Tea Party and Objectivism

[Objectivist]

I have been sitting back and watching, silently biding my time, as the tea party has grown in America. All of this time I have wondered to myself, how can these people possibly compare their beliefs to those of Ayn Rand.
Those who classify themselves as part of the tea party consider themselves conservatives, usually fiscally as well as socially. Therefore I am forced to ask myself, how does this comparison come up. How could any tea party member side with Ayn Rand.
This angers me beyond belief! Rand and Objectivism both preach the evils of religion! Use of the mind and rationalization are the key aspects that everyone seems to ignore!

So I'm going to say this. It is impossible to be a "conservative" and Objectivist. You cannot believe in god. So stop putting up all of these signs about Galt and agreeing with Rand, because you are not. Stop, Stop, Stop.

 

[Truthseeker420]

because their corporate masters like her. I don't know why they need some old communist to tell them it is okay to be selfish.

 

[code1211]

I have been sitting back and watching, silently biding my time, as the tea party has grown in America. All of this time I have wondered to myself, how can these people possibly compare their beliefs to those of Ayn Rand.
Those who classify themselves as part of the tea party consider themselves conservatives, usually fiscally as well as socially. Therefore I am forced to ask myself, how does this comparison come up. How could any tea party member side with Ayn Rand.
This angers me beyond belief! Rand and Objectivism both preach the evils of religion! Use of the mind and rationalization are the key aspects that everyone seems to ignore!

So I'm going to say this. It is impossible to be a "conservative" and Objectivist. You cannot believe in god. So stop putting up all of these signs about Galt and agreeing with Rand, because you are not. Stop, Stop, Stop.

As an objectivist, do you always group all people into conveniently recognized groups to embrace or despise. I am a Conservative and not devoted to a religion. As a Conservative, I see all government as a money laundering scheme and, as such, want to reduce their work load.

To me that is what Conservatism is. Remove as much power as possible from the central and move it always closer and closer to the people. You may have heard the slogan of the Conservative: "Power to the people".

I don't care so much if Rand was an objectivist. I'm not even really sure what that is. However, Rand warned of Collectivism and THAT is the part of her life view that I embrace.

It seems tro me that Rand endorsed and promoted the ability and the resourcefulness of the individual. Whether it be God, a Union, a Political Party or any other renouncing of self in favor of an outside guide for morality, well bing or intellect in place of self interest, it seems to run counter to Rand's basic thinking.

By that standard, nobody is worthy of espousing Rand's philosophy since all of us strive to combine with someone or some group to reinforce our beliefs. Even John Gault had his little commune comprised of individuals to support each other.

The ultimate individualist living as a part of a Collective. Ain't irony sweet? Ain't life a bitch?

The real question then becomes whether you are the legitimate arbiter of Rand's philosophy and whether Rand would support a Central Power to bless or dismiss the interpretation of her ideas as filtered through the lives of those within whom they resonate.

Would Rand recognize YOU as THE central power?

 

[code1211]

because their corporate masters like her. I don't know why they need some old communist to tell them it is okay to be selfish.

Selfish is an interesting word.

Mother Teresa gained great joy from helping those who were Universally revilied by the society. The Catholic Church will very likely make her a Saint. Kind of the Hall of Fame for Catholics.

The more she served others, the closer to God she imagined herself to be. She was in her own mind literally walking on the dead to gain a place in Heaven. Everything she did throughout her adult life was aimed at the singular goal of eternal reward.

Is this not the most selfish thing you have ever heard of?

 

[jillian]

I have been sitting back and watching, silently biding my time, as the tea party has grown in America. All of this time I have wondered to myself, how can these people possibly compare their beliefs to those of Ayn Rand.
Those who classify themselves as part of the tea party consider themselves conservatives, usually fiscally as well as socially. Therefore I am forced to ask myself, how does this comparison come up. How could any tea party member side with Ayn Rand.
This angers me beyond belief! Rand and Objectivism both preach the evils of religion! Use of the mind and rationalization are the key aspects that everyone seems to ignore!

So I'm going to say this. It is impossible to be a "conservative" and Objectivist. You cannot believe in god. So stop putting up all of these signs about Galt and agreeing with Rand, because you are not. Stop, Stop, Stop.

"conservative" doesn't, historically, have anything to do with "religion". conservatism has to do with a view to maintaining the status quo.

randians aren't conservatives, they are government hating reactionaries. and what i believe you're referring to is "social conservatism" which is nothing more than the radical right attempting to intertwine their beliefs with our political system.

 

[Midnight Marauder]

You're stupid enough to believe this exact same talking point hasn't come up on a message board this size, at least a hundred times?

It has.

Really old and stale, you're about a year behind on your parroted talking points, s0n.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

I have been sitting back and watching, silently biding my time, as the tea party has grown in America. All of this time I have wondered to myself, how can these people possibly compare their beliefs to those of Ayn Rand.

Your frustration is understandable as your perception of the TPM is predicated on the misconception that the ‘movement’ is some independent political entity – it’s not. Indeed, there is no such thing as the ‘Tea Party’ per se, as they’re mostly republicans. By its members’ own admission, 7 out of 10 TPM members are republicans or republican leaning independents. All TPM members in the House are republicans.

So if you think the TPM is a neo-libertarian movement based on the childish and inane ‘philosophy’ of Ayn Rand, then you’re clearly mistaken. The TPM is made up mostly of the old Bush Base, the same social conservatives who shut down McCain in 2000 after his New Hampshire primary victory. In addition to the Bush Base, you’ve got pseudo-/quasi-libertarian republicans with a sprinkling of various rightist fringe groups.

So no need to feel frustrated or disappointed – the TPM is simply American political business as usual.

To me that is what Conservatism is. Remove as much power as possible from the central and move it always closer and closer to the people.

As long as where ever the ‘power’ ends up, ‘the people’ understand and acknowledge the rule of law in the context of our Constitutional Republic – something which has been demonstrated to not be the case historically and currently, where the people have been subject to the tyranny of the majority.

 

[Smash_Hits]

I have been sitting back and watching, silently biding my time, as the tea party has grown in America. All of this time I have wondered to myself, how can these people possibly compare their beliefs to those of Ayn Rand.
Those who classify themselves as part of the tea party consider themselves conservatives, usually fiscally as well as socially. Therefore I am forced to ask myself, how does this comparison come up. How could any tea party member side with Ayn Rand.
This angers me beyond belief! Rand and Objectivism both preach the evils of religion! Use of the mind and rationalization are the key aspects that everyone seems to ignore!

So I'm going to say this. It is impossible to be a "conservative" and Objectivist. You cannot believe in god. So stop putting up all of these signs about Galt and agreeing with Rand, because you are not. Stop, Stop, Stop.

It isn't like objectivists are much better. You worship Ayn Rand, they worship God.

 

[Truthmatters]

well they both do believe failed ideas even in the face of their history of failure.

 

[Bfgrn]

You may have heard the slogan of the Conservative: "Power to the people".

WOW, I never knew those people were really conservatives...

 

[Truthseeker420]

because their corporate masters like her. I don't know why they need some old communist to tell them it is okay to be selfish.

Selfish is an interesting word.

Mother Teresa gained great joy from helping those who were Universally revilied by the society. The Catholic Church will very likely make her a Saint. Kind of the Hall of Fame for Catholics.

The more she served others, the closer to God she imagined herself to be. She was in her own mind literally walking on the dead to gain a place in Heaven. Everything she did throughout her adult life was aimed at the singular goal of eternal reward.

Is this not the most selfish thing you have ever heard of?

You really don't know her motives, she didn't have to do all that to get closer to god(if there is one). We all gain something out of giving .

 

[Mad Scientist]

I have been sitting back and watching, silently biding my time, as the tea party has grown in America. All of this time I have wondered to myself, how can these people possibly compare their beliefs to those of Ayn Rand.
Those who classify themselves as part of the tea party consider themselves conservatives, usually fiscally as well as socially. Therefore I am forced to ask myself, how does this comparison come up. How could any tea party member side with Ayn Rand.
This angers me beyond belief! Rand and Objectivism both preach the evils of religion! Use of the mind and rationalization are the key aspects that everyone seems to ignore!

So I'm going to say this. It is impossible to be a "conservative" and Objectivist. You cannot believe in god. So stop putting up all of these signs about Galt and agreeing with Rand, because you are not. Stop, Stop, Stop.

The point of the book is that eventually the producers in society will tire of being taxed out of their profits, tire of being told how to run their business by bureaucrats and just stop working. The question becomes; "What will we do when the Producers stop Producing"? A modern example of this is when businesses move to other states that have less intrusive taxes and laws on business. Or just go overseas.

Conservatives want to feed and care for the Golden Goose.
Liberals want all the golden eggs now thus killing the Golden Goose.

 

[code1211]

To me that is what Conservatism is. Remove as much power as possible from the central and move it always closer and closer to the people.

As long as where ever the ‘power’ ends up, ‘the people’ understand and acknowledge the rule of law in the context of our Constitutional Republic – something which has been demonstrated to not be the case historically and currently, where the people have been subject to the tyranny of the majority.

The notion of the Constitutional Republic envisioned by the founders went out the window sometime between 1790 and 1830. With the advent of the "Two Party System" and the rise of career politicians and political machines, Jefferson's warning of the Tyranny of the Majority has long since been replaced by the tyranny of the minority.

If the power is truly in the hands of the people within a Constitutional Republic, then we will not be in Iraq or Afghanistan, there's no Obamacare, no Department of Education, no huge Federal deficits and no crap-for-brains demagogue telling us that they need to pass it for us to know what's in it.

Most of the tax dollars would be raised and spent locally and the Feds would exist only to regulate trade between the several states and make treaties and trade deals.

"The people" to whom and from whom the power should flow usually care more about their schools their homes than they do about another Destroyer or another stealth fighter that we wouldn't need if we weren't all over the world with our collective nose in everybody's business.

 

[code1211]

You may have heard the slogan of the Conservative: "Power to the people".

WOW, I never knew those people were really conservatives...

Liberals tend to want to centralize power to an elite.

Conservatives tend to want to de-centralize power to the levels closest to those it affects.

In that sense, the people you picture are Conservatives. Since government cannot and should not legislate morality or personal preferances of the pursuit of happiness, they are also.

Centalizing power far from those over whom it is execised is the goal of Liberal policy.

If you are in favor of individual liberty and individual rights and responsibility, you are a Conservative. If you are in favor of regulating everything and removing as much individual choice and individual resposibility as possible from the individual, you are a Liberal.

This is actually pretty simple stuff.

 

[xsited1]

I have been sitting back and watching, silently biding my time, as the tea party has grown in America. All of this time I have wondered to myself, how can these people possibly compare their beliefs to those of Ayn Rand.
Those who classify themselves as part of the tea party consider themselves conservatives, usually fiscally as well as socially. Therefore I am forced to ask myself, how does this comparison come up. How could any tea party member side with Ayn Rand.
This angers me beyond belief! Rand and Objectivism both preach the evils of religion! Use of the mind and rationalization are the key aspects that everyone seems to ignore!

So I'm going to say this. It is impossible to be a "conservative" and Objectivist. You cannot believe in god. So stop putting up all of these signs about Galt and agreeing with Rand, because you are not. Stop, Stop, Stop.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i3My4MHr51c]YouTube - Keep On Trollin' Baby![/ame]

 

[Bfgrn]

You may have heard the slogan of the Conservative: "Power to the people".

WOW, I never knew those people were really conservatives...

Liberals tend to want to centralize power to an elite.

Conservatives tend to want to de-centralize power to the levels closest to those it affects.

In that sense, the people you picture are Conservatives. Since government cannot and should not legislate morality or personal preferances of the pursuit of happiness, they are also.

Centalizing power far from those over whom it is execised is the goal of Liberal policy.

If you are in favor of individual liberty and individual rights and responsibility, you are a Conservative. If you are in favor of regulating everything and removing as much individual choice and individual resposibility as possible from the individual, you are a Liberal.

This is actually pretty simple stuff.

What a pile of absolute bullshit. Conservatives since man began walking upright have tried to create an aristocracy. They are as anti-democracy as it gets. You right wingers today want to create a plutocracy. Power in the hands of the elite; CEO's, corporations and captains of industry.

 

[Truthseeker420]

You may have heard the slogan of the Conservative: "Power to the people".

WOW, I never knew those people were really conservatives...

Liberals tend to want to centralize power to an elite.

Conservatives tend to want to de-centralize power to the levels closest to those it affects.

In that sense, the people you picture are Conservatives. Since government cannot and should not legislate morality or personal preferances of the pursuit of happiness, they are also.

Centalizing power far from those over whom it is execised is the goal of Liberal policy.

If you are in favor of individual liberty and individual rights and responsibility, you are a Conservative. If you are in favor of regulating everything and removing as much individual choice and individual resposibility as possible from the individual, you are a Liberal.

This is actually pretty simple stuff.

Reagan H. Bush and W. Bush all expanded thr Federal governmernt. you calling them liberal?

 

[Truthmatters]

The only people the right ever seems to fight for is the wealthiest people

 

[Bfgrn]

The only people the right ever seems to fight for is the wealthiest people

Yea, the 'right' of the big guy to step on the little guy...

 

[Big Fitz]

I have been sitting back and watching, silently biding my time, as the tea party has grown in America. All of this time I have wondered to myself, how can these people possibly compare their beliefs to those of Ayn Rand.
Those who classify themselves as part of the tea party consider themselves conservatives, usually fiscally as well as socially. Therefore I am forced to ask myself, how does this comparison come up. How could any tea party member side with Ayn Rand.
This angers me beyond belief! Rand and Objectivism both preach the evils of religion! Use of the mind and rationalization are the key aspects that everyone seems to ignore!

So I'm going to say this. It is impossible to be a "conservative" and Objectivist. You cannot believe in god. So stop putting up all of these signs about Galt and agreeing with Rand, because you are not. Stop, Stop, Stop.

All those who smell disinformation, or an 'agent provocateur', raise their hand.

::uts hand up:::

The post reeks of class warfare and collectivist thought.