Transformed Into What?

[Flanders]

When the people find they can vote themselves money that will herald the end of the republic.

Listen to Barack Taqiyya proving Benjamin Franklin was correct:

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=KrefKCaV8m4]Obama: "Fundamentally Transforming the United States of America" Long Version - YouTube[/ame]​

Barack Taqiyya said he was going to fundamentally transform America. His critics, myself included on occasion, put the cart before the horse and accused him of driving America towards socialism/communism. As true as that charge is most Americans never understood that he first had to transform this country into a full-fledged democracy. That is exactly what he has been doing. His plan was never devious; indeed, it is so conspicuous it is rooted in six words:

Democracy is the road to socialism. Karl Marx

Barack Taqiyya’s transformation to democracy is succeeding beyond his wildest dreams because 30 to 40 percent of the American people believe democracy is the best form of government ever devised. That misguided belief began almost a century ago when Woodrow Wilson sent Americans to democracy’s first slaughter:

Making the World "Safe for Democracy": Woodrow Wilson Asks for War

Making the world safe for democracy continues Wilson’s WWI butchery to this day. For almost a century every vile act, every corrupt election, every loss of freedom, committed in the name of democracy went unchallenged. No one dared argue that democracy is bad thing?

Cultivating the idea that America was founded by racist white guys is a calculated cultural lie told to give democracy credit for America’s greatness. The lie worked. Thanks to the education-entertainment-media-complex a majority of at least three generations of Americans firmly believe that America was always a democracy worth fighting for. It isn’t. Democracy is never worth fighting for.

NOTE: Not once was America’s military sent to foreign lands to fight for limited government. More to the point, not one cent of foreign aid was spent promoting a republic modeled after the one America’s Founders created.

Finally, over the years, I’ve posted countless messages denouncing democracy. Todd Keister’s article offers a few obvious truths about democracy confirming that Barack Taqiyya has to know that his transformation would destroy the country he despises.

We have indeed degenerated into a democracy -- socialism is firmly established and has openly won two consecutive presidential elections. The wolves have voted, and we are being served for dinner.

June 21, 2013
The Dangers of Democracy
By Todd Keister

Articles: The Dangers of Democracy

 

[editec]

The only flaw in the ointment here is that every form of government is an attack on what he calls "natural rights".

What are these natural rights Todd explains:

the right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness -- rights granted to them by God, or simply because they are human beings. As John Adams put it, "[y]ou have rights antecedent to all earthly governments; rights that cannot be repealed or restrained by human laws; rights derived from the great legislator of the universe."

Read more: Articles: The Dangers of Democracy
Follow us: @AmericanThinker on Twitter | AmericanThinker on Facebook

What Todd does NOT explain is that no government on earth can assure us these natural rights.

Certainly the government crafted in the US consitution cannot assure us our nature rights, either.

Any government granting power to a few (which our constitution CLEARLY does) is violation of these "natural rights" (as Todd defines them, at least).

Basically the concept of natural rights is RIGHT WING MAGICAL THINKING.

And ya know something? This concept of natural rights is not even well thought out magical thinking either.

Do I think we have the "right" to live as we choose?

Of course I do.

But no government on earth can or will assure us that right.

Every government on earth must violate that right to exist.

Every government, folks...every government

 

[Saigon]

Democracy is a terrible thing. Much better we have one party rule, right?

Btw, Flanders. Please do not make up silly names for real people. Use their real names, or at least something logical and indentifiable.

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

I prefer a Republic. Which is what America was designed to be according to our Founding Fathers. For those who do not know America as a Republic recite your pledge of Allegience. It's all still there. ( at this writing anyhow )

-Jeri

 

[Saigon]

Jeremiah -

There is no contradictoon between Republic and Democracy, anymore so than there is with monarchy and democracy.

What Flanders advocates for here is rule by an extremist elite; not rule by the people.

 

[midcan5]

"No one talks more passionately about his rights than he who in the depths of his soul doubts whether he has any." Friedrich Nietzsche

The only flaw in the ointment here is that every form of government is an attack on what he calls "natural rights"....

Basically the concept of natural rights is RIGHT WING MAGICAL THINKING.

And ya know something? This concept of natural rights is not even well thought out magical thinking either......

Exactly, natural rights are creations of humankind, both adjective and noun are words that carry meanings that don't exist outside of human language usage in society.

We discussed this issue in detail in links below for the interested reader. Come back here if you can disprove them.

"The unity of Government, which constitutes you one people, is also now dear to you. It is justly so; for it is a main pillar in the edifice of your real independence, the support of your tranquillity at home, your peace abroad; of your safety; of your prosperity; of that very Liberty, which you so highly prize. But as it is easy to foresee, that, from different causes and from different quarters, much pains will be taken, many artifices employed, to weaken in your minds the conviction of this truth; as this is the point in your political fortress against which the batteries of internal and external enemies will be most constantly and actively (though often covertly and insidiously) directed, it is of infinite moment, that you should properly estimate the immense value of your national Union to your collective and individual happiness; that you should cherish a cordial, habitual, and immovable attachment to it; accustoming yourselves to think and speak of it as of the Palladium of your political safety and prosperity; watching for its preservation with jealous anxiety; discountenancing whatever may suggest even a suspicion, that it can in any event be abandoned; and indignantly frowning upon the first dawning of every attempt to alienate any portion of our country from the rest, or to enfeeble the sacred ties which now link together the various parts." Quote DB :: Speeches :: George Washington :: George Washington's Farewell Address Speech

http://www.usmessageboard.com/clean-debate-zone/239966-listening-to-paul-ryan.html
http://www.usmessageboard.com/clean-debate-zone/239966-listening-to-paul-ryan-2.html#post5796207
http://www.usmessageboard.com/clean-debate-zone/239966-listening-to-paul-ryan-4.html#post5799892
http://www.usmessageboard.com/clean-debate-zone/239966-listening-to-paul-ryan-5.html#post5805092
http://www.usmessageboard.com/clean-debate-zone/239966-listening-to-paul-ryan-7.html#post5806946
http://www.usmessageboard.com/clean-debate-zone/239966-listening-to-paul-ryan-8.html#post5814461
http://www.usmessageboard.com/clean-debate-zone/239966-listening-to-paul-ryan-8.html#post5818474
http://www.usmessageboard.com/clean-debate-zone/239966-listening-to-paul-ryan-8.html#post5824790
http://www.usmessageboard.com/clean-debate-zone/239966-listening-to-paul-ryan-8.html#post5950608
http://www.usmessageboard.com/clean-debate-zone/239966-listening-to-paul-ryan-9.html#post5977824
http://www.usmessageboard.com/clean-debate-zone/239966-listening-to-paul-ryan-9.html#post5997532

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

Jeremiah -

There is no contradictoon between Republic and Democracy, anymore so than there is with monarchy and democracy.

What Flanders advocates for here is rule by an extremist elite; not rule by the people.

Wrong. There is a huge difference in a Republic and a Democracy. I'm shocked to hear you say you don't know the difference! - Jeri

 

[Saigon]

Jeremiah -

I know thw difference between the moon and the sun - and there is no contradiction between those either.

Of you think Australia can not be a republic and a democracy, please explain why not.

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

Jeremiah -

There is no contradictoon between Republic and Democracy, anymore so than there is with monarchy and democracy.

What Flanders advocates for here is rule by an extremist elite; not rule by the people.

You've lost me there. How is Flanders advocating rule by extremist elitists? That is what we are trying to stop before they achieve their agenda. - J.

 

[Votto]

I hearken back to the warnings of Plato. He said that a democracy cannot succeed unless its people are educated enough to know what is best for them.

Back in his day, men like Plato were given educations and were allowed to study and debate issues of his day, while slaves worked to feed and cloth people like him instead of him having to waste precious time doing it for himself. In this respect, a flourishing democracy is contingent upon slavery.

Today, slaves are given the right to vote. However, through an educational system that ranks 48th in the world and government controlled media and government controlled educational system, these votes from relatively uneducated slaves are easily manipulated by people behind the scenes by educated masterminds like Plato.

 

[Votto]

Democracy is a terrible thing. Much better we have one party rule, right?

Btw, Flanders. Please do not make up silly names for real people. Use their real names, or at least something logical and indentifiable.

Don't look now.

Wakey, wakey.

 

[Saigon]

Jeremiah -

Flanders posting is all about attacks on democracy and anything approaching choice. What he advocates is rule by a small, elite group who are above the law. It's crypto-fascism, pure and simple.

In Flanders ideal world there would be no elections, because people can not be trusted to vote sensibly. Better just let the elite sort things out.

Hence, he opposes democracy.

 

[Flanders]

What Todd does NOT explain is that no government on earth can assure us these natural rights.

Certainly the government crafted in the US consitution cannot assure us our nature rights, either.

To editec: The original Bill of Rights was designed to prevent the government from taking away God-given Rights.

Any government granting power to a few (which our constitution CLEARLY does) is violation of these "natural rights" (as Todd defines them, at least).

To editec: It is up to Americans to hang onto their God-given Rights. The Constitution is their weapon should they choose to fight.

Basically the concept of natural rights is RIGHT WING MAGICAL THINKING.

And ya know something? This concept of natural rights is not even well thought out magical thinking either.

To editec: Oh yeah, the concept of a utopian welfare state is pure logic.

Do I think we have the "right" to live as we choose?

Of course I do.

But no government on earth can or will assure us that right.

Every government on earth must violate that right to exist.

Every government, folks...every government

To editec: Limiting the power of government is the best that civilized men ever hoped for. It took thousands of years to get a working model; so if you must whine about imperfection at least confine your whining to totalitarian government violations.

Democracy is a terrible thing.

To Saigon: It sure is.

Much better we have one party rule, right?

To Saigon: Much better we drive the parasite class away from the public trough.

Btw, Flanders. Please do not make up silly names for real people. Use their real names, or at least something logical and indentifiable.

To Saigon: Btw, Saigon. Mind your own goddamned business, or stop reading my messages.

See the OP in this thread for further comment:

http://www.usmessageboard.com/tea-party/298288-name-change.html

I prefer a Republic. Which is what America was designed to be according to our Founding Fathers. For those who do not know America as a Republic recite your pledge of Allegience. It's all still there. ( at this writing anyhow )

-Jeri

To Jeri: Good reminder.

Note that Red Skelton could be addressing the things our current government is doing to us:

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TZBTyTWOZCM&feature=player_embedded]Red Skelton's Pledge of Allegiance - YouTube[/ame]​

Jeremiah -

There is no contradictoon between Republic and Democracy, anymore so than there is with monarchy and democracy.

To Saigon: That argument wore out with “Socialism and capitalism meet in the middle.”

What Flanders advocates for here is rule by an extremist elite; not rule by the people.

To Saigon: I’m happy to be associated with America’s founding elites. The limited government they gave us is RULE BY THE PEOPLE because the less power the government has the more the people rule.

On the other hand fools line up with ELITIST Barack Taqiyya who is transforming America into a democracy for the sole purpose of enslaving free Americans in order to enrich parasites. In short: Democracy’s tyrants convinced fools that totalitarian government is rule by the people. Those are the same fools who insist a benign totalitarian government is possible.

"The unity of Government, which constitutes you one people, is also now dear to you. It is justly so; for it is a main pillar in the edifice of your real independence, the support of your tranquillity at home, your peace abroad; of your safety; of your prosperity; of that very Liberty, which you so highly prize. But as it is easy to foresee, that, from different causes and from different quarters, much pains will be taken, many artifices employed, to weaken in your minds the conviction of this truth; as this is the point in your political fortress against which the batteries of internal and external enemies will be most constantly and actively (though often covertly and insidiously) directed, it is of infinite moment, that you should properly estimate the immense value of your national Union to your collective and individual happiness; that you should cherish a cordial, habitual, and immovable attachment to it; accustoming yourselves to think and speak of it as of the Palladium of your political safety and prosperity; watching for its preservation with jealous anxiety; discountenancing whatever may suggest even a suspicion, that it can in any event be abandoned; and indignantly frowning upon the first dawning of every attempt to alienate any portion of our country from the rest, or to enfeeble the sacred ties which now link together the various parts." Quote DB :: Speeches :: George Washington :: George Washington's Farewell Address Speech

To Midcan5: Not one of the Founding Fathers could foresee the XVI Amendment, nor could they envision a Godless religion like socialism/communism acquiring power under the Constitution colonial Americans ratified. Were they alive today they would take one look at the country and unanimously champion John Galt’s speech:

COPY & PASTE LINK IN THE SEARCH BOX

http://amberandchaos.com/?page_id=106

I hearken back to the warnings of Plato. He said that a democracy cannot succeed unless its people are educated enough to know what is best for them.

Back in his day, men like Plato were given educations and were allowed to study and debate issues of his day, while slaves worked to feed and cloth people like him instead of him having to waste precious time doing it for himself. In this respect, a flourishing democracy is contingent upon slavery.

Today, slaves are given the right to vote. However, through an educational system that ranks 48th in the world and government controlled media and government controlled educational system, these votes from relatively uneducated slaves are easily manipulated by people behind the scenes by educated masterminds like Plato.

To Votto: Plato also said:

Democracy passes into despotism.

In any event nothing Plato said about democracy cancels the following quote —— most often attributed to Alexander Fraser Tytler (1748 - 1813):

A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world's greatest civilizations has been 200 years. These nations have progressed through this sequence: From bondage to spiritual faith; From spiritual faith to great courage; From courage to liberty; From liberty to abundance; From abundance to selfishness; From selfishness to apathy; From apathy to dependence; From dependence back into bondage.

http://actionamerica.org/fun/tytler.shtml

Democracy is always heading towards something worse; never towards freedom. The question is: Can limited government overcome democracy’s onslaught?

 

[daveman]

Jeremiah -

Flanders posting is all about attacks on democracy and anything approaching choice. What he advocates is rule by a small, elite group who are above the law. It's crypto-fascism, pure and simple.

In Flanders ideal world there would be no elections, because people can not be trusted to vote sensibly. Better just let the elite sort things out.

Hence, he opposes democracy.

Excellent summary of progressive politics.

Doesn't apply to Flanders, though.

 

[whitehall]

Just recently president Hussein referred to Americans as "the U.S. people". Clearly his upbringing as a street kid in Indonesia has skewed his thinking about the greatest Country in the world. It used to be common for presidents to finish a speech with "God bless America" but Barry doesn't seem to think that way.

 

[Flanders]

Just recently president Hussein referred to Americans as "the U.S. people". Clearly his upbringing as a street kid in Indonesia has skewed his thinking about the greatest Country in the world. It used to be common for presidents to finish a speech with "God bless America" but Barry doesn't seem to think that way.

To whitehall: I guess there are no citizens in a democracy. This article might interest you:

Savage also mocked the president’s use of the phrase “American persons” to describe those who supposedly don’t have to worry about being spied on by the NSA (FREE audio).

“Notice he didn’t say, ‘If you’re an America citizen,’” Savage pointed out. “To Obama, a man of the world, there is no such thing as citizenship. He said, ‘If you’re a U.S. person,’ but what he really meant was, ‘If you’re a U.S. number.’”

To Obama, there's no such thing as 'citizenship'
Exclusive: Kathy Shaidle recaps America's debate on immigration battle
Published: 1 day ago
KATHY SHAIDLE

To Obama, there?s no such thing as ?citizenship?

 

[Saigon]

Whitehall -

his upbringing as a street kid in Indonesia

I am sure you know that this is nonsense, but feel free to back it up if you can.

(I've actually been to his school in Jakarta! It did not look like a place for street kids!)

 

[Flanders]

Whitehall -

his upbringing as a street kid in Indonesia

I am sure you know that this is nonsense, but feel free to back it up if you can.

To Saigon: I’ll go out on a limb here and say that Barack Taqiyya spent more time in the streets than he did in a schoolroom. In fact, he said he ran the streets:

. . . Obama went to Besuki, a mostly Muslim school, for less than a year, he spent most of his four years in Indonesia studying at Santo Fransiskus Asisi, a Roman Catholic school run at the time by a stern Dutch priest. Classes began and ended each day with Christian prayers.

That Obama went to a Catholic elementary school for a time while living in Jakarta from 1967 to 1971 has long been known. But this part of the presidential biography has largely been reduced to a footnote, thanks to the energetic self-promotion of its rival, Besuki, which is in one of Jakarta's wealthiest districts.

When the White House made plans for a March presidential trip to the world's most populous Muslim nation, it scheduled a visit to Besuki, not to the "wrong side of the tracks" Catholic school where Obama spent far more time. "They are very good at marketing" their presidential ties, said Yustina Amirah, principal of the Asisi school.

XXXXX​

Obama has kept his distance from Jakarta's uptown-downtown wrangling, but he has dropped a few hints. In his 2006 book, "The Audacity of Hope," he wrote of a "joyous time" when he "went to local Indonesia schools and ran the streets with children of farmers, servants, tailors, and clerks."

Catholic school in Indonesia seeks recognition for its role in Obama's life
By Andrew Higgins
Friday, April 9, 2010

Catholic school in Indonesia seeks recognition for its role in Obama's life

(I've actually been to his school in Jakarta! It did not look like a place for street kids!)

To Saigon: Did you also visit Frank Marshall Davis’ home (school) where he was indoctrinated into communism? The fact is: Barack Taqiyya was indoctrinated into totalitarian government.

Incidentally, I, too, went to Jakarta several times in the 1960s, as well other ports in Indonesia, when Sukarno (1901 - 1970) was running things. I always listed Indonesians as the nastiest of people. I’m talking about average people not government officials and the Indonesian military who were worse than the civilians.

Let me tell you a little story about the military.

I sailed break/bulk freighters in those days. That means the cargo was not in containers and had to be loaded and unloaded by hand onto pallets and in cargo nets.

One day when the longshoremen where leaving the ship for their midday break two teenage boys were stopped by the machine-gun armed soldier stationed at gangway. The kids had bags of candy stolen from the cargo wrapped in the waste of their sarongs. The soldier sent for his superior. When the officer arrived in a jeep and heard the soldier’s report he took the two boys ashore and shot them in the head. He then had his driver tie their feet to the back of the jeep and proceeded to slowly drive them past the long row of warehousers that lined the pier. Hundreds and hundreds of longshoremen were sitting in the shade of the cargo warehouses. That’s the Indonesia I saw before and during the same time period (1967 - 1971) Barack Taqiyya was there.

Since you’re so big on people voting in a democracy, Sukarno was known for inventing “Guided Democracy.” Somehow those two boys did not get a vote.

Just to be clear. I’m all for people voting on every issue that does NOT require tax dollar funding. Let the parasites vote for anything their little hearts desire —— EXCEPT voting themselves tax dollars under this or that pretext. Aside from the cost of traditional necessary government; the military, the courts, roads, etc., the best way to accomplish it is prohibit tax dollars going to charities, political causes, welfare programs, foreign aid, public education, and so on. In short: No American should be forced to fund somebody else’s religious, cultural, or political beliefs.

Parenthetically, for years I’ve written “Democrat party.” As you can see calling the Democratic party the Democrat party is not new:

Multiple reasons are suggested for the use of the term. A 1984 New York Times article suggested Republicans began to use the term when Democrats used their own party name to imply "they are the only true adherents of democracy." Republicans "feared that 'Democratic' suggested Democrats [had] a monopoly on or are somehow the anointed custodians of the concept of democracy." New Yorker commentator Hendrik Hertzberg wrote, "There’s no great mystery about the motives behind this deliberate misnaming. 'Democrat Party' is a slur, or intended to be—a handy way to express contempt. Aesthetic judgments are subjective, of course, but 'Democrat Party' is jarring verging on ugly. It fairly screams 'rat.'" Political analyst Charlie Cook attributed modern use of the term to force of habit rather than a deliberate epithet by Republicans. Ruth Marcus stated that Republicans likely only continue to employ the term because Democrats dislike it. Marcus stated that disagreements over use of the term are "trivial", and Hertzberg calls use of the term "a minor irritation" and also "the partisan equivalent of flashing a gang sign."

XXXXX​

The history of the term has been a subject of interest to scholars. The Oxford English Dictionary, traces the use of the term back to 1890: "Whether a little farmer from South Carolina named Tillman is going to rule the Democrat Party in America—yet it is this, and not output, on which the proximate value of silver depends." However the term was in use much earlier in the 19th century. For example, in an 1834 story of politics in a small Vermont town as seen through the eyes of young girl, the American novelist Catharine Maria Sedgwick wrote: "There was a weekly journal published in Carrington, the 'Star' or 'Sun,' I forget which, but certainly the ascendant luminary of the democrat party."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democrat_Party_(epithet)

Frankly, I cannot figure out why:

Republicans "feared that 'Democratic' suggested Democrats [had] a monopoly on or are somehow the anointed custodians of the concept of democracy."

If Democrats believe Democrat party is a slur, by all means let’s call it the Democracy party. Let’s find out how Democrats like the idea of Americans blaming democracy for the income tax, for socialized medicine, for brainwashing children, for the welfare state, for the United Nations, for the EPA, for illegal immigration, for secret government, and for every other tyranny Democrats/democracy laid on this country.