What would Africa be like if it were never colonized by Europeans?

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IM2

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This is an interesting video. Besides from the uncorked foolishness we have to endure here, this is an interesting look into what Africa might have been like if not for European colonization. Interestingly it is stated that it took 500 years for Europeans to win a battle against any African nation. Funny how that happens.



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Hmmmm..The Arab States would have subdued the Tribes. Hard to keep Europe completely out of the discussion..as they were crossing the Med into Africa from the dawn of history. You are postulating that Rome never conquered Carthage? The Phoenicians would have spread out..and consolidated.

No matter what..the hunter/gatherer tribes were doomed.

Interesting video..one should beware revisionist history though....as he said in the beginning..a lot of variables. I sense a definite agenda--in his presentation.

It is odd though...that people often overlook Rome...as though they were not part of Europe?
 
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We can ask "what ifs" all day long. The fact is it happened and whether people believe colonization is responsible or not, present day Africa is a crisis that needs to be fixed. For all the technology and knowledge we have today there is simply no reason for so many people around the world to live in those kinds of conditions.
 
We can ask "what ifs" all day long. The fact is it happened and whether people believe colonization is responsible or not, present day Africa is a crisis that needs to be fixed. For all the technology and knowledge we have today there is simply no reason for so many people around the world to live in those kinds of conditions.

When the countries that colonized still have business interests in Africa and control the politics, then colonization has not really ended.
 
Hmmmm..The Arab States would have subdued the Tribes. Hard to keep Europe completely out of the discussion..as they were crossing the Med into Africa from the dawn of history. You are postulating that Rome never conquered Carthage? The Phoenicians would have spread out..and consolidated.

No matter what..the hunter/gatherer tribes were doomed.

Interesting video..one should beware revisionist history though....as he said in the beginning..a lot of variables. I sense a definite agenda--in his presentation.

It is odd though...that people often overlook Rome...as though they were not part of Europe?

Given the euros got their asses whipped for 500 years yes we can talk about keeping them out of the discussion. Rome never conquered Carthage. Alexander was sent home by Hannibal.
 
Hmmmm..The Arab States would have subdued the Tribes. Hard to keep Europe completely out of the discussion..as they were crossing the Med into Africa from the dawn of history. You are postulating that Rome never conquered Carthage? The Phoenicians would have spread out..and consolidated.

No matter what..the hunter/gatherer tribes were doomed.

Interesting video..one should beware revisionist history though....as he said in the beginning..a lot of variables. I sense a definite agenda--in his presentation.

It is odd though...that people often overlook Rome...as though they were not part of Europe?

Given the euros got their asses whipped for 500 years yes we can talk about keeping them out of the discussion. Rome never conquered Carthage. Alexander was sent home by Hannibal.

Huh..History not your strong suit, eh? Hannibal did famously have some success..but in the end..the 2nd Punic war ended with the defeat of Carthage..and set the stage for the 3rd Punic war..and the total destruction of Carthage

I refer you to any study of the Punic Wars...and if you don't think utterly destroying Carthage, selling the population into slavery and sowing the field with salt---'Conquering'--I don't know what is:.

First Punic War:

"Save for the disastrous defeat at the Battle of Tunis in Africa, and the early naval defeats, the First Punic War was a nearly unbroken string of Roman victories. In 241 BC, Carthage signed a peace treaty under the terms of which they evacuated Sicily and paid Rome a large war indemnity. The long war was costly to both powers, but Carthage was more seriously destabilized."

Second Punic War:

"While fighting Hannibal in Italy, Hispania, and Sicily, Rome simultaneously fought against Macedon in the First Macedonian War. Eventually, the war was taken to Africa, where Carthage was defeated at the Battle of Zama (201 BC) [8] by Scipio Africanus. The end of the war saw Carthage's control reduced to only the city itself."

Third Punic War:

"In 149 BC, in an attempt to draw Carthage into open conflict, Rome made a series of escalating demands, one being the surrender of three hundred children of the nobility as hostages, and finally ending with the near-impossible demand that the city be demolished and rebuilt away from the coast, deeper into Africa. When the Carthaginians refused this last demand, Rome declared the Third Punic War. Having previously relied on mercenaries to fight their wars for them, the Carthaginians were now forced into a more active role in the defense of their city. They made thousands of makeshift weapons in a short time, even using women's hair for catapult strings, and were able to hold off the initial Roman attack. A second offensive under the command of Scipio Aemilianus resulted in a three-year siege before he breached the walls, sacked the city, and systematically burned Carthage to the ground in 146 BC. When the war ended, the remaining 50,000 Carthaginians, a small part of the original pre-war population, were sold into slavery by the victors – the normal fate in antiquity of inhabitants of sacked cities.[10] Carthage was systematically burned for 17 days; the city's walls and buildings were utterly destroyed. The remaining Carthaginian territories were annexed by Rome and reconstituted to become the Roman province of Africa.


After Rome emerged as victorious, significant Carthaginian settlements, such as those in Mauretania,[8] were taken over and aggrandized by the Romans. Volubilis, for example, was an important Roman town situated near the westernmost border of the Roman conquests. It was built on the site of the previous Carthaginian settlement that overlies an earlier neolithic habitation.[11]"


Punic Wars - Wikipedia

I'm not going to bother with the citations..but Rome had a number of provinces in Africa--for centuries--until the gradual breakup of the Roman Empire and the various defeats inflicted upon them by Assyrians, Persians and of course, Attila.
 
Hmmmm..The Arab States would have subdued the Tribes. Hard to keep Europe completely out of the discussion..as they were crossing the Med into Africa from the dawn of history. You are postulating that Rome never conquered Carthage? The Phoenicians would have spread out..and consolidated.

No matter what..the hunter/gatherer tribes were doomed.

Interesting video..one should beware revisionist history though....as he said in the beginning..a lot of variables. I sense a definite agenda--in his presentation.

It is odd though...that people often overlook Rome...as though they were not part of Europe?

Given the euros got their asses whipped for 500 years yes we can talk about keeping them out of the discussion. Rome never conquered Carthage. Alexander was sent home by Hannibal.

Huh..History not your strong suit, eh? Hannibal did famously have some success..but in the end..the 2nd Punic war ended with the defeat of Carthage..and set the stage for the 3rd Punic war..and the total destruction of Carthage

I refer you to any study of the Punic Wars...and if you don't think utterly destroying Carthage, selling the population into slavery and sowing the field with salt---'Conquering'--I don't know what is:.

First Punic War:

"Save for the disastrous defeat at the Battle of Tunis in Africa, and the early naval defeats, the First Punic War was a nearly unbroken string of Roman victories. In 241 BC, Carthage signed a peace treaty under the terms of which they evacuated Sicily and paid Rome a large war indemnity. The long war was costly to both powers, but Carthage was more seriously destabilized."

Second Punic War:

"While fighting Hannibal in Italy, Hispania, and Sicily, Rome simultaneously fought against Macedon in the First Macedonian War. Eventually, the war was taken to Africa, where Carthage was defeated at the Battle of Zama (201 BC) [8] by Scipio Africanus. The end of the war saw Carthage's control reduced to only the city itself."

Third Punic War:

"In 149 BC, in an attempt to draw Carthage into open conflict, Rome made a series of escalating demands, one being the surrender of three hundred children of the nobility as hostages, and finally ending with the near-impossible demand that the city be demolished and rebuilt away from the coast, deeper into Africa. When the Carthaginians refused this last demand, Rome declared the Third Punic War. Having previously relied on mercenaries to fight their wars for them, the Carthaginians were now forced into a more active role in the defense of their city. They made thousands of makeshift weapons in a short time, even using women's hair for catapult strings, and were able to hold off the initial Roman attack. A second offensive under the command of Scipio Aemilianus resulted in a three-year siege before he breached the walls, sacked the city, and systematically burned Carthage to the ground in 146 BC. When the war ended, the remaining 50,000 Carthaginians, a small part of the original pre-war population, were sold into slavery by the victors – the normal fate in antiquity of inhabitants of sacked cities.[10] Carthage was systematically burned for 17 days; the city's walls and buildings were utterly destroyed. The remaining Carthaginian territories were annexed by Rome and reconstituted to become the Roman province of Africa.


After Rome emerged as victorious, significant Carthaginian settlements, such as those in Mauretania,[8] were taken over and aggrandized by the Romans. Volubilis, for example, was an important Roman town situated near the westernmost border of the Roman conquests. It was built on the site of the previous Carthaginian settlement that overlies an earlier neolithic habitation.[11]"


Punic Wars - Wikipedia

I'm not going to bother with the citations..but Rome had a number of provinces in Africa--for centuries--until the gradual breakup of the Roman Empire and the various defeats inflicted upon them by Assyrians, Persians and of course, Attila.

I really think that a white person should not be talking about misinterpretations of history. You are talking about events occurring in BC but if we talk to you about how your asses benefitted from slavery, 150 years ago was too long ago to talk about. We are not talking about BC and therefore you talking about the Punic wars has no relevance. The Roman Empire was long gone in the 15-1600's and that is the time period this video and OP refers to.
 
Hmmmm..The Arab States would have subdued the Tribes. Hard to keep Europe completely out of the discussion..as they were crossing the Med into Africa from the dawn of history. You are postulating that Rome never conquered Carthage? The Phoenicians would have spread out..and consolidated.

No matter what..the hunter/gatherer tribes were doomed.

Interesting video..one should beware revisionist history though....as he said in the beginning..a lot of variables. I sense a definite agenda--in his presentation.

It is odd though...that people often overlook Rome...as though they were not part of Europe?

Given the euros got their asses whipped for 500 years yes we can talk about keeping them out of the discussion. Rome never conquered Carthage. Alexander was sent home by Hannibal.

Huh..History not your strong suit, eh? Hannibal did famously have some success..but in the end..the 2nd Punic war ended with the defeat of Carthage..and set the stage for the 3rd Punic war..and the total destruction of Carthage

I refer you to any study of the Punic Wars...and if you don't think utterly destroying Carthage, selling the population into slavery and sowing the field with salt---'Conquering'--I don't know what is:.

First Punic War:

"Save for the disastrous defeat at the Battle of Tunis in Africa, and the early naval defeats, the First Punic War was a nearly unbroken string of Roman victories. In 241 BC, Carthage signed a peace treaty under the terms of which they evacuated Sicily and paid Rome a large war indemnity. The long war was costly to both powers, but Carthage was more seriously destabilized."

Second Punic War:

"While fighting Hannibal in Italy, Hispania, and Sicily, Rome simultaneously fought against Macedon in the First Macedonian War. Eventually, the war was taken to Africa, where Carthage was defeated at the Battle of Zama (201 BC) [8] by Scipio Africanus. The end of the war saw Carthage's control reduced to only the city itself."

Third Punic War:

"In 149 BC, in an attempt to draw Carthage into open conflict, Rome made a series of escalating demands, one being the surrender of three hundred children of the nobility as hostages, and finally ending with the near-impossible demand that the city be demolished and rebuilt away from the coast, deeper into Africa. When the Carthaginians refused this last demand, Rome declared the Third Punic War. Having previously relied on mercenaries to fight their wars for them, the Carthaginians were now forced into a more active role in the defense of their city. They made thousands of makeshift weapons in a short time, even using women's hair for catapult strings, and were able to hold off the initial Roman attack. A second offensive under the command of Scipio Aemilianus resulted in a three-year siege before he breached the walls, sacked the city, and systematically burned Carthage to the ground in 146 BC. When the war ended, the remaining 50,000 Carthaginians, a small part of the original pre-war population, were sold into slavery by the victors – the normal fate in antiquity of inhabitants of sacked cities.[10] Carthage was systematically burned for 17 days; the city's walls and buildings were utterly destroyed. The remaining Carthaginian territories were annexed by Rome and reconstituted to become the Roman province of Africa.


After Rome emerged as victorious, significant Carthaginian settlements, such as those in Mauretania,[8] were taken over and aggrandized by the Romans. Volubilis, for example, was an important Roman town situated near the westernmost border of the Roman conquests. It was built on the site of the previous Carthaginian settlement that overlies an earlier neolithic habitation.[11]"


Punic Wars - Wikipedia

I'm not going to bother with the citations..but Rome had a number of provinces in Africa--for centuries--until the gradual breakup of the Roman Empire and the various defeats inflicted upon them by Assyrians, Persians and of course, Attila.

I really think that a white person should not be talking about misinterpretations of history. You are talking about events occurring in BC but if we talk to you about how your asses benefitted from slavery, 150 years ago was too long ago to talk about. We are not talking about BC and therefore you talking about the Punic wars has no relevance. The Roman Empire was long gone in the 15-1600's and that is the time period this video and OP refers to.


You are an idiot...you don't know what race I am..or what culture I come from. You don't get to set what is relevant..and what is not. A question was posed..you were incorrect..and showed you are uneducated in this matter..then, after correction, you continue to show your ass with wild speculation and racist rhetoric. White guilt is the last refuge of the ignorant..those who resort to it are the opposite side of the Alt/right--both sides..are flat out stupid. I expanded the conversation--perhaps I gave you too much credit. History is of a piece--cherry-picking the parts you like..is yet another sign of errant stupidity. When next you plan to engage someone intellectually, perhaps you should know what you are talking about?
 
What would Africa be like if it were never colonized by Europeans?

afreeka.jpeg
 
Hmmmm..The Arab States would have subdued the Tribes. Hard to keep Europe completely out of the discussion..as they were crossing the Med into Africa from the dawn of history. You are postulating that Rome never conquered Carthage? The Phoenicians would have spread out..and consolidated.

No matter what..the hunter/gatherer tribes were doomed.

Interesting video..one should beware revisionist history though....as he said in the beginning..a lot of variables. I sense a definite agenda--in his presentation.

It is odd though...that people often overlook Rome...as though they were not part of Europe?

Given the euros got their asses whipped for 500 years yes we can talk about keeping them out of the discussion. Rome never conquered Carthage. Alexander was sent home by Hannibal.

Huh..History not your strong suit, eh? Hannibal did famously have some success..but in the end..the 2nd Punic war ended with the defeat of Carthage..and set the stage for the 3rd Punic war..and the total destruction of Carthage

I refer you to any study of the Punic Wars...and if you don't think utterly destroying Carthage, selling the population into slavery and sowing the field with salt---'Conquering'--I don't know what is:.

First Punic War:

"Save for the disastrous defeat at the Battle of Tunis in Africa, and the early naval defeats, the First Punic War was a nearly unbroken string of Roman victories. In 241 BC, Carthage signed a peace treaty under the terms of which they evacuated Sicily and paid Rome a large war indemnity. The long war was costly to both powers, but Carthage was more seriously destabilized."

Second Punic War:

"While fighting Hannibal in Italy, Hispania, and Sicily, Rome simultaneously fought against Macedon in the First Macedonian War. Eventually, the war was taken to Africa, where Carthage was defeated at the Battle of Zama (201 BC) [8] by Scipio Africanus. The end of the war saw Carthage's control reduced to only the city itself."

Third Punic War:

"In 149 BC, in an attempt to draw Carthage into open conflict, Rome made a series of escalating demands, one being the surrender of three hundred children of the nobility as hostages, and finally ending with the near-impossible demand that the city be demolished and rebuilt away from the coast, deeper into Africa. When the Carthaginians refused this last demand, Rome declared the Third Punic War. Having previously relied on mercenaries to fight their wars for them, the Carthaginians were now forced into a more active role in the defense of their city. They made thousands of makeshift weapons in a short time, even using women's hair for catapult strings, and were able to hold off the initial Roman attack. A second offensive under the command of Scipio Aemilianus resulted in a three-year siege before he breached the walls, sacked the city, and systematically burned Carthage to the ground in 146 BC. When the war ended, the remaining 50,000 Carthaginians, a small part of the original pre-war population, were sold into slavery by the victors – the normal fate in antiquity of inhabitants of sacked cities.[10] Carthage was systematically burned for 17 days; the city's walls and buildings were utterly destroyed. The remaining Carthaginian territories were annexed by Rome and reconstituted to become the Roman province of Africa.


After Rome emerged as victorious, significant Carthaginian settlements, such as those in Mauretania,[8] were taken over and aggrandized by the Romans. Volubilis, for example, was an important Roman town situated near the westernmost border of the Roman conquests. It was built on the site of the previous Carthaginian settlement that overlies an earlier neolithic habitation.[11]"


Punic Wars - Wikipedia

I'm not going to bother with the citations..but Rome had a number of provinces in Africa--for centuries--until the gradual breakup of the Roman Empire and the various defeats inflicted upon them by Assyrians, Persians and of course, Attila.

I really think that a white person should not be talking about misinterpretations of history. You are talking about events occurring in BC but if we talk to you about how your asses benefitted from slavery, 150 years ago was too long ago to talk about. We are not talking about BC and therefore you talking about the Punic wars has no relevance. The Roman Empire was long gone in the 15-1600's and that is the time period this video and OP refers to.


You are an idiot...you don't know what race I am..or what culture I come from. You don't get to set what is relevant..and what is not. A question was posed..you were incorrect..and showed you are uneducated in this matter..then, after correction, you continue to show your ass with wild speculation and racist rhetoric. White guilt is the last refuge of the ignorant..those who resort to it are the opposite side of the Alt/right--both sides..are flat out stupid. I expanded the conversation--perhaps I gave you too much credit. History is of a piece--cherry-picking the parts you like..is yet another sign of errant stupidity. When next you plan to engage someone intellectually, perhaps you should know what you are talking about?

I don't mind being wrong about the Punic Wars, But the OP had nothing to do with this and because you could not argue the OP you decided to try taking it off topic. So I looked at what you posted and made my statement. And my statement is correct. We are not talking about 146 BC, the punic wars have nothing to do with this discussion. The roman empire did not exist at this time, The roman empire was not going to exist either. You did not expand anything. Expanding the conversation doesn't include talking about events happening 1600 years before especially when at the time we are talking Europe was itself divided, ignorant, recovering from plagues and economically weak.

I set what is relevant when I am the OP. I don't give a flying fuck what tace you are. This thread is not about the times during the Punic Wars. We are talking about at least 1500 AD not 146 BC. So the next time you want to intellectually engage, you study the time period in reference and do not jus think you cam argue willy nilly using a situation that was at least 1600 years before what we are talking about.

Idiot.
 
Advanced African Civilizations they never taught us

 
Given the euros got their asses whipped for 500 years yes we can talk about keeping them out of the discussion. Rome never conquered Carthage. Alexander was sent home by Hannibal.
WTF?!

The facts are that whites got beat down for 500 years trying to invade Africa. This is why most slaves are from the coasts.

You have chosen to believe a eurocentric version of history. If there are 2 sides to any story, why isn't there two sides to what happened in Africa?.

That's because there is and we are going to look at it. You don't have to. You can go on and keep your head buried in the racist sand it's buried in and that's The choice you have a right to make.
 
Sometimes whites like those here must be taught stern lessons.

The Greeks were the first civilized Europeans who were primarily civilized by the Black Africans of the Nile Valley. The Greeks passed on this acquired culture to the Romans who ultimately lost it, thus initiating the dark ages that lasted for 500 years. Civilization was again restored to Europe when another group of Black Africans, The Moors, brought the Dark Ages to an end.

In trying to hide the truth, white historians promote the lie that it was the Europeans who gave civilization to Africa when in fact this is a total reversal of the truth. In school you might have been brainwashed into thinking that western or white civilization was founded on Greek civilization, which seemed to just suddenly appear out of nowhere. What they were trying to conceal or deny was the fact that Greek civilization was a descendant, a child of the more advanced Black African civilization which had preceded it by thousands of years. In fact, Greek legend tells of Egyptian and Phoenician conquerors who had been ruling Greece until the 14th or 15th century B.C.


Lets add just a little more.

For 700 years (711-1492 A.D) during the Middle ages, the Black African Moors had dominated and ruled Spain, southern France and much of Scotland (southwest Europe), providing Europe with its finest civilization ever, recognizing earlier that Europe had again sunk to a level of almost complete barbarism, having lost all of the civilizing principles that were passed on by the ancient Greeks and Romans. Initially, Spain was the only country in Western Europe that had any semblance of civilization, but this later began to spread to Italy, Portugal and also into Northern Europe.

But while the Moors were re-civilizing Europe, noble empires in Ghana, Mali, and Songhai (Western Africa) were thriving and trading with the Moors, therefore Africa was clearly not some Dark Continent waiting for any European civilization. In fact, Black African Egyptians and Black African Moors were credited for having civilized the European barbarian.


By the 11th century, however, the Moroccan Islamic rulers of Spain had become decadent and soft, and in 1086 under the command of the Black-skinned Yusuf ibn Tashfin, the Almoravids, a dynasty of very Black Muslim sultans from Senegal in the heart of western Africa arrived, further consolidating the earlier incursions. Their rise to power began when a pilgrim named Yahya (the Muslim name for John the Baptist) returned home from Mecca and founded a new religious sect which quickly developed into a new military campaign, branching out from Senegal, and conquering all of Northwest Africa and Spain.

El Cid Yusuf ibn Tashfin, the greatest of the Almoravid leaders, defeated El Cid (right), one of Spain's most renowned and legendary folk heroes, and though Yusuf was almost 80 years old when he came to Spain, he was still quite energetic. Outnumbered by the Christians 3-to-1, his unconquerable spirit triumphed, and miraculously he destroyed King Alfonso of León and Castile at the Battle of Zalacca, where 70,000 Christian soldiers were on the run from Yusuf's army of 25,000 Muslims. One by one, Yusuf defeated the Christian generals, inflicting a humiliating defeat on the Christian army, with El Cid being the last one to fall, but when he did, practically the entire Iberian Peninsula was under Yusuf's control. Yusuf became King of an Empire that encompassed a large part of Africa and most of Spain. In 1090 Yusuf ibn Tashfin again invaded Spain, and turning conqueror, he seized all the Moorish territories of Spain except Zaragoza.

One more thing.

When history is taught to white people, the period called the "Middle Ages" is generally referred to as the "Dark Ages," and is portrayed in white history books as the period during which civilization in general, including the arts and sciences, laid idle. This was certainly true for the whites, but not for the Blacks. In fact, a painful piece of evidence that whites still cannot face up to is the reality that during the Middle Ages, the great empires of the world were Black empires, and the educational and cultural centres of the world were predominately African. Moreover, during that period, it was the white people who were the lawless barbarians.

During the dark ages in Christian Europe, the Moors had built more than 300 public baths throughout its 21 suburbs, also introducing Spain to underwear and bathing with soap, at a time when taking a bath was thought to be a diabolical practice to be shunned by all good Christians, and cleanliness was regarded as a sin. Human waste was simply thrown into the streets because there were no bathrooms available.

In addition to 700 mosques, the Moors also constructed magnificent cities in Spain, but the incredible city of Cordova was the most majestic of the tenth century with half a million inhabitants dwelling in over 113,000 homes. There were also well-paved roads with elevated sidewalks for pedestrians.

Alhambra Granada The houses, which were adorned with gardens as well as artificial fountains and orchards, contained marble balconies for summer, and hot-air ducts under the mosaic floors for the winter season. At night it was possible to travel for 10 miles by the light emanating from the lamps along a continuous block of buildings. All this was taking place several hundred years before there was a paved road in Paris, or a single street lamp in London, where even the streets were yet covered with mud and dark. If truth be told, London was yet a tiny mud-hut village. (Digest, 1973, p. 622).

Alhambra Throughout that period, Moorish monarchs were living in splendid palaces of highly polished marble and elaborately carved walls, with beautiful mosaic floors, while European Kings (England, France, and Germany) were living in big, cold, damp barns of unfinished stone which lacked windows and chimneys, with just a hole in the roof to remove any smoke.

Also at a time when Christian Europe had a mere two universities of any merit, the Moors had constructed more than 17 great universities, 800 public schools, numerous colleges and bookstores. Not even public libraries were in existence in Christian Europe during the 10th and 11th centuries, but Moorish Spain had more than 70, of which the one in Cordoba had a collection of 600,000 books!! Students from France and England travelled there to sit at the feet of Muslim intellectuals to study philosophy, science and medicine.

Females were encouraged to dedicate themselves to intense study since mother Africa was a matriarchal society, making Spain in that era, the only region where female doctors, lawyers, and scientists were established.

The Moors had an insatiable desire for knowledge, translating everything they could find into Arabic, even searching monasteries for rare books. They collected and translated ancient Egyptian and ancient scientific texts, which provided the gateway for the European to access higher learning at the end of Roman domination. In Moorish Spain, free education was available even to the poor and most humble, while in Christian Europe where superstition, barbarism and filth ran high, 99% of the populace was illiterate, including the kings who could neither read nor write.

The entrance of the Moors therefore, was responsible for the European rediscovery of art, music, science, mathematics, geography, geometry, political and physical Sciences, philosophy, personal hygiene, medicine, military training and manoeuvres.

Don't be scurred, read more here;

https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/africans-from-nile-valley-first-civilized-europeans-norman-mccreary
 
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