Christian churches ‘must be made’ to affirm homosexuality

[SAYIT]

Excuse me but relax is the wrong message to send someone who is letting the world know that the homosexual agenda is now moving towards forcing Christian Churches into affirming homosexuality...

And if that was the case I'd be standing with you against such an intrusion but it's just not the case. The fact is only real Christians can stop their bigotry.

 

[SAYIT]

Yes, I see your point now and since Protestants reject Sacred Tradition and have a malleable belief system they will eventually succumb to homosexual pressure. Most people don't perceive this fatal weakness that caused Protestants to abandon all opposition to contraception in the 20th century. This laid the groundwork and makes almost certain the day they will cave in to other forms of sexual immorality...

It's not so much caving to sexual immorality but rather fighting the urge to do God's job which in this case is judging our sins. Our job is to break down the walls that separate us from other humans. I'm pretty certain God would prefer we love one another.

 

[koshergrl]

Yes, I see your point now and since Protestants reject Sacred Tradition and have a malleable belief system they will eventually succumb to homosexual pressure. Most people don't perceive this fatal weakness that caused Protestants to abandon all opposition to contraception in the 20th century. This laid the groundwork and makes almost certain the day they will cave in to other forms of sexual immorality...

It's not so much caving to sexual immorality but rather fighting the urge to do God's job which in this case is judging our sins. Our job is to break down the walls that separate us from other humans. I'm pretty certain God would have us love one another.

Christians have no problem with loving everybody.

We object to being told that we must EMBRACE, endorse and approve what we consider sinful behavior.

We would resist any attempt to *force* us to accept murder as a reasonable and non-sinful action as well.
We would resist any attempt to *force* us to state that the bible is wrong when it condemns any sin.

We would resist any attempt to *force* us to adjust our faith to strictures placed upon us by the state, in direct opposition to our convictions.

It isn't going to happen.

But the leftist yahoos see our resistance to their efforts to do just that as our statement that we *hate* homos. We don't hate homos. We hate sin. And homosexuality is a sin. So is covetnous..but nobody's trying to force us to endorse covetnous, or thievery. They do try to get us to endorse murder, and we don't do that either...and again, when we balk, they claim it's because we *hate*.

The people who hate are the ones who think they have the right and the authority to tell us what we must believe.

And let's get this straight as well....objecting to sin is in no way an admission that we are WITHOUT sin. So don't even go there, because it's just stupid. We accept our status as sinners, and we accept the word of God regarding sinful behavior, and we do our best to avoid sin. That is a separate issue from the issue of having the state force us to adopt a foreign DEFINITION of what constitutes sin.

We have the right to believe as our conscience dictates. And our conscience dictates to us that the bible is the word of God, that homosexuality is a sin, and homosexual marriages are SACRILEGE, and therefore..we have the right to abstain from participating in them, and in this country, the law cannot force us to. Even if we own a business.

 

[koshergrl]

Excuse me but relax is the wrong message to send someone who is letting the world know that the homosexual agenda is now moving towards forcing Christian Churches into affirming homosexuality...

And if that was the case I'd be standing with you against such an intrusion but it's just not the case. The fact is only real Christians can stop their bigotry.

Declining to participate in a homosexual wedding ceremony is not bigotry.

 

[SassyIrishLass]

Excuse me but relax is the wrong message to send someone who is letting the world know that the homosexual agenda is now moving towards forcing Christian Churches into affirming homosexuality...

And if that was the case I'd be standing with you against such an intrusion but it's just not the case. The fact is only real Christians can stop their bigotry.

Declining to participate in a homosexual wedding ceremony is not bigotry.

The word bigot is being overplayed, it's lost it's bite

 

[PratchettFan]

What power did the column writer have to modify church behavior?

When did she try to suppress the writer?

Oh yeah, she didn't.

However, the writer is calling for action by the state, against churches.

Which is of course illegal and unconstitutional.

No, the writer is not. It would certainly be unconstitutional, but the writer did not call for government action in the piece.

No, what the writer is calling for is that the people move unconstitutionally to restrict the rights of the American people...in direct opposition to freedoms our government is supposed to protect.

In other words, sedition.

Full Definition of SEDITION
: incitement of resistance to or insurrection against lawful authority

Sedition - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary

Incitement of resistance to or insurrection against lawful authority:
Wouldn't that include every right wing rally?

Name one.

The rancher who refused to pay for the use of land he did not own and the people who showed up with guns when the government insisted he not be allowed to steal from the rest of us comes to mind. What would you call pointing weapons at government officials?

 

[sealybobo]

What part of freedom OF religion and separation of Church and state are the homosexuals and left loons not quite grasping?

Christian churches ‘must be made’ to affirm homosexuality, says New York Times columnist

NEW YORK, April 7, 2015 – A New York Times columnist and a corporate leader have agreed that Christian churches “must” be convinced, or coerced, to change their teachings on sexual morality and abandon an “ossified” doctrinal teaching that sex outside heterosexual marriage is immoral.

Frank Bruni wrote that traditional Christianity – whether among evangelicals, Catholics, or Orthodox – provides the greatest resistance to normalizing homosexuality in the United States in a recent column in the New York Times.

“Homosexuality and Christianity don’t have to be in conflict in any church anywhere,” Bruni insisted. “The continued view of gays, lesbians and bisexuals as sinners is a decision. It’s a choice. It prioritizes scattered passages of ancient texts over all that has been learned since — as if time had stood still, as if the advances of science and knowledge meant nothing.”

Christian churches must be made to affirm homosexuality says New York Times columnist News LifeSite

Bruni's commentary:

Frank Bruni commentary It s time to cross homosexuality off the list of sins The Columbus Dispatch

Being anti gay is not good for the church. Its not even a ten commandments level offense. In fact I read the bible and didn't read 1 word about gay. The church knows eventually it'll be OK to be gay as long as you are monogamous. Why cares if two guys want to live together forever? Premisquity is the sin.

 

[PratchettFan]

What power did the column writer have to modify church behavior?

When did she try to suppress the writer?

Oh yeah, she didn't.

However, the writer is calling for action by the state, against churches.

Which is of course illegal and unconstitutional.

No, the writer is not. It would certainly be unconstitutional, but the writer did not call for government action in the piece.

No, what the writer is calling for is that the people move unconstitutionally to restrict the rights of the American people...in direct opposition to freedoms our government is supposed to protect.

In other words, sedition.

Please, show us where the writer called for government action.

What I said is that the writer called for government action against churches by the government. I did not say that a "call for government action" was sedition, you loons.

What is sedition is calling for the people to rebel against our Constitution and our government, to restrict freedom of religion.

And the writer did neither of those things. Did you bother to read it?

 

[koshergrl]

When did she try to suppress the writer?

Oh yeah, she didn't.

However, the writer is calling for action by the state, against churches.

Which is of course illegal and unconstitutional.

No, the writer is not. It would certainly be unconstitutional, but the writer did not call for government action in the piece.

No, what the writer is calling for is that the people move unconstitutionally to restrict the rights of the American people...in direct opposition to freedoms our government is supposed to protect.

In other words, sedition.

Full Definition of SEDITION
: incitement of resistance to or insurrection against lawful authority

Sedition - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary

Incitement of resistance to or insurrection against lawful authority:
Wouldn't that include every right wing rally?

Name one.

The rancher who refused to pay for the use of land he did not own and the people who showed up with guns when the government insisted he not be allowed to steal from the rest of us comes to mind. What would you call pointing weapons at government officials?

He wasn't stealing from you, asshead.

 

[SassyIrishLass]

What part of freedom OF religion and separation of Church and state are the homosexuals and left loons not quite grasping?

Christian churches ‘must be made’ to affirm homosexuality, says New York Times columnist

NEW YORK, April 7, 2015 – A New York Times columnist and a corporate leader have agreed that Christian churches “must” be convinced, or coerced, to change their teachings on sexual morality and abandon an “ossified” doctrinal teaching that sex outside heterosexual marriage is immoral.

Frank Bruni wrote that traditional Christianity – whether among evangelicals, Catholics, or Orthodox – provides the greatest resistance to normalizing homosexuality in the United States in a recent column in the New York Times.

“Homosexuality and Christianity don’t have to be in conflict in any church anywhere,” Bruni insisted. “The continued view of gays, lesbians and bisexuals as sinners is a decision. It’s a choice. It prioritizes scattered passages of ancient texts over all that has been learned since — as if time had stood still, as if the advances of science and knowledge meant nothing.”

Christian churches must be made to affirm homosexuality says New York Times columnist News LifeSite

Bruni's commentary:

Frank Bruni commentary It s time to cross homosexuality off the list of sins The Columbus Dispatch

Being anti gay is not good for the church. Its not even a ten commandments level offense. In fact I read the bible and didn't read 1 word about gay. The church knows eventually it'll be OK to be gay as long as you are monogamous. Why cares if two guys want to live together forever? Premisquity is the sin.

What? It's mentioned at least six times LMAO

 

[BULLDOG]

No, the writer is not. It would certainly be unconstitutional, but the writer did not call for government action in the piece.

No, what the writer is calling for is that the people move unconstitutionally to restrict the rights of the American people...in direct opposition to freedoms our government is supposed to protect.

In other words, sedition.

Full Definition of SEDITION
: incitement of resistance to or insurrection against lawful authority

Sedition - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary

Incitement of resistance to or insurrection against lawful authority:
Wouldn't that include every right wing rally?

Name one.

The rancher who refused to pay for the use of land he did not own and the people who showed up with guns when the government insisted he not be allowed to steal from the rest of us comes to mind. What would you call pointing weapons at government officials?

He wasn't stealing from you, asshead.

It's federal land that belongs to all of us, so yes he was stealing from all of us. Either way, pointing guns at federal officials, preventing them from doing their lawful duty, is sedition as well as treason.

 

[PratchettFan]

No, the writer is not. It would certainly be unconstitutional, but the writer did not call for government action in the piece.

No, what the writer is calling for is that the people move unconstitutionally to restrict the rights of the American people...in direct opposition to freedoms our government is supposed to protect.

In other words, sedition.

Please, show us where the writer called for government action.

What I said is that the writer called for government action against churches by the government. I did not say that a "call for government action" was sedition, you loons.

What is sedition is calling for the people to rebel against our Constitution and our government, to restrict freedom of religion.

Please, show us where "the writer called for government action against churches by the government."

"Mitchell Gold, a prominent furniture maker and gay philanthropist, founded an advocacy group, Faith in America, which aims to mitigate the damage done to LGBT people by what it calls “religion-based bigotry" Gold says: "..... church leaders must be made “to take homosexuality off the sin list.”

What do you suppose that means? How does one *make* church leaders take "homosexuality off the sin list"?

Frank Bruni commentary It s time to cross homosexuality off the list of sins The Columbus Dispatch

Well, at least you read it. That's good. That is a quote from Gold, not at all what the writer was saying. What Gold meant I don't know. However, nowhere in that quote does he say the government must make the church leaders do anything. Based upon the activities of that group, I would say he intends to do it through public relations campaigns. So far that has worked well for the LGBT community. Theirs has been what must be one of the most non-violent and effective revolutions in history. Truly impressive.

 

[PratchettFan]

Please, show us where the writer called for government action.

What I said is that the writer called for government action against churches by the government. I did not say that a "call for government action" was sedition, you loons.

What is sedition is calling for the people to rebel against our Constitution and our government, to restrict freedom of religion.

Please, show us where "the writer called for government action against churches by the government."

"Mitchell Gold, a prominent furniture maker and gay philanthropist, founded an advocacy group, Faith in America, which aims to mitigate the damage done to LGBT people by what it calls “religion-based bigotry" Gold says: "..... church leaders must be made “to take homosexuality off the sin list.”

What do you suppose that means? How does one *make* church leaders take "homosexuality off the sin list"?

Frank Bruni commentary It s time to cross homosexuality off the list of sins The Columbus Dispatch

Public pressure. Gay church members and their families. Others working in the respective churches to make the change.

Seems pretty obvious.

They're talking about forcing the churches to alter the bible, and penalizing them if they don't. They're talking about criminalizing faith.

Even if they weren't talking about giving the state that authority (which is of course what they're talking about and what Faith in America is all about) they are still encouraging people to commit a CRIME. They are talking about forcing the church to alter their beliefs. Not asking the church. MAKING them.

No, they are not.

 

[PratchettFan]

Please, show us where "the writer called for government action against churches by the government."

"Mitchell Gold, a prominent furniture maker and gay philanthropist, founded an advocacy group, Faith in America, which aims to mitigate the damage done to LGBT people by what it calls “religion-based bigotry" Gold says: "..... church leaders must be made “to take homosexuality off the sin list.”

What do you suppose that means? How does one *make* church leaders take "homosexuality off the sin list"?

Frank Bruni commentary It s time to cross homosexuality off the list of sins The Columbus Dispatch

Public pressure. Gay church members and their families. Others working in the respective churches to make the change.

Seems pretty obvious.

They're talking about forcing the churches to alter the bible, and penalizing them if they don't. They're talking about criminalizing faith.

Even if they weren't talking about giving the state that authority (which is of course what they're talking about and what Faith in America is all about) they are still encouraging people to commit a CRIME. They are talking about forcing the church to alter their beliefs. Not asking the church. MAKING them.

Change doesn't happen unless someone makes it happen, but not all, or even most, change is done at the hands of the government, and government intervention is certainly not being called for here.

And just so I'm clear, are you saying that if the public puts pressure on churches to accept homosexuals, by say mailing leaflets or lobbying church officials, that that would be a crime?

It's a crime to dictate someone's faith to them in this country, it's a tenet we built the country on, and anyone who lobbies to remove that right is seditious.

No, it isn't.

 

[PratchettFan]

I think it's obvious the Christians are not going to be bullied by the homos. Just a couple of weeks ago 34,000 black churches compromised of 15 denominations and over 15 million members told the Presbyterians to pound sand due their choice to allow SSM. That's a lot of members...and a ton of money

I think it's also obvious that the homos are going to go to further lengths to exert control over the churches.

Which is exactly what we said would happen if we created laws against speech (*hate* speech, i.e., biblical references they don't like) and if we allowed the state to define what constitutes the sacrament of *marriage*.

Agreed and we warned this was going to happen, just as we warned they will want the age of consent lowered and inroads are already being made in that direction.

And every time we said "we don't want state-sanctioned homo marriage" and "hate speech is just speech and it's dangerous to regulate speech" because we knew that this was the extremist fringe's foot in the door of the churches..the leftists jeered and dumped our threads in the *conspiracy theory* forum, and laughed and laughed and laughed...because everybody KNOWS homos aren't interested in limiting freedom of speech, or throwing people in jail for their faith..right?

Yeah, right. That's exactly what it's about. The Nazis did the same thing. Hitler first embraced religion, then when he was in power, he said that the churches must sign allegiance first to the state, and wear the Nazi emblem..or be thrown out and imprisoned. And that's exactly what he did..and that's exactly what these pigs will do if they get the chance. They embrace a slightly different form of depraved tyranny..but it's still depraved tyranny and ultimately, the results will be the same if they get a foothold.

This is the reason why the campaigns of the LGBT community is winning. The arguments against them are so massively idiotic.

 

[PratchettFan]

No, the writer is not. It would certainly be unconstitutional, but the writer did not call for government action in the piece.

No, what the writer is calling for is that the people move unconstitutionally to restrict the rights of the American people...in direct opposition to freedoms our government is supposed to protect.

In other words, sedition.

Full Definition of SEDITION
: incitement of resistance to or insurrection against lawful authority

Sedition - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary

Incitement of resistance to or insurrection against lawful authority:
Wouldn't that include every right wing rally?

Name one.

The rancher who refused to pay for the use of land he did not own and the people who showed up with guns when the government insisted he not be allowed to steal from the rest of us comes to mind. What would you call pointing weapons at government officials?

He wasn't stealing from you, asshead.

He was stealing from the taxpayers, of which I am one. I notice you didn't address the actual point and I don't blame you. I named an example of actual sedition from someone who is definitely right wing. Is that why you decided to start calling me names?

 

[sealybobo]

What part of freedom OF religion and separation of Church and state are the homosexuals and left loons not quite grasping?

Christian churches ‘must be made’ to affirm homosexuality, says New York Times columnist

NEW YORK, April 7, 2015 – A New York Times columnist and a corporate leader have agreed that Christian churches “must” be convinced, or coerced, to change their teachings on sexual morality and abandon an “ossified” doctrinal teaching that sex outside heterosexual marriage is immoral.

Frank Bruni wrote that traditional Christianity – whether among evangelicals, Catholics, or Orthodox – provides the greatest resistance to normalizing homosexuality in the United States in a recent column in the New York Times.

“Homosexuality and Christianity don’t have to be in conflict in any church anywhere,” Bruni insisted. “The continued view of gays, lesbians and bisexuals as sinners is a decision. It’s a choice. It prioritizes scattered passages of ancient texts over all that has been learned since — as if time had stood still, as if the advances of science and knowledge meant nothing.”

Christian churches must be made to affirm homosexuality says New York Times columnist News LifeSite

Bruni's commentary:

Frank Bruni commentary It s time to cross homosexuality off the list of sins The Columbus Dispatch

Being anti gay is not good for the church. Its not even a ten commandments level offense. In fact I read the bible and didn't read 1 word about gay. The church knows eventually it'll be OK to be gay as long as you are monogamous. Why cares if two guys want to live together forever? Premisquity is the sin.

What? It's mentioned at least six times LMAO

I must have missed it. Did Jesus say it? I dont even care if he did. He was just a guy in the year zero.

 

[bodecea]

Best Hitler video yet....

This one's better:

 

[SassyIrishLass]

What part of freedom OF religion and separation of Church and state are the homosexuals and left loons not quite grasping?

Christian churches ‘must be made’ to affirm homosexuality, says New York Times columnist

NEW YORK, April 7, 2015 – A New York Times columnist and a corporate leader have agreed that Christian churches “must” be convinced, or coerced, to change their teachings on sexual morality and abandon an “ossified” doctrinal teaching that sex outside heterosexual marriage is immoral.

Frank Bruni wrote that traditional Christianity – whether among evangelicals, Catholics, or Orthodox – provides the greatest resistance to normalizing homosexuality in the United States in a recent column in the New York Times.

“Homosexuality and Christianity don’t have to be in conflict in any church anywhere,” Bruni insisted. “The continued view of gays, lesbians and bisexuals as sinners is a decision. It’s a choice. It prioritizes scattered passages of ancient texts over all that has been learned since — as if time had stood still, as if the advances of science and knowledge meant nothing.”

Christian churches must be made to affirm homosexuality says New York Times columnist News LifeSite

Bruni's commentary:

Frank Bruni commentary It s time to cross homosexuality off the list of sins The Columbus Dispatch

Being anti gay is not good for the church. Its not even a ten commandments level offense. In fact I read the bible and didn't read 1 word about gay. The church knows eventually it'll be OK to be gay as long as you are monogamous. Why cares if two guys want to live together forever? Premisquity is the sin.

What? It's mentioned at least six times LMAO

I must have missed it. Did Jesus say it? I dont even care if he did. He was just a guy in the year zero.

Then why are you bawling about it? Just to whine and bawl about something you obviously have no clue about? You lied, you've never read the Bible. Why say you did if you didn't? You now have zero credibility

 

[Mr.Right]

What part of freedom OF religion and separation of Church and state are the homosexuals and left loons not quite grasping?

The opinion piece
http://mobile.nytimes.com/2015/04/05/opinion/sunday/frank-bruni-same-sex-sinners.html?rref=collection/column/frank-bruni&_r=0&referrer=

So where in that piece does he advocate the government mandate religious beliefs?

You know that's what he, and others like him want. Right?