Democrats' Wisconsin Worry

[Neotrotsky]

Scott Walker Recall Attempt Worries Some Democrats - WSJ.com

With little more than two weeks until Wisconsin's gubernatorial recall election, some Democratic and union officials quietly are expressing fears that they have picked a fight they won't win and that could leave lingering injuries.

Over the weekend, Wisconsin's largest newspaper, the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel, backed Mr. Walker in the recall election. The paper called Mr. Walker's move to limit public-employee bargaining rights "an overreach of political power," but said it "is simply not enough to justify a vote against the governor."

But the national party turned down Wisconsin Democrats' request for $500,000, one party official said.

Top Democrats now say that when labor groups first raised the specter of a recall, the party's officials urged their allies in Wisconsin to reconsider. "We told them it was a bad, bad, bad idea," one Democratic official said.

A union official said both the Democratic National Committee and the Obama campaign expressed reservations. "I don't know that anyone was enthusiastic about it over there," the union official said.

Walker will win.

Big Labor Unions have shown they have no real power

 

[Mac1958]

.

We'll see if the polling is right. If so, the Dems walked straight into this one.

.

 

[del]

I think Wisconsin is too close to call at this point. Walker is out-raising Barrett's campaign, but it's not like the AFL-CIO, Change to Win, and all the labor groups are going to spend at least 20 million on anti-Walker PACs. Some of my friends are working in Wisconsin on the recall (against Walker) - SEIU is throwing a lot of money and manpower into Wisconsin.

You can thank Citizen's United for that.

are they hiring temps?

 

[kiwiman127]

Scott Walker Recall Attempt Worries Some Democrats - WSJ.com

With little more than two weeks until Wisconsin's gubernatorial recall election, some Democratic and union officials quietly are expressing fears that they have picked a fight they won't win and that could leave lingering injuries.

Top Democrats now say that when labor groups first raised the specter of a recall, the party's officials urged their allies in Wisconsin to reconsider. "We told them it was a bad, bad, bad idea," one Democratic official said.

A union official said both the Democratic National Committee and the Obama campaign expressed reservations. "I don't know that anyone was enthusiastic about it over there," the union official said.

Walker will win.

Big Labor Unions have shown they have no real power

Considering the size of the workforce they make up less than 12%,,you're right.

 

[westwall]

Oh, I know the US is a Republic. I also know that the term democracy comes from the Greek word "dēmokratia", which means "rule of the people", thusly the term "democratic elections" which we have in the US. All of this comes around to my point regarding plutocracy and the funding of candidates from corporate and union entities.

The Supreme Court with their ruling in favor of Citizens United clearly chose to spin the words of the Bill of Right, "the enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people, and reserves all powers not granted to the federal government to the citizenry or States.”

The terms “people” and “citizenry” clearly refer here to living human beings, not to artificial entities such as corporations, labor unions, or political lobbyist.

In my original post to Westwall, I condemned all the money coming to Wisconsin from outstate interests, that being corporate and union interests, thus the attempt to manipulate the election their way. In the case of Wisconsin, a huge majority of the money went to Walker. Nationally, it depends which way the wind blows, but in recent years the Dems have reaped a majority of corporate and union donations.

Now Westwall refused to see or failed to see that my comments (Post 46) refereed to both ideologies as being tools of Big Money and then went off on the unions. Yet the business world has contributed over a trillion dollars to political candidates since 2000, while unions have contributed almost 45 million dollars. (Business-Labor-Ideology Split in PAC & Individual Donations to Candidates and Parties | OpenSecrets)

A trillion dollars is alot of influence for favorable legislation and certainly shrinks our nations unions attempts to strengthen their agenda. And all the Big Money minimizes people.

The chart that posted (that was discounted by ideologues), clearly showed that as the unions weakened, the middle class's share of the National Income has nosedived. As a matter of fact, in the year 2010, the middle class hit a record low regarding their share of the National Income. Go and Google and research, my point it's accurate as hell.

What all this means is the "rule of the people" is becoming a thing of the past. The US has entered the early to mid stages of becoming plutocratic. Big Money trumps "people". It's no secret that our elected leaders (from both parties) in Washington spend more time raising funds from Special Interest than they do investing the time to represent their constituents.

And a "oh yeah". I am not union, there are no members of our family or friends inter-circle that are union. I believe that unions did help strengthen the middle class when the middle class was strong. The unions are almost insignificant as they make up less than 12% of this nations workforce. The Working Class has also become insignificant as indicated by their record low share of the National Income.

I'm not an ideologue, I'm Main Street America, middle class and I am mad as hell at the demise of "the people" as Big Money rules America. I also believe that those people who support this phenomena are the "useful idiots". I guess they don't care about their future or even more importantly, the children's future.

Read this article from the conservative The Economist.
Ever higher society, ever harder to ascend
Meritocracy in America: Ever higher society, ever harder to ascend | The Economist

I ignored nothing. You failed to state that both sides were equally guilty, something I go to great pains to make clear. As far as influence goes you are correct but that started a very, very long time ago.

The United States of America hasn't been a free market society for decades. The corruption of the political process began around the year 1900 in earnest. there were attempts to corrupt the process earlier, but the first real coordinated work began then.

Here's my post,,again.

Considering that almost 70% of Walker's War Chest came from out of state is troubling. A perfect sign of plutocracy and with plutocracy there is no democracy.
I don't care who benefits from Citizens United. I know who doesn't benefit, your average American who wants a voice in how this country is run. Yeah, I know that part doesn't matter to ideological goose-steppers, you people certainly put your lame ass ideologies over your own country. Because of Citizens United, our country continues on it's downwards trend and into the direction the Founding Fathers warned against.

Ideologies is plural for ideology, that is what you seemed to miss.

Nice try but you fail. "Ideologies" is also a simple generic term. Anyone with an English degree will tell you your post was poorly written at best if you were trying to assert what you say you were. They are more likely to say you were directing your attack at a single group as it was worded.

 

[American_Jihad]

This is the death rattle of public unions.

The working man is going to get the public union monkey off his back.

And will all get this monkey off our backs in Nov...

 

[kiwiman127]

I ignored nothing. You failed to state that both sides were equally guilty, something I go to great pains to make clear. As far as influence goes you are correct but that started a very, very long time ago.

The United States of America hasn't been a free market society for decades. The corruption of the political process began around the year 1900 in earnest. there were attempts to corrupt the process earlier, but the first real coordinated work began then.

Here's my post,,again.

Considering that almost 70% of Walker's War Chest came from out of state is troubling. A perfect sign of plutocracy and with plutocracy there is no democracy.
I don't care who benefits from Citizens United. I know who doesn't benefit, your average American who wants a voice in how this country is run. Yeah, I know that part doesn't matter to ideological goose-steppers, you people certainly put your lame ass ideologies over your own country. Because of Citizens United, our country continues on it's downwards trend and into the direction the Founding Fathers warned against.

Ideologies is plural for ideology, that is what you seemed to miss.

Nice try but you fail. "Ideologies" is also a simple generic term. Anyone with an English degree will tell you your post was poorly written at best if you were trying to assert what you say you were. They are more likely to say you were directing your attack at a single group as it was worded.

It's paranoia, I tell you,,,paranoia!

Fail? I sure didn't see any thought/facts that disproved or even attempted to disprove my posting.

And then we have this " "Ideologies" is also a simple generic term"

World English Dictionary
ideology (ˌaɪdɪˈɒlədʒ&#618

— n , pl -gies
1. a body of ideas that reflects the beliefs and interests of a nation, political system, etc and underlies political action
2. philosophy, sociol the set of beliefs by which a group or society orders reality so as to render it intelligible
3. speculation that is imaginary or visionary

Whoops! It's a fact that ideologies is plural for ideology.

 

[The Rabbi]

Here's my post,,again.

Considering that almost 70% of Walker's War Chest came from out of state is troubling. A perfect sign of plutocracy and with plutocracy there is no democracy.
I don't care who benefits from Citizens United. I know who doesn't benefit, your average American who wants a voice in how this country is run. Yeah, I know that part doesn't matter to ideological goose-steppers, you people certainly put your lame ass ideologies over your own country. Because of Citizens United, our country continues on it's downwards trend and into the direction the Founding Fathers warned against.

Ideologies is plural for ideology, that is what you seemed to miss.

Nice try but you fail. "Ideologies" is also a simple generic term. Anyone with an English degree will tell you your post was poorly written at best if you were trying to assert what you say you were. They are more likely to say you were directing your attack at a single group as it was worded.

It's paranoia, I tell you,,,paranoia!

Fail? I sure didn't see any thought/facts that disproved or even attempted to disprove my posting.

And then we have this " "Ideologies" is also a simple generic term"

World English Dictionary
ideology (ˌaɪdɪˈɒlədʒ&#618

— n , pl -gies
1. a body of ideas that reflects the beliefs and interests of a nation, political system, etc and underlies political action
2. philosophy, sociol the set of beliefs by which a group or society orders reality so as to render it intelligible
3. speculation that is imaginary or visionary

Whoops! It's a fact that ideologies is plural for ideology.

Your post is a fail linguistically, historically, legally, and practically.
Congratulations.

 

[Conservative]

This is the death rattle of public unions.

The working man is going to get the public union monkey off his back.

And will all get this monkey off our backs in Nov...

negged for being a racist prick.

 

[kiwiman127]

Nice try but you fail. "Ideologies" is also a simple generic term. Anyone with an English degree will tell you your post was poorly written at best if you were trying to assert what you say you were. They are more likely to say you were directing your attack at a single group as it was worded.

It's paranoia, I tell you,,,paranoia!

Fail? I sure didn't see any thought/facts that disproved or even attempted to disprove my posting.

And then we have this " "Ideologies" is also a simple generic term"

World English Dictionary
ideology (ˌaɪdɪˈɒlədʒ&#618

— n , pl -gies
1. a body of ideas that reflects the beliefs and interests of a nation, political system, etc and underlies political action
2. philosophy, sociol the set of beliefs by which a group or society orders reality so as to render it intelligible
3. speculation that is imaginary or visionary

Whoops! It's a fact that ideologies is plural for ideology.

Your post is a fail linguistically, historically, legally, and practically.
Congratulations.

And thanks for pointing my linguistic, historic, legal and practical errors individually,,,,oh that's right you didn't.

 

[WillowTree]

Obama’s “Chicago Thug Way” Invades Wisconsin​

Written on Sunday, May 20, 2012 by Lloyd Marcus

As Chairman of The Campaign To Defeat Barack Obama, I just returned back home to Florida from Wisconsin which is ground zero in the battle to stop Obama’s ruination of America. Welcome to the Campaign to Defeat Barack Obama Like locust, Obama minions have swarmed the state of Wisconsin, devouring all who dare oppose their recall of Gov. Scott Walker for his efforts to restore his state to fiscal sanity. Obama minions organized mob protesters to storm the State Capitol. Death threats have been made against Gov. Walker, the Lieutenant Governor and their families. Protection costs for Walker, Kleefisch more than double - JSOnline

Still, Gov. Walker has hung tough and is leading in the polls. This has forced Team Obama to spend more millions and send in the big guns: DNC Chairwoman Debbie Wasserman Schultz is headed to Wisconsin.

​

Obama’s

Waassssname photo priceless!

 

[Trajan]

This is the death rattle of public unions.

The working man is going to get the public union monkey off his back.

And will all get this monkey off our backs in Nov...

negged for the picture.......grow up.

 

[Trajan]

anyway heres some more good news for barrett, oops I mean Walker

2012 Wisconsin Governor Recall: Walker vs. Barrett | Latest Polls | Pollster | Huffington Post 2012 Election Dashboard

 

[westwall]

Here's my post,,again.

Considering that almost 70% of Walker's War Chest came from out of state is troubling. A perfect sign of plutocracy and with plutocracy there is no democracy.
I don't care who benefits from Citizens United. I know who doesn't benefit, your average American who wants a voice in how this country is run. Yeah, I know that part doesn't matter to ideological goose-steppers, you people certainly put your lame ass ideologies over your own country. Because of Citizens United, our country continues on it's downwards trend and into the direction the Founding Fathers warned against.

Ideologies is plural for ideology, that is what you seemed to miss.

Nice try but you fail. "Ideologies" is also a simple generic term. Anyone with an English degree will tell you your post was poorly written at best if you were trying to assert what you say you were. They are more likely to say you were directing your attack at a single group as it was worded.

It's paranoia, I tell you,,,paranoia!

Fail? I sure didn't see any thought/facts that disproved or even attempted to disprove my posting.

And then we have this " "Ideologies" is also a simple generic term"

World English Dictionary
ideology (ˌaɪdɪˈɒlədʒ&#618

— n , pl -gies
1. a body of ideas that reflects the beliefs and interests of a nation, political system, etc and underlies political action
2. philosophy, sociol the set of beliefs by which a group or society orders reality so as to render it intelligible
3. speculation that is imaginary or visionary

Whoops! It's a fact that ideologies is plural for ideology.

How about posting the OTHER meanings too. You are just as big a partisan hack as you claim everyone else to be. What's more you are unethical as well and cherry pick things to suit your POV. That's natural BTW, but don't ever think you can get away with it here. Too many posters here are far better educated than you.

However, an ethical person would point out both sides of an argument to make sure that the readers know where the OP is coming from. So yes, you........fail.

 

[kiwiman127]

Nice try but you fail. "Ideologies" is also a simple generic term. Anyone with an English degree will tell you your post was poorly written at best if you were trying to assert what you say you were. They are more likely to say you were directing your attack at a single group as it was worded.

It's paranoia, I tell you,,,paranoia!

Fail? I sure didn't see any thought/facts that disproved or even attempted to disprove my posting.

And then we have this " "Ideologies" is also a simple generic term"

World English Dictionary
ideology (ˌaɪdɪˈɒlədʒ&#618

— n , pl -gies
1. a body of ideas that reflects the beliefs and interests of a nation, political system, etc and underlies political action
2. philosophy, sociol the set of beliefs by which a group or society orders reality so as to render it intelligible
3. speculation that is imaginary or visionary

Whoops! It's a fact that ideologies is plural for ideology.

How about posting the OTHER meanings too. You are just as big a partisan hack as you claim everyone else to be. What's more you are unethical as well and cherry pick things to suit your POV. That's natural BTW, but don't ever think you can get away with it here. Too many posters here are far better educated than you.

However, an ethical person would point out both sides of an argument to make sure that the readers know where the OP is coming from. So yes, you........fail.

Why is it that I get quite a few positive reps (approx. 30-40%) from our intelligent conservative posters on this board, if I'm such a "partisan hack"? Just because I don't tow the line of your ideology and have the ability to think for myself,,that really bugs you, doesn't it?
If I cherry pick, why not prove that the data I presented is wrong, backed by facts. You'll note I didn't use any partisan resources for my post (The Economist is conservative) and really rarely do. Why in the hell would anyone use biased resources, when doing so destroys their creditability?
And there's your total inability to understand that ideologies is plural for ideology!
I used the World English Dictionary in my previous post, about other dictionaries?

ideologies plural of i·de·ol·o·gy (Noun)Noun:
A system of ideas and ideals, esp. one that forms the basis of economic or political policy: "the ideology of republicanism".
The ideas and manner of thinking of a group, social class, or individual: "a critique of bourgeois ideology".
Merriam-Webster - The Free Dictionary
-----------------------------------------------------

i·de·ol·o·gy   [ahy-dee-ol-uh-jee, id-ee-] Show IPA
noun, plural i·de·ol·o·gies.
1.
the body of doctrine, myth, belief, etc., that guides an individual, social movement, institution, class, or large group.
Dictionary.com
------------------------------------------------------------
i·de·ol·o·gy (d-l-j, d-)
n. pl. i·de·ol·o·gies
1. The body of ideas reflecting the social needs and aspirations of an individual, group, class, or culture.
2. A set of doctrines or beliefs that form the basis of a political, economic, or other system.
thefreedictionary.com
----------------------------------------------------------------
Is three more dictionaries good enough for you?
You attack my intelligence, yet you are so stubborn that you can't admit you're wrong,,,on anything.
At least when I'm proven wrong I admit it and always do.
From one of the more conservative posters on this board when he gave me reps: "Props for honesty. I respect that."

 

[American_Jihad]

National Dems tiptoe away from Walker recall race

May 25, 2012 By Rick Moran

National Democrats - Obama included - are acting as if Wisconsin is on another planet these days. "Recall? What Recall?" they're telling their union friends who are livid that the national party has failed to support their increasingily quixotic effort to unseat Scott Walker on June 5.

The Hill:

Top union officials are lashing out at Washington Democrats, claiming they haven't done enough to help them unseat Gov. Scott Walker (R) in Wisconsin's recall election.

---

Polls suggest that Walker is slowly pulling away from the hapless Barrett, who continues to shoot himself in the foot. Faking crime stats, failing to attend the memorial service for police officers, a listless effort that has drawn criticism from big labor who wants Barrett to breathe fire and brimstone when criticizing Walker's reform of collective bargaining for state employees.

Barrett appears a competent enough mayor but also looks like he's out of his depth in this campaign. If trends continue, Walker may win in a walk.


Read more: Blog: National Dems tiptoe away from Walker recall race

 

[theDoctorisIn]

National Dems tiptoe away from Walker recall race

May 25, 2012 By Rick Moran

National Democrats - Obama included - are acting as if Wisconsin is on another planet these days. "Recall? What Recall?" they're telling their union friends who are livid that the national party has failed to support their increasingily quixotic effort to unseat Scott Walker on June 5.

The Hill:

Top union officials are lashing out at Washington Democrats, claiming they haven't done enough to help them unseat Gov. Scott Walker (R) in Wisconsin's recall election.

---

Polls suggest that Walker is slowly pulling away from the hapless Barrett, who continues to shoot himself in the foot. Faking crime stats, failing to attend the memorial service for police officers, a listless effort that has drawn criticism from big labor who wants Barrett to breathe fire and brimstone when criticizing Walker's reform of collective bargaining for state employees.

Barrett appears a competent enough mayor but also looks like he's out of his depth in this campaign. If trends continue, Walker may win in a walk.


Read more: Blog: National Dems tiptoe away from Walker recall race

You know this contradicts your previous story, right?

 

[American_Jihad]

National Dems tiptoe away from Walker recall race

May 25, 2012 By Rick Moran

National Democrats - Obama included - are acting as if Wisconsin is on another planet these days. "Recall? What Recall?" they're telling their union friends who are livid that the national party has failed to support their increasingily quixotic effort to unseat Scott Walker on June 5.

The Hill:

Top union officials are lashing out at Washington Democrats, claiming they haven't done enough to help them unseat Gov. Scott Walker (R) in Wisconsin's recall election.

---

Polls suggest that Walker is slowly pulling away from the hapless Barrett, who continues to shoot himself in the foot. Faking crime stats, failing to attend the memorial service for police officers, a listless effort that has drawn criticism from big labor who wants Barrett to breathe fire and brimstone when criticizing Walker's reform of collective bargaining for state employees.

Barrett appears a competent enough mayor but also looks like he's out of his depth in this campaign. If trends continue, Walker may win in a walk.


Read more: Blog: National Dems tiptoe away from Walker recall race

You know this contradicts your previous story, right?

That's what happens when you cover a contradictory group of people...

 

[Big Fitz]

I think Wisconsin is too close to call at this point. Walker is out-raising Barrett's campaign, but it's not like the AFL-CIO, Change to Win, and all the labor groups are going to spend at least 20 million on anti-Walker PACs. Some of my friends are working in Wisconsin on the recall (against Walker) - SEIU is throwing a lot of money and manpower into Wisconsin.

You can thank Citizen's United for that.

Actually, the DNC are pulling out of WI as a lost cause.

Wisconsin Democrats angry that the DNC not funding recall campaign against anti-labor Republican governor

And don't think that John Doe investigation is going to save Barrett either. I think that will be ending soon as its political roots are unearthed.

http://mediatrackers.org/2012/05/24/ethics-complaint-filed-against-chief-investigator-in-john-doe/

As for the Unions? A LOT of that money went behind the now failed Falk campaign. It's a money pit for WI is not a union state anymore. Particularly after the Teachers and state workers threw the Mining union under the bus.

Mining company says it will hire mostly union labor - JSOnline

How's that work? Because their politicians killed the bill that would have made thousands of private sector union jobs for that mine. Even when offered a deal to support them in their efforts WEAC and types sided with the ecofascisti. That wound isn't healed yet either. Interesting how the article trys to justify preventing Walker creating jobs and then blames the private sector unions for 'not getting involved fast enough'. It's the "she asked for it by dressing that way" rape defense. Yeah, this will make it so close.

Public unions drive private union jobs out of Wisconsin - Public Sector Inc. Forum

And which unions are most for this recall outside of WEAC? Mostly out of state because they know if this works, they're next.

COMMENTARY: Union-funded out-of-state political gunslingers dominate Wisconsin recalls



Labor unions funding recall PACs

 

[The Rabbi]

It's paranoia, I tell you,,,paranoia!

Fail? I sure didn't see any thought/facts that disproved or even attempted to disprove my posting.

And then we have this " "Ideologies" is also a simple generic term"

World English Dictionary
ideology (ˌaɪdɪˈɒlədʒ&#618

— n , pl -gies
1. a body of ideas that reflects the beliefs and interests of a nation, political system, etc and underlies political action
2. philosophy, sociol the set of beliefs by which a group or society orders reality so as to render it intelligible
3. speculation that is imaginary or visionary

Whoops! It's a fact that ideologies is plural for ideology.

Your post is a fail linguistically, historically, legally, and practically.
Congratulations.

And thanks for pointing my linguistic, historic, legal and practical errors individually,,,,oh that's right you didn't.

Gawd ytou need it spelled out for you.
1) Linguistically. You mean "beliefs", not "ideologies." While you might mean the libertarian ideology, the conservative ideology, and the social conservative ideoology, probably you just mean the belief that corporations have the protection of the 1A in political matters. So you meant belief/beliefs, but ideologies sounded better. Except it doesn't. Fail.
2)Historically. The idea that corporations are legal people is way older than Citizens. It goes back to the Taft Court, with roots older than that.
3) Legal. The Supreme Court of the U.S. has held that corporations, which are groups of people, hold the same rights in free speech as individual people. That is the law of the land.
4) PPratically. You write that ordinary people are hurt. I tis the exact opposite. I don't have $5M to buy advertising to influence views. Neither does my neighbor. But we can band together, form a corporation, raise money and influence views that way. and that is exactly what Citizens United is--a group of individuals who by themselves could never get the influence they do as a group.