Al Nakba Denial vs Holocaust Denial, what's the Difference

[Lipush]

Often those who deny the Holocaust are in favor for a future one to occure.

You don't fool anyone with the twisted message you try to convey regarding the Holocaust. The fact that you're in favor of ethnic cleasing and discrimination based on race is a fine proof of that.

Correct me if I am wrong, but haven't you stated that the ethnic cleansing of the Muslims and Christians from Palestine to make room for Zionist Jews was perfectly acceptable?

I said no such thing.

 

[montelatici]

Often those who deny the Holocaust are in favor for a future one to occure.

You don't fool anyone with the twisted message you try to convey regarding the Holocaust. The fact that you're in favor of ethnic cleasing and discrimination based on race is a fine proof of that.

Correct me if I am wrong, but haven't you stated that the ethnic cleansing of the Muslims and Christians from Palestine to make room for Zionist Jews was perfectly acceptable?

I said no such thing.

Well, then excuse me.

 

[louie888]

I love the way you make the assumption that I have not looked at this! Because you obviously know me well! hahaha

I made the assumption based on your posting here. I have read Hilberg, Arad, Pressac and some other stuff from their "sources." In total we are talking about over 10,000 pages which make up what mainstream historians consider when discussing "the holocaust."

So, you cannot answer a very simple direct question, preferring to post what YOU think happened... Which, as history has shown, is a pack of lies spread by Holocaust deniers...

Simply not true. I don't know if you read my post, understood my post, watched the Cole documentary I posted or what, but to be clear, I posted:

Here is the definition from wiki:

The Holocaust (from the Greek ὁλόκαυστος holókaustos: hólos, "whole" and kaustós, "burnt"),[3] also referred to as the Shoah (Hebrew: השואה, HaShoah, "the catastrophe"), was a genocide in which some six million European Jews were killed by Adolf Hitler's Nazi Germany, and the World War II collaborators with the Nazis.
The Holocaust - Wikipedia

That, as shown previously, multiple times now, is simply not true - EVEN BY MAINSTREAM STANDARDS.

How is that a pack of lies spread by Holocaust deniers? And moreover, what do you disagree with?

We now know, through your invalid posts that you DO deny the Holocaust... You flail around with your ridiculous assumptions about things being built or happening AFTER the war... Yet you cannot prove a single point you try and make!

I just read a thread where you go back and forth with poor Hollie and you are doing on this thread what she does on every thread. The irony is something. The evidence was posted and it comes directly from Dr. Piper, Auschwitz State Museum Senior Curator. Fanger is absolutely correct on this one. And the Aushwitz "gas chamber" is not the only reconstruction from after the war.

Dr. Piper, Auschwitz State Museum Senior Curator, explains that the room displayed to tourists as an extermination “gas chamber” in its “original state” is actually a postwar reconstruction.

Well, that makes you simple of mind and, in my opinion a Nazi by any other name....

Except I speak out against the nazis frequently. I have even posted the evidence of the zionists working with the nazis. It sickens me.

I am not a Jew but I had family murdered by the Nazi's... You see, not everyone in the concentration camps were Jews!

I'm sorry and I get that. I know many died. I even posted:

But more to the point, we can talk about what did happen. Jews were rounded up for their Jewishness. They were thrown in work camps much like the Japanese in America. Many died in these camps. Some starved, some died from disease, some were shot and some were likely beaten to death. This is what we know and it is horrific.

Keep in mind that the vast majority of these deaths came after the allied firebombing of Europe which left the nazis unable to deliver all the food and medicine to these camps which they had been delivering since the start. If they really wanted to exterminate the Jewish people, why feed them? Why provide medicine for the sick?

I will add that Poles were rounded up for their Polishness, that gays were rounded up for their gayness, that gypsies were rounded up for being gypsies, others for their otherness, etc. All that is certainly horrific.

Now that your simple question was answered, how 'bout you taking a crack at my two simple questions that you skipped over.

If they really wanted to exterminate the Jewish people, why feed them? Why provide medicine for the sick?

So, how about we do this...

You answer my question and I answer yours?

Do you deny the Holocaust - Yes or No?

To help you out even further here, because you seem a little confused, it's ok, we all understand... When I say "Holocaust" I mean in terms of what every normal human being understands and interprets as "Holocaust"... Not some BS undefined waffle...

Does that help you?

Is the wiki definition I posted not "what every normal human being understands and interprets as "Holocaust"" in your eyes?

I answered twice. The answer should now be obvious.

As far as, "Not some BS undefined waffle..."

This is why I assume you have never looked at this crap, comments like that. Are you aware how many times the mainstream story has changed since the Nuremberg trials? I could list countless examples of once "established holocaust history" that no longer is believed by anyone in the mainstream world.

Here is one obvious one. When the propaganda of death camps first appeared, something like 22 death camps were "known." Today, the mainstream historians speak of only 6... and none in Germany. THAT IS A GIGANTIC REVISION BY ANYONE'S STANDARDS!

I am still waiting to find out from anyone why the hell the nazis were feeding and providing medicine to the same Jews they were exterminating, let alone Hitler's Jewish soldiers.

 

[Humanity]

I love the way you make the assumption that I have not looked at this! Because you obviously know me well! hahaha

I made the assumption based on your posting here. I have read Hilberg, Arad, Pressac and some other stuff from their "sources." In total we are talking about over 10,000 pages which make up what mainstream historians consider when discussing "the holocaust."

So, you cannot answer a very simple direct question, preferring to post what YOU think happened... Which, as history has shown, is a pack of lies spread by Holocaust deniers...

Simply not true. I don't know if you read my post, understood my post, watched the Cole documentary I posted or what, but to be clear, I posted:

Here is the definition from wiki:

The Holocaust (from the Greek ὁλόκαυστος holókaustos: hólos, "whole" and kaustós, "burnt"),[3] also referred to as the Shoah (Hebrew: השואה, HaShoah, "the catastrophe"), was a genocide in which some six million European Jews were killed by Adolf Hitler's Nazi Germany, and the World War II collaborators with the Nazis.
The Holocaust - Wikipedia

That, as shown previously, multiple times now, is simply not true - EVEN BY MAINSTREAM STANDARDS.

How is that a pack of lies spread by Holocaust deniers? And moreover, what do you disagree with?

We now know, through your invalid posts that you DO deny the Holocaust... You flail around with your ridiculous assumptions about things being built or happening AFTER the war... Yet you cannot prove a single point you try and make!

I just read a thread where you go back and forth with poor Hollie and you are doing on this thread what she does on every thread. The irony is something. The evidence was posted and it comes directly from Dr. Piper, Auschwitz State Museum Senior Curator. Fanger is absolutely correct on this one. And the Aushwitz "gas chamber" is not the only reconstruction from after the war.

Dr. Piper, Auschwitz State Museum Senior Curator, explains that the room displayed to tourists as an extermination “gas chamber” in its “original state” is actually a postwar reconstruction.

Well, that makes you simple of mind and, in my opinion a Nazi by any other name....

Except I speak out against the nazis frequently. I have even posted the evidence of the zionists working with the nazis. It sickens me.

I am not a Jew but I had family murdered by the Nazi's... You see, not everyone in the concentration camps were Jews!

I'm sorry and I get that. I know many died. I even posted:

But more to the point, we can talk about what did happen. Jews were rounded up for their Jewishness. They were thrown in work camps much like the Japanese in America. Many died in these camps. Some starved, some died from disease, some were shot and some were likely beaten to death. This is what we know and it is horrific.

Keep in mind that the vast majority of these deaths came after the allied firebombing of Europe which left the nazis unable to deliver all the food and medicine to these camps which they had been delivering since the start. If they really wanted to exterminate the Jewish people, why feed them? Why provide medicine for the sick?

I will add that Poles were rounded up for their Polishness, that gays were rounded up for their gayness, that gypsies were rounded up for being gypsies, others for their otherness, etc. All that is certainly horrific.

Now that your simple question was answered, how 'bout you taking a crack at my two simple questions that you skipped over.

If they really wanted to exterminate the Jewish people, why feed them? Why provide medicine for the sick?

So, how about we do this...

You answer my question and I answer yours?

Do you deny the Holocaust - Yes or No?

To help you out even further here, because you seem a little confused, it's ok, we all understand... When I say "Holocaust" I mean in terms of what every normal human being understands and interprets as "Holocaust"... Not some BS undefined waffle...

Does that help you?

Is the wiki definition I posted not "what every normal human being understands and interprets as "Holocaust"" in your eyes?

I answered twice. The answer should now be obvious.

As far as, "Not some BS undefined waffle..."

This is why I assume you have never looked at this crap, comments like that. Are you aware how many times the mainstream story has changed since the Nuremberg trials? I could list countless examples of once "established holocaust history" that no longer is believed by anyone in the mainstream world.

Here is one obvious one. When the propaganda of death camps first appeared, something like 22 death camps were "known." Today, the mainstream historians speak of only 6... and none in Germany. THAT IS A GIGANTIC REVISION BY ANYONE'S STANDARDS!

I am still waiting to find out from anyone why the hell the nazis were feeding and providing medicine to the same Jews they were exterminating, let alone Hitler's Jewish soldiers.

You have provided 'answers' though failed to be honest and answer the direct question with a direct answer... That's ok...

I am happy that there are still investigations taking place about the Holocaust and that there are revisions of what were, at the time, pretty sketchy accounts of what actually happened during the Holocaust... I am not 'scared; of these revisions, I think it's important for history to be correct. Remember it is only in recent times that the Holocaust has moved into 'history' rather than being in 'living memory' (mostly)...

To your questions.... And there are plenty of answers out there if you can be bothered to look it up!

In the very early days, Nazi Germany was a big supporter of Zionism, I am sure you know. Nazi Germany would, if a Jew emigrated to Israel would ship heavy machinery equivalent to the value of property left in Germany. Yes, Nazi Germany actively encouraged Jews to emigrate.

The Nazi's, being the 'superior race' felt they had a duty to behave with some morals. For years there was no 'real' plan for the Jews in Germany... Goebbels himself said that murdering the Jews was an 'unacceptably Asiatic' solution to the problem. "We're the master race, with that goes a certain moral superiority that means just shooting the lot of them isn't acceptable."

The Madagascar Plan was one of the first solutions to be proposed by Nazi Germany... Basically round up all the Jews, ship them to Madagascar... This wasn't the only plan to be put forward PRE 'Final Solution'... Deport all Jews to Palestine, was another, and Siberia was also suggested...

Many Jews fought with Nazi Germany... For many different reasons... If they could 'hide' whilst fighting for Germany then they would, many also believed that fighting for Nazi Germany would bring an end to the war and they would be deported from Germany at the end of it, maybe even to Palestine. Many Jews fought for Nazi Germany against a 'common enemy', the Russians, Finnish Jews, for example, did not fight for the 'Nazi cause', they fought to protect their country from the Russians!

I don't see it a big deal that Jews fought for Nazi Germany, certainly in the early days. There was no 'Final solution' then just several ideas about deporting Jews, perhaps even to Palestine!

Two interesting references that you might want to read....

Lessons and Legacies I: The Meaning of the Holocaust in a Changing World (Lessons and Legacies (Paperback)) (v. 1): Peter Hayes: 9780810109568: Amazon.com: Books

Documents on the Holocaust: Selected Sources on the Destruction of the Jews of Germany and Austria, Poland, and the Soviet Union (Eighth Edition): Yisrael Gutman, Yitzhak Arad, Abraham Margaliot, Lea Ben Dor, Steven T. Katz: 9780803259379: Amazon.com: Books

 

[ForeverYoung436]

I love the way you make the assumption that I have not looked at this! Because you obviously know me well! hahaha

I made the assumption based on your posting here. I have read Hilberg, Arad, Pressac and some other stuff from their "sources." In total we are talking about over 10,000 pages which make up what mainstream historians consider when discussing "the holocaust."

So, you cannot answer a very simple direct question, preferring to post what YOU think happened... Which, as history has shown, is a pack of lies spread by Holocaust deniers...

Simply not true. I don't know if you read my post, understood my post, watched the Cole documentary I posted or what, but to be clear, I posted:

Here is the definition from wiki:

The Holocaust (from the Greek ὁλόκαυστος holókaustos: hólos, "whole" and kaustós, "burnt"),[3] also referred to as the Shoah (Hebrew: השואה, HaShoah, "the catastrophe"), was a genocide in which some six million European Jews were killed by Adolf Hitler's Nazi Germany, and the World War II collaborators with the Nazis.
The Holocaust - Wikipedia

That, as shown previously, multiple times now, is simply not true - EVEN BY MAINSTREAM STANDARDS.

How is that a pack of lies spread by Holocaust deniers? And moreover, what do you disagree with?

We now know, through your invalid posts that you DO deny the Holocaust... You flail around with your ridiculous assumptions about things being built or happening AFTER the war... Yet you cannot prove a single point you try and make!

I just read a thread where you go back and forth with poor Hollie and you are doing on this thread what she does on every thread. The irony is something. The evidence was posted and it comes directly from Dr. Piper, Auschwitz State Museum Senior Curator. Fanger is absolutely correct on this one. And the Aushwitz "gas chamber" is not the only reconstruction from after the war.

Dr. Piper, Auschwitz State Museum Senior Curator, explains that the room displayed to tourists as an extermination “gas chamber” in its “original state” is actually a postwar reconstruction.

Well, that makes you simple of mind and, in my opinion a Nazi by any other name....

Except I speak out against the nazis frequently. I have even posted the evidence of the zionists working with the nazis. It sickens me.

I am not a Jew but I had family murdered by the Nazi's... You see, not everyone in the concentration camps were Jews!

I'm sorry and I get that. I know many died. I even posted:

But more to the point, we can talk about what did happen. Jews were rounded up for their Jewishness. They were thrown in work camps much like the Japanese in America. Many died in these camps. Some starved, some died from disease, some were shot and some were likely beaten to death. This is what we know and it is horrific.

Keep in mind that the vast majority of these deaths came after the allied firebombing of Europe which left the nazis unable to deliver all the food and medicine to these camps which they had been delivering since the start. If they really wanted to exterminate the Jewish people, why feed them? Why provide medicine for the sick?

I will add that Poles were rounded up for their Polishness, that gays were rounded up for their gayness, that gypsies were rounded up for being gypsies, others for their otherness, etc. All that is certainly horrific.

Now that your simple question was answered, how 'bout you taking a crack at my two simple questions that you skipped over.

If they really wanted to exterminate the Jewish people, why feed them? Why provide medicine for the sick?

So, how about we do this...

You answer my question and I answer yours?

Do you deny the Holocaust - Yes or No?

To help you out even further here, because you seem a little confused, it's ok, we all understand... When I say "Holocaust" I mean in terms of what every normal human being understands and interprets as "Holocaust"... Not some BS undefined waffle...

Does that help you?

Is the wiki definition I posted not "what every normal human being understands and interprets as "Holocaust"" in your eyes?

I answered twice. The answer should now be obvious.

As far as, "Not some BS undefined waffle..."

This is why I assume you have never looked at this crap, comments like that. Are you aware how many times the mainstream story has changed since the Nuremberg trials? I could list countless examples of once "established holocaust history" that no longer is believed by anyone in the mainstream world.

Here is one obvious one. When the propaganda of death camps first appeared, something like 22 death camps were "known." Today, the mainstream historians speak of only 6... and none in Germany. THAT IS A GIGANTIC REVISION BY ANYONE'S STANDARDS!

I am still waiting to find out from anyone why the hell the nazis were feeding and providing medicine to the same Jews they were exterminating, let alone Hitler's Jewish soldiers.

You have provided 'answers' though failed to be honest and answer the direct question with a direct answer... That's ok...

I am happy that there are still investigations taking place about the Holocaust and that there are revisions of what were, at the time, pretty sketchy accounts of what actually happened during the Holocaust... I am not 'scared; of these revisions, I think it's important for history to be correct. Remember it is only in recent times that the Holocaust has moved into 'history' rather than being in 'living memory' (mostly)...

To your questions.... And there are plenty of answers out there if you can be bothered to look it up!

In the very early days, Nazi Germany was a big supporter of Zionism, I am sure you know. Nazi Germany would, if a Jew emigrated to Israel would ship heavy machinery equivalent to the value of property left in Germany. Yes, Nazi Germany actively encouraged Jews to emigrate.

The Nazi's, being the 'superior race' felt they had a duty to behave with some morals. For years there was no 'real' plan for the Jews in Germany... Goebbels himself said that murdering the Jews was an 'unacceptably Asiatic' solution to the problem. "We're the master race, with that goes a certain moral superiority that means just shooting the lot of them isn't acceptable."

The Madagascar Plan was one of the first solutions to be proposed by Nazi Germany... Basically round up all the Jews, ship them to Madagascar... This wasn't the only plan to be put forward PRE 'Final Solution'... Deport all Jews to Palestine, was another, and Siberia was also suggested...

Many Jews fought with Nazi Germany... For many different reasons... If they could 'hide' whilst fighting for Germany then they would, many also believed that fighting for Nazi Germany would bring an end to the war and they would be deported from Germany at the end of it, maybe even to Palestine. Many Jews fought for Nazi Germany against a 'common enemy', the Russians, Finnish Jews, for example, did not fight for the 'Nazi cause', they fought to protect their country from the Russians!

I don't see it a big deal that Jews fought for Nazi Germany, certainly in the early days. There was no 'Final solution' then just several ideas about deporting Jews, perhaps even to Palestine!

Two interesting references that you might want to read....

Lessons and Legacies I: The Meaning of the Holocaust in a Changing World (Lessons and Legacies (Paperback)) (v. 1): Peter Hayes: 9780810109568: Amazon.com: Books

Documents on the Holocaust: Selected Sources on the Destruction of the Jews of Germany and Austria, Poland, and the Soviet Union (Eighth Edition): Yisrael Gutman, Yitzhak Arad, Abraham Margaliot, Lea Ben Dor, Steven T. Katz: 9780803259379: Amazon.com: Books

These are all very interesting tidbits. They should not take away, though, from the horrors that happened. When Eisenhower and Patton liberated the camps, they took as many pictures as possible, because Eisenhower sensed that there would be Holocaust denial in the future. He had local people brought in to view the spectacle, and some of these witnesses even committed suicide after seeing the horrors, which were so terrible. There is also a difference between watching a movie like Schindlers' List and watching the actual footage of the liberated camps, with the piles of emaciated bodies stacked like corkwood. That footage makes you want to vomit. Jews took a big hit because there is hardly an Ashkenaz family that wasn't effected by it. But it should be noted that Jews were a relatively late entry into the camps. Many Soviet POW's were gassed, so is that also a lie?

 

[louie888]

These are all very interesting tidbits. They should not take away, though, from the horrors that happened. When Eisenhower and Patton liberated the camps, they took as many pictures as possible, because Eisenhower sensed that there would be Holocaust denial in the future.

Oh, please, nothing he said took away from the horrors and Eisenhower never mentioned holocaust denial which was not even a term then. The term holocaust denier came later when historians started tearing apart the official narrative. You are clueless as to how much of the story has changed since Nuremberg which led to several executions based on, by today's standards, known lies!

He had local people brought in to view the spectacle, and some of these witnesses even committed suicide after seeing the horrors, which were so terrible.

Oh, please, these are the types of lies that piss people off. The horrors that are known are enough. Placing these lies on top only serves to weaken your point.

There is also a difference between watching a movie like Schindlers' List and watching the actual footage of the liberated camps, with the piles of emaciated bodies stacked like corkwood.

Sigh... schindler's lies?

And the piles of bodies we see time and time again are typhus victims. The nazi's spent an enormous amount of time and money keeping these Jews alive throughout the war as typhus was spreading across Europe, After the allied firebombing (Holocaust?) the food and medicine the nazi's has supplied throughout the war could no longer be transported. Those piles of bodies are horrific, but they do not represent what you think.

Many Soviet POW's were gassed, so is that also a lie?

I know this will piss you off, but please provide proof that even one Soviet POW was gassed to death.

 

[louie888]

For the sake of honesty, he is correct there. The original gas chamber of the camp was reconstructed.

He used the word "constructed"! Suggesting that it was originally an air raid shelter and NOT a gas chamber.... It was THEN, after the war, turned into a gas chamber!

I agree it was "reconstructed"

Perfect example of what we are dealing with. Post your proof that it was REconstructed! Seriously, what evidence can you provide that it was a gas chamber, that was turned into an air-raid shelter AND THEN turned back into a gas chamber? Does that even make sense?

Beyond that, do you know how zyklon B even works? It's OK, the storytellers didn't know either.

Now compare that with hermetically sealed actual gas chambers of the time...

Let me be as clear as possible...

I am against any laws prohibiting learning and then writing about any part of history, but far more dangerous than those who write about the holocaust from the actual evidence are those who lie about what happened. At the end of the day, if you want to claim that millions were marched off to gas chambers, then you need some serious and unmistakable proof. Sadly, that simply does not exist and never did.

 

[Humanity]

For the sake of honesty, he is correct there. The original gas chamber of the camp was reconstructed.

He used the word "constructed"! Suggesting that it was originally an air raid shelter and NOT a gas chamber.... It was THEN, after the war, turned into a gas chamber!

I agree it was "reconstructed"

Perfect example of what we are dealing with. Post your proof that it was REconstructed! Seriously, what evidence can you provide that it was a gas chamber, that was turned into an air-raid shelter AND THEN turned back into a gas chamber? Does that even make sense?

Beyond that, do you know how zyklon B even works? It's OK, the storytellers didn't know either.

Now compare that with hermetically sealed actual gas chambers of the time...

Let me be as clear as possible...

I am against any laws prohibiting learning and then writing about any part of history, but far more dangerous than those who write about the holocaust from the actual evidence are those who lie about what happened. At the end of the day, if you want to claim that millions were marched off to gas chambers, then you need some serious and unmistakable proof. Sadly, that simply does not exist and never did.

\
It's quite funny really...

You ask for unmistakable proof to disprove your conspiracy theory? You believe that a 'door' is some kind of proof that nothing happened? Please, do me a favor!

As already stated, at the beginning of WWII there was NO plan to exterminate Jews, just to round them up and deport them so, there would have been NO need to the hermetically sealed doors that you show in your photo... Further more, the small gas chambers appear to be for individuals, to be gassed in as humane a way as possible... You think that the Nazi's cared about being 'humane'?

For me there is ENOUGH evidence out there to not question the Holocaust happened! The one stumbling block I have is on the numbers quoted, but even so, I still do not deny that Nazi Germany tried to commit genocide on the Jewish people!

I wish I could find proof that the millions who were murdered by the Nazi's had managed to escape to the dark side of the moon and lived happily ever after, I'm sure if I searched the internet long enough I would find a conspiracy theory matching that 'wish'...

Your Holocaust denial based on images that mean nothing make your point of view 'nothing'!

Fortunately the Holocaust deniers, conspiracy theorists are few and far between and, fortunately, you will find little support for your views here.

 

[Lipush]

It really is heartbreaking for me to read these posts.

And the fact that you have the nerve to say something like "prove it!" , like the regular person is the one owning answers to the Holocaust denier, is just so outrageous it could almost be funny.

 

[montelatici]

It really is heartbreaking for me to read these posts.

And the fact that you have the nerve to say something like "prove it!" , like the regular person is the one owning answers to the Holocaust denier, is just so outrageous it could almost be funny.

Look, you have people, many posting here, that deny that hundreds of thousands of Muslims and Christians were expelled from Palestine (or killed) by the Jews in 1947-48 when there is even more conclusive evidence (UN reports, British reports etc.) that it happened. It is not that unusual.

 

[louie888]

...It's quite funny really...

You ask for unmistakable proof to disprove your conspiracy theory?

Nope. And be serious, the idea that in secret, the Germans exterminated millions in gas chambers and left no proof of their crime IS THE CONSPIRACY THEORY OF THE LAST CENTURY.

You believe that a 'door' is some kind of proof that nothing happened? Please, do me a favor

Nope.

As already stated, at the beginning of WWII there was NO plan to exterminate Jews, just to round them up and deport them so, there would have been NO need to the hermetically sealed doors that you show in your photo... Further more, the small gas chambers appear to be for individuals, to be gassed in as humane a way as possible... You think that the Nazi's cared about being 'humane'

Nope. BUT THEY SURE AS **** DIDN'T WANT TO GAS THEMSELVES!

Again. it is obvious that you don't know how zyklon-b works and neither did the story tellers.

For me there is ENOUGH evidence out there to not question the Holocaust happened! The one stumbling block I have is on the numbers quoted, but even so, I still do not deny that Nazi Germany tried to commit genocide on the Jewish people!

And you are entitled to that opinion and you can share it without ever wondering if you will end up locked in a cage for doing so.

I wish I could find proof that the millions who were murdered by the Nazi's had managed to escape to the dark side of the moon and lived happily ever after, I'm sure if I searched the internet long enough I would find a conspiracy theory matching that 'wish'..

Nope.

Your Holocaust denial based on images that mean nothing make your point of view 'nothing'!

That is a gross over simplification and I bet you know that.

Fortunately the Holocaust deniers, conspiracy theorists are few and far between and, fortunately, you will find little support for your views here.

Except by those who have the courage to begin to understand this topic.

--------------------------

It really is heartbreaking for me to read these posts.

And the fact that you have the nerve to say something like "prove it!" , like the regular person is the one owning answers to the Holocaust denier, is just so outrageous it could almost be funny.

Look,dummy, if you were put on trial for murdering one person, I am sure would demand evidence, let alone if you were accused of gassing millions to death.

Cry me a river.

 

[Lipush]

It really is heartbreaking for me to read these posts.

And the fact that you have the nerve to say something like "prove it!" , like the regular person is the one owning answers to the Holocaust denier, is just so outrageous it could almost be funny.

Look, you have people, many posting here, that deny that hundreds of thousands of Muslims and Christians were expelled from Palestine (or killed) by the Jews in 1947-48 when there is even more conclusive evidence (UN reports, British reports etc.) that it happened. It is not that unusual.

Oh, save it. Back in 1948 that was a war. Both us and the Palestinians clashed with one another. Both lost land and families and honor.

Do not for a second think it is the same of having entire cities and communities completely destroyed with no trace under the Third Reich. My great grandfather was one of the most respected Rabbis of Budapest. He with the masses were all dust and ashes of destruction camps. I have 9 great aunts I never got to know. A Godfather who I never heard speak because Mengele tore out his vocal cords, a history that is not more than humiliating number - #10205.

So no. I don't see it as the same. Never will.

 

[Lipush]

...It's quite funny really...

You ask for unmistakable proof to disprove your conspiracy theory?

Nope. And be serious, the idea that in secret, the Germans exterminated millions in gas chambers and left no proof of their crime IS THE CONSPIRACY THEORY OF THE LAST CENTURY.

You believe that a 'door' is some kind of proof that nothing happened? Please, do me a favor

Nope.

As already stated, at the beginning of WWII there was NO plan to exterminate Jews, just to round them up and deport them so, there would have been NO need to the hermetically sealed doors that you show in your photo... Further more, the small gas chambers appear to be for individuals, to be gassed in as humane a way as possible... You think that the Nazi's cared about being 'humane'

Nope. BUT THEY SURE AS **** DIDN'T WANT TO GAS THEMSELVES!

Again. it is obvious that you don't know how zyklon-b works and neither did the story tellers.

For me there is ENOUGH evidence out there to not question the Holocaust happened! The one stumbling block I have is on the numbers quoted, but even so, I still do not deny that Nazi Germany tried to commit genocide on the Jewish people!

And you are entitled to that opinion and you can share it without ever wondering if you will end up locked in a cage for doing so.

I wish I could find proof that the millions who were murdered by the Nazi's had managed to escape to the dark side of the moon and lived happily ever after, I'm sure if I searched the internet long enough I would find a conspiracy theory matching that 'wish'..

Nope.

Your Holocaust denial based on images that mean nothing make your point of view 'nothing'!

That is a gross over simplification and I bet you know that.

Fortunately the Holocaust deniers, conspiracy theorists are few and far between and, fortunately, you will find little support for your views here.

Except by those who have the courage to begin to understand this topic.

--------------------------

It really is heartbreaking for me to read these posts.

And the fact that you have the nerve to say something like "prove it!" , like the regular person is the one owning answers to the Holocaust denier, is just so outrageous it could almost be funny.

Look,dummy, if you were put on trial for murdering one person, I am sure would demand evidence, let alone if you were accused of gassing millions to death.

Cry me a river.

My response to that pile of trash might get me banned.

So I say all the unladylike things in my head. You already know what I think of you. I will keep pointing out how deceiving liar you are.

Feel free to take any of my insults personally.

 

[louie888]

...A Godfather who I never heard speak because Mengele tore out his vocal cords....

That Mengele sure was everywhere. Please stop the BS. These are the exact lies that people have grown so sick of.

Tore out his vocal cords... LMAO!

 

[montelatici]

It really is heartbreaking for me to read these posts.

And the fact that you have the nerve to say something like "prove it!" , like the regular person is the one owning answers to the Holocaust denier, is just so outrageous it could almost be funny.

Look, you have people, many posting here, that deny that hundreds of thousands of Muslims and Christians were expelled from Palestine (or killed) by the Jews in 1947-48 when there is even more conclusive evidence (UN reports, British reports etc.) that it happened. It is not that unusual.

Oh, save it. Back in 1948 that was a war. Both us and the Palestinians clashed with one another. Both lost land and families and honor.

Do not for a second think it is the same of having entire cities and communities completely destroyed with no trace under the Third Reich. My great grandfather was one of the most respected Rabbis of Budapest. He with the masses were all dust and ashes of destruction camps. I have 9 great aunts I never got to know. A Godfather who I never heard speak because Mengele tore out his vocal cords, a history that is not more than humiliating number - #10205.

So no. I don't see it as the same. Never will.

Typical Zionist answer. What the Zionists did to the Muslims and Christians should be ignored, but what the Germans did to the Jews must be highlighted.

 

[Lipush]

...A Godfather who I never heard speak because Mengele tore out his vocal cords....

That Mengele sure was everywhere. Please stop the BS. These are the exact lies that people have grown so sick of.

Tore out his vocal cords... LMAO!

Google his name- Efraim Reichenberg. Mengele twin.

And after you do I expect you to apologize.

You just made a joke about a Holocaust survivor who's a family member of mine. That is despicable.

Your message is being reported.

 

[louie888]

Report whatever you want. When you come on here and lie, you will be called out.

Just the way it goes.

 

[Lipush]

It really is heartbreaking for me to read these posts.

And the fact that you have the nerve to say something like "prove it!" , like the regular person is the one owning answers to the Holocaust denier, is just so outrageous it could almost be funny.

Look, you have people, many posting here, that deny that hundreds of thousands of Muslims and Christians were expelled from Palestine (or killed) by the Jews in 1947-48 when there is even more conclusive evidence (UN reports, British reports etc.) that it happened. It is not that unusual.

Oh, save it. Back in 1948 that was a war. Both us and the Palestinians clashed with one another. Both lost land and families and honor.

Do not for a second think it is the same of having entire cities and communities completely destroyed with no trace under the Third Reich. My great grandfather was one of the most respected Rabbis of Budapest. He with the masses were all dust and ashes of destruction camps. I have 9 great aunts I never got to know. A Godfather who I never heard speak because Mengele tore out his vocal cords, a history that is not more than humiliating number - #10205.

So no. I don't see it as the same. Never will.

Typical Zionist answer. What the Zionists did to the Muslims and Christians should be ignored, but what the Germans did to the Jews must be highlighted.

Comparing the Holocaust to the war is foolish. Justice to the people of 1948 should be achieved, I did not say to ignore anything. But I stated my honest opinion regarding this. I am not a fan of PC, and I get that comparing the Palestinians to the Holocaust victims is the cool new thing, but I don't think it is comparitable. Sue me.

 

[Lipush]

Report whatever you want. When you come on here and lie, you will be called out.

Just the way it goes.

Why don't you 'prove it' that I lie?

Still expecting you to apologize.

 

[louie888]

You have provided 'answers' though failed to be honest and answer the direct question with a direct answer... That's ok...

I am happy that there are still investigations taking place about the Holocaust and that there are revisions of what were, at the time, pretty sketchy accounts of what actually happened during the Holocaust... I am not 'scared; of these revisions, I think it's important for history to be correct. Remember it is only in recent times that the Holocaust has moved into 'history' rather than being in 'living memory' (mostly)...

To your questions.... And there are plenty of answers out there if you can be bothered to look it up!

In the very early days, Nazi Germany was a big supporter of Zionism, I am sure you know. Nazi Germany would, if a Jew emigrated to Israel would ship heavy machinery equivalent to the value of property left in Germany. Yes, Nazi Germany actively encouraged Jews to emigrate.

The Nazi's, being the 'superior race' felt they had a duty to behave with some morals. For years there was no 'real' plan for the Jews in Germany... Goebbels himself said that murdering the Jews was an 'unacceptably Asiatic' solution to the problem. "We're the master race, with that goes a certain moral superiority that means just shooting the lot of them isn't acceptable."

The Madagascar Plan was one of the first solutions to be proposed by Nazi Germany... Basically round up all the Jews, ship them to Madagascar... This wasn't the only plan to be put forward PRE 'Final Solution'... Deport all Jews to Palestine, was another, and Siberia was also suggested...

Many Jews fought with Nazi Germany... For many different reasons... If they could 'hide' whilst fighting for Germany then they would, many also believed that fighting for Nazi Germany would bring an end to the war and they would be deported from Germany at the end of it, maybe even to Palestine. Many Jews fought for Nazi Germany against a 'common enemy', the Russians, Finnish Jews, for example, did not fight for the 'Nazi cause', they fought to protect their country from the Russians!

I don't see it a big deal that Jews fought for Nazi Germany, certainly in the early days. There was no 'Final solution' then just several ideas about deporting Jews, perhaps even to Palestine!

Two interesting references that you might want to read....

Lessons and Legacies I: The Meaning of the Holocaust in a Changing World (Lessons and Legacies (Paperback)) (v. 1): Peter Hayes: 9780810109568: Amazon.com: Books

Documents on the Holocaust: Selected Sources on the Destruction of the Jews of Germany and Austria, Poland, and the Soviet Union (Eighth Edition): Yisrael Gutman, Yitzhak Arad, Abraham Margaliot, Lea Ben Dor, Steven T. Katz: 9780803259379: Amazon.com: Books

Thanks for that post, even with the subtle barbs, I appreciate your effort.

1) I have been honest. The 6 million figure was revised in the 80s by some 2 1/2 million and Pressac (not a "denier") reduced that figure even further. You, yourself claim the numbers are bogus. Are you a holocaust denier?

2) "I am happy that there are still investigations taking place..."

Great! But in so called free nations people go to jail becuase of their investigations. That is the point of this thread. Deny the Nakba (a Jewish mass murder spree) all you want, deny the Armenian slaughter at the hands of the Jews or the millions of Russians slaughtered in the Bolshevik revolution at the Jews hands and NOTHING, but point out what I pointed out above and get locked in a hell hole.

3) "I think it's important for history to be correct. Remember it is only in recent times that the Holocaust has moved into 'history' rather than being in 'living memory'"

IT IS IMPORTANT FOR HISTORY TO BE CORRECT! And that line comes right from your Amazon link lol... and it means nothing to this topic.

4) "In the very early days, Nazi Germany was a big supporter of Zionism"

They were in bed together from start to finish. I showed this on another thread. This was their plan to establish their home on Palestinian land. Madagascar, Argentina and a few other place were mentioned in zionist writings long before the nazi ones. But the zionists in power decided only to Palestine. So much of the suffering the Jews suffered could have been avoided had that philosophy not taken hold.

Yitzhak Gruenbaum - Wikipedia

5) To my questions you only sidestepped. Finnish Jews fighting the Russians? Really, is that what you think this is about? We now know of upwards of 150,000 Jews who fought for Hitler including many high ranking officers who commanded large armies themselves. That hardly bodes with an extermination plan.

And you never responded to the main point of why Hitler spent so much time and money feeding and providing medicine for the very people he was exterminating. I'll wait on that and let you think on it... it's a tough one.

6) "Yes, Nazi Germany actively encouraged Jews to emigrate."... "I don't see it a big deal that Jews fought for Nazi Germany, certainly in the early days. There was no 'Final solution' then just several ideas about deporting Jews, perhaps even to Palestine!"

That's the thing. The final solution was one of deportation. I haven't read the first book you posted, but I am quite familiar with the second. I have been through many, many, documents and they all say the same thing. Look through your book again and show me where the final solution was anything more than deportation.

There was no extermination plan ever found that was written by the nazs. Plan Dalet or Plan "D" however, was a document written by the zionists which discussed their final solution for the Palestinians.