What brought the Ottomans down

[ekrem]

http://www2.humnet.ucla.edu/mellon/images/stories/monthlyseminars/reorienting the renaissance.pdf

Hurrem Sultan, the haseki (or favorite slave concubine) of the powerful Ottoman emperor Suleyman I (r.1520--66), was well known in Europe by her Christian name, Rosa or Roxolana.
Although by this time Ottoman rulers did not marry, Suleyman made Hurrem his legal wife when, after being manumitted by him, she refused to share his bed on the grounds that it was sinful for a free woman to cohabit outside wedlock. Hurrem became an important advisor to Suleyman, and her intimate letters to her husband included political advice as well as
declarations of love.

European as well as Ottoman commentators, both
contemporary and of later times, regarded her as inaugurating a manipulative
“sultanate of women,” which ultimately brought about the downfall of the Turkish
empire.

In his influential Generall History of the Turkes, Richard Knolles follows the
famous Ottoman historian Mustafa Ali in holding Roxolana responsible for poisoning
her husband’s mind and having his eldest son killed so that her own could inherit the
throne (...)

_________________________________________

That killed son was Mustafa, who was regarded as a Warrior type of man.
The Army and the Janissaries backed him for his braveness.
Instead, Hürrem or Roxelana gave the Empire Selim the Drunkard, who died by slipping in the Bath whilst being drunk.
It was also this drunkard who let it happen, that women definitely took over the Empire.

 

[High_Gravity]

THE JEWISH GENOCIDE OF ARMENIAN CHRISTIANS
http://www.jewishracism.com/JewishGenocide.htm
ANN/Groong -- REMEMBER THE FIRST HOLOCAUST

I was late to work this morning, can I blame the Jews for that as well?

 

[Ropey]

The Ottomans must be really pathetic if their blaming women for their failures.

It's the Turkish governing character HG. Their government is unwilling to accept responsibility for their acts so they blame it on others.

Sounds just like the Arab Governments who refuse they had a hand in the slave trade, funny they can't explain the presence of black people in those countries. They all moved there for the weather and job ops I suppose.

Much the same. It's seemingly systemic.

 

[Jos]

THE JEWISH GENOCIDE OF ARMENIAN CHRISTIANS
http://www.jewishracism.com/JewishGenocide.htm
ANN/Groong -- REMEMBER THE FIRST HOLOCAUST

I was late to work this morning, can I blame the Jews for that as well?

De nial is also a river in Africa

 

[Ropey]

You do seem to have a definite problem with women sharing power.

I agree with your interpretation syrenn.

 

[Jroc]

The Ottomans must be really pathetic if their blaming women for their failures.

It's the Turkish governing character HG. Their government is unwilling to accept responsibility for their acts so they blame it on others.

It Seems this is a common thing amongst muslim countries in general.

 

[ekrem]

Suleyman's father was Selim I.
Selim I was born to a biologically Muslim woman.
Selim I defeated every competing Muslim Empire, paraded with the Army in the Safavid capital of Tebriz, and brought the title of Caliph to Istanbul.
Selim I - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

His son, Suleyman paired first with a Muslim woman and gave birth to Mustafa who was liked by the Army and the Janissary corp for his braveness.
Then Suleyman paired with an Orthodox woman (Roxelana) who intrigued him to murder Mustafa.
After that, Roxelana gave birth to a Drunkard who ceded power to women.

This period lasts for about 130 years. Governmental affairs become chaotic with a Grand-Vizier serving for less then 12 months.
In this period, the Europeans finally gain the upper-hand over the Ottomans.

 

[High_Gravity]

Maybe instead of the US Marines we should be sending Christian harems to Afghanistan to tackle the Taliban.

 

[Sunni Man]

To have a Zionist Jew point fingers at another nation and yell about genocide.

While at the same time defending Israel's current genocide on the Palestinian people.

Is the most disgusting and pathetic form of hypocrisy the world has ever seen.

 

[Ropey]

To have a Zionist Jew point fingers at another nation and yell about genocide.

While at the same time defending Israel's current genocide on the Palestinian people.

Is the most disgusting and pathetic form of hypocrisy the world has ever seen.

Do you see the Palestinian issue as worse than the Armenian issue? Would you like some comparisons?

If so, create a thread about the two and let's have at 'er Sunni Man.

I'm ready, but I doubt you have the stones.

 

[ekrem]

You do seem to have a definate problem with women sharing power.
(...)

Those were different times.
In today's world, there are supra-national organizations like the UN who make making war more complicated.
In comparison to yesterday's world, today's world is a lot more static when it comes to War and Conflict.

Back then, there was non-stop war, highly inflated with religion. Full piracy on the Seas.
So, yes, I don't think it was good that women took over the power in that kind of world.

 

[boedicca]

Barco loungers and Lazy Boys brought down the Ottomans.

Who needs a foot stool when one has a reclining lounge?

 

[High_Gravity]

The Ottoman Empire was a sad joke.

 

[High_Gravity]

The girl scouts could take down the Ottoman Empire, what a bunch of clowns.

 

[ekrem]

To have a Zionist Jew point fingers at another nation and yell about genocide.

While at the same time defending Israel's current genocide on the Palestinian people.

Is the most disgusting and pathetic form of hypocrisy the world has ever seen.

The punch line of this story is:
Don't marry outside your culture, so your bloodline does not become weaker.

There are some cultures in this world, who were conquered and were forced to mix with the invaders.
The Ottomans mixed voluntarily and that brought their demise.

 

[Ropey]

To have a Zionist Jew point fingers at another nation and yell about genocide.

While at the same time defending Israel's current genocide on the Palestinian people.

Is the most disgusting and pathetic form of hypocrisy the world has ever seen.

In April 1915 the Ottoman government embarked upon the systematic decimation of its civilian Armenian population. The persecutions continued with varying intensity until 1923 when the Ottoman Empire ceased to exist and was replaced by the Republic of Turkey. The Armenian population of the Ottoman state was reported at about two million in 1915. An estimated one million had perished by 1918, while hundreds of thousands had become homeless and stateless refugees. By 1923 virtually the entire Armenian population of Anatolian Turkey had disappeared.

Post that thread Sunni Man.

 

[High_Gravity]

To have a Zionist Jew point fingers at another nation and yell about genocide.

While at the same time defending Israel's current genocide on the Palestinian people.

Is the most disgusting and pathetic form of hypocrisy the world has ever seen.

The punch line of this story is:
Don't marry outside your culture, so your bloodline does not become weaker.

There are some cultures in this world, who were conquered and were forced to mix with the invaders.
The Ottomans mixed voluntarily and that brought their demise.

Sounds like a quote from the Ku Klux Klan.

 

[ekrem]

I have thought long about this issue but hesitated to talk about about my conclusions in message boards.
But, that's my conclusions about that part of history.

And from History we take lessons to avoid making the same mistakes.

 

[Ropey]

The punch line of this story is:
Don't marry outside your culture, so your bloodline does not become weaker.

There are some cultures in this world, who were conquered and were forced to mix with the invaders.
The Ottomans mixed voluntarily and that brought their demise.

Sounds like a quote from the Ku Klux Klan.

This is where the true bigotry comes and is what the reason was for the Turkish Genocide of the Armenians.

Ekrem spouts off the same intolerance that brought about the Turkish Slaughter of the Armenians.

See it?

 

[ekrem]

(...)

See it?

Says the guy, who has built his house on lands, which were cleansed in a multi-cultural genocide.
If I want your moral advice, I will let you know.