Christians attempt to silence non-religious messages at Christmas

[Amanda]

And if you still want to split hairs further, there's no way in hell he's been able to meet the majority of atheists so to call them all bigoted is ironic (and very very stupid).

People do this all the time when referring to "Christians" or "Muslims" or any number of broadly defined religious groups.

 

[Missourian]

Calling an entire religion bigoted is up there in the peak of irony.

You misunderstood F.T.

I said "the atheists" as in "the atheists who erected this display".

I don't think all atheists are intolerant or bigoted.

My sincere apologies if that was unclear.

 

[del]

Why must you split hairs?

Fine, calling a very large group of people defined by some very loose belief bigoted is irony then.

And if you still want to split hairs further, there's no way in hell he's been able to meet the majority of atheists so to call them all bigoted is ironic (and very very stupid).

most atheists that i have met, which is certainly not the majority of the atheists in the country, take great exception if one describes their non-belief as a religion, so i don't consider it "splitting hairs" to point it out.

to call all of any group anything is inaccurate but not ironic, so again, the hair remains whole.

you may want to consider another idiomatic expression at this point.
and a dictionary.

 

[Steerpike]

most atheists that i have met, which is certainly not the majority of the atheists in the country, take great exception if one describes their non-belief as a religion, so i don't consider it "splitting hairs" to point it out.

to call all of any group anything is inaccurate but not ironic, so again, the hair remains whole.

you may want to consider another idiomatic expression at this point.
and a dictionary.

Some atheists I know might be bothered by it. Others would not. I think it is inaccurate to describe it as a 'religion' but some people seem to feel better in doing so. And for some atheists it may be a component of a set of "religious" beliefs. For many others, however, it is part of an absence of religious belief entirely.

 

[Father Time]

You misunderstood F.T.

I said "the atheists" as in "the atheists who erected this display".

I don't think all atheists are intolerant or bigoted.

My sincere apologies if that was unclear.

Oh ok then sorry for the misunderstanding. I don't think these atheists are bigoted because they bash religion (I think smug would be a better term for them) but that's just me.

 

[Shogun]

I think it's absolutely ridiculous to coin atheist as a "religion" simply because there is a belief system involved. That essentially makes the belief of anything equivilent to a religion.. which is stupid as hell. Believing in gravity does not make one a worshiper of gravity. Believing that water is wet doesn't make a person pray to water.

fucking dogma junkies.

 

[Steerpike]

The other problem is what is inherent in the argument that atheist is a 'religion.' Religious people use that argument against atheists because some atheists look down on religion and religious people feel it is a good way to stick a finger in the eye of the atheist.

But if you think about it, the religious person is then basically conceding the point that a 'religion' has less value than non-religion. By basically saying "Oh yeah, well atheism is a religion too!" you're validating the atheists view that "religion" has a negative connotation.

It's what comes from using an emotionally-satisfying response (i.e. stick a finger in their eye) but not a logically sensible one.

 

[Father Time]

Uh can we drop the whole 'is it a religion' discussion. I just called it a religion for simplicity's sake. Even if people classify atheism as religion they'd have to admit it's much different than all the others.

They don't worship anything, nor hold anything in an air of absolute reverence. They don't have churches, religious customs etc.

If you want to call them a religion you'd then have to admit they are the least organized religion there is (unless you also count agnostic as a religion).

 

[KittenKoder]

I can only hope they consider adding the above to their display next year.

No, that wouldn't be any better, though more fact filled. Omitting the last part wouldn't really change the message though, since everyone already knows Atheists don't like religion, so if I were them I would have done that part. Since I am not atheist though I cannot speak fully on their behalf, but I can say this, they were not incorrect. Most wars are fought over religious beliefs, there are many instances in which religious belief has held us back in advances in medicine, however at the same time some religions work to progress these, some would never fight in a war, and others even just live and let live. So while fact I can see the offense, but it is STILL protected by the same right that allows any other religious (or lack of) display.

 

[KittenKoder]

I think it's absolutely ridiculous to coin atheist as a "religion" simply because there is a belief system involved. That essentially makes the belief of anything equivilent to a religion.. which is stupid as hell. Believing in gravity does not make one a worshiper of gravity. Believing that water is wet doesn't make a person pray to water.

fucking dogma junkies.

Hmm ... actually there are many pagan religions who do just those things. Not going further into details of why it fits the term 'religion', it is a LOT better than people who say only christians are religious and ask us pagans "why aren't you religious?"

 

[KittenKoder]

I think you got the key to the Christian point of view with that sentence, especially the last part.

Actually it is you who still doesn't get it. It's still protected under freedom of speech. The opposite side of town was to attract everyone AWAY from the hatemongers because they wanted to let them know that their message was falling on deaf ears. Essentially they just "flipped them the finger" and left it as that. It still does not justify preventing one message from being heard just because someone finds it offensive.

 

[Amanda]

Actually it is you who still doesn't get it. It's still protected under freedom of speech. The opposite side of town was to attract everyone AWAY from the hatemongers because they wanted to let them know that their message was falling on deaf ears. Essentially they just "flipped them the finger" and left it as that. It still does not justify preventing one message from being heard just because someone finds it offensive.

I think I'm going to just stop responding to anything you post. No matter how hard I try to find a middle ground your only response seems to be to tell me how badly I missed the point. Whatever.

 

[KittenKoder]

I think I'm going to just stop responding to anything you post. No matter how hard I try to find a middle ground your only response seems to be to tell me how badly I missed the point. Whatever.

Again? Thought you did that a few threads ago.

 

[del]

I think it's absolutely ridiculous to coin atheist as a "religion" simply because there is a belief system involved. That essentially makes the belief of anything equivilent to a religion.. which is stupid as hell. Believing in gravity does not make one a worshiper of gravity. Believing that water is wet doesn't make a person pray to water.

fucking dogma junkies.

<yawn>
do tell.

 

[Shogun]

still trying to follow me around like a lamprey to a shark, eh guy? Sucks to be so insignificant that you have to cling to my leg in order to feel relevant on a board that you mod on, doesn't it?

 

[del]

Uh can we drop the whole 'is it a religion' discussion. I just called it a religion for simplicity's sake. Even if people classify atheism as religion they'd have to admit it's much different than all the others.

They don't worship anything, nor hold anything in an air of absolute reverence. They don't have churches, religious customs etc.

If you want to call them a religion you'd then have to admit they are the least organized religion there is (unless you also count agnostic as a religion).

suits me. i was just being me in pointing it out.

 

[del]

still trying to follow me around like a lamprey to a shark, eh guy? Sucks to be so insignificant that you have to cling to my leg in order to feel relevant on a board that you mod on, doesn't it?

why don't you save this sort of thing for your "diary"?

you look silly.

 

[Shogun]

says the guy following me around here like an injury lawyer does an ambulance. Relevance, sir.. maybe if you write to Santa he'll finally put some under your xmas tree.

 

[YWN666]

I'll keep it simple: Neither freedom of speech nor freedom of religion creates a right to have the government post your hate speech on its premises

What about christians preaching that non-christians will suffer in hell for eternity? Can that be considered hate speech?

 

[Amanda]

What about christians preaching that non-christians will suffer in hell for eternity? Can that be considered hate speech?

I'm not saying anything so far discussed is hate speech, it's just not an argument I think anyone can prove, but I do think what the atheist have on their sign isn't ok to put up next to a nativity scene. Likewise, I don't think it would be right for Christians to put up a sign saying what you said. I don't think there's anything wrong with Christians discussing the consequences of non-belief in their own space though.