Charlie Wilson (D) Texas Dies

[xotoxi]

Sure you do, you think Charlie himself would take all the credit for the achievements of others who did as much? I doubt that every much. So with the lack of respect that you personally deserve, go fuck yourself too.

And, no, your kid isn't all that. He's as cute as any other kid. Nothing special to anyone but his family. Live with it. You produced a human being... whoooopy fucking do.

Menstruating, I take it?

 

[Vast LWC]

That's a big frigging exception. I know most people aren't that versed in what is going on in Afghanistan, but he's considered among the top five HVTs. Even if he wasn't a player today, his actions after the Soviets withdrew, which completely destabilized Afghanistan and allowed the Taliban to take control were enough to make an honest observer realize that our policy in Afghanistan was short sighted.

Hell, even in the book, the gringos that were interviewed recount about how much Hekmatyar creeped them out.

BTW, (the significance of this was missed in the movie but not the book), Wilson got into Afghanistan because of a Houston socialite that was successfully duped by a Pakistani dictator. She led Wilson around by the nose.

Yes, you heard that right, our involvement in Afghanistan was initiated by a Houston socialite.

Like I said, it's a good lesson in a single person gaining too much power.

Well, that is always the way with the law of unintended consequences, isn't it? Well, he couldn't have known that would happen 20 years later.

But the socialite in question was in the movie, that was the part Julia Roberts played.

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

Yeah.. I went to Vietnam, and I was injured catching a mortar shell in my teeth. And they made me a three-star general! And then I got a job in journalism, writing for the National Enquire.. er, Geographic! Yeah.. I was making twenty thousand a ye.. month! In fact, I won the Pulitzer Prize that year! Yeah, that's the ticket.

Did you prove urine?

 

[geauxtohell]

Well, that is always the way with the law of unintended consequences, isn't it? Well, he couldn't have known that would happen 20 years later.

It didn't take 20 years. It was immediate. We just didn't pay attention to it until 20 years later.

Ironically, French Intelligence had it all figured out. They, and the Brits, were supporting Massoud.

But the socialite in question was in the movie, that was the part Julia Roberts played.

I am aware of that. You saw the Hollywood version of it. You'd have to read the book to see how a niave socialite from Texas was manipulated by a Pakistani dictator to wield undue influence on United States policy to do Pakistan's dirty work for them.

 

[Cold Fusion38]

WTF is WRONG with you people on the "Right"? I don't see people GLEEFULLY celebrating the death of Republican legislators the way those on the Right always seem to celebrate the deaths of those on the Left. Fing DISGUSTING!!!

 

[JakeStarkey]

The man who actually was responsible for winning the Cold War died today.

RIP Charlie.

Now I suppose all kinds of right-wingers are going to insult him because he was a liberal Democrat. Sigh.

Charlie Wilson was my friend. His second wife is saint. She made a great influence on his life. Thousands of East Texans were blessed to have him as a congressman. He was a conservative Blue Dog, and none of the Texas congressmen I know personally or by reputation match him or his service to our country.

RIP.

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/2c247aaa-16a2-11df-aa09-00144feab49a.html

 

[Coyote]

Wilson's contribution to bringing about the fall of the USSR should not be dismissed out of hand. While I do not agree that he is "responsible for winning the Cold War," he certainly lit one of many fuses.

A true American, faults and all. May he rest in peace.

^^^^ What he said. Typical progressives to provoke an argument by claiming their guy walked on water. Charlie was a good American. Pity he is dishonored by those who pretend to salute him.

Show me an American that does not have faults and I'll show you someone I don't trust.

...and I hear many "typical" conservatives claim Reagan walked on water....sigh

But in this thread, the "dishonor" is not coming from the left. Come on Cali, admit that this time certain conservatives are acting like asses about Charlie Wilson (or...should that be elephants?).

 

[RadiomanATL]

Charlie, your war is now officially over. RIP.

And I apologize that your passing has been used in the OP an as excuse to troll the opposition in order to score fictional points on a message board.

You were a great man, with great faults (but those faults sure did sound like fun!). You were one of the key players in the West winning over the USSR. I'm sure you will be missed by many.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

The guy on the right had a great line when asked about who is fighting the Soviets in Afghanistan: 'Me and two other guys'

Good thing that in reality one of the "other guys" was Ronald Reagan

You obviously didn't read the book.

Gust Avrakotos was referring to his collegues. His Afghanistan desk was majorly understaffed, but one of them was an ex SF guy who was a brilliant tactician.

You'll note I said "in reality"

 

[geauxtohell]

Good thing that in reality one of the "other guys" was Ronald Reagan

You obviously didn't read the book.

Gust Avrakotos was referring to his collegues. His Afghanistan desk was majorly understaffed, but one of them was an ex SF guy who was a brilliant tactician.

You'll note I said "in reality"

"In reality" Avrakotos wasn't talking about Reagan, who was president when only three CIA men were on the Afghanistan desk.

That kind of suggests that Reagan was a little oblivious to the situation.

 

[Vast LWC]

Charlie Wilson was my friend. His second wife is saint. She made a great influence on his life. Thousands of East Texans were blessed to have him as a congressman. He was a conservative Blue Dog, and none of the Texas congressmen I know personally or by reputation match him or his service to our country.

RIP.

FT.com / Comment / Obituaries - Hero of ?Charlie Wilson?s War? dies, aged 76

From your link:

Re-elected 12 times on the slogan, “Wilson Gets it Done”, he was the type of Democrat the party rarely, if ever, produces any longer. A hawkish, cold war warrior, Wilson was also strongly progressive on social issues. Nowadays, the few Democrats who get elected to Washington from the southern states are usually social conservatives.

Not really conservative except for his cold war stance and methods...

But nice post, nonetheless.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

You obviously didn't read the book.

Gust Avrakotos was referring to his collegues. His Afghanistan desk was majorly understaffed, but one of them was an ex SF guy who was a brilliant tactician.

You'll note I said "in reality"

"In reality" Avrakotos wasn't talking about Reagan, who was president when only three CIA men were on the Afghanistan desk.

That kind of suggests that Reagan was a little oblivious to the situation.

The Central theme of the entire Reagan foreign policy was to push back at the USSR on every front and in every hemisphere. So the very idea that Wilson trumped Reagan in pushing the USSR out of Afghanistan is laughable.

Moreover, it makes total liars out of the Libs who claim: a. Gorby won the Cold War and b. Reagan armed Al Qaeda.

You can't have three totally different stories: Pick a fucking story and stick to it.

Charlie Wilson: the last Democrat who actually rooted for the USA to win a military victory. He will be sorely missed.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Charlie, your war is now officially over. RIP.

And I apologize that your passing has been used in the OP an as excuse to troll the opposition in order to score fictional points on a message board.

You were a great man, with great faults (but those faults sure did sound like fun!). You were one of the key players in the West winning over the USSR. I'm sure you will be missed by many.

Charlie was socially liberal while conservative in other areas. He had a reputation of having the most beautiful staffers on the entire hill in his office. He made some important personal changes later in his life. Those who fail to understand his signficance simply aren't worth any response.

 

[Vast LWC]

The Central theme of the entire Reagan foreign policy was to push back at the USSR on every front and in every hemisphere. So the very idea that Wilson trumped Reagan in pushing the USSR out of Afghanistan is laughable.

So then, specifically, what would you say were the exact "fronts in every hemisphere" that Reagan was "pushing back" against the Russians in were, besides Afghanistan?

Moreover, it makes total liars out of the Libs who claim: a. Gorby won the Cold War and b. Reagan armed Al Qaeda.

I ever claimed that Reagan armed Al Qaeda. If anything Charlie Wilson inadvertently armed a few Al Qaeda members, but I don't really blame him for that, he couldn't have known.

You can't have three totally different stories: Pick a fucking story and stick to it.

Charlie Wilson: the last Democrat who actually rooted for the USA to win a military victory. He will be sorely missed.

I only have one story, and I always "root for the USA", so much so that I volunteered to join the military when I was 19, rather than just being a cheerleader for the Republican party, like you Frank.

 

[geauxtohell]

You'll note I said "in reality"

"In reality" Avrakotos wasn't talking about Reagan, who was president when only three CIA men were on the Afghanistan desk.

That kind of suggests that Reagan was a little oblivious to the situation.

The Central theme of the entire Reagan foreign policy was to push back at the USSR on every front and in every hemisphere. So the very idea that Wilson trumped Reagan in pushing the USSR out of Afghanistan is laughable.

Moreover, it makes total liars out of the Libs who claim: a. Gorby won the Cold War and b. Reagan armed Al Qaeda.

You can't have three totally different stories: Pick a fucking story and stick to it.

Charlie Wilson: the last Democrat who actually rooted for the USA to win a military victory. He will be sorely missed.

Most of the literature that covers the period disagrees with your assessment. Reagan was obsessed with Star Wars. He was paying little attention to Afghanistan. You are more than welcome to read "Charlie Wilson's War" or "Ghost Wars" and tell why you disagree.

At any rate, I've never said a.) or b.). So your point is moot.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

The Central theme of the entire Reagan foreign policy was to push back at the USSR on every front and in every hemisphere. So the very idea that Wilson trumped Reagan in pushing the USSR out of Afghanistan is laughable.

So then, specifically, what would you say were the exact "fronts in every hemisphere" that Reagan was "pushing back" against the Russians in were, besides Afghanistan?

Moreover, it makes total liars out of the Libs who claim: a. Gorby won the Cold War and b. Reagan armed Al Qaeda.

I ever claimed that Reagan armed Al Qaeda. If anything Charlie Wilson inadvertently armed a few Al Qaeda members, but I don't really blame him for that, he couldn't have known.

You can't have three totally different stories: Pick a fucking story and stick to it.

Charlie Wilson: the last Democrat who actually rooted for the USA to win a military victory. He will be sorely missed.

I only have one story, and I always "root for the USA", so much so that I volunteered to join the military when I was 19, rather than just being a cheerleader for the Republican party, like you Frank.

Eastern Europe, Asia and Central America were the major front. Committing to a 600 ship Navy mean that there was no place on the planet we weren't going to vigorously contest

Thank you for your service

 

[CrusaderFrank]

"In reality" Avrakotos wasn't talking about Reagan, who was president when only three CIA men were on the Afghanistan desk.

That kind of suggests that Reagan was a little oblivious to the situation.

The Central theme of the entire Reagan foreign policy was to push back at the USSR on every front and in every hemisphere. So the very idea that Wilson trumped Reagan in pushing the USSR out of Afghanistan is laughable.

Moreover, it makes total liars out of the Libs who claim: a. Gorby won the Cold War and b. Reagan armed Al Qaeda.

You can't have three totally different stories: Pick a fucking story and stick to it.

Charlie Wilson: the last Democrat who actually rooted for the USA to win a military victory. He will be sorely missed.

Most of the literature that covers the period disagrees with your assessment. Reagan was obsessed with Star Wars. He was paying little attention to Afghanistan. You are more than welcome to read "Charlie Wilson's War" or "Ghost Wars" and tell why you disagree.

At any rate, I've never said a.) or b.). So your point is moot.

Idiot.

 

[geauxtohell]

Idiot.

Wow, Frank. You really had to strain your brain for that response, didn't you?

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Idiot.

Wow, Frank. You really had to strain your brain for that response, didn't you?

My last post had Reagan pushing back the Soviets across the planet and you come up with the idiotic "Reagan was obsessed with Star Wars"

What did you want me to say, "gee, I hadn't thought of that, Freddo!"

 

[geauxtohell]

Idiot.

Wow, Frank. You really had to strain your brain for that response, didn't you?

My last post had Reagan pushing back the Soviets across the planet and you come up with the idiotic "Reagan was obsessed with Star Wars"

What did you want me to say, "gee, I hadn't thought of that, Freddo!"

Reagan didn't push the Soviets "back across the planet" and he was basically unplugged from the Afghanistan operation, if the book is to be believed.