Abe Lincoln: What they won't teach in school.

[TheOldSchool]

For anyone who will be around D.C. in the next couple of months, Fall is a great time to visit the memorials.

 

[Rotagilla]

For anyone who will be around D.C. in the next couple of months, Fall is a great time to visit the memorials.

"My paramount object in this struggle is to save the Union, and is not either to save or to destroy slavery. If I could save the Union without freeing any slave I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone I would also do that. What I do about slavery, and the colored race, I do because I believe it helps to save the Union."
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, Letter to Horace Greeley
August 22, 1862

"Negro equality! Fudge!! How long, in the government of a God great enough to make and maintain this Universe, shall there continue knave to vend, and fools to gulp, so low a piece of demagoguism as this?"
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, Fragments: Notes for Speeches
Sept. 1859 (Vol. III)

"But what shall we do with the Negroes after they are free? I believe that it would be better to export them all to some fertile country with a good climate, which they could have to themselves."
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, Letter to General Benjamin F. Butler
March 1865 (Vol. VII)

"I will say then that I am not, nor ever have been in favor of bringing about in any way the social and political equality of the white and black races, (applause from audience) that I am not nor ever have been in favor of making voters or jurors of Negroes, nor of qualifying them to hold office, nor to intermarry with white people. I will say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will forever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality. And inasmuch as they cannot so live, while they do remain together there must be the position of superior and inferior, and I as much as any other man am in favor of having the superior position assigned to the white race."
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, 4th Debate with Stephan A. Douglas in Illinois
Sept. 1858 (Vol. III)

"Judge Douglas has said to you that he has not been able to get an answer out of me to the question whether I am in favor of Negro citizenship. So far as I know, the Judge never asked me the question before. (applause from audience) He shall have no occasion to ever ask it again, for I tell him very frankly that I am not in favor of Negro citizenship. (renewed applause) If the state of Illinois has the power to grant Negroes citizenship, I shall be opposed to it. (cries of "here, here" and "good, good" from audience) That is all I have to say."
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, Speech at Sringfield, Illinois
June 1857 (Vol. II)

"In the course of his reply, the Senator remarked that he had always considered this a government made for the white people and not for the Negroes. Why, in point of mere fact, I think so, too."
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, Speech at Peoria, Illinois
Oct. 1854 (Vol. II)

"I think your race suffers very greatly, many of them by living among us, while ours suffers from your presence. In a word we suffer on each side. If this is admitted, it affords a reason why we should at least be separated."
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, Address on Colonization to a Deputation of
Africans in Washington D.C.
August 1862 (Vol. V)

 

[Rotagilla]

"But what am I to do in the meantime with those men at Montgomery [meaning the Confederate constitutional convention]? Am I to let them go on... [a]nd open Charleston, etc., as ports of entry, with their ten-percent tariff. What, then, would become of my tariff?" ~ Lincoln to Colonel John B. Baldwin, deputized by the Virginian Commissioners to determine whether Lincoln would use force, April 4, 1861.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"Union means so many millions a year lost to the South; secession means the loss of the same millions to the North. The love of money is the root of this as of many other evils....The quarrel between the North and South is, as it stands, solely a fiscal quarrel".... Charles Dickens in a London periodical in December 1861

"The contest is really for empire on the side of the North and for independence on that of the South....". ..... London Times of 7 Nov 1861

"Slavery is not the cause of the rebellion ....Slavery is the pretext on which the leaders of the rebellion rely, 'to fire the Southern Heart' and through which the greatest degree of unanimity can be produced....Mr. Calhoun, after finding that the South could not be brought into sufficient unanimity by a clamor about the tariff, selected slavery as the better subject for agitation"..... North American Review (Boston October 1862)

"They [the South] know that it is their import trade that draws from the people's pockets sixty or seventy millions of dollars per annum, in the shape of duties, to be expended mainly in the North, and in the protection and encouragement of Northern interests....These are the reasons why these people [the North] do not wish the South to secede from the Union." ..... New Orleans Daily Crescent 21 January 1861

"In one single blow our foreign commerce must be reduced to less than one-half what it now is. Our coastwise trade would pass into other hands. One-half of our shipping would lie idle at our wharves. We should lose our trade with the South, with all of its immense profits. Our manufactories would be in utter ruins. Let the South adopt the free-trade system, or that of a tariff for revenue, and these results would likely follow." .... Chicago Daily Times December 1860

"At once shut down every Southern port, destroy its commerce and bring utter ruin on the Confederate States." ..... NY Times 22 March 1861

"the mask has been thrown off and it is apparent that the people of the principal seceding states are now for commercial independence. They dream that the centres of traffic can be changed from Northern to Southern ports....by a revenue system verging on free trade...." .... Boston Transcript 18 March 1861

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"You and I both anticipated that the cause of the country would be advanced by making the attempt to provision Fort Sumter, even if it should fail ; and it is no small consolation now to feel that our anticipation is justified by the result. "

Abraham Lincoln, in a letter to Gustavus Fox, May 1, 1861

"The affair at Fort Sumter, it seems to us, has been planned as a means by which the war feeling at the North should be intensified, and the administration thus receive popular support for its policy.... If the armament which lay outside the harbor, while the fort was being battered to pieces [the US ship The Harriet Lane, and seven other reinforcement ships], had been designed for the relief of Major Anderson, it certainly would have made a show of fulfilling its mission. But it seems plain to us that no such design was had. The administration, virtually, to use a homely illustration, stood at Sumter like a boy with a chip on his shoulder, daring his antagonist to knock it off. The Carolinians have knocked off the chip. War is inaugurated, and the design of the administration accomplished." ~ The Buffalo Daily Courier, April 16, 1861.

"We have no doubt, and all the circumstances prove, that it was a cunningly devised scheme, contrived with all due attention to scenic display and intended to arouse, and, if possible, exasperate the northern people against the South.... We venture to say a more gigantic conspiracy against the principles of human liberty and freedom has never been concocted. Who but a fiend could have thought of sacrificing the gallant Major Anderson and his little band in order to carry out a political game? Yet there he was compelled to stand for thirty-six hours amid a torrent of fire and shell, while the fleet sent to assist him, coolly looked at his flag of distress and moved not to his assistance! Why did they not? Perhaps the archives in Washington will yet tell the tale of this strange proceeding.... Pause then, and consider before you endorse these mad men who are now, under pretense of preserving the Union, doing the very thing that must forever divide it." ~ The New York Evening Day-Book, April 17, 1861.

 

[TheOldSchool]

For anyone who will be around D.C. in the next couple of months, Fall is a great time to visit the memorials.

"My paramount object in this struggle is to save the Union, and is not either to save or to destroy slavery. If I could save the Union without freeing any slave I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone I would also do that. What I do about slavery, and the colored race, I do because I believe it helps to save the Union."
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, Letter to Horace Greeley
August 22, 1862

"Negro equality! Fudge!! How long, in the government of a God great enough to make and maintain this Universe, shall there continue knave to vend, and fools to gulp, so low a piece of demagoguism as this?"
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, Fragments: Notes for Speeches
Sept. 1859 (Vol. III)

"But what shall we do with the Negroes after they are free? I believe that it would be better to export them all to some fertile country with a good climate, which they could have to themselves."
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, Letter to General Benjamin F. Butler
March 1865 (Vol. VII)

"I will say then that I am not, nor ever have been in favor of bringing about in any way the social and political equality of the white and black races, (applause from audience) that I am not nor ever have been in favor of making voters or jurors of Negroes, nor of qualifying them to hold office, nor to intermarry with white people. I will say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will forever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality. And inasmuch as they cannot so live, while they do remain together there must be the position of superior and inferior, and I as much as any other man am in favor of having the superior position assigned to the white race."
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, 4th Debate with Stephan A. Douglas in Illinois
Sept. 1858 (Vol. III)

"Judge Douglas has said to you that he has not been able to get an answer out of me to the question whether I am in favor of Negro citizenship. So far as I know, the Judge never asked me the question before. (applause from audience) He shall have no occasion to ever ask it again, for I tell him very frankly that I am not in favor of Negro citizenship. (renewed applause) If the state of Illinois has the power to grant Negroes citizenship, I shall be opposed to it. (cries of "here, here" and "good, good" from audience) That is all I have to say."
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, Speech at Sringfield, Illinois
June 1857 (Vol. II)

"In the course of his reply, the Senator remarked that he had always considered this a government made for the white people and not for the Negroes. Why, in point of mere fact, I think so, too."
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, Speech at Peoria, Illinois
Oct. 1854 (Vol. II)

"I think your race suffers very greatly, many of them by living among us, while ours suffers from your presence. In a word we suffer on each side. If this is admitted, it affords a reason why we should at least be separated."
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, Address on Colonization to a Deputation of
Africans in Washington D.C.
August 1862 (Vol. V)

And yet, he freed the slaves. And will be forever renowned by history for it.

 

[Rotagilla]

For anyone who will be around D.C. in the next couple of months, Fall is a great time to visit the memorials.

"My paramount object in this struggle is to save the Union, and is not either to save or to destroy slavery. If I could save the Union without freeing any slave I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone I would also do that. What I do about slavery, and the colored race, I do because I believe it helps to save the Union."
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, Letter to Horace Greeley
August 22, 1862

"Negro equality! Fudge!! How long, in the government of a God great enough to make and maintain this Universe, shall there continue knave to vend, and fools to gulp, so low a piece of demagoguism as this?"
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, Fragments: Notes for Speeches
Sept. 1859 (Vol. III)

"But what shall we do with the Negroes after they are free? I believe that it would be better to export them all to some fertile country with a good climate, which they could have to themselves."
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, Letter to General Benjamin F. Butler
March 1865 (Vol. VII)

"I will say then that I am not, nor ever have been in favor of bringing about in any way the social and political equality of the white and black races, (applause from audience) that I am not nor ever have been in favor of making voters or jurors of Negroes, nor of qualifying them to hold office, nor to intermarry with white people. I will say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will forever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality. And inasmuch as they cannot so live, while they do remain together there must be the position of superior and inferior, and I as much as any other man am in favor of having the superior position assigned to the white race."
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, 4th Debate with Stephan A. Douglas in Illinois
Sept. 1858 (Vol. III)

"Judge Douglas has said to you that he has not been able to get an answer out of me to the question whether I am in favor of Negro citizenship. So far as I know, the Judge never asked me the question before. (applause from audience) He shall have no occasion to ever ask it again, for I tell him very frankly that I am not in favor of Negro citizenship. (renewed applause) If the state of Illinois has the power to grant Negroes citizenship, I shall be opposed to it. (cries of "here, here" and "good, good" from audience) That is all I have to say."
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, Speech at Sringfield, Illinois
June 1857 (Vol. II)

"In the course of his reply, the Senator remarked that he had always considered this a government made for the white people and not for the Negroes. Why, in point of mere fact, I think so, too."
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, Speech at Peoria, Illinois
Oct. 1854 (Vol. II)

"I think your race suffers very greatly, many of them by living among us, while ours suffers from your presence. In a word we suffer on each side. If this is admitted, it affords a reason why we should at least be separated."
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, Address on Colonization to a Deputation of
Africans in Washington D.C.
August 1862 (Vol. V)

And yet, he freed the slaves. And will be forever renowned by history for it.

He "freed the slaves"?..You really believe that? Go read some real history...

Only after the Union had suffered two years of crushing defeats in battle did Lincoln resolve to “emancipate” the slaves, and only as a war measure, a military tactic, not for moral or humanitarian purposes.
He admitted this, remarking, “We must change tactics or lose the game.” He was hoping, as his original draft of the document shows, that a slave uprising would occur, making it harder for Southerners to continue the war.

His only interest in freeing the slaves was in forcing the South to remain in the Union.

His Emancipation Proclamation was denounced by Northerners, Southerners and Europeans alike for its absurdity and hypocrisy; for, it only “freed” the slaves in the seceded states—where he could not reach them—and kept slavery intact in the North and the border states—where he could have freed them at once.

 

[rightwinger]

There is no question about Lincolns repulsion for the institution of slavery. It had been established since the Lincoln/Douglas debates. It was the reason the south seceded when they did.....they knew Lincolns views

But Lincoln was a politician. He was willing to work within the confines of our United States and our laws to resolve the issue of slavery

By seceding and starting a war, the South accelerated the end of slavery

 

[TheOldSchool]

"But what am I to do in the meantime with those men at Montgomery [meaning the Confederate constitutional convention]? Am I to let them go on... [a]nd open Charleston, etc., as ports of entry, with their ten-percent tariff. What, then, would become of my tariff?" ~ Lincoln to Colonel John B. Baldwin, deputized by the Virginian Commissioners to determine whether Lincoln would use force, April 4, 1861.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"Union means so many millions a year lost to the South; secession means the loss of the same millions to the North. The love of money is the root of this as of many other evils....The quarrel between the North and South is, as it stands, solely a fiscal quarrel".... Charles Dickens in a London periodical in December 1861

"The contest is really for empire on the side of the North and for independence on that of the South....". ..... London Times of 7 Nov 1861

"Slavery is not the cause of the rebellion ....Slavery is the pretext on which the leaders of the rebellion rely, 'to fire the Southern Heart' and through which the greatest degree of unanimity can be produced....Mr. Calhoun, after finding that the South could not be brought into sufficient unanimity by a clamor about the tariff, selected slavery as the better subject for agitation"..... North American Review (Boston October 1862)

"They [the South] know that it is their import trade that draws from the people's pockets sixty or seventy millions of dollars per annum, in the shape of duties, to be expended mainly in the North, and in the protection and encouragement of Northern interests....These are the reasons why these people [the North] do not wish the South to secede from the Union." ..... New Orleans Daily Crescent 21 January 1861

"In one single blow our foreign commerce must be reduced to less than one-half what it now is. Our coastwise trade would pass into other hands. One-half of our shipping would lie idle at our wharves. We should lose our trade with the South, with all of its immense profits. Our manufactories would be in utter ruins. Let the South adopt the free-trade system, or that of a tariff for revenue, and these results would likely follow." .... Chicago Daily Times December 1860

"At once shut down every Southern port, destroy its commerce and bring utter ruin on the Confederate States." ..... NY Times 22 March 1861

"the mask has been thrown off and it is apparent that the people of the principal seceding states are now for commercial independence. They dream that the centres of traffic can be changed from Northern to Southern ports....by a revenue system verging on free trade...." .... Boston Transcript 18 March 1861

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"You and I both anticipated that the cause of the country would be advanced by making the attempt to provision Fort Sumter, even if it should fail ; and it is no small consolation now to feel that our anticipation is justified by the result. "

Abraham Lincoln, in a letter to Gustavus Fox, May 1, 1861

"The affair at Fort Sumter, it seems to us, has been planned as a means by which the war feeling at the North should be intensified, and the administration thus receive popular support for its policy.... If the armament which lay outside the harbor, while the fort was being battered to pieces [the US ship The Harriet Lane, and seven other reinforcement ships], had been designed for the relief of Major Anderson, it certainly would have made a show of fulfilling its mission. But it seems plain to us that no such design was had. The administration, virtually, to use a homely illustration, stood at Sumter like a boy with a chip on his shoulder, daring his antagonist to knock it off. The Carolinians have knocked off the chip. War is inaugurated, and the design of the administration accomplished." ~ The Buffalo Daily Courier, April 16, 1861.

"We have no doubt, and all the circumstances prove, that it was a cunningly devised scheme, contrived with all due attention to scenic display and intended to arouse, and, if possible, exasperate the northern people against the South.... We venture to say a more gigantic conspiracy against the principles of human liberty and freedom has never been concocted. Who but a fiend could have thought of sacrificing the gallant Major Anderson and his little band in order to carry out a political game? Yet there he was compelled to stand for thirty-six hours amid a torrent of fire and shell, while the fleet sent to assist him, coolly looked at his flag of distress and moved not to his assistance! Why did they not? Perhaps the archives in Washington will yet tell the tale of this strange proceeding.... Pause then, and consider before you endorse these mad men who are now, under pretense of preserving the Union, doing the very thing that must forever divide it." ~ The New York Evening Day-Book, April 17, 1861.

Let's see what your guy had to say about black people:

"My own convictions as to negro slavery are strong. It has its evils and abuses...We recognize the negro as God and God's Book and God's Laws, in nature, tell us to recognize him - our inferior, fitted expressly for servitude...You cannot transform the negro into anything one-tenth as useful or as good as what slavery enables them to be."
~Jefferson Davis

"It [slavery] was established by decree of Almighty God...it is sanctioned in the Bible, in both Testaments, from Genesis to Revelation...it has existed in all ages, has been found among the people of the highest civilization, and in nations of the highest proficiency in the arts...Let the gentleman go to Revelation to learn the decree of God - let him go to the Bible...I said that slavery was sanctioned in the Bible, authorized, regulated, and recognized from Genesis to Revelation...Slavery existed then in the earliest ages, and among the chosen people of God; and in Revelation we are told that it shall exist till the end of time shall come. You find it in the Old and New Testaments - in the prophecies, psalms, and the epistles of Paul; you find it recognized, sanctioned everywhere.".
~Jefferson Davis

"African slavery, as it exists in the United States, is a moral, a social, and a political blessing."
~Jefferson Davis

 

[TheOldSchool]

For anyone who will be around D.C. in the next couple of months, Fall is a great time to visit the memorials.

"My paramount object in this struggle is to save the Union, and is not either to save or to destroy slavery. If I could save the Union without freeing any slave I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone I would also do that. What I do about slavery, and the colored race, I do because I believe it helps to save the Union."
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, Letter to Horace Greeley
August 22, 1862

"Negro equality! Fudge!! How long, in the government of a God great enough to make and maintain this Universe, shall there continue knave to vend, and fools to gulp, so low a piece of demagoguism as this?"
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, Fragments: Notes for Speeches
Sept. 1859 (Vol. III)

"But what shall we do with the Negroes after they are free? I believe that it would be better to export them all to some fertile country with a good climate, which they could have to themselves."
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, Letter to General Benjamin F. Butler
March 1865 (Vol. VII)

"I will say then that I am not, nor ever have been in favor of bringing about in any way the social and political equality of the white and black races, (applause from audience) that I am not nor ever have been in favor of making voters or jurors of Negroes, nor of qualifying them to hold office, nor to intermarry with white people. I will say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will forever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality. And inasmuch as they cannot so live, while they do remain together there must be the position of superior and inferior, and I as much as any other man am in favor of having the superior position assigned to the white race."
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, 4th Debate with Stephan A. Douglas in Illinois
Sept. 1858 (Vol. III)

"Judge Douglas has said to you that he has not been able to get an answer out of me to the question whether I am in favor of Negro citizenship. So far as I know, the Judge never asked me the question before. (applause from audience) He shall have no occasion to ever ask it again, for I tell him very frankly that I am not in favor of Negro citizenship. (renewed applause) If the state of Illinois has the power to grant Negroes citizenship, I shall be opposed to it. (cries of "here, here" and "good, good" from audience) That is all I have to say."
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, Speech at Sringfield, Illinois
June 1857 (Vol. II)

"In the course of his reply, the Senator remarked that he had always considered this a government made for the white people and not for the Negroes. Why, in point of mere fact, I think so, too."
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, Speech at Peoria, Illinois
Oct. 1854 (Vol. II)

"I think your race suffers very greatly, many of them by living among us, while ours suffers from your presence. In a word we suffer on each side. If this is admitted, it affords a reason why we should at least be separated."
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, Address on Colonization to a Deputation of
Africans in Washington D.C.
August 1862 (Vol. V)

And yet, he freed the slaves. And will be forever renowned by history for it.

He "freed the slaves"?..You really believe that? Go read some real history...

Only after the Union had suffered two years of crushing defeats in battle did Lincoln resolve to “emancipate” the slaves, and only as a war measure, a military tactic, not for moral or humanitarian purposes.
He admitted this, remarking, “We must change tactics or lose the game.” He was hoping, as his original draft of the document shows, that a slave uprising would occur, making it harder for Southerners to continue the war.

His only interest in freeing the slaves was in forcing the South to remain in the Union.

His Emancipation Proclamation was denounced by Northerners, Southerners and Europeans alike for its absurdity and hypocrisy; for, it only “freed” the slaves in the seceded states—where he could not reach them—and kept slavery intact in the North and the border states—where he could have freed them at once.

Lincoln on the Emancipation Proclamation:

"I never, in my life, felt more certain that I was doing right, than I do in signing this paper,” he declared. “If my name ever goes into history it will be for this act, and my whole soul is in it."

Of course then he pushed for and finally signed off on the 13th amendment which finished the job of freeing all slaves.

And I laugh at how you bring up "crushing defeats" of the North by the Confederacy. Something about a guy named Sherman comes to mind.

 

[Rotagilla]

There is no question about Lincolns repulsion for the institution of slavery. It had been established since the Lincoln/Douglas debates. It was the reason the south seceded when they did.....they knew Lincolns views

But Lincoln was a politician. He was willing to work within the confines of our United States and our laws to resolve the issue of slavery

By seceding and starting a war, the South accelerated the end of slavery

lincoln couldn't have cared less about the slaves and he was never in favor of negro "equality"....and he did not "work within the confines....." etc...he invaded a sovereign country and started a war.

The Terrible Truth About Abraham Lincoln and the Confederate War

Lincoln was the greatest tyrant and despot in American history. In the first four months of his presidency, he created a complete military dictatorship, destroyed the Constitution, ended forever the constitutional republic which the Founding Fathers instituted, committed horrendous crimes against civilian citizens, and formed the tyrannical, overbearing and oppressive Federal government which the American people suffer under to this day. In his first four months, he

1. Failed to call Congress into session after the South fired upon Fort Sumter, in direct violation of the Constitution.
2. Called up an army of 75,000 men, bypassing the Congressional authority in direct violation of the Constitution.
3. Unilaterally suspended the writ of habeas corpus, a function of Congress, violating the Constitution. This gave him the power, as he saw it, to arrest civilians without charge and imprison them indefinitely without trial—which he did.
4. Ignored a Supreme Court order to restore the right of habeas corpus, thus violating the Constitution again and ignoring the Separation of Powers which the Founders put in place exactly for the purpose of preventing one man’s using tyrannical powers in the executive.
5. When the Chief Justice forwarded a copy of the Supreme Court’s decision to Lincoln, he wrote out an order for the arrest of the Chief Justice and gave it to a U.S. Marshall for expedition, in violation of the Constitution.
6. Unilaterally ordered a naval blockade of southern ports, an act of war, and a responsibility of Congress, in violation of the Constitution.
7. Commandeered and closed over 300 newspapers in the North, because of editorials against his war policy and his illegal military invasion of the South. This clearly violated the First Amendment freedom of speech and press clauses.
8. Sent in Army forces to destroy the printing presses and other machinery at those newspapers, in violation of the Constitution.
9. Arrested the publishers, editors and owners of those newspapers, and imprisoned them without charge and without trial for the remainder of the war, all in direct violation of both the Constitution and the Supreme Court order aforementioned.
10. Arrested and imprisoned, without charge or trial, another 15,000-20,000 U.S. citizens who dared to speak out against the war, his policies, or were suspected of anti-war feelings. (Relative to the population at the time, this would be equivalent to President G.W. Bush arresting and imprisoning roughly 150,000-200,000 Americans without trial for “disagreeing” with the Iraq war; can you imagine?)
11. Sent the Army to arrest the entire legislature of Maryland to keep them from meeting legally, because they were debating a bill of secession; they were all imprisoned without charge or trial, in direct violation of the Constitution.
12. Unilaterally created the state of West Virginia in direct violation of the Constitution.
13. Sent 350,000 Northern men to their deaths to kill 350,000 Southern men in order to force the free and sovereign states of the South to remain in the Union they, the people, legally voted to peacefully withdraw from, all in order to continue the South’s revenue flow into the North.

You mention "lincoln's views"..here's another one of his "views" to go along with his quotes I posted above...

First Inaugural Address;


Apprehension seems to exist among the people of the Southern States that by the accession of a Republican Administration their property and their peace and personal security are to be endangered.
There has never been any reasonable cause for such apprehension. Indeed, the most ample evidence to the contrary has all the while existed and been open to their inspection. It is found in nearly all the published speeches of him who now addresses you.
I do but quote from one of those speeches when I declare that—I have no purpose, directly or indirectly, to interfere with the institution of slavery in the States where it exists. I believe I have no lawful right to do so, and I have no inclination to do so.

Those who nominated and elected me did so with full knowledge that I had made this and many similar declarations and had never recanted them; and more than this, they placed in the platform for my acceptance, and as a law to themselves and to me, the clear and emphatic resolution which I now read:

Resolved, That the maintenance inviolate of the rights of the States, and especially the right of each State to order and control its own domestic institutions according to its own judgment exclusively, is essential to that balance of power on which the perfection and endurance of our political fabric depend; and we denounce the lawless invasion by armed force of the soil of any State or Territory, no matter what pretext, as among the gravest of crimes.
I now reiterate these sentiments, and in doing so I only press upon the public attention the most conclusive evidence of which the case is susceptible that the property, peace, and security of no section are to be in any wise endangered by the now incoming Administration.

 

[rightwinger]

Lincoln was a politician in the 1860s
In most ways, he was well ahead of his contemporaries in his positions on race, the institution of slavery and preserving the union
As a politician, he had to make concessions to the political and social views of the day....so some of his quotes may not stand up well in 21st century America

 

[cnm]

The south seceded before Lincoln even took office

Please. This is not the place for facty things.

 

[TheOldSchool]

Lincoln was a politician in the 1860s
In most ways, he was well ahead of his contemporaries in his positions on race, the institution of slavery and preserving the union
As a politician, he had to make concessions to the political and social views of the day....so some of his quotes may not stand up well in 21st century America

Rotagilla is convinced that because Lincoln said he didn't mind slavery a few times before he was President it's proof that he never issued the Emancipation Proclamation or signed into law the 13th amendment!

 

[frigidweirdo]

For anyone who will be around D.C. in the next couple of months, Fall is a great time to visit the memorials.

As in - get shot, fall?

 

[Rotagilla]

For anyone who will be around D.C. in the next couple of months, Fall is a great time to visit the memorials.

"My paramount object in this struggle is to save the Union, and is not either to save or to destroy slavery. If I could save the Union without freeing any slave I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone I would also do that. What I do about slavery, and the colored race, I do because I believe it helps to save the Union."
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, Letter to Horace Greeley
August 22, 1862

"Negro equality! Fudge!! How long, in the government of a God great enough to make and maintain this Universe, shall there continue knave to vend, and fools to gulp, so low a piece of demagoguism as this?"
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, Fragments: Notes for Speeches
Sept. 1859 (Vol. III)

"But what shall we do with the Negroes after they are free? I believe that it would be better to export them all to some fertile country with a good climate, which they could have to themselves."
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, Letter to General Benjamin F. Butler
March 1865 (Vol. VII)

"I will say then that I am not, nor ever have been in favor of bringing about in any way the social and political equality of the white and black races, (applause from audience) that I am not nor ever have been in favor of making voters or jurors of Negroes, nor of qualifying them to hold office, nor to intermarry with white people. I will say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will forever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality. And inasmuch as they cannot so live, while they do remain together there must be the position of superior and inferior, and I as much as any other man am in favor of having the superior position assigned to the white race."
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, 4th Debate with Stephan A. Douglas in Illinois
Sept. 1858 (Vol. III)

"Judge Douglas has said to you that he has not been able to get an answer out of me to the question whether I am in favor of Negro citizenship. So far as I know, the Judge never asked me the question before. (applause from audience) He shall have no occasion to ever ask it again, for I tell him very frankly that I am not in favor of Negro citizenship. (renewed applause) If the state of Illinois has the power to grant Negroes citizenship, I shall be opposed to it. (cries of "here, here" and "good, good" from audience) That is all I have to say."
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, Speech at Sringfield, Illinois
June 1857 (Vol. II)

"In the course of his reply, the Senator remarked that he had always considered this a government made for the white people and not for the Negroes. Why, in point of mere fact, I think so, too."
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, Speech at Peoria, Illinois
Oct. 1854 (Vol. II)

"I think your race suffers very greatly, many of them by living among us, while ours suffers from your presence. In a word we suffer on each side. If this is admitted, it affords a reason why we should at least be separated."
-- Abraham Lincoln
-From, Address on Colonization to a Deputation of
Africans in Washington D.C.
August 1862 (Vol. V)

And yet, he freed the slaves. And will be forever renowned by history for it.

He "freed the slaves"?..You really believe that? Go read some real history...

Only after the Union had suffered two years of crushing defeats in battle did Lincoln resolve to “emancipate” the slaves, and only as a war measure, a military tactic, not for moral or humanitarian purposes.
He admitted this, remarking, “We must change tactics or lose the game.” He was hoping, as his original draft of the document shows, that a slave uprising would occur, making it harder for Southerners to continue the war.

His only interest in freeing the slaves was in forcing the South to remain in the Union.

His Emancipation Proclamation was denounced by Northerners, Southerners and Europeans alike for its absurdity and hypocrisy; for, it only “freed” the slaves in the seceded states—where he could not reach them—and kept slavery intact in the North and the border states—where he could have freed them at once.

Lincoln on the Emancipation Proclamation:

"I never, in my life, felt more certain that I was doing right, than I do in signing this paper,” he declared. “If my name ever goes into history it will be for this act, and my whole soul is in it."

Of course then he pushed for and finally signed off on the 13th amendment which finished the job of freeing all slaves.

And I laugh at how you bring up "crushing defeats" of the North by the Confederacy. Something about a guy named Sherman comes to mind.

source your lincoln "quote", my boy...
...and there is no denying he only "emancipted" the slaves in the south (where he had no authority anyway) ignoring the border states and northern states where it still existed...and it was just to weaponize the negroes in the south to destabilize the south. That's why he didn't do it on the first day of the war he started...Why wait 2 years? BEcause he was a cynical, lying POS...typical politician...
Read some history...



The first two years the south was dominant.Read some history....the POS sherman and his murderous genocide against civilians didn't occur until much later...you really don't have any idea what you're talking about, do you?

 

[cnm]

the north INVADED the south which was a sovereign country at that point.The south offered to pay for all federal facilities on their property and escort all civilians and fed troops safely to their country...

It was no longer the south's property, they had conceded all right and title.

 

[Rotagilla]

Lincoln was a politician in the 1860s
In most ways, he was well ahead of his contemporaries in his positions on race, the institution of slavery and preserving the union
As a politician, he had to make concessions to the political and social views of the day....so some of his quotes may not stand up well in 21st century America

Rotagilla is convinced that because Lincoln said he didn't mind slavery a few times before he was President it's proof that he never issued the Emancipation Proclamation or signed into law the 13th amendment!

Very weak..I never said he didn't issue the proclamation..He can "proclaim" anything he wanted..but it was worthless legally..he had no authority over the south.

...and he allowed slavery to remain in the border states and in northern states where it still existed. The whole point was the north was growing tired of the war..there were draft riots in the north...they didn't want to fight for the negroes... and france and england seemed poised to aid the south, so lincoln pretended to seize the moral "high ground" and sway public opinion with his "proclamation"
..Have you never even READ the thing?

 

[frigidweirdo]

1. oh...right...the "suppressed lincoln speeches"...whatever..you're just arguing for the sake of arguing...

   
   No, the OP said he was teaching the truth and not propaganda. I'm asking what the hell the truth is.

Is the truth what we decide the truth is. Is the truth what YOU decide the truth is. Or is the truth what happened?

It's clearly not the latter.

 

[TheOldSchool]

For anyone who will be around D.C. in the next couple of months, Fall is a great time to visit the memorials.

As in - get shot, fall?

 

[Rotagilla]

Lincoln was a politician in the 1860s
In most ways, he was well ahead of his contemporaries in his positions on race, the institution of slavery and preserving the union
As a politician, he had to make concessions to the political and social views of the day....so some of his quotes may not stand up well in 21st century America

Rotagilla is convinced that because Lincoln said he didn't mind slavery a few times before he was President it's proof that he never issued the Emancipation Proclamation or signed into law the 13th amendment!

Very weak..I never said he didn't issue the proclamation..He can "proclaim" anything he wanted..but it was worthless legally..he had no authority over the south.

...and he allowed slavery to remain in the border states and in northern states where it still existed. The whole point was the north was growing tired of the war..there were draft riots in the north...they didn't want to fight for the negroes... and france and england seemed poised to aid the south, so lincoln pretended to seize the moral "high ground" and sway public opinion with his "proclamation"
..Have you never even READ the thing?

..and last but not least..if you think lincoln "signed into law the 13th amendment", you're so ignorant of history as to be unworthy of continuing this discussion...go read some history...LMAO..

*Pro Tip*
Lincoln wasn't alive when the 13th was "ratified"

 

[TheOldSchool]

Lincoln was a politician in the 1860s
In most ways, he was well ahead of his contemporaries in his positions on race, the institution of slavery and preserving the union
As a politician, he had to make concessions to the political and social views of the day....so some of his quotes may not stand up well in 21st century America

Rotagilla is convinced that because Lincoln said he didn't mind slavery a few times before he was President it's proof that he never issued the Emancipation Proclamation or signed into law the 13th amendment!

Very weak..I never said he didn't issue the proclamation..He can "proclaim" anything he wanted..but it was worthless legally..he had no authority over the south.

...and he allowed slavery to remain in the border states and in northern states where it still existed. The whole point was the north was growing tired of the war..there were draft riots in the north...they didn't want to fight for the negroes... and france and england seemed poised to aid the south, so lincoln pretended to seize the moral "high ground" and sway public opinion with his "proclamation"
..Have you never even READ the thing?

So you're just going to pretend the 13th amendment doesn't count for anything? Okay...