Shooting at the DC Holocaust Museum

[Political Junky]

Well I didn't think that's what she was doing, but I can't interpret the fraulein's threads....I think I generally think she's saying the exact opposite of what I initially think she's saying.

The Nazi Party is a socialist party, for the person who wanted to know how they were "liberal".

"The National Socialist program also contained a number of points that supported democracy and even called for wider democratic rights. These, like much of the program, lost their importance as the Party evolved, and were ignored by the Nazis after they rose to power."

National Socialist Program - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Like all things liberal, the so-called desire for increased rights was simply a way to pull the wool over the eyes of the public until they could effectively seize power.

Way to miss the idea that "those things were ignored after the Nazi's rose to power". They voted for people who would expand rights, but instead they got the Nazis. They were not, and are not, the same thing.

Yeah...a desire for more rights was simply a way to pull the wool over the eyes of the public until they could effectively seize power...what the hell do you think the founders were fighting for? Decreased rights? What a tool you are.

The point is, a corrupt regime who violated human rights was able to seize power using a liberal facade and appealing to people by telling them that by giving up their rights and allowing certain people to be targeted, they were really INCREASING freedom.

Typical liberal hogwash, and as usual a complete lie.

Hitler was violently opposed to Marxism .. Marx was a Jew.

 

[Nik]

Anyone can kill themselves? Really? Please tell me exactly how a bed ridden, unable to walk/move terminally ill patient who is dying a slow death from cancer is going to kill themselves?

Now we're getting somewhere. You want to decide who can kill themselves.

Who should kill themselves.

Hmm...someone bedridden, who can't walk or move...would naturally not be able to communicate....is killed by someone else, with or without consent...

Oh, I get it. We're talking about legalizing murder here.

Where have I heard that before?

Wha? If you can't walk or move you can't communicate?

 

[Agnapostate]

Hitler was violently opposed to Marxism .. Marx was a Jew.

To be fair, opposition to Marxism doesn't necessarily indicate anti-socialism. Mikhail Bakunin was certainly opposed to Marxism (and somewhat anti-Semitic at that), but his anarchism remained libertarian socialist in nature, of course. However, there are many significant reasons for describing Nazism as entirely anti-socialist in nature.

 

[Fraulein Hilda]

Quit avoiding the question, what pigeonhole would you place my "side" in? Funny that you focus on that one issue so easily and ignore all the others, shows what's on your mind.

This just proves why binary thinking is dangerous. Now time to get the proof that it's stupid. Answer the question or admit that it.

I have no use for gay rights, as it is defined by their leaders, and believe it has no place in conservatism.

So it has more to do with the inconsistency of that.

Why are you avoiding the question? I know but you need to face it, I simply don't fit into your binary thinking, I require the use of your whole brain.

Dick Cheney says be believes in "gay rights" but says he thinks states should be able to allow gay marriage or not.

The preponderance of the gay rights movement does not believe that, which, among other things precludes them from any resemblance to conservatives.

If those are your views, I would call that consistent with conservatism.

 

[Shogun]

Using MY definition of what constitutes liberalism, the Nazi Party was a liberal party


well, i guess that was your first fucking mistake..

 

[Fraulein Hilda]

Now we're getting somewhere. You want to decide who can kill themselves.

Who should kill themselves.

Hmm...someone bedridden, who can't walk or move...would naturally not be able to communicate....is killed by someone else, with or without consent...

Oh, I get it. We're talking about legalizing murder here.

Where have I heard that before?

Wha? If you can't walk or move you can't communicate?

Then we presuppose you want to die?

 

[DavidS]

Folks, I know this is a political forum and all, but this is a shooting of innocent people by a lunatic. That's all it is. It's terrible, it's disgusting and the guy who did it got off easy by dying. I wouldn't care if the shooter is a Christian, Jew, Muslim, White or Black... murder of innocent people is WRONG.

 

[Agnapostate]

Please stop derailing this thread, and instead start a euthanasia thread in the "Religion and Ethics" section.

 

[Sweet Willy]

All this other crap aside, James Von Brunn was a Ron Paul supporter.

He is also an Obama birth certificate conspiracy nut.

He has authored a couple of books, got a whole bunch of rants about Jews and blacks and democrats out there on the WWW.

Regardless of these inane discussions about political theory, this guy is on the right.

 

[KittenKoder]

I have no use for gay rights, as it is defined by their leaders, and believe it has no place in conservatism.

So it has more to do with the inconsistency of that.

Why are you avoiding the question? I know but you need to face it, I simply don't fit into your binary thinking, I require the use of your whole brain.

Dick Cheney says be believes in "gay rights" but says he thinks states should be able to allow gay marriage or not.

The preponderance of the gay rights movement does not believe that, which, among other things precludes them from any resemblance to conservatives.

If those are your views, I would call that consistent with conservatism.

You are so focused on that one single issue that you have to even try to derail a simple question. Show how your binary logic works, what "side" am I on?

 

[Fraulein Hilda]

Reverend Wright was, and still is, a Barack Obama supporter.

But you libs get to run away from him....

Make me understand how this is so?

 

[Nik]

Hmm...someone bedridden, who can't walk or move...would naturally not be able to communicate....is killed by someone else, with or without consent...

Oh, I get it. We're talking about legalizing murder here.

Where have I heard that before?

Wha? If you can't walk or move you can't communicate?

Then we presuppose you want to die?

What? You are getting more unhinged by the day

 

[Sweet Willy]

Reverend Wright was, and still is, a Barack Obama supporter.

But you libs get to run away from him....

Make me understand how this is so?

I didn't know Reverend Wright had killed anyone in an act of terrorism.

 

[Fraulein Hilda]

Why are you avoiding the question? I know but you need to face it, I simply don't fit into your binary thinking, I require the use of your whole brain.

Dick Cheney says be believes in "gay rights" but says he thinks states should be able to allow gay marriage or not.

The preponderance of the gay rights movement does not believe that, which, among other things precludes them from any resemblance to conservatives.

If those are your views, I would call that consistent with conservatism.

You are so focused on that one single issue that you have to even try to derail a simple question. Show how your binary logic works, what "side" am I on?

If you think gays have an unabridged right to teach their lifestyle in my kids in school, whether I want them to or not, then you're not on my side.

You're the one who won't answer my questions about what you mean about "gay rights."

Is that like "world peace?"

 

[Nik]

Reverend Wright was, and still is, a Barack Obama supporter.

But you libs get to run away from him....

Make me understand how this is so?

Rev Wright didn't murder anyone.

 

[Fraulein Hilda]

Reverend Wright was, and still is, a Barack Obama supporter.

But you libs get to run away from him....

Make me understand how this is so?

I didn't know Reverend Wright had killed anyone in an act of terrorism.

Oh, is that the acid test? Bill Ayers tried to kill people but did not? Does he get a "my bad" on that?

 

[KittenKoder]

Reverend Wright was, and still is, a Barack Obama supporter.

But you libs get to run away from him....

Make me understand how this is so?

What the hell does that have to do with anything here?

Here's my point, Nazism isn't liberal nor conservative, it's Nazism. It isn't Democrat or Republican, it's Nazism ... binary thinking has no place in real life, and should have been purged from politics a long time ago.

 

[Fraulein Hilda]

Reverend Wright was, and still is, a Barack Obama supporter.

But you libs get to run away from him....

Make me understand how this is so?

What the hell does that have to do with anything here?

Here's my point, Nazism isn't liberal nor conservative, it's Nazism. It isn't Democrat or Republican, it's Nazism ... binary thinking has no place in real life, and should have been purged from politics a long time ago.

It's a response to the linking of von Dump or whatever his name is with Ron Paul.

 

[Sweet Willy]

Reverend Wright was, and still is, a Barack Obama supporter.

But you libs get to run away from him....

Make me understand how this is so?

I didn't know Reverend Wright had killed anyone in an act of terrorism.

Oh, is that the acid test? Bill Ayers tried to kill people but did not? Does he get a "my bad" on that?

No, we weren't discussing Bill Ayers. He was certainly a domestic terrorist. On the left.

This guy was a right wing terrorist. And it's useless to try and distance this froma terorrist act. That might have washed with the abortion murderer but this guy attacked the Holocaust museum. If you think this isn't going in the terorrist colum, well, wait and see.

 

[Nik]

To the person who asked why we need a holocaust memorial...

Pollster.com: This is Personal

This is Personal By Mark Blumenthal

Regular readers will probably remember my that my father-in-law Frank Burstin, who passed away about a week before last fall's elections, was a survivor of the Auschwitz death camp. For that reason, as you may imagine, the news this afternoon about a shooting at Washington's Holocaust Museum hits pretty close to home for me and for my family.

But you don't know the half of it.

I have a special memory of Pop (as we knew him) from last summer. It was a few weeks before he received his cancer diagnosis, during what turned out to be his last visit to the Holocaust Museum. Because he lost his parents and all of his siblings to the Nazis, and because no grave site exists for any of his family, Pop made it a habit to visit the Museum at least once a year. It fulfilled for him the custom that many Jews practice of visiting the cemetery of loved ones once a year. I only got to accompany him on one of these visits, that one last year, along with one of my wife's nephew Jake.

I described him last year as "kind and optimistic soul," and he certainly was. But when he entered that museum, something changed. He was not unkind, but in that place, as I soon learned, he suffered no fools (nor anyone else).

We wandered into the museum, through the same doors and into the same foyer where shots rang out this afternoon. My wife had given us visitor passes that she receives as a member of the Museum. The lines were long, and it was not obvious which line we needed to stand in.

Pop was having none of it. He walked away from me and wandered up to the museum staffer standing at the head of the long line leading to the elevators that takes all visitors to the museum exhibits. I thought for a moment that Pop was going to ask directions. I was wrong.

He thrust out his arm in the direction of the staffer, displaying the number the Nazis tattooed on his arm at Auschwitz just a few inches from her face. Without making eye-contact and barely breaking stride, Pop kept walking. Understandably, the staffer barely blinked. She didn't make a move to stop him.

Pop kept walking right into the elevator that had just filled with the visitors that had been waiting in that long line. And even though the elevator was already quite crowded, he walked right in. Jake and I had to run past the guard to catch up. "Pop, Pop," I said, feeling a little embarrassed, hoping to talk him into at least waiting for the next elevator.

The staffer inside the elevator must have heard me, because he smiled, held the door and said with smile, "We have room for Pop. You guys too. C'mon in."

And up we went. I have been to the Holocaust Museum many times, but none as memorable as that visit.

About a month ago, in a conscious effort to carry on her father's tradition and to commemorate his birthday, my wife Helen paid her own solo visit to the Museum. She arrived at the end of a busy work day, in a rush, just a few minutes before closing time. Unfortunately, given the late hour, they had run out of the candles usually provided in the Hall of Remembrance for visitors to light and leave in the niches of the outer walls.

Already feeling emotional -- her dad had passed away just six months before -- she broke down sobbing.

A staffer nearby immediately came to her assistance, asking if she needed help. She explained, and the gentleman asked her to wait. He soon returned with a candle, explaining with a conspiratorial wink that he kept his own special supply for such emergencies.

The guards and staff at the Holocaust Museum have a special duty. The do more than just protect and operate one of Washington's many heavily trafficked museums. On a daily basis, they help open the doors to the elderly survivors of the atrocities of World War II. As my stories attest, they do it with a remarkable degree of kindness and professionalism.

As far as I know, the Holocaust Museum personnel that we encountered were not armed guards, though it is possible they were. But when I heard about the shooting this afternoon, and more specifically that at least one of the victims is a security guard now apparently in critical condition, it struck very close to home.

This is personal.

As far as I am concerned, the staff members of the Holocaust Museum are part of our family and the Museum itself is hallowed ground, and we pray for the recovery of the wounded guard. "Never take your guard force and security people for granted," William Parsons, the museum's chief of staff said on television a few minutes ago. Our family never will.

A very sad update: MSNBC just reported that the guard, Officer Steven Tyrone Johns, has passed away. We are all mourners tonight.