All The News Anti-Israel Posters Will Not Read Or Discuss

[P F Tinmore]

I suspect both Anti-Israeli Posters and Anti-Palestinian posters will not want to read or discuss this but it’s a really thoughtful, observant and respectful article..very human, worth a read.

A Muslim Among Israeli Settlers
A Muslim Among Israeli Settlers

I posted it before. Thanks for posting it again.
Many Muslims work for Jewish settlers, by the way.

Indeed, it is a subservient position.

 

[Sixties Fan]

I suspect both Anti-Israeli Posters and Anti-Palestinian posters will not want to read or discuss this but it’s a really thoughtful, observant and respectful article..very human, worth a read.

A Muslim Among Israeli Settlers
A Muslim Among Israeli Settlers

I posted it before. Thanks for posting it again.
Many Muslims work for Jewish settlers, by the way.

Indeed, it is a subservient position.

What a beautiful piece of Pallywood. Beautiful, I say.
Well done.
Oscar nominated?

 

[RoccoR]

RE: All The News Anti-Israel Posters Will Not Read Or Discuss
⁜→ Sixties Fan, et al,

Sometimes the obvious is not what it appears to be; especially in the Middle East.

(full article online: What we, Western idiots, will never get about Israel)

(COMMENT)

I agree, the article is well worth the time to read.

While I think that even a nickel spent on anything in Gaza is a perversion towards humanity (direct material support to terrorism), the half-million dollars is not an especially large propaganda expenditure in an effort to spread the word (any word). In the last decade, the Arab Palestinians in the state of unknown whereabouts, have become very effective in the use of political and economic coercion and the propaganda in the arena of legalizing jihadism, insurgent activity, radicalized Islamic murder, supports to Arab Palestinian cause, gaining political support in the targeting of civilian Jews, promotion of guerrilla activities and asymmetric operations against Israel.

Is ‘East Jerusalem’ Palestinian Territory?

(COMMENT)

This is a trick question...

No Arab Nation, including the Arab Higher Committee and the PLO Arab Palestinians, accepted the status of 'corpus separatum' for Jerusalem. It was maintained by the Jordanians from 1948 (becoming sovereign in 1950) until 1967. It became occupied Jordanian territory (oJt) in 1967 and maintained that status up and until October 1988; when it was abandoned (terra nullius) and fell into the hands of the Israelis.

It was never sovereign under Arab Palestinian rule (possessing ultimate political power).

The Arab Palestinians argue that the Jordanian Annexation of 1950 was illegal. That makes no real difference. In order for East Jerusalem to have been occupied Palestinian territory, it had to be (at some time since the termination of the Mandate) Arab Palestinians sovereign (which it never was).

OK, I have my ceramic plates and kevlar on --- fire at will.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[Sixties Fan]

RE: All The News Anti-Israel Posters Will Not Read Or Discuss
⁜→ Sixties Fan, et al,

Sometimes the obvious is not what it appears to be; especially in the Middle East.

(full article online: What we, Western idiots, will never get about Israel)

(COMMENT)

I agree, the article is well worth the time to read.

While I think that even a nickel spent on anything in Gaza is a perversion towards humanity (direct material support to terrorism), the half-million dollars is not an especially large propaganda expenditure in an effort to spread the word (any word). In the last decade, the Arab Palestinians in the state of unknown whereabouts, have become very effective in the use of political and economic coercion and the propaganda in the arena of legalizing jihadism, insurgent activity, radicalized Islamic murder, supports to Arab Palestinian cause, gaining political support in the targeting of civilian Jews, promotion of guerrilla activities and asymmetric operations against Israel.

Is ‘East Jerusalem’ Palestinian Territory?

(COMMENT)

This is a trick question...

No Arab Nation, including the Arab Higher Committee and the PLO Arab Palestinians, accepted the status of 'corpus separatum' for Jerusalem. It was maintained by the Jordanians from 1948 (becoming sovereign in 1950) until 1967. It became occupied Jordanian territory (oJt) in 1967 and maintained that status up and until October 1988; when it was abandoned (terra nullius) and fell into the hands of the Israelis.

It was never sovereign under Arab Palestinian rule (possessing ultimate political power).

The Arab Palestinians argue that the Jordanian Annexation of 1950 was illegal. That makes no real difference. In order for East Jerusalem to have been occupied Palestinian territory, it had to be (at some time since the termination of the Mandate) Arab Palestinians sovereign (which it never was).

OK, I have my ceramic plates and kevlar on --- fire at will.

Most Respectfully,
R

Rocco, I believe that the Jordanians attempted to Annex all they conquered after 1948, but the UN, etc, not sure who besides the British did not agree to it.

After trying to get more land in 1967, Jordan lost that part of Jerusalem they had conquered. It became in the hands of Israel ever since.

In 1988, with the Peace Treaty, Jordan gave up any claims on any and all the territories it had conquered in 1948.

And true, as you say, Arabs never had sovereignty over any of the land, be it during the Ottoman Empire or afterwards.

They want it because the Jews have it.
They want it because they do not allow Jews to have rights.

 

[Billo_Really]

Says the seething arch troll himself.

Can't you control your hatred?

I asked you a question, are you going to answer it?

Only trolls don't answer questions.

 

[Coyote]

RE: All The News Anti-Israel Posters Will Not Read Or Discuss
⁜→ Sixties Fan, et al,

Sometimes the obvious is not what it appears to be; especially in the Middle East.

(full article online: What we, Western idiots, will never get about Israel)

(COMMENT)

I agree, the article is well worth the time to read.

While I think that even a nickel spent on anything in Gaza is a perversion towards humanity (direct material support to terrorism), the half-million dollars is not an especially large propaganda expenditure in an effort to spread the word (any word). In the last decade, the Arab Palestinians in the state of unknown whereabouts, have become very effective in the use of political and economic coercion and the propaganda in the arena of legalizing jihadism, insurgent activity, radicalized Islamic murder, supports to Arab Palestinian cause, gaining political support in the targeting of civilian Jews, promotion of guerrilla activities and asymmetric operations against Israel.

Is ‘East Jerusalem’ Palestinian Territory?

(COMMENT)

This is a trick question...

No Arab Nation, including the Arab Higher Committee and the PLO Arab Palestinians, accepted the status of 'corpus separatum' for Jerusalem. It was maintained by the Jordanians from 1948 (becoming sovereign in 1950) until 1967. It became occupied Jordanian territory (oJt) in 1967 and maintained that status up and until October 1988; when it was abandoned (terra nullius) and fell into the hands of the Israelis.

It was never sovereign under Arab Palestinian rule (possessing ultimate political power).

The Arab Palestinians argue that the Jordanian Annexation of 1950 was illegal. That makes no real difference. In order for East Jerusalem to have been occupied Palestinian territory, it had to be (at some time since the termination of the Mandate) Arab Palestinians sovereign (which it never was).

OK, I have my ceramic plates and kevlar on --- fire at will.

Most Respectfully,
R

I would say there is certainly conserable investment in pro-Isreali propoganda, far more than pro Palestinian. Israel has a poweful lobby in the US and has for decades. They have gotten considerable financisl and military support. They have used that propaganda to control key narratives, for example:

That the majority of palestinians whoo fled and were sibsequently exiled, did so at the urging of Arab leaders, yet the (relatively) recent) release of historical documents show that to be largely a lie. Most of those who fled did so either out of fear of conflict or were driven out by Jewish militias.

Another narrative driven by propaganda is the ides thst Istael is some kind of victim .In thid conflict. While thr Palestinians are sore losers of a conflict they started,lost,and cant move on from, Israel had itls own political aims in the conflict. It needed land, it wanyrd land, it got land. There are historians who have said Israel set the stage for a conflict withth Egypt in order to be able to gain teritory.

That is all in the pastnow but propaganda still pushes the victim narrative. No nation as well armed and protected as Israel is a victim.

 

[Sixties Fan]

The word Propaganda implies not telling the truth in order to make people believe what is not true.

Do YOU believe that THAT is what Israel does?

Again, I am going to ask for specific examples, just as I asked from Camera, which I am still waiting for.

Thank you.

 

[Sixties Fan]

RE: All The News Anti-Israel Posters Will Not Read Or Discuss
⁜→ Sixties Fan, et al,

Sometimes the obvious is not what it appears to be; especially in the Middle East.

(full article online: What we, Western idiots, will never get about Israel)

(COMMENT)

I agree, the article is well worth the time to read.

While I think that even a nickel spent on anything in Gaza is a perversion towards humanity (direct material support to terrorism), the half-million dollars is not an especially large propaganda expenditure in an effort to spread the word (any word). In the last decade, the Arab Palestinians in the state of unknown whereabouts, have become very effective in the use of political and economic coercion and the propaganda in the arena of legalizing jihadism, insurgent activity, radicalized Islamic murder, supports to Arab Palestinian cause, gaining political support in the targeting of civilian Jews, promotion of guerrilla activities and asymmetric operations against Israel.

Is ‘East Jerusalem’ Palestinian Territory?

(COMMENT)

This is a trick question...

No Arab Nation, including the Arab Higher Committee and the PLO Arab Palestinians, accepted the status of 'corpus separatum' for Jerusalem. It was maintained by the Jordanians from 1948 (becoming sovereign in 1950) until 1967. It became occupied Jordanian territory (oJt) in 1967 and maintained that status up and until October 1988; when it was abandoned (terra nullius) and fell into the hands of the Israelis.

It was never sovereign under Arab Palestinian rule (possessing ultimate political power).

The Arab Palestinians argue that the Jordanian Annexation of 1950 was illegal. That makes no real difference. In order for East Jerusalem to have been occupied Palestinian territory, it had to be (at some time since the termination of the Mandate) Arab Palestinians sovereign (which it never was).

OK, I have my ceramic plates and kevlar on --- fire at will.

Most Respectfully,
R

I would say there is certainly conserable investment in pro-Isreali propoganda, far more than pro Palestinian. Israel has a poweful lobby in the US and has for decades. They have gotten considerable financisl and military support. They have used that propaganda to control key narratives, for example:

That the majority of palestinians whoo fled and were sibsequently exiled, did so at the urging of Arab leaders, yet the (relatively) recent) release of historical documents show that to be largely a lie. Most of those who fled did so either out of fear of conflict or were driven out by Jewish militias.

Another narrative driven by propaganda is the ides thst Istael is some kind of victim .In thid conflict. While thr Palestinians are sore losers of a conflict they started,lost,and cant move on from, Israel had itls own political aims in the conflict. It needed land, it wanyrd land, it got land. There are historians who have said Israel set the stage for a conflict withth Egypt in order to be able to gain teritory.

That is all in the pastnow but propaganda still pushes the victim narrative. No nation as well armed and protected as Israel is a victim.

"That the majority of Palestinians whoo fled and were subsequently exiled, did so at the urging of Arab leaders,"

TRUE

You do not have to believe in it, if you do not want to but Arabs have testified to that.

And YES, all of those who stayed and fought against Israel, either died in the fight or had to be expelled from Israel. What country would allow hostile people to stay and continue to attack its population?

Israel's only aim is Peace with its neighbors as it has achieved with Egypt and Jordan.

It needed land, are we talking 1967 now? And it got land?
Israel did not start the 1948 war, where it lost land, nor did it start the 1967 war, where it ended getting Gaza and Judea, Samaria and the Jewish Quarter of Jerusalem back.

It just happened that Israel was much stronger this time, and knew how to fight to win, with much fewer casualties than in 1948.

"Historians say". What? Do you not have a mind of your own and can you NOT tell History from non History?

There is HISTORY, period. It means what happened at a certain point in time at a certain place.

NOT, what some people would like others to believe happened.

Now, How are YOU going to be able to tell one from the other?

 

[Coyote]

RE: All The News Anti-Israel Posters Will Not Read Or Discuss
⁜→ Sixties Fan, et al,

Sometimes the obvious is not what it appears to be; especially in the Middle East.

(full article online: What we, Western idiots, will never get about Israel)

(COMMENT)

I agree, the article is well worth the time to read.

While I think that even a nickel spent on anything in Gaza is a perversion towards humanity (direct material support to terrorism), the half-million dollars is not an especially large propaganda expenditure in an effort to spread the word (any word). In the last decade, the Arab Palestinians in the state of unknown whereabouts, have become very effective in the use of political and economic coercion and the propaganda in the arena of legalizing jihadism, insurgent activity, radicalized Islamic murder, supports to Arab Palestinian cause, gaining political support in the targeting of civilian Jews, promotion of guerrilla activities and asymmetric operations against Israel.

Is ‘East Jerusalem’ Palestinian Territory?

(COMMENT)

This is a trick question...

No Arab Nation, including the Arab Higher Committee and the PLO Arab Palestinians, accepted the status of 'corpus separatum' for Jerusalem. It was maintained by the Jordanians from 1948 (becoming sovereign in 1950) until 1967. It became occupied Jordanian territory (oJt) in 1967 and maintained that status up and until October 1988; when it was abandoned (terra nullius) and fell into the hands of the Israelis.

It was never sovereign under Arab Palestinian rule (possessing ultimate political power).

The Arab Palestinians argue that the Jordanian Annexation of 1950 was illegal. That makes no real difference. In order for East Jerusalem to have been occupied Palestinian territory, it had to be (at some time since the termination of the Mandate) Arab Palestinians sovereign (which it never was).

OK, I have my ceramic plates and kevlar on --- fire at will.

Most Respectfully,
R

I would say there is certainly conserable investment in pro-Isreali propoganda, far more than pro Palestinian. Israel has a poweful lobby in the US and has for decades. They have gotten considerable financisl and military support. They have used that propaganda to control key narratives, for example:

That the majority of palestinians whoo fled and were sibsequently exiled, did so at the urging of Arab leaders, yet the (relatively) recent) release of historical documents show that to be largely a lie. Most of those who fled did so either out of fear of conflict or were driven out by Jewish militias.

Another narrative driven by propaganda is the ides thst Istael is some kind of victim .In thid conflict. While thr Palestinians are sore losers of a conflict they started,lost,and cant move on from, Israel had itls own political aims in the conflict. It needed land, it wanyrd land, it got land. There are historians who have said Israel set the stage for a conflict withth Egypt in order to be able to gain teritory.

That is all in the pastnow but propaganda still pushes the victim narrative. No nation as well armed and protected as Israel is a victim.

"That the majority of Palestinians whoo fled and were subsequently exiled, did so at the urging of Arab leaders,"

TRUE

You do not have to believe in it, if you do not want to but Arabs have testified to that.

And YES, all of those who stayed and fought against Israel, either died in the fight or had to be expelled from Israel. What country would allow hostile people to stay and continue to attack its population?

Israel's only aim is Peace with its neighbors as it has achieved with Egypt and Jordan.

It needed land, are we talking 1967 now? And it got land?
Israel did not start the 1948 war, where it lost land, nor did it start the 1967 war, where it ended getting Gaza and Judea, Samaria and the Jewish Quarter of Jerusalem back.

It just happened that Israel was much stronger this time, and knew how to fight to win, with much fewer casualties than in 1948.

"Historians say". What? Do you not have a mind of your own and can you NOT tell History from non History?

There is HISTORY, period. It means what happened at a certain point in time at a certain place.

NOT, what some people would like others to believe happened.

Now, How are YOU going to be able to tell one from the other?

Thete id history and there is propaganda. Every nation does it.

 

[Sixties Fan]

RE: All The News Anti-Israel Posters Will Not Read Or Discuss
⁜→ Sixties Fan, et al,

Sometimes the obvious is not what it appears to be; especially in the Middle East.

(full article online: What we, Western idiots, will never get about Israel)

(COMMENT)

I agree, the article is well worth the time to read.

While I think that even a nickel spent on anything in Gaza is a perversion towards humanity (direct material support to terrorism), the half-million dollars is not an especially large propaganda expenditure in an effort to spread the word (any word). In the last decade, the Arab Palestinians in the state of unknown whereabouts, have become very effective in the use of political and economic coercion and the propaganda in the arena of legalizing jihadism, insurgent activity, radicalized Islamic murder, supports to Arab Palestinian cause, gaining political support in the targeting of civilian Jews, promotion of guerrilla activities and asymmetric operations against Israel.

Is ‘East Jerusalem’ Palestinian Territory?

(COMMENT)

This is a trick question...

No Arab Nation, including the Arab Higher Committee and the PLO Arab Palestinians, accepted the status of 'corpus separatum' for Jerusalem. It was maintained by the Jordanians from 1948 (becoming sovereign in 1950) until 1967. It became occupied Jordanian territory (oJt) in 1967 and maintained that status up and until October 1988; when it was abandoned (terra nullius) and fell into the hands of the Israelis.

It was never sovereign under Arab Palestinian rule (possessing ultimate political power).

The Arab Palestinians argue that the Jordanian Annexation of 1950 was illegal. That makes no real difference. In order for East Jerusalem to have been occupied Palestinian territory, it had to be (at some time since the termination of the Mandate) Arab Palestinians sovereign (which it never was).

OK, I have my ceramic plates and kevlar on --- fire at will.

Most Respectfully,
R

I would say there is certainly conserable investment in pro-Isreali propoganda, far more than pro Palestinian. Israel has a poweful lobby in the US and has for decades. They have gotten considerable financisl and military support. They have used that propaganda to control key narratives, for example:

That the majority of palestinians whoo fled and were sibsequently exiled, did so at the urging of Arab leaders, yet the (relatively) recent) release of historical documents show that to be largely a lie. Most of those who fled did so either out of fear of conflict or were driven out by Jewish militias.

Another narrative driven by propaganda is the ides thst Istael is some kind of victim .In thid conflict. While thr Palestinians are sore losers of a conflict they started,lost,and cant move on from, Israel had itls own political aims in the conflict. It needed land, it wanyrd land, it got land. There are historians who have said Israel set the stage for a conflict withth Egypt in order to be able to gain teritory.

That is all in the pastnow but propaganda still pushes the victim narrative. No nation as well armed and protected as Israel is a victim.

"That the majority of Palestinians whoo fled and were subsequently exiled, did so at the urging of Arab leaders,"

TRUE

You do not have to believe in it, if you do not want to but Arabs have testified to that.

And YES, all of those who stayed and fought against Israel, either died in the fight or had to be expelled from Israel. What country would allow hostile people to stay and continue to attack its population?

Israel's only aim is Peace with its neighbors as it has achieved with Egypt and Jordan.

It needed land, are we talking 1967 now? And it got land?
Israel did not start the 1948 war, where it lost land, nor did it start the 1967 war, where it ended getting Gaza and Judea, Samaria and the Jewish Quarter of Jerusalem back.

It just happened that Israel was much stronger this time, and knew how to fight to win, with much fewer casualties than in 1948.

"Historians say". What? Do you not have a mind of your own and can you NOT tell History from non History?

There is HISTORY, period. It means what happened at a certain point in time at a certain place.

NOT, what some people would like others to believe happened.

Now, How are YOU going to be able to tell one from the other?

Thete id history and there is propaganda. Every nation does it.

And I continue to wait for specifics on it and not your generalizations.
Generalizations you read someplace without being able to tell if it is true or not.

Unless a country is strong, tribe, village, etc it has always been defeated by the stronger ones. Ask the Kurds about it who have had to fight the Arabs and continue to have Turkey imposing them from achieving Independence in the same region.

When strong Israel retained territory and protected it's people from its enemies.
When weak, Israel Lost sovereignty and was at the hands of its conquerors.

So yes, Israel has to be strong today knowing very well what its enemies want to do wit it and its population. The Muslims have been very clear about it for the past 98 years.

Victim, how has it not been a victim of 7 Arab countries attacking it in1948, and all the attacks before and after.

How is the Jewish population not victimized on an almost daily basis wit knives, screws, cars, rocks, molotov, just because Israel now has a stronger army which keeps the enemy from a full fledged attack, as in 1948.

Maybe you are not aware of it but Turkey, Iran, the Palestinians, just about every one, the NRA, etc have lobbies in DC. So, why shouldn't Israel have one as well.
Does it mean that Israel gets all it wants. Of course not.

 

[Coyote]

The word Propaganda implies not telling the truth in order to make people believe what is not true.

Do YOU believe that THAT is what Israel does?

Again, I am going to ask for specific examples, just as I asked from Camera, which I am still waiting for.

Thank you.

Yes I believe Israel does. I believe EVERY nation does. Why would Israel be any different? Just as an exame look at what were once the prevailing narratives in my own country.

 

[Coyote]

RE: All The News Anti-Israel Posters Will Not Read Or Discuss
⁜→ Sixties Fan, et al,

Sometimes the obvious is not what it appears to be; especially in the Middle East.

(full article online: What we, Western idiots, will never get about Israel)

(COMMENT)

I agree, the article is well worth the time to read.

While I think that even a nickel spent on anything in Gaza is a perversion towards humanity (direct material support to terrorism), the half-million dollars is not an especially large propaganda expenditure in an effort to spread the word (any word). In the last decade, the Arab Palestinians in the state of unknown whereabouts, have become very effective in the use of political and economic coercion and the propaganda in the arena of legalizing jihadism, insurgent activity, radicalized Islamic murder, supports to Arab Palestinian cause, gaining political support in the targeting of civilian Jews, promotion of guerrilla activities and asymmetric operations against Israel.

Is ‘East Jerusalem’ Palestinian Territory?

(COMMENT)

This is a trick question...

No Arab Nation, including the Arab Higher Committee and the PLO Arab Palestinians, accepted the status of 'corpus separatum' for Jerusalem. It was maintained by the Jordanians from 1948 (becoming sovereign in 1950) until 1967. It became occupied Jordanian territory (oJt) in 1967 and maintained that status up and until October 1988; when it was abandoned (terra nullius) and fell into the hands of the Israelis.

It was never sovereign under Arab Palestinian rule (possessing ultimate political power).

The Arab Palestinians argue that the Jordanian Annexation of 1950 was illegal. That makes no real difference. In order for East Jerusalem to have been occupied Palestinian territory, it had to be (at some time since the termination of the Mandate) Arab Palestinians sovereign (which it never was).

OK, I have my ceramic plates and kevlar on --- fire at will.

Most Respectfully,
R

I would say there is certainly conserable investment in pro-Isreali propoganda, far more than pro Palestinian. Israel has a poweful lobby in the US and has for decades. They have gotten considerable financisl and military support. They have used that propaganda to control key narratives, for example:

That the majority of palestinians whoo fled and were sibsequently exiled, did so at the urging of Arab leaders, yet the (relatively) recent) release of historical documents show that to be largely a lie. Most of those who fled did so either out of fear of conflict or were driven out by Jewish militias.

Another narrative driven by propaganda is the ides thst Istael is some kind of victim .In thid conflict. While thr Palestinians are sore losers of a conflict they started,lost,and cant move on from, Israel had itls own political aims in the conflict. It needed land, it wanyrd land, it got land. There are historians who have said Israel set the stage for a conflict withth Egypt in order to be able to gain teritory.

That is all in the pastnow but propaganda still pushes the victim narrative. No nation as well armed and protected as Israel is a victim.

"That the majority of Palestinians whoo fled and were subsequently exiled, did so at the urging of Arab leaders,"

TRUE

You do not have to believe in it, if you do not want to but Arabs have testified to that.

And YES, all of those who stayed and fought against Israel, either died in the fight or had to be expelled from Israel. What country would allow hostile people to stay and continue to attack its population?

Israel's only aim is Peace with its neighbors as it has achieved with Egypt and Jordan.

It needed land, are we talking 1967 now? And it got land?
Israel did not start the 1948 war, where it lost land, nor did it start the 1967 war, where it ended getting Gaza and Judea, Samaria and the Jewish Quarter of Jerusalem back.

It just happened that Israel was much stronger this time, and knew how to fight to win, with much fewer casualties than in 1948.

"Historians say". What? Do you not have a mind of your own and can you NOT tell History from non History?

There is HISTORY, period. It means what happened at a certain point in time at a certain place.

NOT, what some people would like others to believe happened.

Now, How are YOU going to be able to tell one from the other?

Thete id history and there is propaganda. Every nation does it.

And I continue to wait for specifics on it and not your generalizations.
Generalizations you read someplace without being able to tell if it is true or not.

Unless a country is strong, tribe, village, etc it has always been defeated by the stronger ones. Ask the Kurds about it who have had to fight the Arabs and continue to have Turkey imposing them from achieving Independence in the same region.

When strong Israel retained territory and protected it's people from its enemies.
When weak, Israel Lost sovereignty and was at the hands of its conquerors.

So yes, Israel has to be strong today knowing very well what its enemies want to do wit it and its population. The Muslims have been very clear about it for the past 98 years.

Victim, how has it not been a victim of 7 Arab countries attacking it in1948, and all the attacks before and after.

How is the Jewish population not victimized on an almost daily basis wit knives, screws, cars, rocks, molotov, just because Israel now has a stronger army which keeps the enemy from a full fledged attack, as in 1948.

Maybe you are not aware of it but Turkey, Iran, the Palestinians, just about every one, the NRA, etc have lobbies in DC. So, why shouldn't Israel have one as well.
Does it mean that Israel gets all it wants. Of course not.

I never said Israel is the only one with a lobby, just that theirs is extremely powerful, much more so than the Palestinian one.

 

[Sixties Fan]

The word Propaganda implies not telling the truth in order to make people believe what is not true.

Do YOU believe that THAT is what Israel does?

Again, I am going to ask for specific examples, just as I asked from Camera, which I am still waiting for.

Thank you.

Yes I believe Israel does. I believe EVERY nation does. Why would Israel be any different? Just as an exame look at what were once the prevailing narratives in my own country.

You have said absolutely NOTHING.

You are doing nothing else but Generalizing everything.

 

[Sixties Fan]

RE: All The News Anti-Israel Posters Will Not Read Or Discuss
⁜→ Sixties Fan, et al,

Sometimes the obvious is not what it appears to be; especially in the Middle East.

(COMMENT)

I agree, the article is well worth the time to read.

While I think that even a nickel spent on anything in Gaza is a perversion towards humanity (direct material support to terrorism), the half-million dollars is not an especially large propaganda expenditure in an effort to spread the word (any word). In the last decade, the Arab Palestinians in the state of unknown whereabouts, have become very effective in the use of political and economic coercion and the propaganda in the arena of legalizing jihadism, insurgent activity, radicalized Islamic murder, supports to Arab Palestinian cause, gaining political support in the targeting of civilian Jews, promotion of guerrilla activities and asymmetric operations against Israel.

(COMMENT)

This is a trick question...

No Arab Nation, including the Arab Higher Committee and the PLO Arab Palestinians, accepted the status of 'corpus separatum' for Jerusalem. It was maintained by the Jordanians from 1948 (becoming sovereign in 1950) until 1967. It became occupied Jordanian territory (oJt) in 1967 and maintained that status up and until October 1988; when it was abandoned (terra nullius) and fell into the hands of the Israelis.

It was never sovereign under Arab Palestinian rule (possessing ultimate political power).

The Arab Palestinians argue that the Jordanian Annexation of 1950 was illegal. That makes no real difference. In order for East Jerusalem to have been occupied Palestinian territory, it had to be (at some time since the termination of the Mandate) Arab Palestinians sovereign (which it never was).

OK, I have my ceramic plates and kevlar on --- fire at will.

Most Respectfully,
R

I would say there is certainly conserable investment in pro-Isreali propoganda, far more than pro Palestinian. Israel has a poweful lobby in the US and has for decades. They have gotten considerable financisl and military support. They have used that propaganda to control key narratives, for example:

That the majority of palestinians whoo fled and were sibsequently exiled, did so at the urging of Arab leaders, yet the (relatively) recent) release of historical documents show that to be largely a lie. Most of those who fled did so either out of fear of conflict or were driven out by Jewish militias.

Another narrative driven by propaganda is the ides thst Istael is some kind of victim .In thid conflict. While thr Palestinians are sore losers of a conflict they started,lost,and cant move on from, Israel had itls own political aims in the conflict. It needed land, it wanyrd land, it got land. There are historians who have said Israel set the stage for a conflict withth Egypt in order to be able to gain teritory.

That is all in the pastnow but propaganda still pushes the victim narrative. No nation as well armed and protected as Israel is a victim.

"That the majority of Palestinians whoo fled and were subsequently exiled, did so at the urging of Arab leaders,"

TRUE

You do not have to believe in it, if you do not want to but Arabs have testified to that.

And YES, all of those who stayed and fought against Israel, either died in the fight or had to be expelled from Israel. What country would allow hostile people to stay and continue to attack its population?

Israel's only aim is Peace with its neighbors as it has achieved with Egypt and Jordan.

It needed land, are we talking 1967 now? And it got land?
Israel did not start the 1948 war, where it lost land, nor did it start the 1967 war, where it ended getting Gaza and Judea, Samaria and the Jewish Quarter of Jerusalem back.

It just happened that Israel was much stronger this time, and knew how to fight to win, with much fewer casualties than in 1948.

"Historians say". What? Do you not have a mind of your own and can you NOT tell History from non History?

There is HISTORY, period. It means what happened at a certain point in time at a certain place.

NOT, what some people would like others to believe happened.

Now, How are YOU going to be able to tell one from the other?

Thete id history and there is propaganda. Every nation does it.

And I continue to wait for specifics on it and not your generalizations.
Generalizations you read someplace without being able to tell if it is true or not.

Unless a country is strong, tribe, village, etc it has always been defeated by the stronger ones. Ask the Kurds about it who have had to fight the Arabs and continue to have Turkey imposing them from achieving Independence in the same region.

When strong Israel retained territory and protected it's people from its enemies.
When weak, Israel Lost sovereignty and was at the hands of its conquerors.

So yes, Israel has to be strong today knowing very well what its enemies want to do wit it and its population. The Muslims have been very clear about it for the past 98 years.

Victim, how has it not been a victim of 7 Arab countries attacking it in1948, and all the attacks before and after.

How is the Jewish population not victimized on an almost daily basis wit knives, screws, cars, rocks, molotov, just because Israel now has a stronger army which keeps the enemy from a full fledged attack, as in 1948.

Maybe you are not aware of it but Turkey, Iran, the Palestinians, just about every one, the NRA, etc have lobbies in DC. So, why shouldn't Israel have one as well.
Does it mean that Israel gets all it wants. Of course not.

I never said Israel is the only one with a lobby, just that theirs is extremely powerful, much more so than the Palestinian one.

Maybe, just Maybe, the USA knows that Israel wants Peace and that the Palestinians have not stopped wanting to destroy Israel (as written in their charters) and have refused endless plans for peace, including following the requirements of the Oslo Accords.

JUST Maybe.

 

[Sixties Fan]

The U.N.’s anti-Israel history is both long and undeniable. And journalists shouldn’t pretend otherwise. As Winston Churchill—himself a former journalist—famously observed, “The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it, ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is.”

(full article online)

CAMERA Op-Ed: The U.N.’s Anti-Israel Bias Isn’t Up For Debate

 

[Sixties Fan]

Why Zionism Is Not Like Pan-Africanism and White Nationalism

 

[Sixties Fan]

The CICC’s highly inaccurate summary states, in full:

“The Israel-Palestine conflict is one of the longest running in modern history. Following the establishment of the state of Israel in 1948, violence erupted between Israeli armed forces and Palestinian armed groups. During the first and second intifadas in the late 1980s and early 2000s respectively, mass violations of international law occurred, with civilian casualties on both sides. Hundreds of thousands of Palestinians fled to neighboring countries, where many remain in refugee camps. Gaza saw a recurrence of violence in April 2014 after the collapse of US-led peace negotiations. The death of two Palestinian teenagers and the subsequent abduction and death of three Israeli teenagers led to the launch of an Israeli military campaign into Gaza (Operation Protective Edge). The conflict caused a high number of civilian casualties. Between June and November 2014, over 2,000 Palestinians and 70 Israelis were reportedly killed, and more than 11,000 Palestinians and 1600 Israelis injured according to reports by the UN Refugee Agency and others.”

The most obvious inaccuracies include:

• Immediately following Israel’s Declaration of Independence on the basis of UNGA 181, five Arab states – Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, Egypt, and Iraq – not “Palestinian armed groups” invaded the newborn country seeking to eliminate it. Local armed Palestinian militias assisted the Arab states in their military campaign.
• Arab violence against the Jewish population began well before May 1948. Notable examples include the 1929 Hebron Massacre, the 1936-1939 Arab Revolt, and fighting following the 1947 UN Partition vote.
• The “Palestinian armed groups” usually associated with the Arab-Israeli conflict did not come into existence until much later: Fatah (1959), PLO (1964), PFLP (1967), and Hamas (1988).

(full article online)

ICC Lobby Group’s Embarrassing Account of the Arab-Israeli Conflict

 

[Coyote]

I would say there is certainly conserable investment in pro-Isreali propoganda, far more than pro Palestinian. Israel has a poweful lobby in the US and has for decades. They have gotten considerable financisl and military support. They have used that propaganda to control key narratives, for example:

That the majority of palestinians whoo fled and were sibsequently exiled, did so at the urging of Arab leaders, yet the (relatively) recent) release of historical documents show that to be largely a lie. Most of those who fled did so either out of fear of conflict or were driven out by Jewish militias.

Another narrative driven by propaganda is the ides thst Istael is some kind of victim .In thid conflict. While thr Palestinians are sore losers of a conflict they started,lost,and cant move on from, Israel had itls own political aims in the conflict. It needed land, it wanyrd land, it got land. There are historians who have said Israel set the stage for a conflict withth Egypt in order to be able to gain teritory.

That is all in the pastnow but propaganda still pushes the victim narrative. No nation as well armed and protected as Israel is a victim.

"That the majority of Palestinians whoo fled and were subsequently exiled, did so at the urging of Arab leaders,"

TRUE

You do not have to believe in it, if you do not want to but Arabs have testified to that.

And YES, all of those who stayed and fought against Israel, either died in the fight or had to be expelled from Israel. What country would allow hostile people to stay and continue to attack its population?

Israel's only aim is Peace with its neighbors as it has achieved with Egypt and Jordan.

It needed land, are we talking 1967 now? And it got land?
Israel did not start the 1948 war, where it lost land, nor did it start the 1967 war, where it ended getting Gaza and Judea, Samaria and the Jewish Quarter of Jerusalem back.

It just happened that Israel was much stronger this time, and knew how to fight to win, with much fewer casualties than in 1948.

"Historians say". What? Do you not have a mind of your own and can you NOT tell History from non History?

There is HISTORY, period. It means what happened at a certain point in time at a certain place.

NOT, what some people would like others to believe happened.

Now, How are YOU going to be able to tell one from the other?

Thete id history and there is propaganda. Every nation does it.

And I continue to wait for specifics on it and not your generalizations.
Generalizations you read someplace without being able to tell if it is true or not.

Unless a country is strong, tribe, village, etc it has always been defeated by the stronger ones. Ask the Kurds about it who have had to fight the Arabs and continue to have Turkey imposing them from achieving Independence in the same region.

When strong Israel retained territory and protected it's people from its enemies.
When weak, Israel Lost sovereignty and was at the hands of its conquerors.

So yes, Israel has to be strong today knowing very well what its enemies want to do wit it and its population. The Muslims have been very clear about it for the past 98 years.

Victim, how has it not been a victim of 7 Arab countries attacking it in1948, and all the attacks before and after.

How is the Jewish population not victimized on an almost daily basis wit knives, screws, cars, rocks, molotov, just because Israel now has a stronger army which keeps the enemy from a full fledged attack, as in 1948.

Maybe you are not aware of it but Turkey, Iran, the Palestinians, just about every one, the NRA, etc have lobbies in DC. So, why shouldn't Israel have one as well.
Does it mean that Israel gets all it wants. Of course not.

I never said Israel is the only one with a lobby, just that theirs is extremely powerful, much more so than the Palestinian one.

Maybe, just Maybe, the USA knows that Israel wants Peace and that the Palestinians have not stopped wanting to destroy Israel (as written in their charters) and have refused endless plans for peace, including following the requirements of the Oslo Accords.

JUST Maybe.

Maybe. Or maybe it is far more cynical and all about national self interest. Like building settlements on contested territory (that sure shows they want peace eh?)

 

[Coyote]

The word Propaganda implies not telling the truth in order to make people believe what is not true.

Do YOU believe that THAT is what Israel does?

Again, I am going to ask for specific examples, just as I asked from Camera, which I am still waiting for.

Thank you.

Yes I believe Israel does. I believe EVERY nation does. Why would Israel be any different? Just as an exame look at what were once the prevailing narratives in my own country.

You have said absolutely NOTHING.

You are doing nothing else but Generalizing everything.

I am not in the mood for novel length posts. Most of this discussion IS generalizing, it is what you do with the Palestinians and it is done with the Jews. Partly why I posted the article I did.

 

[Sixties Fan]

"That the majority of Palestinians whoo fled and were subsequently exiled, did so at the urging of Arab leaders,"

TRUE

You do not have to believe in it, if you do not want to but Arabs have testified to that.

And YES, all of those who stayed and fought against Israel, either died in the fight or had to be expelled from Israel. What country would allow hostile people to stay and continue to attack its population?

Israel's only aim is Peace with its neighbors as it has achieved with Egypt and Jordan.

It needed land, are we talking 1967 now? And it got land?
Israel did not start the 1948 war, where it lost land, nor did it start the 1967 war, where it ended getting Gaza and Judea, Samaria and the Jewish Quarter of Jerusalem back.

It just happened that Israel was much stronger this time, and knew how to fight to win, with much fewer casualties than in 1948.

"Historians say". What? Do you not have a mind of your own and can you NOT tell History from non History?

There is HISTORY, period. It means what happened at a certain point in time at a certain place.

NOT, what some people would like others to believe happened.

Now, How are YOU going to be able to tell one from the other?

Thete id history and there is propaganda. Every nation does it.

And I continue to wait for specifics on it and not your generalizations.
Generalizations you read someplace without being able to tell if it is true or not.

Unless a country is strong, tribe, village, etc it has always been defeated by the stronger ones. Ask the Kurds about it who have had to fight the Arabs and continue to have Turkey imposing them from achieving Independence in the same region.

When strong Israel retained territory and protected it's people from its enemies.
When weak, Israel Lost sovereignty and was at the hands of its conquerors.

So yes, Israel has to be strong today knowing very well what its enemies want to do wit it and its population. The Muslims have been very clear about it for the past 98 years.

Victim, how has it not been a victim of 7 Arab countries attacking it in1948, and all the attacks before and after.

How is the Jewish population not victimized on an almost daily basis wit knives, screws, cars, rocks, molotov, just because Israel now has a stronger army which keeps the enemy from a full fledged attack, as in 1948.

Maybe you are not aware of it but Turkey, Iran, the Palestinians, just about every one, the NRA, etc have lobbies in DC. So, why shouldn't Israel have one as well.
Does it mean that Israel gets all it wants. Of course not.

I never said Israel is the only one with a lobby, just that theirs is extremely powerful, much more so than the Palestinian one.

Maybe, just Maybe, the USA knows that Israel wants Peace and that the Palestinians have not stopped wanting to destroy Israel (as written in their charters) and have refused endless plans for peace, including following the requirements of the Oslo Accords.

JUST Maybe.

Maybe. Or maybe it is far more cynical and all about national self interest. Like building settlements on contested territory (that sure shows they want peace eh?)

If Israel had any interests in territory only, it would have expelled all, or most Arabs from Judea and Samaria and the previous Jewish Quarter of Jerusalem in 1967 and avoided beliefs like yours.

And most of all, it would have never have expelled all of its Jews from Gaza and some of Judea and Samaria in 2005.

You really know history. You really know Israel.