the main reason why OWS is hilariously stupid

[dblack]

They want almost everything that we oppose and we're supposed to be their allies? How stupid is that?

Compared to what? You assume they want 'almost everything' you oppose and write them off. I don't call looking for common ground stupid. Especially when what we're looking to do is change the status quo. That simply isn't going to happen without widespread support.

I'm not actively involved by the Tea Party, so I'm willing to have my assumptions corrected by those who are. But what I've seen is very similar to the wheel-spinning the Libertarian party has been mired in for the last three decades. Painting ourselves into a corner by declaring everyone who isn't 'for' us to be 'against' us isn't a recipe for success. We need to find common cause with those who share our concerns, and not get caught up insisting that they follow our notions lockstep.

We aren't pretending that the GOP is our friend. We are trying to CHANGE the GOP into real conservatives. Changing the Democrats is impossible, so we must change the GOP. WE began that process in 2010 and it's going to be a long hard fight.

Well, I sincerely hope I'm wrong, and you succeed at that goal. But I don't see it happening. They'll give your issues just enough lip-service to keep you on the line, and go back to servicing the status-quo as soon as they are elected. It'll be the same bait-and-switch Obama pulled on liberals. Change simply isn't going to come out of the vested power structure.

 

[dblack]

... they're protesting against many of the same problems that the Tea Party targets: Corporate welfare, crony capitalism - corporatism as a mode of governing.

That's not what the tea party protests! Is this what the democrats are telling you? It's not true.

Well, I've heard it repeatedly from Tea Party people. I know that Ron Paul is opposed to these things, though I'll grant the Tea Party has morphed into something significantly different than it's origins.

Like I said, I'm not in the Tea Party. For those of you who are, what's your take? Is the Tea Party opposed to corporatism and crony capitalism?

 

[Dragon]

dblack:

It might interest you to know that there is already a substantial amount of participation on the Occupy movement by people who consider themselves Tea Party supporters, so what you're saying here is not unrecognized.

I saw a Venn diagram with OWS and the TP each represented by a circle. Where they did not intersect, the OWS circle said "corporations have too much power," while the TP circle said "the government has too much power." Where they DID intersect was labeled, "corporations have too much influence on the government."

It's by no means a perfect match-up, but there is considerable common ground.

 

[dblack]

I saw a Venn diagram with OWS and the TP each represented by a circle. Where they did not intersect, the OWS circle said "corporations have too much power," while the TP circle said "the government has too much power." Where they DID intersect was labeled, "corporations have too much influence on the government."

It's by no means a perfect match-up, but there is considerable common ground.

And of course, I'll grind my old axe here: corporate power and government power are the same thing.

 

[PredFan]

They want almost everything that we oppose and we're supposed to be their allies? How stupid is that?

Compared to what? You assume they want 'almost everything' you oppose and write them off. I don't call looking for common ground stupid. Especially when what we're looking to do is change the status quo. That simply isn't going to happen without widespread support.

What's the common ground then? We aren't blaming Wall Street, so joining them in their protest on Wall Street is silly, and nothing on their list of demands is in agreement with the Tea Party in any way shape or form. Hey I'm willing to learn but I can see no common ground with us and them at all.

I'm not actively involved by the Tea Party, so I'm willing to have my assumptions corrected by those who are. But what I've seen is very similar to the wheel-spinning the Libertarian party has been mired in for the last three decades. Painting ourselves into a corner by declaring everyone who isn't 'for' us to be 'against' us isn't a recipe for success. We need to find common cause with those who share our concerns, and not get caught up insisting that they follow our notions lockstep.

I am active in the Tea Party. I agree that it would be beneficial for us to be able to fine people who feel as we do but the OWS people are not it.

We aren't pretending that the GOP is our friend. We are trying to CHANGE the GOP into real conservatives. Changing the Democrats is impossible, so we must change the GOP. WE began that process in 2010 and it's going to be a long hard fight.

Well, I sincerely hope I'm wrong, and you succeed at that goal. But I don't see it happening. They'll give your issues just enough lip-service to keep you on the line, and go back to servicing the status-quo as soon as they are elected. It'll be the same bait-and-switch Obama pulled on liberals. Change simply isn't going to come out of the vested power structure.

They have already shown that they are intending as you say, to give us lip service. However, our victories in 2010 while historically significant did not give us any kind of majority in the GOP. WE are still working on that. As soon as we have replaced enough of the RINOs with TP Conservatives, then we will no longer get lip service.

 

[boilermaker55]

The idiots who are at this protest are only there to feel good nothing more nothing less. They have no plans no solutions, and where their anger should be focus at is congress and both Pres. Bush and Obama for spending this country into this massive debt.

But, no those Asshats in New York think that if they yell loud enough at people who are just doing their job things would be hunky dory.

Ugh I really hate people sometimes

OH! They have plans and ideas to solve the current situation, those like you refuse to hear.

 

[PredFan]

... they're protesting against many of the same problems that the Tea Party targets: Corporate welfare, crony capitalism - corporatism as a mode of governing.

That's not what the tea party protests! Is this what the democrats are telling you? It's not true.

Well, I've heard it repeatedly from Tea Party people. I know that Ron Paul is opposed to these things, though I'll grant the Tea Party has morphed into something significantly different than it's origins.

Like I said, I'm not in the Tea Party. For those of you who are, what's your take? Is the Tea Party opposed to corporatism and crony capitalism?

Yes we are, but these issues are not top issues and certainly aren't enough to overcome the other issues that the OWS croud advocates. They was more government, we want less, they want handouts, we want to end handouts, they want more spending,we want less, they want taxes, we want less.

The Tea Party's main tenements are :

1. Fiscal Responsibility.
2. Smaller Government.
3. Closed Borders.

Everything else is secondary.