOH fuel dried out all the gaskets on my motorcycle and one of our small 2-cycle outboard motors.

The stuff is total shit for small engines.

And that is why the FAA does not allow its use in airplanes. It also reduces your mpg so while the price is a few cents lower, you're filling up more often. I've lost around 20% of my mpg due to ethanol.

Horse shit! E10 will drop mileage, at the most, about 5%. (In a flex-fuel vehicle, E85 will drop mileage about 20%.) Having done a direct comparison, even that is often stretching it. You need to STOP LYING.

Are these the same tests that said that cars would get 40 mpg when most drivers only get 30 mpg?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Horse shit. I have run it in no less than a dozen small engines (many of them 20+ years old). The sum total of the problems resulting was having to clean out the carb on a 20-year-old leaf blower when the alcohol loosened years of crud in the fuel system. Cleaned it out, I'm still using that leaf blower. I have run my old (late 70's!) generator for easily 1000 hours on E10...it ran 19 days straight at one point without a hiccup. My wife's old motorcycle (1979 Suzuki) had no problems with E10. None of the half dozen vehicles I help prep for winter storage have had a problem.

In your case, I suspect operator error.

So my fucked over motorcycle carbs and outboard motor that needed an overhaul long before its time -both with irreparably dried out gaskets and seals- are complete figments of my imagination.

Gotcha.

As I said: in your case, I suspect operator error. Four different motorcycles (my wife's 1979 Suzuki, my mother's & stepfather's Suzuki LS650 Savages, my uncle's Yamaha cruiser, all carbuerated), ZERO E10 related problems. My wife's 'Zuki had close to 95,000 miles when she sold it.

Let me guess, she sold it before it developed major problems. Did you move before the new owner could sue you for lying about the condition of the motorcycle?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Yeah...You're right and thousands of mechanics are wrong.

BYW, the alcohol in drygas attracts moisture out of the fuel to later evaporate it in use...But it's not a good thing when the fuel is in storage in a closed container, like a motorcycle or farm equipment in winter storage.

That probably explains why ethanol is not added to the gasoline until it is ready to be shipped,