She cried rape — and no one helped

[KittenKoder]

I think the best advice I can give women is to not be alone outside at night. It's not safe anywhere. If I ever had to be alone, I definitely would have had my guard up, especially at 2 in the morning.

Statistically you are no less safe now than 50 years ago at any time, the time period that such crimes occur is about even. Best advice is to learn to defend yourself, there are many free classes, and hope you are the millions of lucky ones who are never attacked. Many survivors have a saying, one which I have come to know too well, living in fear is not living. The big difference between now and 50 years ago is that too many have become disconnected from society, fewer attackers got away with it and if it happened in public people did something to help as much as they were capable instead of just ignoring it. Oddly it's our excessive use of digital "social networking" that can be blamed, but that's a different topic. In some neighborhoods they are now reforming real life social networks and these are showing a lot of promise. While we can't force people to do this I think we should all participate a little. I know almost everyone in my building, and I know that if something happened to me they'd be on the phone if not actively helping, as I would for any of them, and it doesn't just extend to those we live with, we would do the same for anyone we see being harmed. It's that kind of caring that we are lacking.

Statistically, this neighborhood, heck this city is a lot more dangerous than it was even 30 years ago. We have multiple murders every year now, when I was a kid there was one murder and it was talked about for years. None of the homes in this neighborhood were robbed, I now know of 3 that have been robbed recently. Plus two people who's cars were stolen. And that's just in a 3 block radius.

The number increases when the population increases, but the percentage of criminals does not. You have to factor in the recent increases in population, which in the US is almost an explosion in population levels. Perspective is often blurred by the media, since they never show the actual percentages only the number of crimes. Chances of something happening are based on the percentage though.

Oh, unless you have a recent change in laws like we did (making our sentences too soft in many areas here).

 

[sealybobo]

I would have to think about that one. But in this case, were the transit workers in imminent danger? I think not. I don't even think the assailant had a deadly weapon.

I agree. Even if I worried that they might turn and attack me, I'd still yell/scream for help and throw rocks at them. Then I would run if necessary.

But I remember being a night watchman in college. No one in after 10pm. These 5 big black guys come and I ask them for ID, but they just blow me off and go up the elevators anyways. What could I do? And the dorm didn't even give me access to a phone or nothing. So I'm supposed to push it with 5 huge brothers? I don't think so. So I just hoped they didn't cause any trouble.

The next thing I know, they are attacking people on the floors above me.

No one got hurt, thank god, but man, I was all alone at like 1am at night and they could have FUCKED ME UP!!!

So the school needed to have a better system. I should have had a phone and easy access to campus security/police.

If it had been me, as soon as they got in the elevator, I would have been up the stairs and waking the residents. All of us together could take them easy. Trust me, I have a voice loud enough that I could have awakened everyone in that dorm with one blood curtailing scream.

Of course, that's if I was smart enough to let them get into the elevator. I probably would have done my best to keep them from ever getting into the elevator in spite of what they'd do to me. Yep, when the war comes, I'll probably be one of the first ones killed for standing my ground.

It happened so fast. 50/50 chance they were just going to visit someone too so I didn't even know if I needed to be concerned.

Then not 5 minutes later they left. Then 1 minute later my boss came down stairs frantic. Apparently they knocked on her door, and when she opened the door, one of them was peeing on her.

I'm thankful they didn't rape or murder someone.

Anyways, like I said, I should have had a phone near by that I could call campus security. They probably have that avalable now, but back then it was 1988, they didn't.

It still bothers me to this day that I let them go up without making them show id and signing in. If it was 2 or 1 guy, I'd insist, but 5 big 6 foot brothers? I was scared, I'll admit.

 

[KittenKoder]

I agree. Even if I worried that they might turn and attack me, I'd still yell/scream for help and throw rocks at them. Then I would run if necessary.

But I remember being a night watchman in college. No one in after 10pm. These 5 big black guys come and I ask them for ID, but they just blow me off and go up the elevators anyways. What could I do? And the dorm didn't even give me access to a phone or nothing. So I'm supposed to push it with 5 huge brothers? I don't think so. So I just hoped they didn't cause any trouble.

The next thing I know, they are attacking people on the floors above me.

No one got hurt, thank god, but man, I was all alone at like 1am at night and they could have FUCKED ME UP!!!

So the school needed to have a better system. I should have had a phone and easy access to campus security/police.

If it had been me, as soon as they got in the elevator, I would have been up the stairs and waking the residents. All of us together could take them easy. Trust me, I have a voice loud enough that I could have awakened everyone in that dorm with one blood curtailing scream.

Of course, that's if I was smart enough to let them get into the elevator. I probably would have done my best to keep them from ever getting into the elevator in spite of what they'd do to me. Yep, when the war comes, I'll probably be one of the first ones killed for standing my ground.

It happened so fast. 50/50 chance they were just going to visit someone too so I didn't even know if I needed to be concerned.

Then not 5 minutes later they left. Then 1 minute later my boss came down stairs frantic. Apparently they knocked on her door, and when she opened the door, one of them was peeing on her.

I'm thankful they didn't rape or murder someone.

Anyways, like I said, I should have had a phone near by that I could call campus security. They probably have that avalable now, but back then it was 1988, they didn't.

It still bothers me to this day that I let them go up without making them show id and signing in. If it was 2 or 1 guy, I'd insist, but 5 big 6 foot brothers? I was scared, I'll admit.

That sounds more like a bad protest.

 

[WillowTree]

Just get a gun girls. and know how to use it. nobody is going to help you but you.

 

[Againsheila]

Statistically you are no less safe now than 50 years ago at any time, the time period that such crimes occur is about even. Best advice is to learn to defend yourself, there are many free classes, and hope you are the millions of lucky ones who are never attacked. Many survivors have a saying, one which I have come to know too well, living in fear is not living. The big difference between now and 50 years ago is that too many have become disconnected from society, fewer attackers got away with it and if it happened in public people did something to help as much as they were capable instead of just ignoring it. Oddly it's our excessive use of digital "social networking" that can be blamed, but that's a different topic. In some neighborhoods they are now reforming real life social networks and these are showing a lot of promise. While we can't force people to do this I think we should all participate a little. I know almost everyone in my building, and I know that if something happened to me they'd be on the phone if not actively helping, as I would for any of them, and it doesn't just extend to those we live with, we would do the same for anyone we see being harmed. It's that kind of caring that we are lacking.

Statistically, this neighborhood, heck this city is a lot more dangerous than it was even 30 years ago. We have multiple murders every year now, when I was a kid there was one murder and it was talked about for years. None of the homes in this neighborhood were robbed, I now know of 3 that have been robbed recently. Plus two people who's cars were stolen. And that's just in a 3 block radius.

The number increases when the population increases, but the percentage of criminals does not. You have to factor in the recent increases in population, which in the US is almost an explosion in population levels. Perspective is often blurred by the media, since they never show the actual percentages only the number of crimes. Chances of something happening are based on the percentage though.

Oh, unless you have a recent change in laws like we did (making our sentences too soft in many areas here).

Well, when I was a kid, if you got caught stealing a car, you went to prison. Now our prisons are so full that you have to get caught stealing a car SEVEN times before they sentence you to prison.

 

[Againsheila]

I agree. Even if I worried that they might turn and attack me, I'd still yell/scream for help and throw rocks at them. Then I would run if necessary.

But I remember being a night watchman in college. No one in after 10pm. These 5 big black guys come and I ask them for ID, but they just blow me off and go up the elevators anyways. What could I do? And the dorm didn't even give me access to a phone or nothing. So I'm supposed to push it with 5 huge brothers? I don't think so. So I just hoped they didn't cause any trouble.

The next thing I know, they are attacking people on the floors above me.

No one got hurt, thank god, but man, I was all alone at like 1am at night and they could have FUCKED ME UP!!!

So the school needed to have a better system. I should have had a phone and easy access to campus security/police.

If it had been me, as soon as they got in the elevator, I would have been up the stairs and waking the residents. All of us together could take them easy. Trust me, I have a voice loud enough that I could have awakened everyone in that dorm with one blood curtailing scream.

Of course, that's if I was smart enough to let them get into the elevator. I probably would have done my best to keep them from ever getting into the elevator in spite of what they'd do to me. Yep, when the war comes, I'll probably be one of the first ones killed for standing my ground.

It happened so fast. 50/50 chance they were just going to visit someone too so I didn't even know if I needed to be concerned.

Then not 5 minutes later they left. Then 1 minute later my boss came down stairs frantic. Apparently they knocked on her door, and when she opened the door, one of them was peeing on her.

I'm thankful they didn't rape or murder someone.

Anyways, like I said, I should have had a phone near by that I could call campus security. They probably have that avalable now, but back then it was 1988, they didn't.

It still bothers me to this day that I let them go up without making them show id and signing in. If it was 2 or 1 guy, I'd insist, but 5 big 6 foot brothers? I was scared, I'll admit.

Of course you were, I would have been too. Heck only an idiot wouldn't have been scared.

 

[KittenKoder]

Statistically, this neighborhood, heck this city is a lot more dangerous than it was even 30 years ago. We have multiple murders every year now, when I was a kid there was one murder and it was talked about for years. None of the homes in this neighborhood were robbed, I now know of 3 that have been robbed recently. Plus two people who's cars were stolen. And that's just in a 3 block radius.

The number increases when the population increases, but the percentage of criminals does not. You have to factor in the recent increases in population, which in the US is almost an explosion in population levels. Perspective is often blurred by the media, since they never show the actual percentages only the number of crimes. Chances of something happening are based on the percentage though.

Oh, unless you have a recent change in laws like we did (making our sentences too soft in many areas here).

Well, when I was a kid, if you got caught stealing a car, you went to prison. Now our prisons are so full that you have to get caught stealing a car SEVEN times before they sentence you to prison.

Okay, then I concede that your area may have an actual increase in percentages (like Seattle has for the same reasons).

 

[Againsheila]

The number increases when the population increases, but the percentage of criminals does not. You have to factor in the recent increases in population, which in the US is almost an explosion in population levels. Perspective is often blurred by the media, since they never show the actual percentages only the number of crimes. Chances of something happening are based on the percentage though.

Oh, unless you have a recent change in laws like we did (making our sentences too soft in many areas here).

Well, when I was a kid, if you got caught stealing a car, you went to prison. Now our prisons are so full that you have to get caught stealing a car SEVEN times before they sentence you to prison.

Okay, then I concede that your area may have an actual increase in percentages (like Seattle has for the same reasons).

Um, I live in Federal Way....just south of Seattle. Most people even in Seattle had never heard of it until a few years ago when our crimes started going up. Now we're on the news almost every night.

 

[KittenKoder]

Well, when I was a kid, if you got caught stealing a car, you went to prison. Now our prisons are so full that you have to get caught stealing a car SEVEN times before they sentence you to prison.

Okay, then I concede that your area may have an actual increase in percentages (like Seattle has for the same reasons).

Um, I live in Federal Way....just south of Seattle. Most people even in Seattle had never heard of it until a few years ago when our crimes started going up. Now we're on the news almost every night.

*blush* Helps if I look at the "location" part of the bio doesn't it?

 

[Father Time]

They're not obligated to help and frankly I don't entirely blame them. If someone is willing to rape someone in public who knows what else they'd be willing to do?

 

[Amanda]

What if you were in prison and 3 of the biggest bull dykes were raping another prisoner. Would you get involved knowing that you would be making three enemies? Would you get involved if you knew they'd most likely target you next?

I think most people don't speak up because they are afraid, not bad.

Yeah, I'm just that stupid and idealistic.

And I can take a lot of abuse. So... yeah.

 

[Father Time]

What if you were in prison and 3 of the biggest bull dykes were raping another prisoner. Would you get involved knowing that you would be making three enemies? Would you get involved if you knew they'd most likely target you next?

I think most people don't speak up because they are afraid, not bad.

Yeah, I'm just that stupid and idealistic.

And I can take a lot of abuse. So... yeah.

I don't know I bet most of us would be too shocked to consider jumping in.

On a related note I saw a video on youtube (that I can't find right now) that was imitating the game hitman.

What they basically did was have a guy come out in a suit wrap a wire around another guy's neck in public (the other guy was with the crew) drag him away with him protesting and then the guy in the suit would show up a bit later wearing the other guy's clothes (in the game this would be the equivalent of taking a disguise but it's not usually done in public).

Anyway they did this several times all in public with small crowds of people nearby (one of it was done in a movie theater lobby IIRC) and no one did ANYTHING.

 

[Amanda]

What if you were in prison and 3 of the biggest bull dykes were raping another prisoner. Would you get involved knowing that you would be making three enemies? Would you get involved if you knew they'd most likely target you next?

I think most people don't speak up because they are afraid, not bad.

Yeah, I'm just that stupid and idealistic.

And I can take a lot of abuse. So... yeah.

I don't know I bet most of us would be too shocked to consider jumping in.

On a related note I saw a video on youtube (that I can't find right now) that was imitating the game hitman.

What they basically did was have a guy come out in a suit wrap a wire around another guy's neck in public (the other guy was with the crew) drag him away with him protesting and then the guy in the suit would show up a bit later wearing the other guy's clothes (in the game this would be the equivalent of taking a disguise but it's not usually done in public).

Anyway they did this several times all in public with small crowds of people nearby (one of it was done in a movie theater lobby IIRC) and no one did ANYTHING.

That's a really sad commentary on our society.

I was at this party once and a band was playing. my friends little bro was the drummer. Anyway, these white power dickheads showed up and started hassling him cos how he had his Docs laced. They started pushing him and stuff and no one would do anything. I just threw myself into it. I got hit a couple times but after some people saw how it was going they jumped ina nd things got diffused but I don't regret it at all. I can take a punch or 3, who cares if the greater good is served? I've never been beat up so bad I didn't recover. Who thinks a little physical discomfort is more important than doing what's right? I sure don't. And if you somehow ended up dead cos you did the right thing what do you think God would say to you??? It'd be high fives all around and who doesn't want God to give 'em a high five??? Think about it, srsrly.

 

[Terry]

Just get a gun girls. and know how to use it. nobody is going to help you but you.

It took me living out in the country to realize that I'm on my own to protect our house and family. Heck the EMT/Police response time to my house is 16 minutes. That is a long time when you are in need of them.

 

[sealybobo]

Just get a gun girls. and know how to use it. nobody is going to help you but you.

It took me living out in the country to realize that I'm on my own to protect our house and family. Heck the EMT/Police response time to my house is 16 minutes. That is a long time when you are in need of them.

Scary story. This woman was a newlywed, just moved into her husbands home and just got back from the honeymoon. The first morning he goes off to work a plumber shows up and says her husband contracted him to do some work in the basement, so she led him down to the basement and said, "well, I'll leave you alone" and he says, "i have a confession to make" and she says, "what", and he says, "I'm not really a plumber".

 

[editec]

Bernard Goetz where were you when we needed you?

 

[Terry]

Just get a gun girls. and know how to use it. nobody is going to help you but you.

It took me living out in the country to realize that I'm on my own to protect our house and family. Heck the EMT/Police response time to my house is 16 minutes. That is a long time when you are in need of them.

Scary story. This woman was a newlywed, just moved into her husbands home and just got back from the honeymoon. The first morning he goes off to work a plumber shows up and says her husband contracted him to do some work in the basement, so she led him down to the basement and said, "well, I'll leave you alone" and he says, "i have a confession to make" and she says, "what", and he says, "I'm not really a plumber".

well I would never hire any electrician's, plumber's, air condition repair man for I do all that myself and if I cannot then I have neighbors.
1 neighbor is an electrician, 2 neighbor is a refrigeration man, 3 neighbor is a Water/Sewage man. LOL

Yeah but that's a scary thought!

 

[GHook93]

Fox News Reported this morning the Judge threw her case out of court. "There is no duty to help"

That is not entirely accurate. The Clerk and the conductor had a duty to contact the police and that is what they did. You never know what was going through their heads and they definitely didn't think creative or quickly by just waiting for the police!

They are definitely cowards no doubt. Getting out of the booth and yelling "I contacted the police and they are 2 minutes away, you better run, would have been much better."

I usually look down on liberal "soft" judges, but in this case I don't think the judge got it entirely wrong.

And that is why I say every American should arm themselves and know how to protect themselves. The cops and the courts aren't going to do it.

Look, during the Wild West carrying load guns was legal! Murder rates were the highest ever in this country. I don't think its a good idea to arm everyone. If carrying load weapons were legal, then robbery, gang violence, mass-murder would be much easier, guaranteed!

I heard the same arguments after VT mass-murder! People said if the students were able to carry guns problem solved? I don't buy it. What I buy is that more killing would happen. Instead of 2 kids settling an argument with their fist they would settle them with their guns. When one kid might have walked away, now he stays and shoots. I don't believe in arming everyone to shot random acts of terror and mass-murder.

However, I think a possible solution would be to arm a few workers. In VT say you give the teachers the option of arming! What if they allowed the conductor to arm himself and same with the clerk. They could give training and a code of conduct when engaging suspects. Even have some signs that the clerks and conductors are packing!

But I don't think a knee-jerk reaction of allowing everyone to carry guns anywhere is a good reaction.

 

[GHook93]

Willow, you know damn well if that woman had a gun and used it on the perp she would have been convicted of murder! This world has gone mad! No common sense!

You also know damn well that if NY citizens could legally carry loaded concealed weapons NY city would be the murder capital of the world and gun fights on the subway would be a common-place.

I know we always blame the liberal for jumping to irrational knee-jerk conclusions to fix problems, but sometime the conservatives do also!

 

[Terry]

Willow, you know damn well if that woman had a gun and used it on the perp she would have been convicted of murder! This world has gone mad! No common sense!

You also know damn well that if NY citizens could legally carry loaded concealed weapons NY city would be the murder capital of the world and gun fights on the subway would be a common-place.

I know we always blame the liberal for jumping to irrational knee-jerk conclusions to fix problems, but sometime the conservatives do also!

Majority LEGAL gun owners are responsible, trained, and respect guns. It's only the illegal gun owners (Thugs) that are dangerous with a weapon.