Death Toll from Communism Approaches 100 Million

[JoeB131]

The collective adopted capitalism. Does that trigger you?

Well, if it's "collective", it isn't capitalism, is it?

 

[JoeB131]

So, you have to go back to the 13th and 14th centuries to find a rival for Communism's record of bloodletting. It think we can give the communists a second place silver medal for mass murder.

Wow, his point went right over your head, didn't it?

 

[DonGlock26]

Wow, his point went right over your head, didn't it?

It was a weak apology for the communist butchers.

 

[there4eyeM]

It was a weak apology for the communist butchers.

...yep, right over...

 

[DonGlock26]

...yep, right over...

Weak sauce.

 

[ThunderKiss1965]

China has had 1800 recorded famines between antiquity and the fall of the Qing Dynasty.

There's a reason why your parents told you, "They're starving in China, finish what you have!" (To which I responded, "Send them this!" )

Funny thing. After 1962, China stopped having Famines. The Commies got their food distribution system straight.

In conclusion the Communist fucked up royally and murdered millions of their own people. There is a big goddamn difference between crop failure causing famines and human idiocy doing it. Socialism is the most murderous socioeconomic system in history.

 

[there4eyeM]

In conclusion the Communist fucked up royally and murdered millions of their own people. There is a big goddamn difference between crop failure causing famines and human idiocy doing it. Socialism is the most murderous socioeconomic system in history.

...and guns kill people.

 

[ThunderKiss1965]

...and guns kill people.

Guns are inanimate objects that don't do shit unless a human interacts with them. Socialism is an inherently murderous system.

 

[JoeB131]

In conclusion the Communist fucked up royally and murdered millions of their own people. There is a big goddamn difference between crop failure causing famines and human idiocy doing it. Socialism is the most murderous socioeconomic system in history.

I agree, there's a difference.

The Great Leap Forward was both. A bit of human idiocy and a bit of natural disasters.

The same could be said of famines that happened under the Kumontang, the Qing, the Ming, the Mongols, the Song, the Tang, and the Han Dynasties.

Funny thing, though. China hasn't had a famine since the GLF.

Now, if you want to discuss man-made famines, let's discuss Churchill and his role in the Bengal Famine of 1943.

 

[DonGlock26]

The Great Leap Forward was both. A bit of human idiocy and a bit of natural disasters.

It was mass murder, Joe. The Chinese Communists murdered millions of their own people.
The Soviets used famine to murder millions of Ukrainians. This is what the radical Left is capable of.

 

[JoeB131]

It was mass murder, Joe. The Chinese Communists murdered millions of their own people.
The Soviets used famine to murder millions of Ukrainians. This is what the radical Left is capable of.

No, they really didn't.

Famines happen no matter what your political ideology is. They are unknown to us today because we've managed to engineer our environment to produce plenty of food.

So if you take out the Famines, what are you left with?

 

[DonGlock26]

No, they really didn't.

Famines happen no matter what your political ideology is. They are unknown to us today because we've managed to engineer our environment to produce plenty of food.

So if you take out the Famines, what are you left with?

Are you really that ignorant?


"About 7% of those who died during the Great Leap Forward were tortured to death or summarily killed.[65] Benjamin Valentino notes that "communist officials sometimes tortured and killed those accused of failing to meet their grain quota".[66]

If an estimate of 30 million deaths is accepted, the failure of the Great Leap Forward caused the deadliest famine in the history of China, and it also caused the deadliest famine in human history.[79][80] "

Great Leap Forward - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

7% of 30 million is over 2 million murdered Chinese citizens. That's what you are ignoring.

 

[JoeB131]

Are you really that ignorant?


"About 7% of those who died during the Great Leap Forward were tortured to death or summarily killed.[65] Benjamin Valentino notes that "communist officials sometimes tortured and killed those accused of failing to meet their grain quota".[66]

If an estimate of 30 million deaths is accepted, the failure of the Great Leap Forward caused the deadliest famine in the history of China, and it also caused the deadliest famine in human history.[79][80] "

Great Leap Forward - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

7% of 30 million is over 2 million murdered Chinese citizens. That's what you are ignoring.

Okay, that's really not a big number, is it? 2 million out of a population of 700 million? By way of comparison, the Japanese killed 22 million Chinese during the Second Sino-Japanese War/World War II. The Taiping Rebellion of the 19th century (where some crazy guy thought he as Jesus' brother) resulted in 20-70 million deaths. (Again, entirely depends how you score famines.)

Not that I accept even that number as being anything but Bircher Bullshit. "Benjamin Valentino"? Wow, we have a whole lot of white people telling us what's what with China.

Kind of like the other douchenoodle I'm arguing with who claims the Rape of Nanking wasn't that bad. And he's got a whole slew of White people who will insist it wasn't so.

Now, the Great Leap Forward was a huge mistake. From local officials overreporting grain yields, to the "Four Pests" Campaign encouraging people to kill birds (that kept the insect population under control), to encouraging people to industrialize by building kilns to refine metal in their backyards, it was truly awful policy by a country that felt threatened by both the USSR and US and needed to catch up quickly.

 

[DonGlock26]

Okay, that's really not a big number, is it? 2 million out of a population of 700 million? By way of comparison, the Japanese killed 22 million Chinese during the Second Sino-Japanese War/World War II.

Not that I accept even that number as being anything but Bircher Bullshit. "Benjamin Valentino"? Wow, we have a whole lot of white people telling us what's what with China.

Kind of like the other douchenoodle I'm arguing with who claims the Rape of Nanking wasn't that bad. And he's got a whole slew of White people who will insist it wasn't so.

But, it was more than those executed by the Chinese Communists, Joe. The Communist Chinese KNEW their policies were causing mass deaths and they continued to create the conditions causing the famine. That's murder as well.

You are simply a communist apologist.

 

[JoeB131]

But, it was more than those executed by the Chinese Communists, Joe. The Communist Chinese KNEW their policies were causing mass deaths and they continued to create the conditions causing the famine. That's murder as well.

You are simply a communist apologist.

I make no apologies for Communism. Every economic system has its horrors.

We can talk about the Bengal Famine of 1943 or the Belgian Congo or the Holocaust as examples of Capitalist excess.

(And yes, Nazi Germany was Capitalist... Big corporations that got rich under the Nazis are still around today.)

The problem was that at least initially, the central government in Beijing didn't know what was going on in the provinces.

Local officials, trying to curry favor, were reporting utterly bullshit grain production numbers.

 

[DonGlock26]

I make no apologies for Communism. Every economic system has its horrors.

We can talk about the Bengal Famine of 1943 or the Belgian Congo or the Holocaust as examples of Capitalist excess.

(And yes, Nazi Germany was Capitalist... Big corporations that got rich under the Nazis are still around today.)

The problem was that at least initially, the central government in Beijing didn't know what was going on in the provinces.

Local officials, trying to curry favor, were reporting utterly bullshit grain production numbers.

Can we agree that communist murderers were as evil as the Nazis?

 

[JoeB131]

Can we agree that communist murderers were as evil as the Nazis?

Nope, I wouldn't agree with that at all.

With the Nazis, mass murder was the point. They wanted to eliminate certain ethnicities.

Communism had some funny idea that people would work collectively for no personal benefit. It doesn't really work because it's contrary to human nature.

 

[there4eyeM]

A clique in power oversaw the deaths of millions of people. This has happened in a number of countries and times. The Nazis did it, the Stalinists and Maoists did it. The Catholic Church did it. Capitalism has had its sociopathic episodes as well. Ideologies and economic systems are just ideas. The unscrupulous people who take control of them are responsible for the deaths and damage. Be real, people. Just regurgitating jingoistic pap tends to obfuscate truth. Our common enemy is the lack of a selection process that would weed-out the sick minds.

 

[Soupnazi630]

No, they really didn't.

Famines happen no matter what your political ideology is. They are unknown to us today because we've managed to engineer our environment to produce plenty of food.

So if you take out the Famines, what are you left with?

Yes they did

Just because famines happen does not mean they cannot be inflicted and they wrre

You are ignorant

 

[Soupnazi630]

Nope, I wouldn't agree with that at all.

With the Nazis, mass murder was the point. They wanted to eliminate certain ethnicities.

Communism had some funny idea that people would work collectively for no personal benefit. It doesn't really work because it's contrary to human nature.

with the communists mass murder was the point