Abortion was 50/50. Now it is quicksand.

[Concerned American]

I’ve posted several links.

Here is another.

Scarlet Letters: Getting the History of Abortion and Contraception Right

Despite anti-abortion activists’ rhetoric, abortion and contraception have been legally practiced in America since the Pilgrims’ arrival.

www.americanprogress.org

So how is it the Founders didn’t ban it immediately if this idea of yours is what they really wanted?

But hey. Let’s see what Ben Franklin had to say about it.

First things first. I haven't seen any of your previous links so they are disregarded. The link you made from "American Progress" is hardly a source. At best is an opinion piece from Ranana Dine, a PHD student studying religious ethics of all things--hardly an expert on history or abortion. The article cites recorded historical facts as false without rebutting citation. Your cited article also states that one of the founders, Thomas Jefferson is quoted as saying —“The care of human life and happiness, and not their destruction, is the first and only legitimate object of good government” Indeed, your audio link disagrees with history and current thought without a credible source. So much for your unsupported assertions.

 

[krichton]

There is an old saying, I’d call it a curse. Watch what you wish for. You just might get it.

For decades Conservatives dreamed of overturning Roe. They salivated at ending this right. They imagined that this would be the culmination of all their dreams.

Abortion was a 50/50 issue. Now, it’s Republican quicksand.

Six in 10 voters support legal abortion in most cases. Just over a third want it to be entirely or mostly illegal.

www.politico.com

For elected Republicans the trap is right here before them. If they back off of Abortion to represent the majority view, they alienate the base and lose their positions. If they embrace the base they still risk losing their positions to a majority populist view.

For decades Republicans claimed that the Democrats didn’t dare allow the issue onto the ballot as they would lose. It was a favorite claim of Rush Limbaugh as one example. But the truth turns out to be much stranger than fiction. Every time Abortion is on the ballot the Left wins.

Now this is apparently supported by polling which shows roughly 60% of the people supporting the right to an Abortion in most cases. In other words the standards of the old Roe decision.

So how did this happen? How did decades of polling get it so wrong? I think it is money where the mouth was syndrome.

I don’t like Abortions. I would prefer the woman choose another path. However my dislike doesn’t change my duty as an American to protect her rights. As I argue to protect other rights, even if the individual is doing something I disagree with, I argue in favor of the woman’s right to choose her own path.

For those who would argue it is a Sin. Perhaps it is. But I’m not the one who judges such things. That is God. That is between God and her. I may be able to pray that God have mercy. But that is about all I can do.

I always oppose someone having their rights stripped away. I would hope that you feel the same way. I suspect many of you do not.

And yet Republican politicians are loving this and doubling and tripling down on abortion bans because corporate democrats are too weak and stupid to take advantage of this. Do not be surprised to see some democrats siding with republicans on this issue because they think, well maybe more voters do think we need less rights for women.

 

[SavannahMann]

First things first. I haven't seen any of your previous links so they are disregarded. The link you made from "American Progress" is hardly a source. At best is an opinion piece from Ranana Dine, a PHD student studying religious ethics of all things--hardly an expert on history or abortion. The article cites recorded historical facts as false without rebutting citation. Your cited article also states that one of the founders, Thomas Jefferson is quoted as saying —“The care of human life and happiness, and not their destruction, is the first and only legitimate object of good government” Indeed, your audio link disagrees with history and current thought without a credible source. So much for your unsupported assertions.

Perhaps this will be enough.

Did Ben Franklin Publish a Recipe in a Math Textbook on How to Induce Abortion?

Such recipes have been common since the early days of the U.S.

www.snopes.com

 

[Couchpotato]

Animals are not humans and animal testing never agrees 100% with human results

And I'm not changing the subject you say that an embryo is no different than a born child but even you are not prepared to protect an embryo as if it had all the rights of personhood.

Yeah I really am.

And I already answered the last question.

No you didn’t.

If there is brain function and a person can reasonably be expected to recover then there is no need to remove life support. But even then a family can still decide to remove mechanical life support and even the use of feeding tubes and it still isn't murder.

So if we know in say 9 months the person will be fully recovered and be off life support we shouldn’t ever pull the plug right?

 

[Concerned American]

Perhaps this will be enough.

Did Ben Franklin Publish a Recipe in a Math Textbook on How to Induce Abortion?

Such recipes have been common since the early days of the U.S.

www.snopes.com

1748

LMAO, nope, that's not going to do it either--snopes? Even researching their source--which I might add, is a better citation than most they offer, this tome was written July 21, 1748. Correct me if I'm wrong, but this was prior to the Declaration of Independence or the constitution of the US. Different cultures have murdered for many different barbaric reasons over the years--does not mean they are legal, right or accepted by US founders and your sources do not suggest that either.

 

[Dragonlady]

And yet Republican politicians are loving this and doubling and tripling down on abortion bans because corporate democrats are too weak and stupid to take advantage of this. Do not be surprised to see some democrats siding with republicans on this issue because they think, well maybe more voters do think we need less rights for women.

80% of Americans from B0TH parties want abortion to be safe and legal. Witness the overwhelming passage of the right to abortion questions on the ballot in Kansas, and the election of a pro choice state SC justice is in Wisconnsin.

There are 8 million more women voters than men in the USA, so the men have no hope of winning on this issue. Women fought long and hard for this right and even pro-life women are suing the states because they nearly died because they couldn't get treatment for their pregnancy complications, until they were dying.

 

[zaangalewa]

So what? I would have never known if I was aborted would I?

And what means this for you?` That you are totally superflous in this world here?

And what is stupid is your claim that the average lifespan in the US is 60 years old

It is anythibnhg else than stupid to find out what I found out. Your intentional ignorance shows just simple that you do not like to think about this problem or that you do not like to think at all.

 

[zaangalewa]

Yes it is. 0ur bodies are built for two primary functions, one of which is reproduction.

Ahem. ... Okay ??? ...

Fully half the women who have abortions were using birth control when they got pregnant.

?

I personally have two beautiful grandchildren who were both conceived while my daughter was on the Pill.

Strange - but nice. Congrats grandma,

I was never able to take the Pill, and despite all of the precautions I took, I had two unplanned pregnancies, one of which ended in miscarriage.

Bad luck.

My other "surprise" will be turning 49 this year.

Also nice.

Virtually every woman I know has had at least one unplanned pregnancy.

Really? ... Hmm ... My wife and I never had a problem in this context.

In my daughter's case, they were planning a second child, so the second pregnancy was a bit early, but welcome. When you're married, financially secure, and well situated, it's easy to say, yeah,

Hmmm., This remembers me to a very famous foto in Germany - I am btw a German - which was made in this Roe v Wade time. Many famous German women said in one of the best illustrated newspapers "I made an abortion". This was perhaps an importsnt step to acccept abortions in Germany. Many long years later I heard the same women said "We had been liars - no one of us made an abortion. But still we are proud that we said so." ...

it's not what we planned but let's do this. Which is mostly what happens.

Sure. Many of my friends married because their grilfriend was pregnant. A child was a very good reason to found a family. Today this seems to be an exception.

But for those whose relationships are unstable, or worse, dangerous, or who have other children to support with few resources, it's a much different decision.

If as well abortion and the pill would not exist - what would be the "wrong" decision in this case for a woman? Sex with an untrustworthy man - isn't it? So what will - in this 'experiment by thoughts' - untrustworthy men do to get more sex? They will invent the pill and abortion. Are you really sure you speak about the freedom of women ... or could it be this freedom of women is more a kind of slavery of women? I see on my own the main reason for this huge amount of abortions not in the free wil of women - I see this in the context that strangers, friends and even the own family and parents "decide" the "free will" of a women. A famous - and very rich - sportsman in Germany for example was married - he and his wife always had been very happy together as far as I know - and "suddenly" he had a baby together with his secretary who had been his secretary since a very long time, She was pregnant, The press liked to know a lot about this - but his only comment had been: "A child is always a reason for joy". I guess they all together found a good way to "solve" what needs not really a solution as long as real love is in the center of all decisions. Nobody is perfect.

 

[Blues Man]

Good for you, I'm glad you read the article. Maybe now you know what a fetal heartbeat is and I am glad that you agree that it is murder.

It's not a heartbeat at 6 weeks it seems you can't read very well

 

[Blues Man]

No more emotional than your moronic post about 5 million safe abortions. Please keep up with the discussion or STFU.
Except now the antiabortion crowd is trying for a back door ban on abortion by calling the most used method dangerous and improperly tested even though it's been safely used over 5 million times Blues Man post #461

Those abortions were absolutely safe for the women who used that medication.

 

[Blues Man]

Yeah I really am.


No you didn’t.


So if we know in say 9 months the person will be fully recovered and be off life support we shouldn’t ever pull the plug right?

It's not up to ypu or me to decide if a family removes life support just like it's not up to you or me to decide if a woman termites a pregnancy

 

[zaangalewa]

What needs to happen is young adults need the fear of God about having kids instilled in them. If you have any doubts at all,. Then avoid having kids. That would be a great help in getting rid of abortion. Instead some of you promote having kids. Why?

Why not? ... and by the way: The Protestant and natural scientist and philosopher Harald Lesch subsumizes the most important Christian message in only one simple sentence: "Fürchte dich nicht!" = "Do not fear!".

 

[Rumpole]

What’s odd is that you tree-hugging weirdos see an eagles egg as an eagle…WTF?

Rants are not an argument.
I don't engage with specious right wing memes.

Now pester someone else


Rumpole