America is already a "Sharia Compliant State"

[Sunni Man]

By far the vast majority of Muslims believe that the Quran should be read and taken literally because it is a divine revelation from Allah. So going by that, I would venture to say that 99% of all Muslims are what the West would consider fundamentalist. And yes, I am definitely included in that group.l.

Thank you for that useful post. What were you saying again about "moderates"?

So sunni man - what about "Al Wala' Wal Bara'"?

Being a fundamentalist Muslim and a moderate Muslim are not diametrically opposed.

Just as there are many Christians who are fundamentalist in their belief.

But moderate in their personal lives and within their community.


Also, Orthodox Jews would be considered extremely fundamentalist.

Yet we have congressmen and senators who are Orthodox Jews but are considered political moderates.


Personally, I am a fundamentalist when it comes to Islam, but would consider myself a moderate Muslim.

As I abide by all of the laws of the land, and participate in our democratic process.


As for the term “Al Wala' Wal Bara”,

I do not subscribe to that particular belief and find it to be unIslamic and not based on the true intent of the Quran.

 

[alexa]

Sharia Law endows all men with Allah-given right to beat and abuse their wives. This will NEVER happen in the Great USA. We are far too open and free to comply with the vile dictates of Sharia Law. Also, Americans are far too intelligent to be fooled by pathetic Muslim Apologists who try to "White Wash" the oppressive nature of Sharia Law. America will ALWAYS say NO to Sharia. GO USA!

Well it wouldn't in the UK. Jews have had their own courts here for over a hundred years and where Muslims choose to go by Sharia Law concerning family matters it is still subservient to British Law.

Allowed to beat up your wife because you are a Muslim in the UK, of course not. That is against British Law.

BBC NEWS | UK | Religious courts already in use

 

[Sunni Man]

So are you a Salafi? which I guess is loosely what I would call a Fundamental Muslim.

Madhhab is an Islamic term that refers to a school of thought or religious jurisprudence, or fiqh, within Sunni Islam. The differences between these schools of thought manifest in minor practical differences, as most Sunni Muslims consider them all fundamentally the same. Sunnis generally do not identify themselves with a particular school of thought — simply calling themselves "Sunnis".



Hanafi

The Hanafi school was founded by Imam Abu Hanifa an-Nu‘man; it is the largest school of thought followed by most Muslims around the world. It is predominant among Sunni Muslims in Central Asia, Afghanistan, Pakistan, India, Bangladesh, northern Egypt, Iraq, Turkey, Balkans and in many western countries.

Shafi`i

Shafi`i was founded by Imam Muhammad ibn Idris ash-Shafi`i, is the second largest school of thought in terms of followers. It is practiced throughout the Muslim world, but is most prevalent in Egypt, Somalia, Indonesia, Thailand, Singapore, Philippines, Yemen, among Kurds, Kerala (Mappilas) and is officially followed by the governments of Brunei and Malaysia.

Maliki

The Maliki school derives from the work of Imam Malik ibn Anas. It is practiced in North and West Africa. It is the third-largest of the four schools.

Hanbali

Hanbali is considered to be the most conservative of the four schools and the one that relies on Hadith the most. Hanbalis reject the use of philosophical argument[vague] in matters of religious belief.[citation needed] The school was started by the students of Imam Ahmad. Hanbali jurisprudence is predominant among Muslims in Saudi Arabia.

Islamic schools and branches - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[alexa]

So are you a Salafi? which I guess is loosely what I would call a Fundamental Muslim.

Madhhab is an Islamic term that refers to a school of thought or religious jurisprudence, or fiqh, within Sunni Islam. The differences between these schools of thought manifest in minor practical differences, as most Sunni Muslims consider them all fundamentally the same. Sunnis generally do not identify themselves with a particular school of thought — simply calling themselves "Sunnis".



Hanafi

The Hanafi school was founded by Imam Abu Hanifa an-Nu‘man; it is the largest school of thought followed by most Muslims around the world. It is predominant among Sunni Muslims in Central Asia, Afghanistan, Pakistan, India, Bangladesh, northern Egypt, Iraq, Turkey, Balkans and in many western countries.

Shafi`i

Shafi`i was founded by Imam Muhammad ibn Idris ash-Shafi`i, is the second largest school of thought in terms of followers. It is practiced throughout the Muslim world, but is most prevalent in Egypt, Somalia, Indonesia, Thailand, Singapore, Philippines, Yemen, among Kurds, Kerala (Mappilas) and is officially followed by the governments of Brunei and Malaysia.

Maliki

The Maliki school derives from the work of Imam Malik ibn Anas. It is practiced in North and West Africa. It is the third-largest of the four schools.

Hanbali

Hanbali is considered to be the most conservative of the four schools and the one that relies on Hadith the most. Hanbalis reject the use of philosophical argument[vague] in matters of religious belief.[citation needed] The school was started by the students of Imam Ahmad. Hanbali jurisprudence is predominant among Muslims in Saudi Arabia.

Islamic schools and branches - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Thank you Sunni. Obviously the situation in the states will be different to here. The majority of our Muslims came from a basically Sufi tradition. They used to learn the Koran in a language they did not understand and were not getting much from ....until the Saudi's arrived with Salifism. This can certainly cause problems. Then of course we had extremist preachers coming just to pick people up.

UK and US Muslims come from different backgrounds - or certainly used to.

Given that there is such a large divergence within Islam, how can you imagine every Muslim would think or respond the same?

You didn't answer my other questions.

 

[Divine Wind]

Not quite sure what you mean by Radical Muslim theocracies?

Far as I know none exist today.

In fact I do not believe there is such a thing.

The Taliban and the Iranian government. There are some two-bit nations in Africa which go the same way, but they are only a threat to their own people, not their neighbors.

 

[Sunni Man]

Alexas, I do better when people asked me questions one at a time rather than a group of multiple questions.

Overwhelmingly, the mosque's in America are Sunni mosque's. That is because historically the seed money to finance the building of a mosque many times came from Saudi Arabia. But the Saudi's took a very hands-off approach when it came to organizing our directing the direction and everyday activities of the mosque.

The Saudis practice a form of Islam called "Wahhabism" or sometimes called "Salafism". It is a combination of all 4 Sunni schools of thought.

So most mosque's in the United States have a strain of Salafi woven into their literature and teaching.

Thus, the vast majority of American mosque's are very conservative in outlook and religious practice.

Which suits me just fine.

 

[Sunni Man]

Not quite sure what you mean by Radical Muslim theocracies?

Far as I know none exist today.

In fact I do not believe there is such a thing.

The Taliban and the Iranian government. There are some two-bit nations in Africa which go the same way, but they are only a threat to their own people, not their neighbors.

The Taliban are currently out of power and do not rule Afghanistan.

Also, Iran is a democracy with a Parliament and is only considered radical by the West

 

[daveman]

Seems like conservatives and Muslims should get along just fine.

Funny, then, innit, how it's conservatives who oppose radical Islam and leftists who are kissing their ass?

I have never met anyone who does not oppose Radical Islam. It is not an issue of left or right.

You don't get out much, do you?

 

[Divine Wind]

The Taliban are currently out of power and do not rule Afghanistan.

Yes, thank God for the United States military in taking them down too, right?

Also, Iran is a democracy with a Parliament and is only considered radical by the West

Maybe the West wouldn't consider them radical if they'd quit funding terrorist organizations like Hezbollah, Hamas and Muqtada al-Sadr's Shi'as in Iraq.

 

[alexa]

Funny, then, innit, how it's conservatives who oppose radical Islam and leftists who are kissing their ass?

I have never met anyone who does not oppose Radical Islam. It is not an issue of left or right.

You don't get out much, do you?

Really, tell me where you meet all these people who support radical Islam and Al Qaeda as you seem to know so many.

 

[chanel]

Not quite sure what you mean by Radical Muslim theocracies?

Far as I know none exist today.

In fact I do not believe there is such a thing.

The Taliban and the Iranian government. There are some two-bit nations in Africa which go the same way, but they are only a threat to their own people, not their neighbors.

The Taliban are currently out of power and do not rule Afghanistan.

Also, Iran is a democracy with a Parliament and is only considered radical by the West

Iranian women might disagree.

Despite the gains they have made, women still face extraordinary obstacles. Girls can legally be forced into marriage at the age of 13. Men have the right to divorce their wives whenever they wish, and are granted custody of any children over the age of 7. Men can ban their wives from working outside the home, and can engage in polygamy.

By law, women may inherit from their parents only half the shares of their brothers. Their court testimony is worth half that of a man. Although the state has taken steps to discourage stoning, it remains in the penal code as the punishment for women who commit adultery. A woman who refuses to cover her hair faces jail and up to 80 lashes.

Women also face fierce resistance when they organize to change the law.

Starting at Home, Iran’s Women Fight for Rights - NYTimes.com

Yes - we crazy Westerners think that stoning may be radical, as well.

 

[alexa]

Alexas, I do better when people asked me questions one at a time rather than a group of multiple questions.

Well the issues I brought up were in response to what you said. I believe they are valid.

 

[Sunni Man]

What you posted does not change the fact that Iran is a democracy with an elected parliament.


The only point that I disagree with in your list of grievances against Iranian sharia law.

Is girls being forced to marry.

Islamicly, a girl should be able to say yes or no to a man who wants to marry her.

Everything else I wholeheartedly agree with.

 

[Sunni Man]

Alexas, I do better when people asked me questions one at a time rather than a group of multiple questions.

Well the issues I brought up were in response to what you said. I believe they are valid.

I am not saying that the questions were not valid.

In fact they were all very good questions.

I was just asking you to present one question at a time.

Thanks

 

[chanel]

What you posted does not change the fact that Iran is a democracy with an elected parliament.


The only point that I disagree with in your list of grievances against Iranian sharia law.

Is girls being forced to marry.

Islamicly, a girl should be able to say yes or no to a man who wants to marry her.

Everything else I wholeheartedly agree with.

Thank you for that useful post.

 

[Sunni Man]

What you posted does not change the fact that Iran is a democracy with an elected parliament.


The only point that I disagree with in your list of grievances against Iranian sharia law.

Is girls being forced to marry.

Islamicly, a girl should be able to say yes or no to a man who wants to marry her.

Everything else I wholeheartedly agree with.

Thank you for that useful post.

Why do you refer to it as "useful" ??

 

[chanel]

USMB-speak:

The Following User Says Thank You to alexa For This Useful Post:

 

[Divine Wind]

What you posted does not change the fact that Iran is a democracy with an elected parliament.

Iran is no more a free democracy than the Soviet Union was.

I take it you sided with the government during all of those riots over the "election" a couple years ago. Is this correct?

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I0MkATcn04M&skipcontrinter=1]‪Iran election. Riot in tehran streets after election day - 13/06/09‬‏ - YouTube[/ame]

 

[daveman]

I have never met anyone who does not oppose Radical Islam. It is not an issue of left or right.

You don't get out much, do you?

Really, tell me where you meet all these people who support radical Islam and Al Qaeda as you seem to know so many.

"In a situation like this, of course you identify with everyone who's suffering. [But we must also think about] the terrorists who are creating such horrible future lives for themselves because of the negativity of this karma. It's all of our jobs to keep our minds as expansive as possible. If you can see [the terrorists] as a relative who's dangerously sick and we have to give them medicine, and the medicine is love and compassion. There's nothing better." -- Richard Gere

"I don't know how you wage war against one person; it doesn't make sense. I can imagine a commando-type raid to capture Bin Laden, then a trial, with evidence, before the world court. But that would not address the vast global inequalities in which terrorism is ultimately rooted. What is so heartbreaking to me as a feminist is that the strongest response to corporate globalization and U.S. military domination is based on such a violent and misogynist ideology." -- Barbara Ehrenreich, The Village Voice, October 9, 2001

"They have struck us, and in their strike announced: We'd rather die—and take you with us—than go on living in the world you have forced us to occupy. Force will get us nowhere. It is reparations that are owing, not retribution." -- Vivian Gornick, The Village Voice, October 9, 2001

"Melt their weapons, melt their hearts, melt their anger with love." -- Shirley MacLaine on her anti-terrorism policy

"In a war on Afghanistan, Osama bin Laden will either be left alive, while thousands of impoverished, frightened people are bombed into oblivion around him, or he will be killed in a bombing attack for which he seems quite prepared. But what would happen to his cool armor if he could be reminded of all the good, nonviolent things he has done? Further, what would happen to him if he could be brought to understand the preciousness of the lives he has destroyed? I firmly believe the only punishment that works is love." -- Alice Walker, The Village Voice Who's The Real Enemy Here?

"America, America. What did you do--either intentionally or unintentionally--in the world order, in Central America, in Africa where bombs are still blasting? America, what did you do in the global warming conference when you did not embrace the smaller nations? America, what did you do two weeks ago when I stood at the world conference on racism, when you wouldn't show up? Oh, America, what did you do?" -- Former San Francisco Supervisor Amos Brown on September 17.

"We have been the cowards, lobbing cruise missiles from 2,000 miles away. That's cowardly. Staying in the airplane when it hits the building, say what you want about it, it's not cowardly." -- Bill Maher, Politically Incorrect

"The WTC was not just an architectural monstrosity, but also terrible for people who didn't work there, for it said to all those people: 'If you can't work up here, boy, you're out of it.' That's why I'm sure that if those towers had been destroyed without loss of life, a lot of people would have cheered. Everything wrong with America led to the point where the country built that tower of Babel, which consequently had to be destroyed. And then came the next shock. We had to realize that the people that did this were brilliant. It showed that the ego we could hold up until September 10 was inadequate." -- Norman Mailer

"Americans can't admit that you need courage to do such a thing. For that might be misunderstood. The key thing is that we in America are convinced that it was blind, mad fanatics who didn't know what they were doing. But what if those perpetrators were right and we were not? We have long ago lost the capability to take a calm look at the enormity of our enemy's position." -- Norman Mailer on 9/11

"I just think we are a little bit of an arrogant nation and maybe this is a little bit of a humbling experience ... what has our government done to provoke this action that we don't know about?" -- Backstreet Boy Kevin Richardson

"If the word 'cowardly' is to be used, it might be more aptly applied to those who kill from beyond the range of retaliation, high in the sky, than to those willing to die themselves in order to kill others." -- Susan Sontag in New Yorker magazine

Let's get rid of all the economic (expletive) this country represents! Bring it on, I hope the Muslims win! -- Chrissie Hynde of The Pretenders

The President wants to talk about a terrorist named bin Laden. I don’t want to talk about bin Laden. I want to talk about a terrorist called Christopher Columbus. I want to talk about a terrorist called George Washington. I want to talk about a terrorist called Rudy Giuliani. The real terrorists have always been the United Snakes of America. — Malik Zulu Shabazz

As to those in the World Trade Center…Let’s get a grip here, shall we? True enough, they were civilians of a sort. But innocent? Gimme a break. …If there was a better, more effective, or in fact any other way of visiting some penalty befitting their participation upon the little Eichmanns inhabiting the sterile sanctuary of the twin towers, I’d really be interested in hearing about it. — Ward Churchill

 

[daveman]

The Taliban and the Iranian government. There are some two-bit nations in Africa which go the same way, but they are only a threat to their own people, not their neighbors.

The Taliban are currently out of power and do not rule Afghanistan.

Also, Iran is a democracy with a Parliament and is only considered radical by the West

Iranian women might disagree.

Despite the gains they have made, women still face extraordinary obstacles. Girls can legally be forced into marriage at the age of 13. Men have the right to divorce their wives whenever they wish, and are granted custody of any children over the age of 7. Men can ban their wives from working outside the home, and can engage in polygamy.

By law, women may inherit from their parents only half the shares of their brothers. Their court testimony is worth half that of a man. Although the state has taken steps to discourage stoning, it remains in the penal code as the punishment for women who commit adultery. A woman who refuses to cover her hair faces jail and up to 80 lashes.

Women also face fierce resistance when they organize to change the law.

Starting at Home, Iran’s Women Fight for Rights - NYTimes.com

Yes - we crazy Westerners think that stoning may be radical, as well.

Pffft. They're just women. Little more than animals, really.

Right, Sunni?