The Reality That Awaits Women in Combat

[g5000]

Women don't need your fucking protection. They're more than capable.

Women have much easier physical requirements than men in the military.

What's that tell you?

This is about promotions at the expense of our military readiness. It's bullshit.

Can you have the best military in the world with an all male force?

Yes.

Can you have the best military in the world with an all female force?

No.

We should do away with all of that. If women want to serve in combat they should be required to pass the same physical standards as men, do the same 20 mile ruck marches with the same amount of weight, and complete the mos specific fitness tests. That should do away with about 99.9% of female applicants. What then?

I suspect the military would instead lower the standards for men down to what women must do to pass, rather than the other way around.

We are living in a politically correct world now.

 

[rightwinger]

Women have served as nurses for hundreds of years where they have seen men urinate into bottles at close range and suffer from dysentery.

Why didn't you complain then?

You are missing the point.

Which is?

 

[CaféAuLait]

Woman have already been serving in combat.

Exactly...only (correct me if I'm wrong) - they don't get combat pay for it do they? I think this change means that they will get paid the same as men in a combat zone?

As long as they are in a combat zone they get the combat pay, no matter their sex.

 

[Publius1787]

Women have much easier physical requirements than men in the military.

What's that tell you?

This is about promotions at the expense of our military readiness. It's bullshit.

Can you have the best military in the world with an all male force?

Yes.

Can you have the best military in the world with an all female force?

No.

We should do away with all of that. If women want to serve in combat they should be required to pass the same physical standards as men, do the same 20 mile ruck marches with the same amount of weight, and complete the mos specific fitness tests. That should do away with about 99.9% of female applicants. What then?

/agree. But you know what will most likely happen when the politicians tell the generals to make this happen.

No doubt they will lower the standards so we have a bunch of weak ass fat men in the infantry so as to accommodate the women. It's affirmative action military style. Say goodbye to the martial arts program too. Once the first woman gets her teeth knocked out it will be all over with but the shouting.

 

[Pheonixops]

Women don't need your fucking protection. They're more than capable.

Women have much easier physical requirements than men in the military.

What's that tell you?

This is about promotions at the expense of our military readiness. It's bullshit.

Can you have the best military in the world with an all male force?

Yes.

Can you have the best military in the world with an all female force?

No.

If they try out for Combat Arms, they need to fulfill the same standards that are already required for the men. No "modified" anything. There are women who can outrun, out shoot, out pushup, out skydive, out think, and out * , me and plenty of other men. If they can qualify for the job and recognize what they are getting into, no problem.

One folly I keep hearing is in regard to the "chivalrous" attitude men have about women and how that attitude can get them killed because they will try to save her. Do people think that fellow male team members will abandon a male team member who is distress?

 

[g5000]

Women have served as nurses for hundreds of years where they have seen men urinate into bottles at close range and suffer from dysentery.

Why didn't you complain then?

You are missing the point.

Which is?

Humping up at hill into the teeth of the enemy under heavy fire with a full load is not the same thing as emptying a piss bottle.

That's the point, dipshit.

 

[CaféAuLait]

Ryan Smith @ The WSJ:


America has been creeping closer and closer to allowing women in combat, so Wednesday’s news that the decision has now been made is not a surprise. It appears that female soldiers will be allowed on the battlefield but not in the infantry. Yet it is a distinction without much difference: Infantry units serve side-by-side in combat with artillery, engineers, drivers, medics and others who will likely now include women. The Pentagon would do well to consider realities of life in combat as it pushes to mix men and women on the battlefield.

Many articles have been written regarding the relative strength of women and the possible effects on morale of introducing women into all-male units. Less attention has been paid to another aspect: the absolutely dreadful conditions under which grunts live during war.

Most people seem to believe that the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan have merely involved driving out of a forward operating base, patrolling the streets, maybe getting in a quick firefight, and then returning to the forward operating base and its separate shower facilities and chow hall. The reality of modern infantry combat, at least the portion I saw, bore little resemblance to this sanitized view.

I served in the 2003 invasion of Iraq as a Marine infantry squad leader. We rode into war crammed in the back of amphibious assault vehicles. They are designed to hold roughly 15 Marines snugly; due to maintenance issues, by the end of the invasion we had as many as 25 men stuffed into the back. Marines were forced to sit, in full gear, on each other’s laps and in contorted positions for hours on end. That was the least of our problems.

The invasion was a blitzkrieg. The goal was to move as fast to Baghdad as possible. The column would not stop for a lance corporal, sergeant, lieutenant, or even a company commander to go to the restroom. Sometimes we spent over 48 hours on the move without exiting the vehicles. We were forced to urinate in empty water bottles inches from our comrades.

Many Marines developed dysentery from the complete lack of sanitary conditions. When an uncontrollable urge hit a Marine, he would be forced to stand, as best he could, hold an MRE bag up to his rear, and defecate inches from his seated comrade’s face.

During the invasion, we wore chemical protective suits because of the fear of chemical or biological weapon attack. These are equivalent to a ski jumpsuit and hold in the heat. We also had to wear black rubber boots over our desert boots. On the occasions the column did stop, we would quickly peel off our rubber boots, desert boots and socks to let our feet air out.Due to the heat and sweat, layers of our skin would peel off our feet. However, we rarely had time to remove our suits or perform even the most basic hygiene. We quickly developed sores on our bodies.

When we did reach Baghdad, we were in shambles. We had not showered in well over a month and our chemical protective suits were covered in a mixture of filth and dried blood. We were told to strip and place our suits in pits to be burned immediately. My unit stood there in a walled-in compound in Baghdad, naked, sores dotted all over our bodies, feet peeling, watching our suits burn. Later, they lined us up naked and washed us off with pressure washers.

Yes, a woman is as capable as a man of pulling a trigger. But the goal of our nation's military is to fight and win wars. Before taking the drastic step of allowing women to serve in combat units, has the government considered whether introducing women into the above-described situation would have made my unit more or less combat effective?




***snip***

Continue reading: ---->
Ryan Smith: The Reality That Awaits Women in Combat - WSJ.com

Women have served as nurses for hundreds of years where they have seen men urinate into bottles at close range and suffer from dysentery.

Why didn't you complain then?

Nurses are tained to see such, yes? Military or not, right?

 

[Bigfoot]

Women have served as nurses for hundreds of years where they have seen men urinate into bottles at close range and suffer from dysentery.

Why didn't you complain then?

You are missing the point.

Which is?

How would the ladies feel about standing in formation nude along with all of the men and the normal daily Post's activities going on around them.

 

[Freewill]

A nation that does not protect its women is a nation lost, in my opinion. Its not just that women do not have the ability it a natural law kind of thing.

But it is just an indication of the further deterioration of our country.

I really think Penetta has no idea about combat and thinks it is just some kind of game. I hope he rest well when one our women gets captured and raped.

 

[rightwinger]

Ryan Smith @ The WSJ:


America has been creeping closer and closer to allowing women in combat, so Wednesday’s news that the decision has now been made is not a surprise. It appears that female soldiers will be allowed on the battlefield but not in the infantry. Yet it is a distinction without much difference: Infantry units serve side-by-side in combat with artillery, engineers, drivers, medics and others who will likely now include women. The Pentagon would do well to consider realities of life in combat as it pushes to mix men and women on the battlefield.

Many articles have been written regarding the relative strength of women and the possible effects on morale of introducing women into all-male units. Less attention has been paid to another aspect: the absolutely dreadful conditions under which grunts live during war.

Most people seem to believe that the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan have merely involved driving out of a forward operating base, patrolling the streets, maybe getting in a quick firefight, and then returning to the forward operating base and its separate shower facilities and chow hall. The reality of modern infantry combat, at least the portion I saw, bore little resemblance to this sanitized view.

I served in the 2003 invasion of Iraq as a Marine infantry squad leader. We rode into war crammed in the back of amphibious assault vehicles. They are designed to hold roughly 15 Marines snugly; due to maintenance issues, by the end of the invasion we had as many as 25 men stuffed into the back. Marines were forced to sit, in full gear, on each other’s laps and in contorted positions for hours on end. That was the least of our problems.

The invasion was a blitzkrieg. The goal was to move as fast to Baghdad as possible. The column would not stop for a lance corporal, sergeant, lieutenant, or even a company commander to go to the restroom. Sometimes we spent over 48 hours on the move without exiting the vehicles. We were forced to urinate in empty water bottles inches from our comrades.

Many Marines developed dysentery from the complete lack of sanitary conditions. When an uncontrollable urge hit a Marine, he would be forced to stand, as best he could, hold an MRE bag up to his rear, and defecate inches from his seated comrade’s face.

During the invasion, we wore chemical protective suits because of the fear of chemical or biological weapon attack. These are equivalent to a ski jumpsuit and hold in the heat. We also had to wear black rubber boots over our desert boots. On the occasions the column did stop, we would quickly peel off our rubber boots, desert boots and socks to let our feet air out.Due to the heat and sweat, layers of our skin would peel off our feet. However, we rarely had time to remove our suits or perform even the most basic hygiene. We quickly developed sores on our bodies.

When we did reach Baghdad, we were in shambles. We had not showered in well over a month and our chemical protective suits were covered in a mixture of filth and dried blood. We were told to strip and place our suits in pits to be burned immediately. My unit stood there in a walled-in compound in Baghdad, naked, sores dotted all over our bodies, feet peeling, watching our suits burn. Later, they lined us up naked and washed us off with pressure washers.

Yes, a woman is as capable as a man of pulling a trigger. But the goal of our nation's military is to fight and win wars. Before taking the drastic step of allowing women to serve in combat units, has the government considered whether introducing women into the above-described situation would have made my unit more or less combat effective?




***snip***

Continue reading: ---->
Ryan Smith: The Reality That Awaits Women in Combat - WSJ.com

Women have served as nurses for hundreds of years where they have seen men urinate into bottles at close range and suffer from dysentery.

Why didn't you complain then?

And how many of those women ended up as POWs in the past 100 years?

How many men have ended up as POWs?

It is unpleasant whether you are a man or woman

 

[Bigfoot]

A nation that does not protect its women is a nation lost, in my opinion. Its not just that women do not have the ability it a natural law kind of thing.

But it is just an indication of the further deterioration of our country.

I really think Penetta has no idea about combat and thinks it is just some kind of game. I hope he rest well when one our women gets captured and raped.

You mean raped repeatedly, sodomized and tortured I think.

 

[rightwinger]

Ryan Smith @ The WSJ:


America has been creeping closer and closer to allowing women in combat, so Wednesday’s news that the decision has now been made is not a surprise. It appears that female soldiers will be allowed on the battlefield but not in the infantry. Yet it is a distinction without much difference: Infantry units serve side-by-side in combat with artillery, engineers, drivers, medics and others who will likely now include women. The Pentagon would do well to consider realities of life in combat as it pushes to mix men and women on the battlefield.

Many articles have been written regarding the relative strength of women and the possible effects on morale of introducing women into all-male units. Less attention has been paid to another aspect: the absolutely dreadful conditions under which grunts live during war.

Most people seem to believe that the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan have merely involved driving out of a forward operating base, patrolling the streets, maybe getting in a quick firefight, and then returning to the forward operating base and its separate shower facilities and chow hall. The reality of modern infantry combat, at least the portion I saw, bore little resemblance to this sanitized view.

I served in the 2003 invasion of Iraq as a Marine infantry squad leader. We rode into war crammed in the back of amphibious assault vehicles. They are designed to hold roughly 15 Marines snugly; due to maintenance issues, by the end of the invasion we had as many as 25 men stuffed into the back. Marines were forced to sit, in full gear, on each other’s laps and in contorted positions for hours on end. That was the least of our problems.

The invasion was a blitzkrieg. The goal was to move as fast to Baghdad as possible. The column would not stop for a lance corporal, sergeant, lieutenant, or even a company commander to go to the restroom. Sometimes we spent over 48 hours on the move without exiting the vehicles. We were forced to urinate in empty water bottles inches from our comrades.

Many Marines developed dysentery from the complete lack of sanitary conditions. When an uncontrollable urge hit a Marine, he would be forced to stand, as best he could, hold an MRE bag up to his rear, and defecate inches from his seated comrade’s face.

During the invasion, we wore chemical protective suits because of the fear of chemical or biological weapon attack. These are equivalent to a ski jumpsuit and hold in the heat. We also had to wear black rubber boots over our desert boots. On the occasions the column did stop, we would quickly peel off our rubber boots, desert boots and socks to let our feet air out.Due to the heat and sweat, layers of our skin would peel off our feet. However, we rarely had time to remove our suits or perform even the most basic hygiene. We quickly developed sores on our bodies.

When we did reach Baghdad, we were in shambles. We had not showered in well over a month and our chemical protective suits were covered in a mixture of filth and dried blood. We were told to strip and place our suits in pits to be burned immediately. My unit stood there in a walled-in compound in Baghdad, naked, sores dotted all over our bodies, feet peeling, watching our suits burn. Later, they lined us up naked and washed us off with pressure washers.

Yes, a woman is as capable as a man of pulling a trigger. But the goal of our nation's military is to fight and win wars. Before taking the drastic step of allowing women to serve in combat units, has the government considered whether introducing women into the above-described situation would have made my unit more or less combat effective?




***snip***

Continue reading: ---->
Ryan Smith: The Reality That Awaits Women in Combat - WSJ.com

Women have served as nurses for hundreds of years where they have seen men urinate into bottles at close range and suffer from dysentery.

Why didn't you complain then?

Nurses are tained to see such, yes? Military or not, right?

Are the men trained to see other men urinate at close quarters and suffer from dysentery? Or is it something they learn to deal with?

Being in combat can be unpleasant. It can be unpleasant for women also

 

[Pheonixops]

A nation that does not protect its women is a nation lost, in my opinion. Its not just that women do not have the ability it a natural law kind of thing.

But it is just an indication of the further deterioration of our country.

I really think Penetta has no idea about combat and thinks it is just some kind of game. I hope he rest well when one our women gets captured and raped.

Is Israel a "lost nation"? Don't they have a coed military?

 

[sfcalifornia]

You are missing the point.

Which is?

How would the ladies feel about standing in formation nude along with all of the men and the normal daily Post's activities going on around them.

The article says women are allowed to go to the battlefield... not forced.

If women volunteer for the job, I presume they know what they were getting themselves into.

 

[rightwinger]

A nation that does not protect its women is a nation lost, in my opinion. Its not just that women do not have the ability it a natural law kind of thing.

But it is just an indication of the further deterioration of our country.

I really think Penetta has no idea about combat and thinks it is just some kind of game. I hope he rest well when one our women gets captured and raped.

You mean raped repeatedly, sodomized and tortured I think.

Hate to tell you. But a woman in our armed forces is more likely to get raped by one of her fellow soldiers than from the enemy

 

[Bigfoot]

Which is?

How would the ladies feel about standing in formation nude along with all of the men and the normal daily Post's activities going on around them.

The article says women are allowed to go to the battlefield... not forced.

If women volunteer for the job, I presume they know what they were getting themselves into.

That's a lot of presuming.

 

[Doc91678]

I'm all for women in the military. Women should have to take the same course of Basic trainng and be subject to the draft the same as men.
If this is what women seek, we should give it to them along with all the vagaries of the hardships of war interspersed with livng wth men of war.

 

[sfcalifornia]

How would the ladies feel about standing in formation nude along with all of the men and the normal daily Post's activities going on around them.

The article says women are allowed to go to the battlefield... not forced.

If women volunteer for the job, I presume they know what they were getting themselves into.

That's a lot of presuming.

And don't they have to get trained to withstand those living conditions long before they get to the point where they are on a battlefield? The ones who can't hack it get weeded out.

 

[Glensather]

I don't understand why everyone is making a big deal about this on both sides.
I mean, if a woman is going to the Middle East, shouldn't she know what to expect?

 

[sfcalifornia]

I'm all for women in the military. Women should have to take the same course of Basic trainng and be subject to the draft the same as men.
If this is what women seek, we should give it to them along with all the vagaries of the hardships of war interspersed with livng wth men of war.

If women want to do it and they are capable of doing it, then more power to them.