The "RINO" Thread

[Gadawg73]

Gay marriage? Who cares as it affects no one?
Abortion? Laws never stopped it and women were never prosecuted when it was illegal.
Those 2 issues alone bring in another 5% gain.

You work on the assumption that that would help the GOP.

I know there are a lot of convervatives that vote on those two issues primarily.

You take those two out, and frankly, they might as well vote for the Democrat that won't try to kill off their good union job.

Having been part of goal line stances where it was first and goal from the one I never, ever give up.
At age 58, over 35 years after I faced first and goal at the one.
NEVER, EVER GIVE UP.

 

[Gadawg73]

Do we want the moral police or fiscal conservatives leading the party.
Boils down to that and nothing else.

The Plutocrats or the Theocrats?

Frankly, given that choice, which would general suck, I'd probably go with the Theocrats. At least their transactions aren't cynical and they care about something other than themselves.

Once again you are off subject.
Next time read the post.

 

[del]

Heavens sake, Elvis, read Crusader Frank or Oddball or Paulie or Paulitician or that mos toxic poster, Contumacious.

would rather hear your reasoning.

he hasn't a clue

 

[Old Rocks]

The GOP has let the far right wingnuts decide their position on every issue from guns to abortion. They make the claim of fiscal conservatives, yet the record of the GOP is hardly that. Not only that, the people elected in 2010 seem far more interested in what goes in someone's bedroom, than how the government is funded, or where the funds go.

In doing this, they have alienated many, many potential voters. And motivated people like myself to get involved in the process. So we have normal conservatives turned off by the wingnuts, and liberals like myself, motivated to oppose what I see as detrimental to my nation. This does not bode well for the GOP in the near future if the sane people in the party do not take it back.

And I would like to see that. We have had some excellant GOP governors here in Oregon. Unfortunately we saw the party hijacked by the likes of Sizemore, who is now justly in prison, and we have essentially one party representation in DC, and even in Salem. This is not a healthy situation.

So, you sane people in the GOP, get busy. We need two viable and sane political parties.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

This thread is for those who have left the party because they view it as being too extreme, or for the increasingly rare heretics in the party, the "RINOs."

First, scoreboard. The Republicans have lost 4 of the last 6 Presidential elections, the Presidential popular vote in 5 of the last 6 Presidential elections, and moderates in 5 of the last 6 Presidential elections, and will probably extend that losing streak if Hillary runs in 2016.

Next, math. According to FoxNews exit polls, moderates were 45% of the electorate in the 2012 Presidential election and voted for Obama over Romney, 56% to 41%. With 130 million Americans voting, that is a deficit of nearly 9 million voters. Obama beat Romney by 5 million votes.

For a party that reveres business, I find it odd that so many of the base believe that the best path to winning is to make the party more appealing to themselves and less appealing to everyone else. A successful businessperson wants to expand her market and sell her product to more people, not shrink the market and sell less. But that appears to be the course many in the party want to take.

As the base of the GOP does it's best to emulate the "success" of the Democrat party of the 1970s and 1980s by becoming too exclusionary and doctrinaire, think of this thread as a self-help thread for the Republican party as those who once considered themselves to be Republicans but are no more tell you why.

First, an assessment from Peggy Noonan, Reagan's speechwriter.

Republicans are now in the habit of editing their views, and they've been in it for 10 years. The Bush White House suppressed dissent; talk-radio stars functioned as enforcers; the angrier parts of the base, on the Internet, attempted to silence critical thinkers. Orthodoxy was everything, or orthodoxy as some defined it. This isn't loyalty, it's lockstep. It has harmed the party's creativity, its ability to think, when now more than ever it has to.

Noonan: Republicans Need to Talk - WSJ.com

And now, from one poster

I was a republican over 40 yrs and I am now an independent and so is many many used to be devout republicans. My leaving the party started not too much before the primary season, when the extremists were gearing up anyone that dared disagree with a single component of their platform or agenda was vilified and labeled a rhino and a liberal.
As a working class republican I was offended by the attacks on the public "WORKERS" not bums and skids and people looking for a handout...WORKING class people. I was offended by the rhetoric coming out of the mouths of newly elected republican govs.
In short the Gop went waaay to far and they lost votes here and they lost some there and they lost some there and they "LOST" the election. The most amazing thing to me is that the teaparty who made the republican party lose is still tooting their horns and beating their chests. Im not alone theres many that left the gop...and wont be back anytime soon.

As you note, democrats have won four of the last six presidential elections, when prior to 1992 they won only one of the last six.

The democratic turnaround was accomplished by marginalizing the extreme left and appealing to more segments of the voting population. And this was done without compromising their principles; indeed, it was their emphasis on those principles that allowed democrats to appeal to more voters.

The republican return to relevance will need to follow a similar course: marginalize the radical right – both with regard to fiscal extremism and social issues – where republicans return to a position of respecting privacy rights, due process rights, and equal protection rights, for all persons. And reject Christian fundamentalists with regard to their extreme and un-Constitutional positions concerning abortion, marriage equality, and Establishment Clause jurisprudence.

Last, republicans need to get away from the ‘RINO’ nonsense, anyone’s a republican who says he’s a republican. This pointless civil war in the Party will do nothing to bring about success at the polls.

 

[YoungRepublican]

Sorry im so late to this post. I just found it. I wrote a little article to a friend and I think it speaks to us RINO's very well. Here it is
I am writing this as a call to all Republican who wish to restore the sanity within our party. The sanity that has been so clearly lost over the course of the past three years. This sector will draw a line in the sand and adopt an attitude of, either you are with us, or you are against us. When I say that I do not mean your values need to be compromised, or your opinions amended, I am simply stating that if you claim membership to the Tea Parties social values, we no longer want you tarnishing our name. Many “Tea partiers” abide by the theories of Charles Darwin, ironically enough, that only the strong survive. I am accepting your theory and utilizing it to reform the Republican Party for the sake of its survival. To those people I ask, do you believe your values will still hold true in twenty years? Do you believe that gay marriage will take a 180 degree turn and become banned like we live in Alabama circa 1945? Do you believe that scientist will make a remarkable discovery that will show man walked with dinosaurs four thousand years ago? I could continue these rhetorical questions, but I have things to do and don’t have the two weeks it would most likely take me to finish. The answer to all of these questions if you haven’t guessed is no. The fact of the matter is that eventually you will die and with you will go all of your opinions based in lunacy. The only hope I have is that we can stop you in time to save our party, and I’m not sure if the damage you have already done is too vast. In order to reverse the adulteration the tea party has done to the Republican Party we must rely on our youth. The youth, the generation that the fringe conservative’s disillusioned mind feels is ruining this country. The truth is, we are the only hope for the party and much like a hiker stuck between a rock and cave, we must cut off our arm to save our life. We are not RINO’s as you so affectionately refer to us as; it is you that deserve that moniker. I was raised to believe that the Republican Party valued fiscal responsibility just as much as social freedom, but our values of social freedom finds itself in serious jeopardy in your hands. How can the rest of the country take us seriously when are core component is violated everyday by those who claim to be our future? They cannot, and I do not blame them. I can’t take you seriously, and we claim the same political party (I think). I’d like to say that there is hope for us to reconcile, that perhaps you ultra conservatives can learn to adapt to the world, but deep down I know you cannot. I am a Republican, but I am also more than that. I develop my opinions from different sources. I don’t take Sean Hannity’s words and regurgitate them in political debates. I do not align with every platform my party puts forth, but that is the beauty of having a mind not shaped by FOX news. Perhaps something someday will click, and fringe conservatives will realize the contamination they are putting on the party. They may realize that it wasn’t the fact that Mitt Romney isn’t “conservative enough” and that is why we lost the election, it’s because you forced him to be something he wasn’t. You see without money presidential candidates might as well not even bother, and guess where all of the GOP’s money is? Ding ding ding, that’s right; in the hands of old, fringe conservatives. We lost the election because you wouldn’t support a candidate who couldn’t care less about what two men did in the privacy of their own homes or who denies the truly ignorant statement that our president is not from America. The next time I hear a person say we lost because we couldn’t find a person with conservative values I’m going to have an aneurism. We lost the election do to pure, unadulterated stupidity and the President knew how to capitalize on that. So the next time any person who considers themselves a true, no nonsense conservative blames the election on the youth, moderates, democrats or whatever scapegoat is on the menu this week I want you to look at yourself and there is where you will find who is truly killing the Republican party.

 

[asterism]

Each of them were perfectly electable until the far right social values and libertarian crowds pulled the hate card.

You would think after America rejected them, and Obama should have been beat by a Howdie Doodie candidate, the far right of the GOP would catch on that their national power is eroding.

You guys don't count much anymore, Frank and Asterism, and if the country goes over the cliff fiscally, you will have nothing left to offer except come shovel snow from the public streets.

Good Point. John McCain and Mitt Romney - two guys who stood a real chance of getting elected until the far right of the GOP sentenced both of them to 6 years of genuflecting and far right ass kissing. Two perfectly electable guys until the far right made them into people no one could trust.

Both were forced into trying to out right flank their primary opponents with idiotic and unrealistic panderings like "self-deport" and Sarah Palin.

Yeah - not conservative enough ....

Neither of them were fiscally conservative.

Pulled the hate card? Libertarians?

You're off your fucking rocker. McCain lost because the Democrats had an overwhelmingly superior ground game. Romney lost because he didn't get the disaffected conservatives to vote for him and the GOP didn't do ANYTHING to attract new voters.

And you painting me as the "far right" is indicative of how tone deaf the GOP establishment is. It's all abstract to your type. I'm nowhere near the "far right" in voting nor in political pragmatism. I just didn't think McCain and Romney were worth the grief becoming an election day activist. Neither had anything but status quote milquetoast proposals.

But go ahead and invent your own narrative. We lost, but you're still manning your post on a sinking ship. I've decided to swim on my own - and that's worked out quite well for me so far.

 

[asterism]

Either we all hang together and pull as one,or the dems will hang our candidates individually.

That was the line sold to us before McCain. It didn't work, the clueless GOP still fucked it up.

Gillespie set the tone and the GOP establishment was okay with losing the election as long as they had a shot to retake the House in 2010. Then they were fine with Obama getting re-elected as long as they could keep the House.

 

[asterism]

I remember those freaks chanting that at Paul's presentation.

That turned me off to libertarianism forever. They will be the ones chanting for euthanasia by 2025 for resource allocation drains such as the mentally challenged, the elderly, the severely ill.

I have no doubt shooting will be part of the results of that.

That's an emotional reaction.

I've decided that instead of trying to bring the GOP back to sanity maybe a few million friends of mine and I will have better luck moderating the Libertarian Party.

 

[asterism]

Heavens sake, Elvis, read Crusader Frank or Oddball or Paulie or Paulitician or that mos toxic poster, Contumacious. The crowd chanting at Ron Paul's campaign appearance said it all anyone needs to know about libertarianism.

Oh, I'm sorry. I thought this was a serious conversation. You mean your impression of the LP is based solely on a few people on this board?

My mistake. You aren't worth my time.

 

[bripat9643]

Either we all hang together and pull as one,or the dems will hang our candidates individually.

Good point, Fakey. So when are you actually going to start supporting republican candidates? Oh, I forgot. You're actually a Democrat - based on who you support, that is.

 

[bripat9643]

I am not a Romney fan nor did I vote for him; typical RINO

But the Democrats were very successful in painting a false picture of him and his policies.

Miraculously, the "War on Women" (TM) just stopped within the last month and a half.

Yes, that usually happens in a war when one side gets it's ass beaten...

Why would it stop the minute a campaign was over unless it was a phony issue?

 

[bripat9643]

Do we want the moral police or fiscal conservatives leading the party.
Boils down to that and nothing else.

The Plutocrats or the Theocrats?

Frankly, given that choice, which would general suck, I'd probably go with the Theocrats. At least their transactions aren't cynical and they care about something other than themselves.

Who gives a fuck who you would go with, blow job? You're a Democrat.

 

[bripat9643]

I remember those freaks chanting that at Paul's presentation.

That turned me off to libertarianism forever. They will be the ones chanting for euthanasia by 2025 for resource allocation drains such as the mentally challenged, the elderly, the severely ill.

Obamacare has already made that into government policy, numskull.

 

[bripat9643]

Yes, I know libertarianism is seriously wrong.

Can you expand on that?

No, he can't. That's what you have to understand about Fakey: none of his positions are based on any kind of reasoning process. They are purely emotional grunts emanating from some primitive portion of his brain. Of course, there is no evidence that any part of Fakey's brain isn't primitive.

 

[bripat9643]

Heavens sake, Elvis, read Crusader Frank or Oddball or Paulie or Paulitician or that mos toxic poster, Contumacious. The crowd chanting at Ron Paul's campaign appearance said it all anyone needs to know about libertarianism.

I think all that showed is that the crowd like Ron Paul.

 

[bripat9643]

No need for me to condemn them. Read them for yourself to get the feel of what they are about.

We all know there is no "reasoning" behind anything you post in this forum, Fakey. They why you can't respond with any kind of real answer to the question.

 

[Shelzin]

It went beyond that for the GOP

They still are afraid to tell their crazies to STFU

Immigration, Womens issues, Gay rights, working poor......there is no limit to whom they will insult

But here's the thing. The GOP has won in the past being against these things.

A lot of hispanics don't see the illegals as kindred, and a lot of women look at the screeching feminist as something they don't relate to.

Unlike Reagan or a Bush, Romney couldn't make these positions palatable. Probably because as a moderate, he was uncomfortable with them.

*laughs*

Either that... Or over the last couple decades the world has changed it's position on various things. Evolution. You know.. Towards something better.

 

[Sunni Man]

Sorry im so late to this post. I just found it. I wrote a little article to a friend and I think it speaks to us RINO's very well. Here it is
I am writing this as a call to all Republican who wish to restore the sanity within our party. The sanity that has been so clearly lost over the course of the past three years. This sector will draw a line in the sand and adopt an attitude of, either you are with us, or you are against us. When I say that I do not mean your values need to be compromised, or your opinions amended, I am simply stating that if you claim membership to the Tea Parties social values, we no longer want you tarnishing our name. Many “Tea partiers” abide by the theories of Charles Darwin, ironically enough, that only the strong survive. I am accepting your theory and utilizing it to reform the Republican Party for the sake of its survival. To those people I ask, do you believe your values will still hold true in twenty years? Do you believe that gay marriage will take a 180 degree turn and become banned like we live in Alabama circa 1945? Do you believe that scientist will make a remarkable discovery that will show man walked with dinosaurs four thousand years ago? I could continue these rhetorical questions, but I have things to do and don’t have the two weeks it would most likely take me to finish. The answer to all of these questions if you haven’t guessed is no. The fact of the matter is that eventually you will die and with you will go all of your opinions based in lunacy. The only hope I have is that we can stop you in time to save our party, and I’m not sure if the damage you have already done is too vast. In order to reverse the adulteration the tea party has done to the Republican Party we must rely on our youth. The youth, the generation that the fringe conservative’s disillusioned mind feels is ruining this country. The truth is, we are the only hope for the party and much like a hiker stuck between a rock and cave, we must cut off our arm to save our life. We are not RINO’s as you so affectionately refer to us as; it is you that deserve that moniker. I was raised to believe that the Republican Party valued fiscal responsibility just as much as social freedom, but our values of social freedom finds itself in serious jeopardy in your hands. How can the rest of the country take us seriously when are core component is violated everyday by those who claim to be our future? They cannot, and I do not blame them. I can’t take you seriously, and we claim the same political party (I think). I’d like to say that there is hope for us to reconcile, that perhaps you ultra conservatives can learn to adapt to the world, but deep down I know you cannot. I am a Republican, but I am also more than that. I develop my opinions from different sources. I don’t take Sean Hannity’s words and regurgitate them in political debates. I do not align with every platform my party puts forth, but that is the beauty of having a mind not shaped by FOX news. Perhaps something someday will click, and fringe conservatives will realize the contamination they are putting on the party. They may realize that it wasn’t the fact that Mitt Romney isn’t “conservative enough” and that is why we lost the election, it’s because you forced him to be something he wasn’t. You see without money presidential candidates might as well not even bother, and guess where all of the GOP’s money is? Ding ding ding, that’s right; in the hands of old, fringe conservatives. We lost the election because you wouldn’t support a candidate who couldn’t care less about what two men did in the privacy of their own homes or who denies the truly ignorant statement that our president is not from America. The next time I hear a person say we lost because we couldn’t find a person with conservative values I’m going to have an aneurism. We lost the election do to pure, unadulterated stupidity and the President knew how to capitalize on that. So the next time any person who considers themselves a true, no nonsense conservative blames the election on the youth, moderates, democrats or whatever scapegoat is on the menu this week I want you to look at yourself and there is where you will find who is truly killing the Republican party.

Please!!!!!...... for the love of God............go to this link before you post again!!!

Paragraphs - The Writing Center

 

[JoeB131]

It went beyond that for the GOP

They still are afraid to tell their crazies to STFU

Immigration, Womens issues, Gay rights, working poor......there is no limit to whom they will insult

But here's the thing. The GOP has won in the past being against these things.

A lot of hispanics don't see the illegals as kindred, and a lot of women look at the screeching feminist as something they don't relate to.

Unlike Reagan or a Bush, Romney couldn't make these positions palatable. Probably because as a moderate, he was uncomfortable with them.

*laughs*

Either that... Or over the last couple decades the world has changed it's position on various things. Evolution. You know.. Towards something better.

I don't necessarily think so.

Not really a social conservative at this point in my life, but Romney didn't lose because of the social conservatives. He lost because most people saw he was offering more of the same slop on economics that got us into this mess.

The thing that absolutely killed him was the 47% comment.