WSJ makes a correction to Karl Rove article

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Political Junky, Mar 22, 2012.

  1. Political Junky
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    Political Junky Gold Member

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    Thanks, WSJ for correcting the wording. Thanks, Rachel Maddow for calling them on it.
    Rove: 'The Road We've Traveled' With Obama - WSJ.com

    Editor's note: An earlier version of this column included an incomplete quote from Bill Clinton in the last paragraph.

    As for the killing of Osama bin Laden, Mr. Obama did what virtually any commander in chief would have done in the same situation. Even President Bill Clinton says in the film "I hope that's the call I would have made." For this to be portrayed as the epic achievement of the first term tells you how bare the White House cupboards are.
    >
    As originally posted, the words "I hope" were left out.
     
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  2. The Rabbi
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    The Rabbi Diamond Member

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    Oh, WOW! Dyn-O-Mite! That blows the whole article to smithereens.
    Oh, wait. No it doesn't.
     
  3. ladyliberal
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    ladyliberal Progressive Princess

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    The "I hope" changes the meaning, indicating that Clinton now believes that Obama's decision was correct. Rove's original incorrect quote implied that Clinton believes that was the choice he would have made without the benefit of hindsight. Given that Rove's whole point regards how difficult the decision was, this nearly reverses the original meaning.

    Still, as dishonest as it was, it seems to fit in well with the column as a whole. Perhaps Rove's greatest absurdity is that Jimmy Carter faced a weaker overall economy than Obama: he did not. Rove incorrectly concludes from the overall number of American jobs (in a time period that covers part of the economic crisis prior to the Stimulus) that the Stimulus did not created jobs. Where Obama criticizes his opponents for wanting to "let [the auto industry] go" Rove incorrectly interprets this as suggesting that bankruptcy was not an option (it was a bad option). Rove without explanation attributes certain promises regarding health care to Obama and calls them untrue. Rove's misleading phrasing also suggests that Iranian pursuit of nuclear power is a positive act of Obama's.

    Rove's basic point, that Obama's video was slanted and played loosely with the truth, is certainly correct. However, Rove's column is much worse in this regard.
     
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  4. The Rabbi
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    The Rabbi Diamond Member

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    It does not change much of anything. His point was that given the chance to take out bin Laden anyone would have done so. Especially Clinton, who never shied from bombing an aspirin factory if it could get himj votes.
    He is correct that Carter had a weaker economy. There were many structural issues from long before his tenure. Does the "Misery Index" mean anything to you? Stagflation?
    Bankruptcy for GM/Chrysler were the only options. In fact they filed bankruptcy. Had the normal rules applied this would be fine. But the Obama Administration trashed the rule of law
    Obama made many promises about health care reform. All of them have proven to be untrue. And they were known to be untrue when he made them.
    I'd suggest re-reading Rove's column with a more open mind. You know, the one libs pride themselves on?
     
  5. ladyliberal
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    ladyliberal Progressive Princess

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    The choice was not "Do you want us to take out bin Laden?" It was something more like:

    "We think we might found bin Laden. Do you want us to try to gather more information?" Yes.
    "OK, we think we might have found him (50% certainty), and we can't get any more information. Should we go in now?" Yes.
    "Should we involve the Pakistani authorities?" No.
    "Should we use helicopters or missiles?" Helicopters.

    I could easily imagine another president making different choices. I could also imagine an army general presented with the question "bin Laden might be at Tora Bora, or he might not. Should we commit enough ground troops to the battle to ensure we do capture him if he is there?" answering poorly, ans General Franks in fact did.

    I am familiar with the Misery index. It's not very scientific (even if we accept that we want a linear combination of UE and inflation, there's no reason to add the fractional unemployment to the annual inflation rate at one-to-one). It also purports to be a measure of misery, not of strength. Overall strength of the economy (which is not necessarily the thing I care most about) is better measured by GDP or by its rate of change. By that latter measure the recent time period (2008-09) was clearly the worst since the Great Depression (http://webcache.googleusercontent.c...onal/xls/gdpchg.xls+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us).


    It's absurd to say that bankruptcy for the auto industry was the only option. There were any number of complicated choices to make that affected the outcome.

    The Obama administration did not trash the rule of law. Had they violated the rule of law those creditors unhappy with the result could have successfully sued them.

    It's absurd to say that all of Obama's promises about health care have proven untrue. Do you really think you have an accurate mental catalog of Obama's promises, or do you accept as an article of faith that anything he says is untrue? In any event, Politifact documents a number of promises that have proven quite true: PolitiFact | The Obameter: Campaign Promises that are about Health Care.
     
  6. g5000
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    g5000 Diamond Member

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    The film is backward looking. That's so you don't notice no one has a clue what Obama's plans for the future are.

    Doesn't that lack of information strike anyone as very odd?
     
  7. Rozman
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    Rozman Gold Member Supporting Member

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    What choice did the President have with OBL.
    There wasn't any.
    To make the claim that the President made a historic choice in the matter is ludicrous.
     
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  8. ladyliberal
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    ladyliberal Progressive Princess

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    I think it's perfectly appropriate for the film to focus on the past. If it didn't, Obama would be accused of running away from his record. In any event, there's plenty of time for Obama to talk about the future later in the campaign. Right now there's some information on his website but it is pretty vague (though Romney's info is too vague for my tastes as well).

    If I had to guess Obama's plans for his second term, I would guess that they were pretty modest. A divided congress and the accumulation of opposition mean that Obama will be much much weaker in his second term. When was the last time a president had a major legislative accomplishment in his second term?
     
  9. Dick Tuck
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    Bush would have involved Pakistan, who have a bad habit of blowing operations like this.
     
  10. Vidi
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    Vidi CDZ prohibited

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    I don't think the inclusion or exclusion of "I hope" reflects on Obama as much as it would have reflected on Clinton.

    Most people just aren't going to pick up on that subtle of a nuance.
     

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