The ultimate 2nd amendment poll!

[Old Rocks]

35 people will die today in the cause to allow gun lovers to fantasize about "taking back their country with their well regulated militia."

Crazy shit.

Correction...

35 people will die today at the hands of people that have no issue with breaking the law....so guns illegal or not, they will have one anyway.

Now...I wonder how many people today will have the ability to legally defend themselves with the legal firearm they have when attacked by someone who wants to hurt them.

A good many of that 35 will be kids killed by their parents mishandling firearms. And some will be kids being killed by other kids getting their parents firearms that were carelessly left where the kids could get at them.

I am a life long gun owner. I am thourghly disgusted by the putting of firearms, expecially the war weopons, on a pedistal, and acting out adolescent fantasies of bringing down the government with these pop guns. Most of these people screamng 'Second Amendment Rights' are people I would not want within a mile of me with a .22.

 

[GuyPinestra]

35 people will die today in the cause to allow gun lovers to fantasize about "taking back their country with their well regulated militia."

Crazy shit.

Correction...

35 people will die today at the hands of people that have no issue with breaking the law....so guns illegal or not, they will have one anyway.

Now...I wonder how many people today will have the ability to legally defend themselves with the legal firearm they have when attacked by someone who wants to hurt them.

A good many of that 35 will be kids killed by their parents mishandling firearms. And some will be kids being killed by other kids getting their parents firearms that were carelessly left where the kids could get at them.

I am a life long gun owner. I am thourghly disgusted by the putting of firearms, expecially the war weopons, on a pedistal, and acting out adolescent fantasies of bringing down the government with these pop guns. Most of these people screamng 'Second Amendment Rights' are people I would not want within a mile of me with a .22.

There are about 1500 accidental deaths by firearm each year. If ALL of those deaths were children either shot by their parents or other kids your statement would STILL be wrong, unless you consider 4 of 35 to be 'a good many'.

Once again you repeat an absurd premise, that people want their guns to "bring down the government". You have NO PROOF to back up this ridiculous claim, it's another example of 'the BIG lie'.

IOW, BOTH of your 'points' are in error and you should be ashamed of yourself for posting them.

 

[Abatis]

A good many of that 35 will be kids killed by their parents mishandling firearms. And some will be kids being killed by other kids getting their parents firearms that were carelessly left where the kids could get at them.

Some questions for the sage:

What age range defines "kid" in your consideration of this subject? (for me it is 0 to 17 yrs, 364 days old)
Are actual numbers of accidental deaths by firearm discharge rising or falling over time (by age class or not)?
Is the rate of of accidental deaths by firearm discharge rising or falling over time (by age class or not)?

I am a life long gun owner. I am thourghly disgusted by the putting of firearms, expecially the war weopons, on a pedistal, and acting out adolescent fantasies of bringing down the government with these pop guns.

Explaining the principle is not putting guns on a pedestal nor is it acting out of juvenile fantasy.

Madison in 1788 explained the ratios and he said that the "standing army" should be outnumbered (opposed was the word he used) by armed citizens by a factor of 17-20 to 1 . . . Today, with active duty and reserve numbering 2.9 million and armed citizens estimated at 75 million I argue the 2nd Amendment is alive and well.

While the framers did not envision every person being armed they certainly desired a significant percentage to be properly situated to effectively resist the government's standing army with violence.

Most of these people screamng 'Second Amendment Rights' are people I would not want within a mile of me with a .22.

And people who whine incessantly and drone on out of their distrust of their fellow citizens should never be given a shred of political power.
Fear like yours can lead to some bad things with the weight of government's power behind it,
Which, if you stop the histrionics for a moment, kinda-sorta proves the point you are arguing against LOL.

 

[Old Rocks]

Guy, you are full of shit. Look at what is posted right here on this board concerning the coming 'revolution' or 'civil war'. And when some looney buys 10,000 rounds of ammo for his Ak or AR 15, we are supposed to believe that is just target practice?

 

[GuyPinestra]

Guy, you are full of shit. Look at what is posted right here on this board concerning the coming 'revolution' or 'civil war'.

No, I'm not. People on this board have talked about DEFENDING themselves, nobody is talking about marching on Washington, DC.

And when some looney buys 10,000 rounds of ammo for his Ak or AR 15, we are supposed to believe that is just target practice?

Why don't you ask that question of the government? They just purchased 1/2 BILLION hollow point rounds for DOMESTIC agencies!!

You do know that hollow point ammo is against the Geneva Conventions, don't you?

 

[JoeB131]

How about this, Joe?

FUCK your 'license'!

I don't NEED a God-damned license, it's nobody's business if I have a gun or how many I own! I've never shot anyone and I'm no threat to anyone UNLESS they are a threat to me.

Gawd, you fucks are some punks!

You're reasoned argument has convinced me... no, really. You are not the least bit insane and the fact you own guns shouldn't concern anyone.

 

[JakeStarkey]

GuyPinestra is as goofy as ObamaPhone Lady.

Grow up, Guy.

 

[JoeB131]

How about this. Before you get a gun license, they have to do a background check on you, just like you would if you got a job.

By what authority would the government compel a citizen to acquire a license to exercise a fundamental right? The idea is abhorrent to me.

The idea that someone as crazy as Cho or Loughner could get a gun is a "right" is what is crazy. if current background checks aren't catching these guys, the background check is inadequate.

[

The thing is, if Cho, Holmes or Loughner had applied for a job, people would have had no problem finding out they were, as you say, Cookoo for Cocoa Puffs.

And just how would that happen?

"Hi, Dean Wormwood? This is Bob from the Department of Firearms Licensing. We are calling about one of your students, Cho Dong Crazy. He applied for a gun permit."

"Holy shit! Don't give him a gun. We had to put his ass in private tutoring because he was scaring the piss out of the other students, especially the girls."

Sounds pretty simple to me. Frankly, AFTER a shooting, it never seem to take that much research to find out how crazy these folks were.

You as a rabid gun phobic, might have other criteria to bar gun ownership, like wearing white after Labor Day, but that doesn't amount to anything but typical authoritarian leftist wishful thinking.

Not gun phobic, guy. Spent 11 years in the US Army. Fired M16's, M60's, M2 (50 cal), M203 grenade launchers. What I have is a healthy respect for what these devices can do in the wrong hands.

And the guy who thinks he's the Joker from the Batman movies is definitely the wrong hands.

[

"but, but, the second Amendment says I can have a gun!"

No it doesn't.

I do not rely on any word from any document for the existence of any fundamental right.

I'm going to break this to you very gently.

There are no "rights". Any asshole who thinks he has "rights" needs to look up "Japanese-Americans, 1942" to see how fast rights can disappear.

What we have are privilages. You can have what the rest of us say you can have or agree you should be able to have. And for the most part, we are a quite "liberal" in this regard, as we should be.

But Sweet Evil Jesus, we should also practice a bit of common sense. You shouldn't be allowed to molest children because your religion says that's okay, you shouldn't let people who are batshit crazy get guns.

 

[GuyPinestra]

GuyPinestra is as goofy as ObamaPhone Lady.

Grow up, Guy.

Hey Jake, please quote the part you think is 'goofy' and explain WHY you feel that way.

We might get somewhere if you'd get specific for a change...

 

[zeke]

Hey Abitas you bad muttafukker you. How many people have you shot and killed? You know saving your life and possessions.

Seeing as how you don't want to defend yourself from tyranny. (That is what you said wasn't it, that gun nuts don't fear their govenment?) I guess you either live in fear of your neighbors or they live in fear of you. Gotta shoot someone. Hell the stats show you may end up shooting yourself. You know, with suicides making up a lot of the gun deaths.

But it must be a drag walking around scared all the time.

 

[GuyPinestra]

Hey Abitas you bad muttafukker you. How many people have you shot and killed? You know saving your life and possessions.

Seeing as how you don't want to defend yourself from tyranny. (That is what you said wasn't it, that gun nuts don't fear their govenment?) I guess you either live in fear of your neighbors or they live in fear of you. Gotta shoot someone. Hell the stats show you may end up shooting yourself. You know, with suicides making up a lot of the gun deaths.

But it must be a drag walking around scared all the time.

I doubt he is "walking around scared all the time", having a means of protecting yourself tends to lower the fear level.

 

[zeke]

GuyPinestra is as goofy as ObamaPhone Lady.

Grow up, Guy.

Hey Jake, please quote the part you think is 'goofy' and explain WHY you feel that way.

We might get somewhere if you'd get specific for a change...

There is no "getting somewhere" with a true, blue gun believer.

You either accept that we will kill each other how ever we want with easy access for all to guns and ammo.

Or you try and contol some of the easy access and limit the killing,

As you posted earlier, you don't care if crazies can get access to guns. Your position in like that of many others.

Where is there to get?

Fuking true believers like you and abitas go fuking nuts when someone even hints that things could be better if there wasn't such easy access to guns.

 

[zeke]

Hey Abitas you bad muttafukker you. How many people have you shot and killed? You know saving your life and possessions.

Seeing as how you don't want to defend yourself from tyranny. (That is what you said wasn't it, that gun nuts don't fear their govenment?) I guess you either live in fear of your neighbors or they live in fear of you. Gotta shoot someone. Hell the stats show you may end up shooting yourself. You know, with suicides making up a lot of the gun deaths.

But it must be a drag walking around scared all the time.

I doubt he is "walking around scared all the time", having a means of protecting yourself tends to lower the fear level.

If I am packing, I am scared that I have put myself in a situation where I think I might need a gun.

If I pack 24/7, no matter where I am going, ie my kids school, shopping, home depot, what ever, then I am scared that where I go someone may be lurking to do me harm.
Even if I have no reason to believe that. Other than being scared all the time.

Carrying a gun is like a big ole security blanket.

 

[GuyPinestra]

Hey Abitas you bad muttafukker you. How many people have you shot and killed? You know saving your life and possessions.

Seeing as how you don't want to defend yourself from tyranny. (That is what you said wasn't it, that gun nuts don't fear their govenment?) I guess you either live in fear of your neighbors or they live in fear of you. Gotta shoot someone. Hell the stats show you may end up shooting yourself. You know, with suicides making up a lot of the gun deaths.

But it must be a drag walking around scared all the time.

I doubt he is "walking around scared all the time", having a means of protecting yourself tends to lower the fear level.

If I am packing, I am scared that I have put myself in a situation where I think I might need a gun.

If I pack 24/7, no matter where I am going, ie my kids school, shopping, home depot, what ever, then I am scared that where I go someone may be lurking to do me harm.
Even if I have no reason to believe that. Other than being scared all the time.

Carrying a gun is like a big ole security blanket.

You remember the Boy Scout Motto?

"Be Prepared"

I'd rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Just plain goofy. You are a true believer, who has made up his own narrative, which will not change for the facts.

ObamaPhoneLady and you are the same type of person.

GuyPinestra is as goofy as ObamaPhone Lady.

Grow up, Guy.

Hey Jake, please quote the part you think is 'goofy' and explain WHY you feel that way.

We might get somewhere if you'd get specific for a change...

 

[GuyPinestra]

Just plain goofy. You are a true believer, who has made up his own narrative, which will not change for the facts.

ObamaPhoneLady and you are the same type of person.

GuyPinestra is as goofy as ObamaPhone Lady.

Grow up, Guy.

Hey Jake, please quote the part you think is 'goofy' and explain WHY you feel that way.

We might get somewhere if you'd get specific for a change...

Please highlight this 'made up narrative' and compare it to these 'facts' you claim I'm trying to change.

Or continue your predilection of spouting baseless statements.

Up to you, of course, but option #2 makes you look pretty stupid, AGAIN...

 

[JakeStarkey]

Your goofiness is demonstrated by your cry for more evidence of it, which you will deny.

Anybody who has read your stuff and has half a brain knows that you are a goofy Obamaphonelady type.

Yup, that's you.

Just plain goofy. You are a true believer, who has made up his own narrative, which will not change for the facts.

ObamaPhoneLady and you are the same type of person.

Hey Jake, please quote the part you think is 'goofy' and explain WHY you feel that way.

We might get somewhere if you'd get specific for a change...

Please highlight this 'made up narrative' and compare it to these 'facts' you claim I'm trying to change.

Or continue your predilection of spouting baseless statements.

Up to you, of course, but option #2 makes you look pretty stupid, AGAIN...

 

[9thIDdoc]

GuyPinestra is as goofy as ObamaPhone Lady.

Grow up, Guy.

Hey Jake, please quote the part you think is 'goofy' and explain WHY you feel that way.

We might get somewhere if you'd get specific for a change...

There is no "getting somewhere" with a true, blue gun believer.

You either accept that we will kill each other how ever we want with easy access for all to guns and ammo.

Or you try and contol some of the easy access and limit the killing,

As you posted earlier, you don't care if crazies can get access to guns. Your position in like that of many others.

Where is there to get?

Fuking true believers like you and abitas go fuking nuts when someone even hints that things could be better if there wasn't such easy access to guns.

And your unwillingness to honestly discuss your claims does you no more credit than it does the "true believers".

"You either accept that we will kill each other how ever we want with easy access for all to guns and ammo.
Or you try and contol some of the easy access and limit the killing,"

You are begging the question.
1. It is NOT a proven fact that easy access increases violent crime. People were killing each other quite well before firearms were invented and would likely continue to do quite well if they all suddenly vanished. Do you think murder rates are higher now than in the middle ages?
2. It is also NOT a proven fact that gun control laws limit access in any helpful way in this country. In fact there is a very large amount of evidence for the opposite view.

 

[GuyPinestra]

Your goofiness is demonstrated by your cry for more evidence of it, which you will deny.

Anybody who has read your stuff and has half a brain knows that you are a goofy Obamaphonelady type.

Yup, that's you.

It would be a refreshing change Jake, for you to offer ANY evidence, but you prefer to look stupid, I guess.

Not surprising, since your inability to cite ANYTHING even resembling a basis for your opinion would remove any doubt of how deep your ignorance runs.

 

[JakeStarkey]

It would be refreshing for GuyPinestra to accept clear and convincing evidence when it refutes his postion.

That is what a mature adult does.

When Guy demonstrates he can act like an adult, then we can conduct an adult conversation.

But "neener neener no you didn't" does not county as adult speech, Guy.