Ban or Censor Video Games, Not Guns?

[beagle9]

Yes, more prayer would reduce mass murders. If only one of the Newtown victims had believed in God or prayed for help.

You know with statements like this, it's so wonder you get any respect in these forums at all.. I mean do you think that people are this dumb that you would actually take time to write such a thing as this ?

 

[AmyNation]

I'm sorry that the facts don't fit your argument

 

[beagle9]

"Stuff" is not getting worse and worse. That is your personal perception and has been repeatedly shown to be faulty in this thread.

2 more shootings today, but everything is just hunky dory for you eh ?

Hey if you want to live with your head in the sand then so be it, but don't try and lead others to believe that this nation isn't worse now than it was during many peoples life times as they knew them in their past. This school shooting involving these young children was as heinous as it gets, but here we are poised to water it all down in respects to protecting certain cultures and their freedom to corrupt freely, and to kill freely in America. You want to be a part of that ?

 

[Foxfyre]

The video games don't inspire the violence, the violence is already in the individual.

No, but the video games are a tool that can be easily used in the process of needing to brush up on getting the feel of the real experience or coming close to it, so people are defending these games in any form that they are in, and that is disturbing.

Content is the key to change of mindset, but if we are not ready to change what we take into our minds these days, then get ready for this stuff to keep getting worse and worse.

Many of those studies say that the content and concept can drill into the game player a definition of power, prestige, importance based on success using violence, all concepts reinforced by Catz' Slate article if you look at it from that perspective.

In Mario Brothers, for instance, the object isn't to kill or destroy things, though that could sometimes be necessary, but the object is to solve the puzzle and get Mario from Point A to Point B. It becomes progressively more difficult to do that, but the one who solves the puzzle does so through creativity and innovation and figuring out how to solve the problems presented. In my opinion, that is a healthy game that reinforces positive concepts of problem solving and success.

Contrast that to a game in which almost the whole concept is to destroy things and people in order to succeed. If you couple that with showing the most violent types on television and in the movies as heroes and the more violent, the more successful and admirable they are, I can see how that might translate thoughts into a young mind that wasn't quite stable. And how he might see himself elevated to hero status, admired by the world through mass violence.

 

[AmyNation]

Nationally, when it comes to violence, things are the best they've been in 25 years. Murder is down, rape is down, larceny is down, auto theft is down, mass murder is not on the rise.

There are at least 2 dozen links in this thread that attest to this.

 

[beagle9]

Facebook has been responsible for more deaths than video games.

I just heard something about Facebook is trying to make it where one can find out more information on their friends.......HUH? What is this all about ? More loss of privacy for people, more stalking, more rapes, murders and etc. ? This nation has lost it's sanity is what it has done (imho).

 

[Foxfyre]

Nationally, when it comes to violence, things are the best they've been in 25 years. Murder is down, rape is down, larceny is down, auto theft is down, mass murder is not on the rise.

There are at least 2 dozen links in this thread that attest to this.

And there are just as many references to expert opinions who say that the motiveless mass murders as we saw at Columbine, Aurora, Sandy Hook, as examples, are on the rise whether or not all other forms of crime are decreasing.

Do you have any objection of exploring such a concept for accuracy? Or do you think others should not discuss or research it because your mind is already made up?

 

[Big Black Dog]

When I was a kid we played cops and robbers, cowboys and indians and things such as that. We had our cap pistols, toy rifles and all sorts of garb like that. We played Army and had fake plastic hand grenades and toy mines. We had a great time playing those kind of things and just about every boy in the neighborhood played those kind of things. I don't know of anybody that I used to play with growing up that turned out to be a mass murderer or that has even shot somebody outside of being a member of the military. I think video games played by mentally healthy kids and young adults are ok. I guess the point I am trying to make is this kind of activity, i.e., war games, cowboy and indians, cops and robbers and even violent video games to me doesn't seem like a problem. I think the problem is two fold. There are mentally unstable people in the world, that no matter what you do short of locking them up, will eventually hurt somebody or themselves. There are also some very evil people in the world that have no problem except for being mean by nature and sometimes they hurt just to cause the pain. I think our efforts should be geared more to mental health screenings, closely monitoring those with a diagnosis of mental illness, and prevention measures to ensure these types of people do not cause harm. There are more than enough gun laws in the country to ensure that only those authorized to buy a gun can obtain one. We also need to very heavily punish those that commit crimes using a gun.

 

[AmyNation]

There is a difference between facts, and opinions. Whether mass murder is on the rise or not, is either true, or false. There is no grey area in that. Every link I've seen that uses actual data, attests to the fact that it is not on the rise.

Suggesting it is "debatable" is dishonest of you, and shows a disregard for facts that don't fit the "discussion" you want to have.

 

[beagle9]

The video games don't inspire the violence, the violence is already in the individual.

No, but the video games are a tool that can be easily used in the process of needing to brush up on getting the feel of the real experience or coming close to it, so people are defending these games in any form that they are in, and that is disturbing.

Content is the key to change of mindset, but if we are not ready to change what we take into our minds these days, then get ready for this stuff to keep getting worse and worse.

Many of those studies say that the content and concept can drill into the game player a definition of power, prestige, importance based on success using violence, all concepts reinforced by Catz' Slate article if you look at it from that perspective.

In Mario Brothers, for instance, the object isn't to kill or destroy things, though that could sometimes be necessary, but the object is to solve the puzzle and get Mario from Point A to Point B. It becomes progressively more difficult to do that, but the one who solves the puzzle does so through creativity and innovation and figuring out how to solve the problems presented. In my opinion, that is a healthy game that reinforces positive concepts of problem solving and success.

Contrast that to a game in which almost the whole concept is to destroy things and people in order to succeed. If you couple that with showing the most violent types on television and in the movies as heroes and the more violent, the more successful and admirable they are, I can see how that might translate thoughts into a young mind that wasn't quite stable. And how he might see himself elevated to hero status, admired by the world through mass violence.

Think about why MTV the network, along with the show 's "ridiculousness" and "jack-a-s-s" had to always put the disclaimer for the viewers, to not send any video's of themselves as viewers doing this stuff, or them even doing it themselves because of the viewing of these shows. Undoubtedly MTV and these shows must have figured that they were inspirational to the new mindset found in these young people, so they tried to persuade them not to emulate the show in any way shape or form.

Then we had the incidents with Beavis and Butt Head, where the young one viewing the show burned down the families house, because he saw them making pyro-maniac's or arson seem cool and hip when playing with matches on that show. That was the beginning I think for me becoming aware of the influence upon the youth that were coming up now or back then, in which they were coming up way different than we did back in the old days, and it has been escalating ever since into the wrong directions.

 

[beagle9]

When I was a kid we played cops and robbers, cowboys and indians and things such as that. We had our cap pistols, toy rifles and all sorts of garb like that. We played Army and had fake plastic hand grenades and toy mines. We had a great time playing those kind of things and just about every boy in the neighborhood played those kind of things. I don't know of anybody that I used to play with growing up that turned out to be a mass murderer or that has even shot somebody outside of being a member of the military. I think video games played by mentally healthy kids and young adults are ok. I guess the point I am trying to make is this kind of activity, i.e., war games, cowboy and indians, cops and robbers and even violent video games to me doesn't seem like a problem. I think the problem is two fold. There are mentally unstable people in the world, that no matter what you do short of locking them up, will eventually hurt somebody or themselves. There are also some very evil people in the world that have no problem except for being mean by nature and sometimes they hurt just to cause the pain. I think our efforts should be geared more to mental health screenings, closely monitoring those with a diagnosis of mental illness, and prevention measures to ensure these types of people do not cause harm. There are more than enough gun laws in the country to ensure that only those authorized to buy a gun can obtain one. We also need to very heavily punish those that commit crimes using a gun.

If we ignore the mental disintegration brought about by the things in which we know of, and that is found more and more prevalent in this nation's society, then we are complete fools. These things in which are being geared towards those whom would not have had any of these problems to begin with, but yet all due to their exposures in which they are having access to now more and more in society, and far more easier, and at younger and younger ages, especially by what is being found within the content of these things that which are causing such problems, then we are doomed as a people, and as a nation, and so it is really that simple.

 

[catzmeow]

Yes, more prayer would reduce mass murders. If only one of the Newtown victims had believed in God or prayed for help.

You know with statements like this, it's so wonder you get any respect in these forums at all.. I mean do you think that people are this dumb that you would actually take time to write such a thing as this ?

Sarcasm clearly isn't lost on you, Beagle.

 

[catzmeow]

And there are just as many references to expert opinions who say that the motiveless mass murders as we saw at Columbine, Aurora, Sandy Hook, as examples, are on the rise whether or not all other forms of crime are decreasing.

This discussion has been quite enlightening for me. It shows exactly how invested some posters are in confirming their existing biases. It's interesting that you would not even read the multiple sources of information I provided to you that confirm that mass murders are not increasing over time. What is so scary about factual information?

 

[catzmeow]

No, but the video games are a tool that can be easily used in the process of needing to brush up on getting the feel of the real experience or coming close to it, so people are defending these games in any form that they are in, and that is disturbing.

Content is the key to change of mindset, but if we are not ready to change what we take into our minds these days, then get ready for this stuff to keep getting worse and worse.

Many of those studies say that the content and concept can drill into the game player a definition of power, prestige, importance based on success using violence, all concepts reinforced by Catz' Slate article if you look at it from that perspective.

In Mario Brothers, for instance, the object isn't to kill or destroy things, though that could sometimes be necessary, but the object is to solve the puzzle and get Mario from Point A to Point B. It becomes progressively more difficult to do that, but the one who solves the puzzle does so through creativity and innovation and figuring out how to solve the problems presented. In my opinion, that is a healthy game that reinforces positive concepts of problem solving and success.

Contrast that to a game in which almost the whole concept is to destroy things and people in order to succeed. If you couple that with showing the most violent types on television and in the movies as heroes and the more violent, the more successful and admirable they are, I can see how that might translate thoughts into a young mind that wasn't quite stable. And how he might see himself elevated to hero status, admired by the world through mass violence.

Think about why MTV the network, along with the show 's "ridiculousness" and "jack-a-s-s" had to always put the disclaimer for the viewers, to not send any video's of themselves as viewers doing this stuff, or them even doing it themselves because of the viewing of these shows. Undoubtedly MTV and these shows must have figured that they were inspirational to the new mindset found in these young people, so they tried to persuade them not to emulate the show in any way shape or form.

Then we had the incidents with Beavis and Butt Head, where the young one viewing the show burned down the families house, because he saw them making pyro-maniac's or arson seem cool and hip when playing with matches on that show. That was the beginning I think for me becoming aware of the influence upon the youth that were coming up now or back then, in which they were coming up way different than we did back in the old days, and it has been escalating ever since into the wrong directions.

And in spite of all of those atrocities, violent crime is still down by a significant margin in America.

It must suck when the sky doesn't fall in order to confirm your beliefs.

 

[catzmeow]

I think foxfyre has finally found the "debate" she was looking for.

 

[Foxfyre]

When I was a kid we played cops and robbers, cowboys and indians and things such as that. We had our cap pistols, toy rifles and all sorts of garb like that. We played Army and had fake plastic hand grenades and toy mines. We had a great time playing those kind of things and just about every boy in the neighborhood played those kind of things. I don't know of anybody that I used to play with growing up that turned out to be a mass murderer or that has even shot somebody outside of being a member of the military. I think video games played by mentally healthy kids and young adults are ok. I guess the point I am trying to make is this kind of activity, i.e., war games, cowboy and indians, cops and robbers and even violent video games to me doesn't seem like a problem. I think the problem is two fold. There are mentally unstable people in the world, that no matter what you do short of locking them up, will eventually hurt somebody or themselves. There are also some very evil people in the world that have no problem except for being mean by nature and sometimes they hurt just to cause the pain. I think our efforts should be geared more to mental health screenings, closely monitoring those with a diagnosis of mental illness, and prevention measures to ensure these types of people do not cause harm. There are more than enough gun laws in the country to ensure that only those authorized to buy a gun can obtain one. We also need to very heavily punish those that commit crimes using a gun.

I agree that I also played all those games. Some of us were designated the Cowboys and some of us were the robbers, etc. and we didn't much care whether we got shot. It was as much fun to get shot and perform a dramatic death scene as it was to be the Sheriff who shot the bad guys. But there was no end goal in those games. The joy was just in doing it and when we got tired or Mom called us in for supper, the game ended. There was a very strong sense of who were the good guys and who were the bad guys in the movies and on television back then. The fun in the games was in playing the games and our success or winning was not determined over and over and over and over again by how many others we were able to kill until we were the last one standing.

I think for most people, probably even kids, it isn't much different playing the video games. But if as some of those studies suggest, spending much time with the more violent games are altering the ways kids' brains work and/or changing their personalities and not in a good way, then parents really need to know that.

 

[Foxfyre]

Pssst. Clue to Catz. Foxfyre was not looking for any kind of debate here.

 

[catzmeow]

I think you should keep repeating the same post multiple times since that's clearly very satisfying for you, Foxy.

 

[beagle9]

Nationally, when it comes to violence, things are the best they've been in 25 years. Murder is down, rape is down, larceny is down, auto theft is down, mass murder is not on the rise.

There are at least 2 dozen links in this thread that attest to this.

And there are just as many references to expert opinions who say that the motiveless mass murders as we saw at Columbine, Aurora, Sandy Hook, as examples, are on the rise whether or not all other forms of crime are decreasing.

Do you have any objection of exploring such a concept for accuracy? Or do you think others should not discuss or research it because your mind is already made up?

It' simply a game of cover up the trail is all that we see in all of this stuff, and then to blame objects instead of people and their cultural ways in which they have created these days.

 

[catzmeow]

Pssst. Clue to Catz. Foxfyre was not looking for any kind of debate here.

Then why post in the clean debate zone? I understand the coffee shop is nice if you're just looking for confirmation of your biases.

Also, interesting, in light of this post earlier in the thread:

Good advice. However I am already spoiled having encountered on line friends who actually do have a clue, who can articulate an intelligent opinion, and who enjoy actually exploring a subject and testing to see whether their point of view can hold up against those who argue against it. And I really appreciate them. And sometimes get impatient with those who don't share my enthusiasm for that sort of thing. Which is my bad, I know.

You really want no such thing, and you've demonstrated that quite clearly. You want people to agree with you that these games are JUST TERRIBLE and THEY ARE RUINING OUR KIDS and ISN'T IT A SHAME THAT PARENTS DON'T PARENT LIKE THEY USED TO and surely SUCH DESPICABLE AND VIOLENT GAMES ARE THE REASON THAT THE KIDS THESE DAYS ARE SO DISTURBED AND DANGEROUS and isn't it JUST TERRIBLE THAT OUR COUNTRY IS GOING TO HELL IN A HANDBASKET.

It's funny that you say that you want testing to see if your point of view can hold up. You want affirmation of your ingrained prejudices, nothing more.

But, thanks for demonstrating all of this so clearly in this thread. It's been entertaining. I've enjoyed it--immensely.