Senate Democrats block VA accountability bill

[Vigilante]

Oh my, how soon we FORGET!!!!

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vtli_1w3Hk4]Obama Wants Our Vets to Pay for Their War Injuries, but Illegal Immigrants Get Free Medical Care - YouTube[/ame]

 

[TemplarKormac]

Hold the phone. I'm not finished yet. My admission of defeat may have been a bit premature.

Bernie Sanders killed the bill because he hadn't read it. He pulled a Pelosi. The bill is HR 4031, and it was merely 2 1/2 pages long. While he "agreed with the provisions," he wanted a hearing on it. On a 2 1/2 page bill.

And I quote:

“Some of us are old-fashioned enough to know that maybe folks in the Senate might want to know what is in the bill before we voted on it...I do not want to see an enormous amount of paperwork and obstruction go forward before we can get rid of incompetent people,” he added. “But before we vote on legislation, it might be a good idea to understand the full implications of that legislation...So I respectfully object to that legislation right now.”

Sure, but the bill is not even 3 pages long. The Bill passed with no amendments either. Petty parliamentary politics killed this bill, it was an Independent caucusing with Democrats who killed the bill, purely because he wanted to read it first.

H.R.4031 - 113th Congress (2013-2014): Department of Veterans Affairs Management Accountability Act of 2014 | Congress.gov | Library of Congress
S.2013 - 113th Congress (2013-2014): Department of Veterans Affairs Management Accountability Act of 2014 | Congress.gov | Library of Congress

No. Nothing about a 2 1/2 page bill needed to be "cleaned up" as per Doc's words. Forcing an immediate vote would have been ideal here, since some of them wanted to pass this bill before Memorial day. It was passed barebones as to fast track it to the President's desk. Now instead of it being passed, it will be some time in June before they do.

@Zoom-boing , R's did not attach any Iran amendments to the bill when it passed the House. It was barebones legislation, unless you're referring to the Vets bill before Congress last December, in that instance people were indeed pushing for more sanctions on Iran.

I have the text of the Bill in my hands right now. No amendments were added, none. It would have taken no more than 5 or 10 minutes to read the bill. It would have taken about 2 hours to pass it and send it to the president before the day was over.

 

[tinydancer]

Hold the phone. I'm not finished yet. My admission of defeat may have been a bit premature.

Bernie Sanders killed the bill because he hadn't read it. He pulled a Pelosi. The bill is HR 4031, and it was merely 2 1/2 pages long. While he "agreed with the provisions," he wanted a hearing on it. On a 2 1/2 page bill.

And I quote:

“Some of us are old-fashioned enough to know that maybe folks in the Senate might want to know what is in the bill before we voted on it...I do not want to see an enormous amount of paperwork and obstruction go forward before we can get rid of incompetent people,” he added. “But before we vote on legislation, it might be a good idea to understand the full implications of that legislation...So I respectfully object to that legislation right now.”

Sure, but the bill is not even 3 pages long. The Bill passed with no amendments either. Petty parliamentary politics killed this bill, it was an Independent caucusing with Democrats who killed the bill, purely because he wanted to read it first.

H.R.4031 - 113th Congress (2013-2014): Department of Veterans Affairs Management Accountability Act of 2014 | Congress.gov | Library of Congress
S.2013 - 113th Congress (2013-2014): Department of Veterans Affairs Management Accountability Act of 2014 | Congress.gov | Library of Congress

No. Nothing about a 2 1/2 page bill needed to be "cleaned up" as per Doc's words. Forcing an immediate vote would have been ideal here, since some of them wanted to pass this bill before Memorial day. It was passed barebones as to fast track it to the President's desk. Now instead of it being passed, it will be some time in June before they do.

@Zoom-boing , R's did not attach any Iran amendments to the bill when it passed the House. It was barebones legislation, unless you're referring to the Vets bill before congress last December, in that instance people were indeed pushing for more sanctions on Iran.

I have the text of the Bill in my hands right now. No amendments were added, none. It would have taken no more than 5 or 10 minutes to read the bill. It would have taken about 2 hours to pass it and send it to the president before the day was over.

Thank you. I couldn't figure out the why of the Senate shut down the bill. I just put up the actual House vote and it was overwhelmingly bipartisan.

And then there is this as well.

The bill has received letters of support from leading voices in the veterans community including; IAVA; AMVETS; The American Legion; Concerned Veterans for America; and the Reserve Officers Association.

H.R. 4031, the ?Department of Veterans Affairs Management Accountability Act of 2014? | House Committee on Veterans' Affairs

 

[LoneLaugher]

Hold the phone. I'm not finished yet. My admission of defeat may have been a bit premature.

Bernie Sanders killed the bill because he hadn't read it. He pulled a Pelosi. The bill is HR 4031, and it was merely 2 1/2 pages long. While he "agreed with the provisions," he wanted a hearing on it. On a 2 1/2 page bill.

And I quote:

“Some of us are old-fashioned enough to know that maybe folks in the Senate might want to know what is in the bill before we voted on it...I do not want to see an enormous amount of paperwork and obstruction go forward before we can get rid of incompetent people,” he added. “But before we vote on legislation, it might be a good idea to understand the full implications of that legislation...So I respectfully object to that legislation right now.”

Sure, but the bill is not even 3 pages long. The Bill passed with no amendments either. Petty parliamentary politics killed this bill, it was an Independent caucusing with Democrats who killed the bill, purely because he wanted to read it first.

H.R.4031 - 113th Congress (2013-2014): Department of Veterans Affairs Management Accountability Act of 2014 | Congress.gov | Library of Congress
S.2013 - 113th Congress (2013-2014): Department of Veterans Affairs Management Accountability Act of 2014 | Congress.gov | Library of Congress

No. Nothing about a 2 1/2 page bill needed to be "cleaned up" as per Doc's words. Forcing an immediate vote would have been ideal here, since some of them wanted to pass this bill before Memorial day. It was passed barebones as to fast track it to the President's desk. Now instead of it being passed, it will be some time in June before they do.

@Zoom-boing , R's did not attach any Iran amendments to the bill when it passed the House. It was barebones legislation, unless you're referring to the Vets bill before congress last December, in that instance people were indeed pushing for more sanctions on Iran.

I have the text of the Bill in my hands right now. No amendments were added, none. It would have taken no more than 5 or 10 minutes to read the bill. It would have taken about 2 hours to pass it and send it to the president before the day was over.

What? Have you had a miraculous recovery from your various ailments?

You have not gotten it right this time either.

When was the bill introduced. Why was it not brought to the floor until this week? Will the bill be taken up in the Senate?

Answer those questions, take two aspirin ( Granny will probably give them to you ) and call your psychiatrist in the morning.....er......afternoon.

 

[JakeStarkey]

I don't think is it foreboding, I think the Dems are grandstanding for whatever reason.

No candidate wants to go into the election with a "s/he hates the vets" sign on his or her back.

They will pass something.

I agree. There has got to be a good reason. Political suicide is not in the Democrats playbook.

Maybe it's not political suicide.

Plenty of progressives loathe anything military, think vets deserve what they get for volunteering to fight, and actively rooted against the US.

It's amazing that Obama ran on improving the VA and it turned out to be just a swindle of faking results for bonuses. Oh NOW he's focused on the problem now that it's a scandal? Interesting.

Big government types of both parties just pay lip service to actually assisting veterans. For the most part it's just a good excuse for more earmarks and more bureaucracy.

You don't understand the far left anymore than they understand you wankers on the far right.

No one hates the military, but good Americans hate neo-conservatism finally.

An awful lot of good is done but much needs to be fixed.

 

[Vigilante]

Lawmaker: VA Wait-List, Cover-Up Allegations 'Tip of the Iceberg'

*CNN ^

It's "just the tip of the iceberg." That's what a congressional committee chairman investigating allegations of delayed care and cooked books at Veterans Affairs health care facilities told CNN. Rep. Jeff Miller, a Florida Republican who heads the House Veterans Affairs panel, on Thursday forecast more serious developments in the national program serving nearly 9 million veterans. "We've received some information and some tips that will make what has already come look like kindergarten stuff," he told CNN's New Day. The controversy has broadened since CNN first reported six months ago on allegations of alarming shortcomings within the VA medical...

 

[idb]

Some of the WH's reasoning here.

"We do have some concerns that some provisions could result in significant litigation, which would defer valuable time and resources from VA’s accountability efforts and its core mission of delivering quality services to our veterans," Carney said.
"We’ve been very clear we want to work with Congress on specific language issues and look forward to discussing the bill going forward," Carney said.

An association representing top-level government employees has complained that the House bill would eliminate due process protections afforded to top-tier government officials.

According to the Senior Executives Association, government employees are currently allowed to appeal firings and demotions to an administrative panel. The House bill would eliminate that recourse.

The group also expressed concerns that the bill would allow the department to scapegoat career civil servants in the media and interject politics into the firing process.



Read more: White House fears VA reform bill could mean 'significant litigation' | TheHill


Follow us: @thehill on Twitter | TheHill on Facebook

White House fears VA reform bill could mean 'significant litigation' | TheHill

 

[Wildman]

Naturally. Block the stuff that really matters and do crap like sign petitions to get the Redskins to change their name, foist Homosexuality on society, and demonize producers like the Koch Brothers.

These people are SICK.

not really. Had the GOP not shoved in some add-on's i assume the dems would have passed it. But then Boner wanted to be a partisan hack and add in some crap that wasnt needed.

But hey you continue on with your ignorance.

can you provide more info this "crap" you speak of? link ? anything ?

 

[asterism]

Some of the WH's reasoning here.

"We do have some concerns that some provisions could result in significant litigation, which would defer valuable time and resources from VA’s accountability efforts and its core mission of delivering quality services to our veterans," Carney said.
"We’ve been very clear we want to work with Congress on specific language issues and look forward to discussing the bill going forward," Carney said.

An association representing top-level government employees has complained that the House bill would eliminate due process protections afforded to top-tier government officials.

According to the Senior Executives Association, government employees are currently allowed to appeal firings and demotions to an administrative panel. The House bill would eliminate that recourse.

The group also expressed concerns that the bill would allow the department to scapegoat career civil servants in the media and interject politics into the firing process.



Read more: White House fears VA reform bill could mean 'significant litigation' | TheHill


Follow us: @thehill on Twitter | TheHill on Facebook

White House fears VA reform bill could mean 'significant litigation' | TheHill

Ah. The lawyer response.

Last I checked we elected Obama to be Commander-In-Chief, not Attorney General.


And once again, we see that that primary concern of another big-government Administration is the interests of the people who work for it, not the people they work for.

Republican or Democrat, the story remains the same.

 

[asterism]

Naturally. Block the stuff that really matters and do crap like sign petitions to get the Redskins to change their name, foist Homosexuality on society, and demonize producers like the Koch Brothers.

These people are SICK.

not really. Had the GOP not shoved in some add-on's i assume the dems would have passed it. But then Boner wanted to be a partisan hack and add in some crap that wasnt needed.

But hey you continue on with your ignorance.

can you provide more info this "crap" you speak of? link ? anything ?

Yes, please tell us about all this "crap"

[Congressional Bills 113th Congress]
[From the U.S. Government Printing Office]
[S. 2013 Introduced in Senate (IS)]

113th CONGRESS
2d Session
S. 2013

To amend title 38, United States Code, to provide for the removal of
Senior Executive Service employees of the Department of Veterans
Affairs for performance, and for other purposes.


_______________________________________________________________________


IN THE SENATE OF THE UNITED STATES

February 11, 2014

Mr. Rubio introduced the following bill; which was read twice and
referred to the Committee on Veterans' Affairs

_______________________________________________________________________

A BILL



To amend title 38, United States Code, to provide for the removal of
Senior Executive Service employees of the Department of Veterans
Affairs for performance, and for other purposes.

Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the
United States of America in Congress assembled,

SECTION 1. SHORT TITLE.

This Act may be cited as the ``Department of Veterans Affairs
Management Accountability Act of 2014''.

SEC. 2. REMOVAL OF SENIOR EXECUTIVE SERVICE EMPLOYEES OF THE DEPARTMENT
OF VETERANS AFFAIRS FOR PERFORMANCE.

(a) In General.--Chapter 7 of title 38, United States Code, is
amended by adding at the end the following new section:
``Sec. 713. Senior Executive Service: removal based on performance
``(a) In General.--(1) Notwithstanding subchapter V of chapter 35
of title 5, subchapter V of chapter 75 of title 5, or any other
provision of law, the Secretary may remove any individual who is an
employee of the Department from a Senior Executive Service position (as
defined in section 3132(a) of title 5) if the Secretary determines the
performance of the individual warrants such removal.
``(2) If the Secretary so removes such an individual, the Secretary
may--
``(A) remove the individual from the civil service (as
defined in section 2101 of title 5); or
``(B) appoint the individual to a General Schedule position
at any grade of the General Schedule the Secretary determines
appropriate.
``(b) Notice to Congress.--Not later than 30 days after removing an
individual from the Senior Executive Service under subsection (a), the
Secretary shall submit to the Committee on Veterans' Affairs of the
Senate and the Committee on Veterans' Affairs of the House of
Representatives notice in writing of such removal and the reason for
such removal.
``(c) Manner of Removal.--A removal under this section shall be
done in the same manner as the removal of a professional staff member
employed by a Member of Congress.''.
(b) Clerical Amendment.--The table of sections at the beginning of
such chapter is amended by adding at the end the following new item:

``713. Senior Executive Service: removal based on performance.''.
<all>

Text - S.2013 - 113th Congress (2013-2014): Department of Veterans Affairs Management Accountability Act of 2014 | Congress.gov | Library of Congress


This was an up or down vote on a clean bill.


Democrats opted to protect incompetent government workers.

 

[asterism]

There were no amendments.


Amendments - S.2013 - 113th Congress (2013-2014): Department of Veterans Affairs Management Accountability Act of 2014 | Congress.gov | Library of Congress

 

[asterism]

So when a Democrat is appointed to a high office and Republicans want to allow said Democrat the option of firing incompetent government workers the Democrats block the bill.

Democrats don't trust their own kind in government it seems.

 

[idb]

So when a Democrat is appointed to a high office and Republicans want to allow said Democrat the option of firing incompetent government workers the Democrats block the bill.

Democrats don't trust their own kind in government it seems.

We wouldn't want those employees living under a tyranny.

 

[asterism]

So when a Democrat is appointed to a high office and Republicans want to allow said Democrat the option of firing incompetent government workers the Democrats block the bill.

Democrats don't trust their own kind in government it seems.

We wouldn't want those employees living under a tyranny.

What tyranny?

I don't think I've ever even hinted at that.

 

[idb]

So when a Democrat is appointed to a high office and Republicans want to allow said Democrat the option of firing incompetent government workers the Democrats block the bill.

Democrats don't trust their own kind in government it seems.

We wouldn't want those employees living under a tyranny.

What tyranny?

I don't think I've ever even hinted at that.

Giving one man the power to dismiss an employee without due process.

 

[SmedlyButler]

are guiltless. Nothing will get done the way it should if citizens don't raise holy hell.

This was back in February. This is not acceptable! Time they were all told Americans will not stand by while they play politics with veterans healthcare.

FROM:THE HILL

Senate Republicans stopped Democrats from advancing a bill that would have expanded healthcare and education programs for veterans.In a 56-41 vote Thursday, the motion to waive a budget point of order against the bill failed, as Democrats fell short of the 60 votes needed to overcome the Republican roadblock.GOP Sens. Dean Heller (Nev.) and Jerry Moran (Kan.) voted with Democrats.Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-Nev.) refused to allow a GOP substitute amendment to get an up-or-down vote because it included Iran sanctions, which he said were unrelated to veterans’ issues.“I hope all the veterans groups have witnessed all the contortions the Republicans have done to defeat this bill,” Reid said Thursday. “Shame on Republicans for bringing base politics into a bill to help veterans.”Republicans tried to force consideration of the GOP amendment, but failed to table Reid's pending amendments on a 44-52 vote.

 

[KNB]

Republicans acting like they care about the soldiers. That's so god-damned funny that it's insulting to such a point that someone should shoot Karl Rove twice in the back of the head on a live youtube feed.

GOPieces of shit started two unwinnable wars over complete lies and threw our soldiers into a region of the world that was designed by the CIA to be a quagmire, and then bitch like little whiny bitches that their rich fascist system won't take care of the soldiers once they come back with missing limbs and PTSD?

Fuck you, Republicans. Obama is a piece of shit, too, but fuck the GOP for only caring about this now that a black man is in office.

 

[Zoom-boing]

Hold the phone. I'm not finished yet. My admission of defeat may have been a bit premature.

Bernie Sanders killed the bill because he hadn't read it. He pulled a Pelosi. The bill is HR 4031, and it was merely 2 1/2 pages long. While he "agreed with the provisions," he wanted a hearing on it. On a 2 1/2 page bill.

And I quote:

“Some of us are old-fashioned enough to know that maybe folks in the Senate might want to know what is in the bill before we voted on it...I do not want to see an enormous amount of paperwork and obstruction go forward before we can get rid of incompetent people,” he added. “But before we vote on legislation, it might be a good idea to understand the full implications of that legislation...So I respectfully object to that legislation right now.”

Sure, but the bill is not even 3 pages long. The Bill passed with no amendments either. Petty parliamentary politics killed this bill, it was an Independent caucusing with Democrats who killed the bill, purely because he wanted to read it first.

H.R.4031 - 113th Congress (2013-2014): Department of Veterans Affairs Management Accountability Act of 2014 | Congress.gov | Library of Congress
S.2013 - 113th Congress (2013-2014): Department of Veterans Affairs Management Accountability Act of 2014 | Congress.gov | Library of Congress

No. Nothing about a 2 1/2 page bill needed to be "cleaned up" as per Doc's words. Forcing an immediate vote would have been ideal here, since some of them wanted to pass this bill before Memorial day. It was passed barebones as to fast track it to the President's desk. Now instead of it being passed, it will be some time in June before they do.

@Zoom-boing , R's did not attach any Iran amendments to the bill when it passed the House. It was barebones legislation, unless you're referring to the Vets bill before Congress last December, in that instance people were indeed pushing for more sanctions on Iran.

I have the text of the Bill in my hands right now. No amendments were added, none. It would have taken no more than 5 or 10 minutes to read the bill. It would have taken about 2 hours to pass it and send it to the president before the day was over.

Oops, my bad. I read about a previous bill. Thanks, TK.

 

[Zoom-boing]

are guiltless. Nothing will get done the way it should if citizens don't raise holy hell.

This was back in February. This is not acceptable! Time they were all told Americans will not stand by while they play politics with veterans healthcare.

FROM:THE HILL

Senate Republicans stopped Democrats from advancing a bill that would have expanded healthcare and education programs for veterans.In a 56-41 vote Thursday, the motion to waive a budget point of order against the bill failed, as Democrats fell short of the 60 votes needed to overcome the Republican roadblock.GOP Sens. Dean Heller (Nev.) and Jerry Moran (Kan.) voted with Democrats.Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-Nev.) refused to allow a GOP substitute amendment to get an up-or-down vote because it included Iran sanctions, which he said were unrelated to veterans’ issues.“I hope all the veterans groups have witnessed all the contortions the Republicans have done to defeat this bill,” Reid said Thursday. “Shame on Republicans for bringing base politics into a bill to help veterans.”Republicans tried to force consideration of the GOP amendment, but failed to table Reid's pending amendments on a 44-52 vote.

That's what I read and what I was referring to in my post.

 

[TemplarKormac]

Ahh yes, it was February, not December. Anywho...