The N Word

[MizMolly]

Hope nobody minds me jumping in here. I would like to share a couple stories I heard last weekend. One older black lady told about when she was a child and her mother did domestic work for white people. Her mom always talked about how wonderful the family was to her and how much she appreciated that they let her work for them and treated her decently. Her mother did not know, however that when she went along to work with her and spent time with the white children, they teased her mercilessly and called her names. She put up with all most daily dehumanization, but never told her mother. Now she is a woman in her 80's and to this very day, cries over those painful memories.

Another older black lady cried as she told about a woman she considered her second mother. One day she wondered why this woman had no children of her own. When she asked, she was told that when she was young she had some female problems and went to the doctor. They did an operation and told her she would be fine. But for years after that she tried to conceive and never could. Finally, a doctor told her that the previous doctor had done a hysterectomy and never told her. He said that it was common practice back then in that state to control the black population. You could feel and see the pain this woman experienced to this very day.

Emotional trauma, I believe, can be passed from generation to generation just like inherited diseases. Painful memories and even pain from stories that happened generations ago, still linger. There can never be enough financial restitution to take away emotional pain. There can be at least partial healing when folks are given the opportunity to unburden themselves and are received with grace and understanding. There can be at least partial healing, like there was in the room where we gathered together, when folks hugged, cried together and offered apologies for the way these women had been mistreated.

There are countless similar stories whether or not you believe them and whether or not you think the pain is real. I do not think our nation has done nearly enough to right our wrongs.

Jump in any time delores.

Sorry, I had to go out for a while. Like I've often said, although laws may be currently on the books that make certain acts of discrimination illegal, the implementation of those laws are not always carried through and so many things that used to be done openly are now done quietly and are done in such a way to be nearly impossible to prove in a court of law.

I agree. It isn't always regarding race either. People will hire who they want, regardless of the laws. Some won't hire blacks, Mexican's, orientals, women, etc.

Of course there is no more racism Race is never considered even though blacks are unemployed at double the rate of whites, it just means that all the blacks who did not get hired were unqualified. It's not about it always being about anything it is that it happens at all.

Racism by whites is a major problem in this nation. Denying it allows it to continue.

Here's some more of the book So You Want To Talk About Race.

"No discussion of racism is just about one incident for people of color, because we cannot divorce ourselves from the past pain of systematic racism, or the future repercussion of current abuse. When people of color talk about systematic racism, far more than feelings have been hurt and far more than feelings are at stake. When people of color are talking about racism, no matter the immediate subject, they are also always talking about lifelong abuse at the hands of society.

If you've been privileged enough to not suffer from the cumulative effects of systemic racism, and are therefore able to look at racially charged situations one at a time and then let it go, please recognize that very few people of color are able to enter into discussions on racism with the same freedom. When people of color speak out about systemic racism, they are opening up all of that pain and fear and anger to you. They are not doing this because they enjoy it. We do this because we have to, because systemic racism is killing us. And yes, that pain and fear and anger will sometimes show in our words and our actions. But to see all that pain and how we fight still after entire lifetimes of struggle - and then tell us to be more polite is just plain cruel. To refuse to listen to someone's cries for justice and equality until the request comes in a language you feel comfortable with is a way of asserting your dominance over them in the situation."

I think we as white people have a lot to learn.

I agree

 

[LOIE]

Hope nobody minds me jumping in here. I would like to share a couple stories I heard last weekend. One older black lady told about when she was a child and her mother did domestic work for white people. Her mom always talked about how wonderful the family was to her and how much she appreciated that they let her work for them and treated her decently. Her mother did not know, however that when she went along to work with her and spent time with the white children, they teased her mercilessly and called her names. She put up with all most daily dehumanization, but never told her mother. Now she is a woman in her 80's and to this very day, cries over those painful memories.

Another older black lady cried as she told about a woman she considered her second mother. One day she wondered why this woman had no children of her own. When she asked, she was told that when she was young she had some female problems and went to the doctor. They did an operation and told her she would be fine. But for years after that she tried to conceive and never could. Finally, a doctor told her that the previous doctor had done a hysterectomy and never told her. He said that it was common practice back then in that state to control the black population. You could feel and see the pain this woman experienced to this very day.

Emotional trauma, I believe, can be passed from generation to generation just like inherited diseases. Painful memories and even pain from stories that happened generations ago, still linger. There can never be enough financial restitution to take away emotional pain. There can be at least partial healing when folks are given the opportunity to unburden themselves and are received with grace and understanding. There can be at least partial healing, like there was in the room where we gathered together, when folks hugged, cried together and offered apologies for the way these women had been mistreated.

There are countless similar stories whether or not you believe them and whether or not you think the pain is real. I do not think our nation has done nearly enough to right our wrongs.

Jump in any time delores.

Sorry, I had to go out for a while. Like I've often said, although laws may be currently on the books that make certain acts of discrimination illegal, the implementation of those laws are not always carried through and so many things that used to be done openly are now done quietly and are done in such a way to be nearly impossible to prove in a court of law.

I agree. It isn't always regarding race either. People will hire who they want, regardless of the laws. Some won't hire blacks, Mexican's, orientals, women, etc.

Of course there is no more racism Race is never considered even though blacks are unemployed at double the rate of whites, it just means that all the blacks who did not get hired were unqualified. It's not about it always being about anything it is that it happens at all.

Racism by whites is a major problem in this nation. Denying it allows it to continue.

I never denied it. I don't know how to fix it. What do you suggest?

I have joined an organization who fights for racial justice, equal employment opportunities, educational equality, fair minimum wage, etc. I support them and go to whatever marches and meetings I can. They also give out info about when to call our congressmen and let our voices be heard. They seem like little things but when thousands of people work together it can be very effective.

Along with that I attend as many discussions on race and I can to learn. Most recently it was an organization called Come To The Table.

 

[IM2]

Molly this is about more than past injustices and bad names. Your view on this is simplistic and you refuse to educate yourself about the completeness of what has been done and what continues to be done. Why not try doing that instead of arguing all day and night with people based upon an unlearned opinion and a feeling of white victimization?

I am not a victim. You seem to be. I just disagree with you that it is okay to call anyone names. Constant whining about how bad whites treat blacks. I have already said I disagree with racism. Equal treatment is what I agree on, but you don't. You want blacks to be able to do and say whatever they want, because they have been oppressed. Today there are still strides to be made, things are not equal or perfect. But, this does NOT give anyone the right to treat others badly, even blacks.

I've never said it was OK to call anyone names. You are here arguing from a position of victimhood. I know you can't understand that because you just don't have the knowledge and you think a victim can only be a black person standing up against racism, but that's not victimhood, what you are doing is. You are the one not for equal treatment. Because if there are strides still to be made it means that equal treatment does not exist. Molly yo think what you ae saying makes sense, but it doesn't. It's stupid. You assume I want blacks to be able to do and say anything because we were oppressed, Do you not understand how stupid that sounds? You say I don't want equal treatment. Based on what can you make that comment? You make no sense but you run your mouth day in and day out because others just as dumb will jump on anyone who doesn't go along with the racism. Molly, if you had the ovarian fortitude, I could shows you how whites have got what they have beginning in 1618 that has allowed them to be were they are today. And if you think that 243 years of working for free has no impact on the black community today while sons and daughters of the revolution and other whites are now in the 15th or 16th generation of turning over old money. then you are crazy as hell.

This discussion is not just about you, and it's not just about me. It is about blacks and whites, two distinct groups in America with histories and those histories are direct opposites of one another. So until whites like you understand that and keep trying to argue like we have had the same experience and you ignore the macro level of this argument to talk about what you haven't' done at the micro level, you are a waste of time.

There ya go again, the past, 1618? Really? I don't have old money so I can't relate. I never said we have the same experiences, NEVER ONCE compared them.I am not playing the victim. I have not been victimized. You are crying on here all the time. You think I don't deserve to comment. Just what are you doing on here, other than arguing about anything I post? If I am a waste of time, go away and shut the fuck up. Just because I don't think you should call whites names you get butt hurt and blabber about other shit that is irrelevant. The past is irrelevant when it comes to treating people right, when they don't deserve mistreatment. You can't understand that. I do make sense, you just don't have the sense to understand anything other than your one-sided views.

While I was running my errand a few incidents came to mind where I was called white ass, white bitch, etc. etc. by a black woman, who was my neighbor. I tried to reason with her from time to time, tried to get a mediator, but nothing worked. Tried ignoring her, but she persisted. Finally, she actually threatened to kill me so I took her to court and eventually got a restraining order. She eventually moved away.

The next time it was a teenage black girl who harassed me and called me white this, that and the other. She eventually threatened me also. I took her to court but because she had family members who worked at court, our case kept getting delayed. I finally wrote to the District Attorney and the next court date we were heard and got a restraining order. She eventually moved away also.

None of this was pleasant, but I treated each of these people as individuals with obvious problems. It did not make me dislike or blame all black people of racism or hating white people. I knew far too many good black people by then.

I don't blame all black people for anything. I know and love many black people. I have many black relatives that I love tremendously. A lot of blacks say blacks can't be racist, what do you call the way you were treated, if not racism?

Anger at the way we have been treated. You don't get it molly. You don't get to mistreat a group of people continuously fpr 400 years, and when I say 400 it means from 1618 when Hugh Gywnne decided to male his black servant a slave until 2018 which is right now. You don't get o do tat and expect there will not be one person who is going tp show anger towards you. To actually miss this and try claiming racism shows your ignorance. I've never said it is OK to call anyone a name. I have said that the damage from racist laws and policies made by whites need to be fixed and those racist laws ad ;policies have benefitted whites as a whole. Nowhere in these words are it's fine to call white people names and they can't call us names. This is why I say you make no sense. Because you don't. .Whites today have benefitted from those laws and policies and whites need roll up sleeves and work to fix the damage with us instead of crying about how we don't talk abut how blacks mistreat whites.. So if that's mistreating whites, then I'm going to be mistreating whites until the problem is fixed or I am gone.

No matter what you think, there are degrees to things. It's why even in murder here are various degrees and various punishments for the same act depending on intent. A black person calling a white person a name is not the same as a white person denying a black person a job..

 

[MizMolly]

I am not a victim. You seem to be. I just disagree with you that it is okay to call anyone names. Constant whining about how bad whites treat blacks. I have already said I disagree with racism. Equal treatment is what I agree on, but you don't. You want blacks to be able to do and say whatever they want, because they have been oppressed. Today there are still strides to be made, things are not equal or perfect. But, this does NOT give anyone the right to treat others badly, even blacks.

I've never said it was OK to call anyone names. You are here arguing from a position of victimhood. I know you can't understand that because you just don't have the knowledge and you think a victim can only be a black person standing up against racism, but that's not victimhood, what you are doing is. You are the one not for equal treatment. Because if there are strides still to be made it means that equal treatment does not exist. Molly yo think what you ae saying makes sense, but it doesn't. It's stupid. You assume I want blacks to be able to do and say anything because we were oppressed, Do you not understand how stupid that sounds? You say I don't want equal treatment. Based on what can you make that comment? You make no sense but you run your mouth day in and day out because others just as dumb will jump on anyone who doesn't go along with the racism. Molly, if you had the ovarian fortitude, I could shows you how whites have got what they have beginning in 1618 that has allowed them to be were they are today. And if you think that 243 years of working for free has no impact on the black community today while sons and daughters of the revolution and other whites are now in the 15th or 16th generation of turning over old money. then you are crazy as hell.

This discussion is not just about you, and it's not just about me. It is about blacks and whites, two distinct groups in America with histories and those histories are direct opposites of one another. So until whites like you understand that and keep trying to argue like we have had the same experience and you ignore the macro level of this argument to talk about what you haven't' done at the micro level, you are a waste of time.

There ya go again, the past, 1618? Really? I don't have old money so I can't relate. I never said we have the same experiences, NEVER ONCE compared them.I am not playing the victim. I have not been victimized. You are crying on here all the time. You think I don't deserve to comment. Just what are you doing on here, other than arguing about anything I post? If I am a waste of time, go away and shut the fuck up. Just because I don't think you should call whites names you get butt hurt and blabber about other shit that is irrelevant. The past is irrelevant when it comes to treating people right, when they don't deserve mistreatment. You can't understand that. I do make sense, you just don't have the sense to understand anything other than your one-sided views.

While I was running my errand a few incidents came to mind where I was called white ass, white bitch, etc. etc. by a black woman, who was my neighbor. I tried to reason with her from time to time, tried to get a mediator, but nothing worked. Tried ignoring her, but she persisted. Finally, she actually threatened to kill me so I took her to court and eventually got a restraining order. She eventually moved away.

The next time it was a teenage black girl who harassed me and called me white this, that and the other. She eventually threatened me also. I took her to court but because she had family members who worked at court, our case kept getting delayed. I finally wrote to the District Attorney and the next court date we were heard and got a restraining order. She eventually moved away also.

None of this was pleasant, but I treated each of these people as individuals with obvious problems. It did not make me dislike or blame all black people of racism or hating white people. I knew far too many good black people by then.

I don't blame all black people for anything. I know and love many black people. I have many black relatives that I love tremendously. A lot of blacks say blacks can't be racist, what do you call the way you were treated, if not racism?

Anger at the way we have been treated. You don't get it molly. You don't get to mistreat a group of people continuously fpr 400 years, and when I say 400 it means from 1618 when Hugh Gywnne decided to male his black servant a slave until 2018 which is right now. You don't get o do tat and expect there will not be one person who is going tp show anger towards you. To actually miss this and try claiming racism shows your ignorance. I've never said it is OK to call anyone a name. I have said that the damage from racist laws and policies made by whites need to be fixed and those racist laws ad ;policies have benefitted whites as a whole. Nowhere in these words are it's fine to call white people names and they can't call us names. This is why I say you make no sense. Because you don't. .Whites today have benefitted from those laws and policies and whites need roll up sleeves and work to fix the damage with us instead of crying about how we don't talk abut how blacks mistreat whites.. So if that's mistreating whites, then I'm going to be mistreating whites until the problem is fixed or I am gone.

No matter what you think, there are degrees to things. It's why even in murder here are various degrees and various punishments for the same act depending on intent. A black person calling a white person a name is not the same as a white person denying a black person a job..

I agree with you on that. Denying someone a job hurts a hell of a lot more than a name. My posts were not meant to be blown out of proportion, saying nobody deserves to be put down with derogetory names was all I said, no matter who you are. No, blacks are not treated equal. I asked you for a suggestion on changing that. Enough with the damn insults.

 

[MikeK]

Hope nobody minds me jumping in here. I would like to share a couple stories I heard last weekend.

How do you know these stories are true? I'll bet there is no end to such stories. How come we never hear stories about acts of kindness shown to Blacks by Whites. Why is it we never hear stories about the miseries heaped on Whites who opposed slavery?

 

[MikeK]

[...] Whites today have benefitted from those laws and policies and whites need roll up sleeves and work to fix the damage with us instead of crying about how we don't talk abut how blacks mistreat whites.[...]

Any reparation you have in mind has been paid in full by the simple fact that you are living in the U.S. instead of in the homeland of your enslaved forebears where you would be living in a mud hut, dining on rat soup, and hoping some neighboring tribe isn't getting ready to capture you and sell you.

I don't know what level of society you inhabit, but whichever it might be you need to understand that the standard of living of Blacks in America is far better than that of Blacks who live anywhere else in the world.

 

[IM2]

[...] Whites today have benefitted from those laws and policies and whites need roll up sleeves and work to fix the damage with us instead of crying about how we don't talk abut how blacks mistreat whites.[...]

Any reparation you have in mind has been paid in full by the simple fact that you are living in the U.S. instead of in the homeland of your enslaved forebears where you would be living in a mud hut, dining on rat soup, and hoping some neighboring tribe isn't getting ready to capture you and sell you.

I don't know what level of society you inhabit, but whichever it might be you need to understand that the standard of living of Blacks in America is far better than that of Blacks who live anywhere else in the world.

Since I didn't ask for reparations.... . What you need do is what I suggested. Because if I moved Africa I would no more be living in a mud hut than your white ass would be living in a sod cabin hoping the feudal lords don't beat your ass, taking two baths in your life, watching rats living with you while the dead bodes float in the river while you drink the same water you would face back in your ancestral home.

 

[Taz]

The N word? You mean "Not-White"?

 

[IM2]

The N word? You mean "Not-White"?

People get paid for being comedians. You work at the corner convenience store. So it's apparent you aren't funny.

 

[MikeK]

Since I didn't ask for reparations....

[...]

No. You didn't ask directly and openly for reparations but the focus of your commentary makes it clear that's what you have in mind.

 

[IM2]

Since I didn't ask for reparations....

[...]

No. You didn't ask directly and openly for reparations but the focus of your commentary makes it clear that's what you have in mind.

If I was talking about reparations I would be saying reparations. Since I didn't ask for reparations.... . What you need do is what I suggested. Because if I moved Africa I would no more be living in a mud hut than your white ass would be living in a sod cabin hoping the feudal lords don't beat your ass, taking two baths in your life, watching rats living with you while the dead bodes float in the river while you drink the same water you would face back in your ancestral home.

 

[Taz]

The N word? You mean "Not-White"?

People get paid for being comedians. You work at the corner convenience store. So it's apparent you aren't funny.

I’m being serious.

 

[ChrisL]

Since I didn't ask for reparations....

[...]

No. You didn't ask directly and openly for reparations but the focus of your commentary makes it clear that's what you have in mind.

If I was talking about reparations I would be saying reparations. Since I didn't ask for reparations.... . What you need do is what I suggested. Because if I moved Africa I would no more be living in a mud hut than your white ass would be living in a sod cabin hoping the feudal lords don't beat your ass, taking two baths in your life, watching rats living with you while the dead bodes float in the river while you drink the same water you would face back in your ancestral home.

Then what is it that you want? For people to be nice to you and not say mean things? Seriously, I don't get what you think you are going to get out of people. People who are racist are going to be racist. That is all there is to it. All of this angst and complaining isn't going to help you or change the minds of any racists.

 

[IM2]

Since I didn't ask for reparations....

[...]

No. You didn't ask directly and openly for reparations but the focus of your commentary makes it clear that's what you have in mind.

If I was talking about reparations I would be saying reparations. Since I didn't ask for reparations.... . What you need do is what I suggested. Because if I moved Africa I would no more be living in a mud hut than your white ass would be living in a sod cabin hoping the feudal lords don't beat your ass, taking two baths in your life, watching rats living with you while the dead bodes float in the river while you drink the same water you would face back in your ancestral home.

Then what is it that you want? For people to be nice to you and not say mean things? Seriously, I don't get what you think you are going to get out of people. People who are racist are going to be racist. That is all there is to it. All of this angst and complaining isn't going to help you or change the minds of any racists.

Well I believe we can end racism. Just because you are a racist doesn't mean racism should get to continue. So try asking your questions to some of these white people here.

 

[DrLove]

Yet the fact is the following is racist: Some of you claim that black folk are racists too when they use epithets like honky, redneck, cracker, ofay, gray boy and the like. Asking for a pass on what is racism is like a Trumper asking for a pass on Alt Facts. There is no Alt Racism, guys, for any of us, regardless of color.

Were honkies, rednecks, or crackers taken to Africa in chains to work on plantations?

 

[IM2]

The N word? You mean "Not-White"?

People get paid for being comedians. You work at the corner convenience store. So it's apparent you aren't funny.

I’m being serious.

That's even worse. I wouldn't admit that if I were you.

 

[MikeK]

Were honkies, rednecks, or crackers taken to Africa in chains to work on plantations?

No. They weren't. So why do you suppose they weren't?

It appears to be in the essential nature of the Black sub-species to enslave others, including their own kind -- a practice that continues to this day in many parts of the African continent, such as, Mauritania, Mali, Nigeria, Chad, Sudan, et al. The simple reality is the White sub-species has abandoned the practice of slavery whereas Blacks have not. It appears to be an embedded characteristic of their culture.

And you may rest assured I will be denounced as a "racist" for making this simple academic observation.

 

[MikeK]

Then what is it that you want? For people to be nice to you and not say mean things? Seriously, I don't get what you think you are going to get out of people. People who are racist are going to be racist. That is all there is to it. All of this angst and complaining isn't going to help you or change the minds of any racists.

Chris,

Specifically what do you mean when using the word, "racist?" What exactly is a "racist?"

 

[DrLove]

It appears to be in the essential nature of the Black sub-species to enslave others, including their own kind -- a practice that continues to this day in many parts of the African continent, such as, Mauritania, Mali, Nigeria, Chad, Sudan, et al. The simple reality is the White sub-species has abandoned the practice of slavery whereas Blacks have not. It appears to be an embedded characteristic of their culture.

And you may rest assured I will be denounced as a "racist" for making this simple academic observation.

Nominated ^ ^ ^ For Super-Dumb and Most Racist Analysis of the Day!

 

[ChrisL]

Then what is it that you want? For people to be nice to you and not say mean things? Seriously, I don't get what you think you are going to get out of people. People who are racist are going to be racist. That is all there is to it. All of this angst and complaining isn't going to help you or change the minds of any racists.

Chris,

Specifically what do you mean when using the word, "racist?" What exactly is a "racist?"

Well, this is the definition I would probably use.

Definition of racism
: a belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits and capacities and that racial differences produce an inherent superiority of a particular race