War On Christmas Deniers

[nukeman]

In my school we were regularly required to hear Christian prayers every morning. By the way, it was a public school.

You were required to HEAR but not take part in, other than being repsectful and quite.

Untill I was in 3rd grade we had a prayer before the lunch period. This was a Christian prayer(public school as well). If I was in a Public School that was in a predominately Jewish community I would expect to hear a Jewish prayer and the same goes for an Islamic community. this is where a lot of Libberals lose it they think because someone doesnt agree than they are being persecuted. If you dont agree with the prayer than quitely tolerate it that is exactly what I would do if I was in an area with another prodominate religion. Tolerance is a two way street I should not be forced to tolerate another religion but have them not have to tolerate mine. Do you see the irony in this or are you just not getting it.....

 

[Gunny]

You ALWAYS present the "other side." If it's corrupt, perverted, dishonest, wrong or bad, you will champion the cause. They got a new icon just for YOU:[/QUOTE


The other side of what?

Loony liberalism? He plays the role of the offended victim very well

Matts isn't loony .... he's dishonest.

 

[nukeman]

OK I thought about this and the only people being forced to do anything this Holiday season are the ones that are displaying Christian Icons. If you can disprove this Matts I would like for you to show me.

That being said there is deffinitley something amiss in this country when the primary religion has to be forced to REMOVE anything relating to it from all public and gov't offices.....

 

[dilloduck]

OK I thought about this and the only people being forced to do anything this Holiday season are the ones that are displaying Christian Icons. If you can disprove this Matts I would like for you to show me.

That being said there is deffinitley something amiss in this country when the primary religion has to be forced to REMOVE anything relating to it from all public and gov't offices.....

Maybe secularists have icon envy. If they had one one that expressed anything positive I would be glad to hang it on my Christmas Tree.

 

[Gunny]

OK I thought about this and the only people being forced to do anything this Holiday season are the ones that are displaying Christian Icons. If you can disprove this Matts I would like for you to show me.

That being said there is deffinitley something amiss in this country when the primary religion has to be forced to REMOVE anything relating to it from all public and gov't offices.....

It's called the majority suffering the tyranny of the minority. The desires of the one outweigh the needs of the many.

 

[manu1959]

No. We began each day of the entire school year listening to a Christian prayer to the chagrin of non-Christians. I’m confident that if you had to sit through Islamic prayers to Allah, you would feel as though you were being treated unfairly.

well take comfort that my children will not have to endure the pain of listening to the moral and ethical stories of the bible and will instead be told to accept two mommies and two daddies as families as normal, and that competition and grades and dodge ball and tag are bad and make people feel bad.

 

[Abbey Normal]

well take comfort that my children will not have to endure the pain of listening to the moral and ethical stories of the bible and will instead be told to accept two mommies and two daddies as families as normal, and that competition and grades and dodge ball and tag are bad and make people feel bad.

 

[mattskramer]

Maybe secularists have icon envy. If they had one one that expressed anything positive I would be glad to hang it on my Christmas Tree.

I like the peace symbol.

http://www.nonukesnorth.net/images/Symbol.gif

 

[Gunny]

I like the peace symbol.

http://www.nonukesnorth.net/images/Symbol.gif

What a shock. Mattsktramer's symbol is the footprint of the American chicken.

 

[mattskramer]

It's called the majority suffering the tyranny of the minority. The desires of the one outweigh the needs of the many.

Oh, please. What are you suffering? All that we are asking for is a little bit of recognition and respect for less popular religions. Shheesh. Can’t the schools allow a Muslim prayer once in a while? Anyway, it is pretty evident that there is establishment of religion – as far as the public school system is concerned.

 

[mattskramer]

well take comfort that my children will not have to endure the pain of listening to the moral and ethical stories of the bible and will instead be told to accept two mommies and two daddies as families as normal, and that competition and grades and dodge ball and tag are bad and make people feel bad.

That is neat how you lumped so many other things together. Please. We can still have moral and ethical stories without reading from the Bible. It is not normal for children to have two mommies and two daddies, but it is okay to have two mommies and two daddies. I do not like the lack of competition for academic and athletic grades.

 

[Gunny]

Oh, please. What are you suffering? All that we are asking for is a little bit of recognition and respect for less popular religions. Shheesh. Can’t the schools allow a Muslim prayer once in a while? Anyway, it is pretty evident that there is establishment of religion – as far as the public school system is concerned.

No, the school's CAN'T allow even one Muslim prayer if they can't allow even one Christian prayer.

What you're asking is that everyone try and be politically correct and the vast majority cater to the beliefs of the minority.

 

[Gunny]

That is neat how you lumped so many other things together. Please. We can still have moral and ethical stories without reading from the Bible. It is not normal for children to have two mommies and two daddies, but it is okay to have two mommies and two daddies. I do not like the lack of competition for academic and athletic grades.

Morals and ethics based on WHAT? Judeo-Christian tradition/law, is what.

And no, it is NOT okay to have two mommies and/or two daddies. It's abnormal as Hell.

 

[dilloduck]

Oh, please. What are you suffering? All that we are asking for is a little bit of recognition and respect for less popular religions. Shheesh. Can’t the schools allow a Muslim prayer once in a while? Anyway, it is pretty evident that there is establishment of religion – as far as the public school system is concerned.

We??? What group you hanging with THESE days ?

 

[mattskramer]

No, the school's CAN'T allow even one Muslim prayer if they can't allow even one Christian prayer.

What you're asking is that everyone try and be politically correct and the vast majority cater to the beliefs of the minority.

The American schools averages 180 days of instruction per year. There were 180 Christian prayers at my school each year recited to a practically captive audience. Not once was a Jewish or Muslim prayer allowed. You see no problem with this. Perhaps other religions should not be given perfectly equal time, but considering that we have the anti-establishment clause, I would think that some consideration for other religious prayers be given – if only for a day. Is that asking too much? Oh well. We simply agree to disagree.

 

[mattskramer]

Morals and ethics based on WHAT? Judeo-Christian tradition/law, is what.

Morals and ethics come from a variety of sources: The Bible (or other religious book) is a source. Other sources include philosophy, reason, and experience

And no, it is NOT okay to have two mommies and/or two daddies. It's abnormal as Hell.

I did not say that having two mommies and/or two daddies is normal. I said that it is okay.

 

[Gunny]

Morals and ethics come from a variety of sources: The Bible (or other religious book) is a source. Other sources include philosophy, reason, and experience

Bullshit. Our morals, and the way we perceive things is based on the teaching of our society which is based on Judeo-Christian morals/ethics/laws.

You deceive yourself if you believe otherwise. Buth then, that seems to be SOP with YOU.


I did not say that having two mommies and/or two daddies is normal. I said that it is okay.

It isn't okay. Only you and those like you and your concocted BS try to spin it that way.

 

[mattskramer]

Bullshit. Our morals, and the way we perceive things is based on the teaching of our society which is based on Judeo-Christian morals/ethics/laws.

People are individuals. Some individuals Use the Bible as a source for their morals and ethics. Some people use teachings from other religious books (including the Koran). Some people think about past event and derive an ethics and value system from it. Some people read about the writings of different philosophers and derive their morals from an interpretation of those people.

Again, students can be taught about ethics and morality without even being quoted something from the Bible.

You think that it is not okay to have two mommies and/or two daddies. I think that it is okay to have two mommies and/or two daddies. You have your opinion and you have a right to it and to speak it. I have my opinion and I have a right to it and to speak it. We simply agree to disagree.

 

[Gunny]

People are individuals. Some individuals Use the Bible as a source for their morals and ethics. Some people use teachings from other religious books (including the Koran). Some people think about past event and derive an ethics and value system from it. Some people read about the writings of different philosophers and derive their morals from an interpretation of those people.

Again, students can be taught about ethics and morality without even being quoted something from the Bible.

You think that it is not okay to have two mommies and/or two daddies. I think that it is okay to have two mommies and/or two daddies. You have your opinion and you have a right to it and to speak it. I have my opinion and I have a right to it and to speak it. We simply agree to disagree.

Thanks fo rmaking MY point with your argument. You have a bad habit of doing that to yourself.

Look at the differences in right and wrong between "some individuals" who use the Bible, and the one who use the Koran.

Students can be taught about ethics and morality without using the Bible just so long as you avoid origin. The big flaw in that is that there is NO universal set of ethics or morality. Ours are Judeo-Christian. You and people like you have just thrown out the reason as you pick and choose which morals and ethics you wish to keep, and those you wish to throw out without fear of consequence.

I don't agree to disagree with you, matts. I agree you're wrong, as usual. YOU are what is wrong in this country. The US can only be destroyed from within, and it's people like you who are leading the charge. Be a good American and move to antoher country and undermine THEIR culture instead of ours.

 

[mattskramer]

Thanks fo rmaking MY point with your argument. You have a bad habit of doing that to yourself.

Look at the differences in right and wrong between "some individuals" who use the Bible, and the one who use the Koran.

Students can be taught about ethics and morality without using the Bible just so long as you avoid origin. The big flaw in that is that there is NO universal set of ethics or morality. Ours are Judeo-Christian. You and people like you have just thrown out the reason as you pick and choose which morals and ethics you wish to keep, and those you wish to throw out without fear of consequence.

I don't agree to disagree with you, matts. I agree you're wrong, as usual. YOU are what is wrong in this country. The US can only be destroyed from within, and it's people like you who are leading the charge. Be a good American and move to antoher country and undermine THEIR culture instead of ours.

You choose the Bible. These two people choose the Koran, That Hindu guy chooses the Bhagavad Gita. The Buddhists have their scriptures. Joe likes the writings of Immanuel Kant. Sam likes utilitarianism. The origins for my philosophy come primarily from the early writers of libertarian view.

I’m sorry to disappoint you but you are not the ultimate decider on who is right and who is wrong. This conversation is going nowhere. It is just turning into a childish exchange of “You are wrong” and “No. You are wrong”. Just keep thinking that you are right.

Has it ever occurred to you that perhaps the religious right and conservatives my be bad for America. After all, in the early days if America, it was the radical liberals who revolted against British rule. No. You probably never considered such things. Stay safely tucked away in your shell.