Spain Invokes Article 155 and imposes Direct Rule on Catalonia

[Confounding]

This could get ugly.

Catalans declare independence from Spain

The Catalan regional parliament has voted to declare independence from Spain, while the Spanish parliament has approved direct rule over the region.

Catalan MPs backed the motion 70-10 in a ballot boycotted by the opposition.

Spanish Prime Minister Mariano Rajoy earlier told senators direct rule was needed to return "law, democracy and stability" to Catalonia.

 

[GHook93]

Hit them hard Spain. Make it sting


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[Confounding]

Hit them hard Spain. Make it sting


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Why should these people not be allowed independence?

 

[Ace Nova]

Should be interesting to see if some sort of Civil War breaks out. I'm not too familiar with the situation....does Catalonia even have any sort of "Militia"?

 

[Marxist_Trash]

All I have to say is I'm beyond fuming right now at Madrid.

 

[Votto]

That's collectivism.

Collectivism is like the mob, you can join, but you can never leave.

At least it's not like Lincoln sending out the troops and killing everyone.

 

[Stratford57]

Putin (last week) : In the case of Catalonia, we saw the European Union and a number of other states unanimously condemn the supporters of independence.

However, at one point they actually welcomed the disintegration of a number of states in Europe without hiding their joy.

Why were they so unthinking, driven by fleeting political considerations and their desire to please – I will put it bluntly – their big brother in Washington, in providing their unconditional support to the secession of Kosovo, thus provoking similar processes in other regions of Europe and the world?

You may remember that when Crimea also declared its independence, and then – following the referendum – its decision to become part of Russia, this was not welcomed for some reason. Now we have Catalonia. There is a similar issue in another region, Kurdistan.

It turns out that some of our colleagues think there are ”good“ fighters for independence and freedom and there are ”separatists“ who are not entitled to defend their rights, even with the use of democratic mechanisms.

As we always say in similar cases, such double standards – and this is a vivid example of double standards – pose serious danger to the stable development of Europe and other continents, and to the advancement of integration processes across the world.

On July 22, 2010, after two years of deliberations, the Hague Court issued an Advisory Opinion that the declaration of independence of Kosovo adopted on February 17, 2008 did not violate international law. The court ruling concerns not just Kosovo, but also the applicability of international law to the declaration of independence by any part of any state in principle. It was a ruling that opened Pandora’s box.

Meeting of the Valdai International Discussion Club

 

[Marxist_Trash]

Both the Civil War and this coup of independence were for economic reasons. Catalonia has a lot of Spain's economy in a stranglehold. That and there was a lot of police brutality attempting to keep Catalans away from the ballot box for their independence referendum...such a bloody mess.

Also worth mentioning that the EU and the US both support "Spanish unity." Shows you how much our elites care about democracy.

 

[Ringel05]

All I have to say is I'm beyond fuming right now at Madrid.

Yeah, I always fume over things that are beyond my control..........

 

[Marxist_Trash]

I generally tend to fume when basic human rights are violated in a supposedly modern country = P

 

[Ringel05]

I generally tend to fume when basic human rights are violated in a supposedly modern country = P

Sounds like a personal problem. Keep it up long enough and you'll be the crotchety old man yelling at neighborhood kids for walking on "your" sidewalk.

Well, look at the positive, at least windmill tilting occupies your spare time.

 

[Stratford57]

EU didn't mind Scottish independence referendum, and Brexit referendum.

Scottish independence referendum, 2014 - Wikipedia

Why Catalonia independence referendum is any different? EU just has mired in its doubled standards.

 

[Lucy Hamilton]

All I have to say is I'm beyond fuming right now at Madrid.

Catalonia has a right to Democracy and Self-Determination, the Catalans have a right to have a legal democratic election that they have asked for and that Mariano Rajoy has refused to allow them to have and even refuses to have a meeting with Carles Puigdemont

Carles Puigdemont is not some Far Leftist Revolutionary, his party PDeCAT are Centre Right as was the CDC the party that preceded it.

Catalan European Democratic Party - Wikipedia .

Democratic Convergence of Catalonia - Wikipedia

Let the Catalans have a legal vote on Independence, if a majority vote for then that should be respected, if a majority vote against then that should be respected, but they should be allowed their democratic right to have a vote.

I just heard that the Spanish Prosecutor is going to file charges against Carles Puigdemont for Sedition this has a prison sentence of 30 years, they are going to make an example of him to send the STFU and sit down message to others, dangerous territory this is heading into now potentially.

There is going to be violence and again the EU Commission will be silent, the EU Commission is anti-Democratic and anti-Self-Determination, they do not give a shit about European peoples, all they care about is protecting the EU Project.

catalonia - Twitter Search

Catalan independence crisis escalates

 

[Votto]

Both the Civil War and this coup of independence were for economic reasons. Catalonia has a lot of Spain's economy in a stranglehold. That and there was a lot of police brutality attempting to keep Catalans away from the ballot box for their independence referendum...such a bloody mess.

Also worth mentioning that the EU and the US both support "Spanish unity." Shows you how much our elites care about democracy.

Just look at Trump. He was elected and both parties hate him and refuse to acknowledge him as legitimate.

No, they don't care about democracy

 

[Marxist_Trash]

I think they only reason they didn't mind the Scottish referendum was it didn't succeed. And if the EU made plans to impose military rule on an already sovereign nation, the amount of people who would realize the true intent of the oligrachy would be catastrophic. Plus it's a delayed exit to begin with, i think they're counting on it getting reversed down the line.

Carles Puigdemont is not some Far Leftist Revolutionary, his party PDeCAT are Centre Right as was the CDC the party that preceded it.

I totally understand that. But as Lenin himself said, all people have a right to freedom and self-determination. I don't care what political leaning revolutionaries come from. Facism must be fought on all fronts.

 

[Stratford57]

Carles Puigdemont is not some Far Leftist Revolutionary, his party PDeCAT are Centre Right as was the CDC the party that preceded it.

I totally understand that. But as Lenin himself said, all people have a right to freedom and self-determination. I don't care what political leaning revolutionaries come from. Facism must be fought on all fronts.

Forget Lenin, it's an International Law.

According to UN Declaration on the Granting of Independence to Colonial Countries and Peoples:
All peoples have the right to self-determination; by virtue of that right they freely determine their political status and freely pursue their economic, social and cultural development.

The United Nations and Decolonization - Declaration

 

[Lucy Hamilton]

I think they only reason they didn't mind the Scottish referendum was it didn't succeed. And if the EU made plans to impose military rule on an already sovereign nation, the amount of people who would realize the true intent of the oligrachy would be catastrophic. Plus it's a delayed exit to begin with, i think they're counting on it getting reversed down the line.

Carles Puigdemont is not some Far Leftist Revolutionary, his party PDeCAT are Centre Right as was the CDC the party that preceded it.

I totally understand that. But as Lenin himself said, all people have a right to freedom and self-determination. I don't care what political leaning revolutionaries come from. Facism must be fought on all fronts.

Communists are not pro-Democracy, Lenin was not pro-Democracy he was pro-Totalitarian as was Marx and Trotsky.

 

[Marxist_Trash]

This thread isn't about Marxism so I won't push the subject, but I will leave it at me respectfully disagreeing.

 

[MisterBeale]

Both the Civil War and this coup of independence were for economic reasons. Catalonia has a lot of Spain's economy in a stranglehold. That and there was a lot of police brutality attempting to keep Catalans away from the ballot box for their independence referendum...such a bloody mess.

Also worth mentioning that the EU and the US both support "Spanish unity." Shows you how much our elites care about democracy.

Just look at Trump. He was elected and both parties hate him and refuse to acknowledge him as legitimate.

No, they don't care about democracy

Yup . . . it's getting about time we let what ever state wants out, out.

 

[Votto]

I think they only reason they didn't mind the Scottish referendum was it didn't succeed. And if the EU made plans to impose military rule on an already sovereign nation, the amount of people who would realize the true intent of the oligrachy would be catastrophic. Plus it's a delayed exit to begin with, i think they're counting on it getting reversed down the line.

Carles Puigdemont is not some Far Leftist Revolutionary, his party PDeCAT are Centre Right as was the CDC the party that preceded it.

I totally understand that. But as Lenin himself said, all people have a right to freedom and self-determination. I don't care what political leaning revolutionaries come from. Facism must be fought on all fronts.

Lenin? Lenin helped create one of the most oppressive regimes in world history that murdered far more people than Hitler.

He died young, so who knows how he would have governed, but the bottom line is that he surrounded himself with ilk like Stalin who was a murderous bastard and did not provide any safe guards against his tyrannical rule.