US Middle schools are to promote "Tolerance"

[wolvie20m]

P.S. Wolvie, I know what your screen name is, and I just wrote "wolfie" to press your buttons because you've corrected like 32498230943 people. I didn't mean to piss you off as much as I did. I find it somewhat ironic that you'd choose to insult me by saying I make "allot of mistakes". Anyway, if terms of being "blind to the harsh truth of the real world", I can't say that I'm enlightened, but I have a pretty strong sense that my eyes are open as far if not farther than yours are. I don't exactly relish being condescended to by someone younger than me (you're probably 16 or 17, yeah?), so I'd appreciate if you'd lay off me a touch.

First off sorry if you felt I was getting into, I do get heated and sometimes seem aggressive. No not 16 or 17, nearly 21(April 20). You seem to have a happy go lucky everyone can get along. When this is just simply not the truth.

What I'd like to know is where these tolerant people were when their frickin' brats were beating me up because I was under 5'6". Where was all their tolerance then?

As you can see it's been happing probably since the beginning of time. So why now why mention gay's so blatantly? I don't think their going as far to destabilize society, no, just trying to push gay/lesbian more mainstream then it already is. They took it too far when they brought it into a classroom. If you can't see this well I hope you do someday when you have children. I have 2 nieces and I wouldn't want this taught in their school. I think there’s other places they can be taught this, a school not being one. It takes time to be accepted into a society, pushing it into peoples schools and onto thier children isn't right.

 

[Shattered]

They also use countless other names and words, to single out fag is bias towards one word.

Thats just typical, and sad. Lets blame the parents, lets blame the media, and entertainment. Whatever happened to blaming the kids who did it!! I blame them! The reason they killed was for personal reasons, they are even to be said this is for picking on us, in a more vulgar term. So where was this then?

Are you going to blame the kids when they obviously don't know right from wrong, because they haven't been *taught* by their parents? What *difference* does it make which word is used, so long as the *end result* is the same?

Put the responsibility where it lies. If parents weren't so god damned lazy, and taught their kids right from wrong in the FIRST place, teachers wouldn't feel the need to waste perfectly good learning time on crap like this.

Just out of curiousity, where do you think a parents responsibility begins, and ends?

You sound like one of those kids that ran around shouting "Fag!" to every child who may have been gay, was just a geek, or an outsider in any way. Did you also twist the heads off small rodents just for amusement?

 

[Shattered]

If you completely remove the word "gay" from this scenario, and just wanted to have a "no name-calling day" (kinda like funny hair day, wear red day, pajama day, etc) without anyone specifying a single group of people, would you guys have a problem with it, or would you be more in favor of it?

I'm betting you'd be more in favor of it. It's amazing what one single solitary word does to change a persons entire outlook on something...

(And Wolvie - If you're going to pick at someone for making a lot of mistakes, make sure your own posts are not riddled with spelling errors, grammatical errors, lack of punctuation, and just generally bad sentence structure. If you can't clean yours up, don't pick on someone elses, or we'll need a "Political Board Tolerance Day".)

 

[pegwinn]

Pegwinn, I agree with everything you wrote, and I'm your first two posts seem somewhat incompatible.. I don't think "it isn't the responsibility of the school to teach values, tolerance morals" is compatible with "it is to the school to reinforce the parents in the arena of value systems, moral compass, and simple right and wrong".

It is not the schools job to teach values, or ethics, or right and wrong.
It is the schools job to reinforce what the parents teach about values, ethics, and right and wrong. They reinforce parental teachings by setting rules of polite conduct in school, setting a fair, firm, and consistant disciplinary policy for those that violate the rules.

Parents are to reinforce the schools academic teachings by making sure lil johnnie does his schoolwork and stays focused on studies.

I'm 21, I have no children of my own but have assistant-taught 2 semesters of high school English in the NYC public school system. I don't believe I'm "confused" on the issue-- I simply believe that "name-calling" is a prevalent factor in the abuse children put each other through; dealing with this abuse and preventing it are, at root, what you seem to believe to be issue that should not be dealt with at school. I believe that simply punishing a student for calling someone a fag isn't satisfactory. When children take the time to learn about minorities, most of the time the exposure to information will reduce their prejudices on its own.

I'm 40, I have placed two kids (ages 22 and 19) thru public schools with a 14 year old in currently in the 9th grade. Name calling isn't polite. It is appropriate that if a student is bullying another or being disruptive to simply remove the student. Then you tell the parent to fix the root problem. My teaching experience is limited to training Marines. The group dynamics are different. My point is that it is MY job to teach "thou shalt not pound.....". Not the teachers. Her job is tough enough without haveing to be a combination drill instructor/social worker.

OBTW I am well aware of the parents not living up to thier end of the bargain. If they did, this wouldn't be needed. Have a good one now.

 

[elephant]

This whole debate is soooooo gay! Puh-lease.

 

[freeandfun1]

Frankly, I look at it this way:

In many ways, being called names, etc. helps prepare one for the real world. Hell, I was fed my fair share of shit as a kid, and it gave me "backbone" and resolve. Now, if name calling and picking on kids gets out of control, then it is an issue. But it is part of growing up and in my opinion, it is more important to teach kids how to DEAL with it when it does happen as it will all through life on one level or another. If you start teaching kids that they can cry to mommie or the teacher, then they are not going to learn how to deal with life or how to make lemonade when life gives you lemons.

 

[OCA]

Yet I don't see why this only happens when gays are affected. Maybe you could anwser why hasn't action been taken after Columbine? The reason among many was they were constantly bullied even allowed one kid to live for not picking on them. Why wasn't this "Tolerance Day" promoted then to stop all bulling? Maybe even before that, could of saved those 9 lives. My B-Day was on april 20, the same day as that I felt terrible, I couldn't even celebrate after hearing that. Anyways why now and why so obvisly on Gays? Like I said why not for the poor kids? Or the kids who aren't "cool"? Or for the "Ugly Girls"? Or "geeks"? or the "rockers"? My point is this is simply a way to expoilt childern for a political reason, sad to say the least.

A child in middle school does not have the capacity yet to make the choice to smoke pole or not to smoke pole and that is exactly what it is...a choice.

How come a teacher would get fired for teaching that homnosexuality is wrong and not get fired for the opposite? I find this hypocracy(sp?) maddening.

This country is headed to hell if this madness isn't stopped.

 

[wolvie20m]

If you completely remove the word "gay" from this scenario, and just wanted to have a "no name-calling day" (kind of like funny hair day, wear red day, pajama day, etc) without anyone specifying a single group of people, would you guys have a problem with it, or would you be more in favor of it?

Yes I would cause it doesn't deal with sexuality of people. That little word Gay and talking about it is more for adults. Not for middle school kids.

(And Wolvie - If you're going to pick at someone for making a lot of mistakes, make sure your own posts are not riddled with spelling errors, grammatical errors, lack of punctuation, and just generally bad sentence structure. If you can't clean yours up, don't pick on someone elses, or we'll need a "Political Board Tolerance Day".)

Well English and math aren't my things and I'll be first to admit. I get allot of things wrong. I just get frustrated when someone messes up my name when it's spelled so clearly. And that’s been settled so there . Oh yea and it else’s not elses, just thought you might want to know.

You sound like one of those kids that ran around shouting "Fag!" to every child who may have been gay, was just a geek, or an outsider in any way. Did you also twist the heads off small rodents just for amusement?

You know I did say it, but also I've been called fag too. It's a hip or cool word for now and it's not going anywhere. Just as ****** faded away into nigga, perhaps fag will do the same. No actually I like most animals, rodents nope never touched one.

 

[5stringJeff]

Shameless plug for my own post on tolerance and validation!

http://www.usmessageboard.com/forums/showthread.php?t=17062

 

[Annie]

I've refrained from commenting, to see what other adults, especially parents think.

I teach middle school, albeit in a parochial system. We teach 'tolerance' of all people, keeping in mind that while some acts are wrong, people deserve the respect that being human God grants them. Teachers are expected to model the correct behavior and anyone who thinks one can't tell which kids will probably be 'gay' by 5th grade, well your memory is faulty.

Now I had one of my kids in public school from 3rd grade on, the other two in public high schools. Whatever grades they were in, the teachers were expected to model correct behavior. It was openly discussed that 'hate speech' and 'actions' would not be tolerated. Thoughts were 'not controlled' by school, but behavior must be. Students who tried to 'get away with' were reprimanded and parents called in.

 

[Shattered]

Yes I would cause it doesn't deal with sexuality of people. That little word Gay and talking about it is more for adults. Not for middle school kids.

So, Wolvie... Your entire problem with this thing is the use of one word: gay.

Gay is gay. Regardless of whether it's a middle school student, high school student, or 85 year old.

Doesn't it seem a little odd to you that you're fighting something merely because of the choice of wording used, rather than any actual, important *principle*?

 

[wolvie20m]

No not cause of the word but, when they describe gays and gay/lesbian behavior. Now I wasn't there and I don't know how far they got into that. So I won't say I do. Yet teaching a child about homosexual behavior isn't right. That's my view on the subject.

Let me pose a question for you. Do you think Homosexuality should be taught in sex Ed.? Would that be taking it too far?

 

[Shattered]

No not cause of the word but, when they describe gays and gay/lesbian behavior. Now I wasn't there and I don't know how far they got into that. So I won't say I do. Yet teaching a child about homosexual behavior isn't right. That's my view on the subject.

You previously stated that you wouldn't have a problem with it if they'd used a word other than "gay". Now you say your problem with it isn't the word.. Which is it?

Let me pose a question for you. Do you think Homosexuality should be taught in sex Ed.? Would that be taking it too far?

How, precisely, do you "teach" homosexuality? What do you want a teacher to say? "Homosexuality is bad."? That will create even more problems for those gay students that are there for an *education* - not to have their lives picked apart. It sounds like this day is strictly to enforce the fact that any derrogatory comments toward another individual really have no place in the classroom. Everyone is there for the same reason - to get an education.

 

[elephant]

By advocating against "Gay Rights" why should they get extra rights if their just people like us? Don't get me wrong one thing they should get is civil unions NOT marriage. I just don't see them as deserving special treatment for going against nature. I'm tired of it like I said it's CRAP. They get should get the same rights no more no less.

I was joking, sorry.

 

[wolvie20m]

You previously stated that you wouldn't have a problem with it if they'd used a word other than "gay". Now you say your problem with it isn't the word.. Which is it?

You said it below, teaching homosexuality in the school is wrong. It shouldn't be taught its ok, niether should it be taught it's wrong. Shouldn't be in the schools period.

How, precisely, do you "teach" homosexuality? What do you want a teacher to say? "Homosexuality is bad."? That will create even more problems for those gay students that are there for an *education* - not to have their lives picked apart. It sounds like this day is strictly to enforce the fact that any derrogatory comments toward another individual really have no place in the classroom. Everyone is there for the same reason - to get an education.

I couldn't agree with you more. They should be there for an education. Nothing more nothing less.

Well this day shouldn't of been targeted at gays, but at everyone that simple

 

[wolvie20m]

I was joking, sorry.

I wasn't.

 

[elephant]

I wasn't.

... tough guy.

 

[wolvie20m]

:rotflmao: .....no just telling ya how I feel about the whole subject..

 

[Hobbit]

I think my last post on this subject was misunderstood. I was trying to point out the hypocrisy of the "tolerance" movement because of the fact that for decades, they've overlooked some of the most oppressed groups (short people and "nerds") in favor of more politically correct groups like gays and minorities. What's needed is not "awareness" of everything you can get picked on for. What's needed are tough principals who are willing to actually DO something about bullies.

Seriously, I don't know what you were reading into it, because I can't make sense of the how the replies relate to my post. It's almost like you thought I wanted them to *keep* gay awareness in schools and also raise awareness of short people. That would be retarded.

 

[wolvie20m]

It's almost like you thought I wanted them to *keep* gay awareness in schools and also raise awareness of short people. That would be retarded.

Are you making fun of the mentally inpaired?..


See now theres a thought, not jus the princepal's but, teachers and all staff at the school to take it more seriously. Not have some day where lets all kiss and make up(which would never happen in Middle or High School).